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View Full Version : need info on San Francisco city firearm laws


CzechPoint
07-10-2009, 11:10 AM
Hello,
I'm in the beginning stages of research on San Francisco city firearms laws. We've been told by an FFL, who is also in law enforcement, that the vz.58 rifle (with non-detachable 10 round magazine) is illegal in San Francisco. Does anyone have a source for San Francisco city ordinances with regard to firearms?

Thanks in advance.

fusionstar
07-10-2009, 11:35 AM
I declare FUD

SickofSoCal
07-10-2009, 11:42 AM
I declare FUD

You never know with San Fran...

Isn't this the city that just the other day made it illegal to throw away orange peals?

TZL
07-10-2009, 11:45 AM
Aside from no mail order ammo sales to san francisco addresses, i'm pretty sure there aren't San Francisco specific laws....

gadjeep
07-10-2009, 11:50 AM
The only other city/county specific law I know of is the ban on derringer sales. Not sure about the laws on possession though. Call Gavin. If you can catch him between trips to the beauty parlor and liasons with his friends significant others maybe he will fill u in.

dfletcher
07-10-2009, 12:00 PM
Aside from no mail order ammo sales to san francisco addresses, i'm pretty sure there aren't San Francisco specific laws....


I live in SF. SF has passed some BS laws on certain handguns, most notably a ban on "ultra compact handguns" that bans pretty much any Smith J frame, Walther PP type, small 32 & 380 ACP as well as "50 caliber handguns" - but they are poorly written and ignored. They were written before Prop F tanked in the courts.

I've seen no ordinances on semi auto centerfire rifles. Ask him to show you the ordinance, I doubt it exists.

dfletcher
07-10-2009, 12:02 PM
Aside from no mail order ammo sales to san francisco addresses, i'm pretty sure there aren't San Francisco specific laws....

That's not 100% accurate regarding ammo sales, although you're correct some mail order companies will not deliver to SF, many will. The SF ordinance has been interpreted by some to mean all ammo sales must comply, while others assert they must comply only if their business is located in SF.

lorax3
07-10-2009, 12:29 PM
Search the SF Muni code (http://www.municode.com/Resources/ClientCode_List.asp?cn=San%20Francisco&sid=5&cid=4201).

berg
07-10-2009, 2:11 PM
I couldn't find any results at that link. I did type into another search box on the main site and found this: http://74.125.155.132/custom?q=cache:FdZ2URtyyioJ:www.sfgov.org/site/uploadedfiles/bdsupvrs/ordinances07/o0192-07.pdf+firearm&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=google-coop-np

eighteenninetytwo
07-10-2009, 2:23 PM
I live in SF - the ban on ammo sales was in the bill that was defeated by the NRA suit. Thing is that it was know beforehand and admitted by the idiot supervisors that thsi would happne so they saddled teh city with a $600000 bill for tha legal action and Chris daly (our prized idiot lefty fool) said that it was worth it to make the point. F&^&in idiots! no wonder we're in such a bad state.

Brutish
07-10-2009, 2:24 PM
Hello,
I'm in the beginning stages of research on San Francisco city firearms laws. We've been told by an FFL, who is also in law enforcement, that the vz.58 rifle (with non-detachable 10 round magazine) is illegal in San Francisco. Does anyone have a source for San Francisco city ordinances with regard to firearms?

Thanks in advance.

He is full of **** (and perhaps an idiot to boot). At best he is just ignorant of current law. Don't waste your time looking at SF laws.

greybeard
07-10-2009, 2:28 PM
At one point in time they had their own Assault Weapons bill but they void it after the NRA went after them.

reidnez
07-10-2009, 2:33 PM
City Attorney's office, perhaps?

dfletcher
07-10-2009, 2:41 PM
City Attorney's office, perhaps?

Just make sure they don't have caller ID. :TFH:

swerv512
07-10-2009, 4:55 PM
you'll probably just get more FUD from the city attorney.

reidnez
07-10-2009, 5:13 PM
you'll probably just get more FUD from the city attorney.

Entirely possible. I was just trying to think what the municipal equivalent of DOJ would be, and that's what came to mind. There's always a *slim* chance that someone within a given agency will know what they're talking about ;)

B Strong
07-10-2009, 5:24 PM
Hello,
I'm in the beginning stages of research on San Francisco city firearms laws. We've been told by an FFL, who is also in law enforcement, that the vz.58 rifle (with non-detachable 10 round magazine) is illegal in San Francisco. Does anyone have a source for San Francisco city ordinances with regard to firearms?

Thanks in advance.

Your source is incorrect.

There is no S.F. specific "assault-weapon" ban that would impact the vz. 58.

Homebuddy
07-10-2009, 5:29 PM
People are complaining about some out of state dealers refusal to ship firearms or firearm related articles to California. The fact is some local ffl dealers are contributing to this problem by their own refusal to accept supposedly California compliant firearms. I wonder on which side they are anyway.

Mssr. Eleganté
07-10-2009, 8:30 PM
I live in SF - the ban on ammo sales was in the bill that was defeated by the NRA suit.

But the ban on receiving mail order ammo shipments (or what some interpret as that ban) was law in San Francisco long before the whole Prop H mess that got shot down by the NRA. It is still on the books

CzechPoint
07-11-2009, 6:01 AM
Thanks for the feedback - much appreciated.

joelogic
07-11-2009, 8:26 AM
Midway wont even ship components to SF.

motorhead
07-11-2009, 9:44 AM
gunshop/former l.e.=double fud at one conveniet location! if he was former doj you could have a trifecta!

Mssr. Eleganté
07-11-2009, 10:55 AM
Midway wont even ship components to SF.

The S.F. law that some people interpret as outlawing mail order ammo sales to San Francisco includes ammo components as well.

huck
07-11-2009, 12:08 PM
You can break no law and still be sued in court by some idiot and his lawyer. And since every 3rd person in SF is an unemployed attorney, the odds can be high. It bugs me that they won't ship here, but I can hardly blame them. It's a matter of self-preservation.

tpirman
07-11-2009, 12:14 PM
Midway wont even ship components to SF.

Midway has shipped many many magazines straight to my door in San Francisco. That and countless other parts. And quickly too :) Now, they won't ship ammo to me, but others will so they get the business. That's been my experience.

Homebuddy
07-11-2009, 2:18 PM
If the FFl dealer could not back up his claim with a legal document then he is just helping the cause of the antigun crowd in San Francisco/California.

RolinThundr
07-11-2009, 7:46 PM
Hello,
I'm in the beginning stages of research on San Francisco city firearms laws. We've been told by an FFL, who is also in law enforcement, that the vz.58 rifle (with non-detachable 10 round magazine) is illegal in San Francisco. Does anyone have a source for San Francisco city ordinances with regard to firearms?

Thanks in advance.

Post this in the LEO forum, you may be able to get some replies by SFPOs that know what they're talking about.

joelogic
07-11-2009, 9:27 PM
By components, I mean reloading components. Yes, they do ship other stuff to us.

Midway has shipped many many magazines straight to my door in San Francisco. That and countless other parts. And quickly too :) Now, they won't ship ammo to me, but others will so they get the business. That's been my experience.

trashman
07-11-2009, 11:36 PM
I live in SF. SF has passed some BS laws on certain handguns, most notably a ban on "ultra compact handguns" that bans pretty much any Smith J frame, Walther PP type, small 32 & 380 ACP as well as "50 caliber handguns" - but they are poorly written and ignored.

IIRC the "sale of" is banned -- not possession of.

--Neill

Bowser
07-11-2009, 11:56 PM
Can't wait to meet you at the shop in mtn view CzechPoint!

chefdude
07-11-2009, 11:59 PM
Ok I am going out on a limb here, but maybe the said FFL/LEO thought you were a crazy SF journalist doing a story and the FFL did not want to bring attention to his shop by saying it was "OK" to bring in the VZ.

but probably not

joelukehart
07-12-2009, 2:24 AM
Only illegal alien gang bangers are allowed to own firearms in SF as well as in LA.

tpirman
07-12-2009, 10:46 AM
By components, I mean reloading components. Yes, they do ship other stuff to us.

Roger that. That sucks.

dwtt
07-12-2009, 4:09 PM
Hello,
I'm in the beginning stages of research on San Francisco city firearms laws. We've been told by an FFL, who is also in law enforcement, that the vz.58 rifle (with non-detachable 10 round magazine) is illegal in San Francisco. Does anyone have a source for San Francisco city ordinances with regard to firearms?

That's the problem, the source of the information. As others have said, you can check the municipal codes, but you can also ask the Golden Gate NRA member's council. If you need a contact, PM me.
If the VZ-58 with a fixed magazine is legal in CA, it's legal in San Francisco also. CA has a preemption law that was used to void Prop. H. This same law is what makes any CA legal off-list rifle legal to own in San Francisco.

cousinkix1953
07-12-2009, 5:46 PM
I live in SF. SF has passed some BS laws on certain handguns, most notably a ban on "ultra compact handguns" that bans pretty much any Smith J frame, Walther PP type, small 32 & 380 ACP as well as "50 caliber handguns" - but they are poorly written and ignored. They were written before Prop F tanked in the courts.

I've seen no ordinances on semi auto centerfire rifles. Ask him to show you the ordinance, I doubt it exists.
Don't you mean the Proposition H (handgun ban) from 2006? Didn't a judge rule that the city has no power to ban guns of any kind; because the legislature had adopted a state-wide pre-emption law, giving themselves this exclusive right. In that case, the VZ-58 not illegal in San Francisco unless it's also illegal in the rest of Kommiefornia...