PDA

View Full Version : How to Defend Yourself Against a Shotgun or Rifle :How to Defend Hostages at Gunpoint


JohnnyRooks
07-05-2009, 11:05 PM
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Yy_h9dERqZA&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Yy_h9dERqZA&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

this guy is a pro...:p

evan69
07-05-2009, 11:24 PM
That would be a lot easier with a gun of your own. :p

NeoWeird
07-05-2009, 11:25 PM
The sad thing is someone will watch this and think that they know how to defend against something like that.

It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

GoingPro
07-05-2009, 11:31 PM
i would rather rely on my 1911.

chsk9
07-05-2009, 11:32 PM
Damn.... so all I really need is my Monte Blanc? My wife is gonna be pissed!

technique
07-05-2009, 11:46 PM
The sad thing is someone will watch this and think that they know how to defend against something like that.

It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

I feel you there. I believe that its more effective in the classroom...I made it to a Brown belt in Kajukenbo before I realized it was really no help. My Dad is a instructor..(sifu).

I will say that kicking arse just comes natural to some people...Martial Arts will help you if you are born with out the ability to fend for you self.


"Having no way as way, Having no limitation as limitation".;)

kicker72
07-05-2009, 11:51 PM
LOL, looks like two kids got a hold of mom and dads video camera;)

GoingPro
07-05-2009, 11:57 PM
and what thug will use an AR15 anyways (or any type of rifle). most of the time its a handgun (revolver or a small caliber .22)

SDgarrick
07-06-2009, 12:00 AM
The sad thing is someone will watch this and think that they know how to defend against something like that.

It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

Depends on the martial art.
I've trained in a few styles, and in my opinion there are some styles I trust in combat or "the street" and some I just don't. Even Muay Thai, my Go-To style isn't the most effective if I really want to stop a fight. Although if you train correctly and have realistic expectations, you can really do damage with your hands feet and elbows.

I know guys who have been at it longer than me and are useless outside the Dojang and I know guys who have used their hands to take life.

socaldsal
07-06-2009, 12:00 AM
This is pure arsehattery at its finest.

xr650r
07-06-2009, 12:06 AM
he got pretty worked up there.

I think he'd wet himself in a real such situation.

J_Rock
07-06-2009, 12:22 AM
rename this:

How to Get Yourself Killed By a Shotgun or Rifle :How to Get Hostages Killed at Gunpoint

Ian
07-06-2009, 12:31 AM
also, if successful this will result in the armed assailant suing you because his back was towards you and your life was not in danger...lol

Astig Boy
07-06-2009, 1:03 AM
The sad thing is someone will watch this and think that they know how to defend against something like that.

It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

Depends on the martial art.
I've trained in a few styles, and in my opinion there are some styles I trust in combat or "the street" and some I just don't. Even Muay Thai, my Go-To style isn't the most effective if I really want to stop a fight. Although if you train correctly and have realistic expectations, you can really do damage with your hands feet and elbows.

I know guys who have been at it longer than me and are useless outside the Dojang and I know guys who have used their hands to take life.


Agreed.
A McDojo will make you believe you are learning something by teaching constant mundane repetitive drills and some fancy looking moves, which typically don't work. You need to really have an eye out for this type of stuff. It is all in the instructor...real instructors will not let you get caught up in drilling...but will force you to think outside the repetitive drill by putting you in real scenarios. Ive seen some schools where one instructor doesn't teach real world(just drills), while another instructor of the same school will teach real world. Any art can be used well enough to defend yourself...it is all in the type of instructor you have.

NeoWeird
07-06-2009, 1:09 AM
Depends on the martial art.
I've trained in a few styles, and in my opinion there are some styles I trust in combat or "the street" and some I just don't. Even Muay Thai, my Go-To style isn't the most effective if I really want to stop a fight. Although if you train correctly and have realistic expectations, you can really do damage with your hands feet and elbows.

I know guys who have been at it longer than me and are useless outside the Dojang and I know guys who have used their hands to take life.

That's why I said 95% are only classroom worthy. It's the same reason why you can mix genres and have people easily beating other individuals at much higher levels.

I've seen a "Master" get his *** handed to him mulitple times by a retired Marine with no training outside of his military work who wanted nothing more than to not fight. I've also heard numerous stories of people, usually kids, who have gotten seriously injured or died because they took the mindset that they were "trained" so they had the advantage to a fight.

On the other hand, I know people who were given just a handful of classroom instructions and have successfully disarmed a mugger/potential killer.

I think what Technique was eluding to, if not flat out saying, is more along the lines of what I believe to be true; it takes someone with the proper mindset and physical capability to be an effectivehand to hand fighter. Any formal training is simply a guidline that helps someone along the way.

I like Miyumoto's stance on martial arts - there are only so many ways to kill. Anything else is an exagertion or dramatic performance to impress the less informed. If what you're doing is not meant to kill, then it is fruitless and should be avoided at all costs.

Norccer
07-06-2009, 1:13 AM
wonder what happens if the ar doesn't have a carrying handle... lol

Tomwadek
07-06-2009, 1:13 AM
looks like the first stab wound would make the shooter pull the trigger and bullets would be flying... thats not a good idea...

SDgarrick
07-06-2009, 1:50 AM
That's why I said 95% are only classroom worthy. It's the same reason why you can mix genres and have people easily beating other individuals at much higher levels.

I've seen a "Master" get his *** handed to him mulitple times by a retired Marine with no training outside of his military work who wanted nothing more than to not fight. I've also heard numerous stories of people, usually kids, who have gotten seriously injured or died because they took the mindset that they were "trained" so they had the advantage to a fight.

On the other hand, I know people who were given just a handful of classroom instructions and have successfully disarmed a mugger/potential killer.

I think what Technique was eluding to, if not flat out saying, is more along the lines of what I believe to be true; it takes someone with the proper mindset and physical capability to be an effectivehand to hand fighter. Any formal training is simply a guidline that helps someone along the way.

I like Miyumoto's stance on martial arts - there are only so many ways to kill. Anything else is an exagertion or dramatic performance to impress the less informed. If what you're doing is not meant to kill, then it is fruitless and should be avoided at all costs.

:shrug:
I believe that more than 95% of martial arts are effective in real life application, though no amount of training can compensate for going into a situation mentally unprepared. Sport fighting is just that, a sport, but it's better than slapping. Running is an effective means of self preservation as well. I know what has worked for me and I feel lucky to be where I am at. Ultimately the best fighting doctrine, I believe, is to win by any means necessary.

Giovani X
07-06-2009, 2:11 AM
Also make sure that your assailant is carrying an A2 or Detachable Cary handle model for that stupid take away.....

Cal-Irish
07-06-2009, 2:37 AM
k brb. Trying out those ninja pen techniques on passers by

frigginchi
07-06-2009, 5:18 AM
I think I'd rather use my Gun Fu.

B Strong
07-06-2009, 5:57 AM
The sad thing is someone will watch this and think that they know how to defend against something like that.
It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

OFT.

Too many martial arts instructors set up scenarios in class for demonstration purposes that uninformed students believe will work in the real world.

The stuff in that vid should be labeled as Dangerous to user.

cortayack
07-06-2009, 11:10 AM
You never know how a person will react to a situation. Question is what happens when the intruder doesn't do what you think hes going to do? or doesn't happen the way you where taught.....Time to think out side the box if that happens..........I took Martial arts classes when I was younger and now have great defensive skills and reflexes...I automaticly block punches coming my way without thinking out it....Like all things it takes time and practice......And a clear thinking mind!

Flying Bones
07-06-2009, 11:29 AM
It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

That leaves 5% that work...
Behold Krav Maga, which is 2nd behind having a weapon of your own and trails the leader by only a mile or so...

Yea, I just spoke up and spoke down for the same art in one sentence.

supermario
07-06-2009, 11:41 AM
The sad thing is someone will watch this and think that they know how to defend against something like that.

It seems to me, from things I have both seen and heard talking with people much more informed than I, that 95% of all martial arts work GREAT in a classroom enviornment where the setup and variables are controlled but flat out suck and in many cases put you at a disadvantage in the real world. Not all, just most.

I think martial arts works well with knife attacks but not gun attacks. I would say if you wanted to learn to defend against weapons, I would learn from
the Gracie Jiu Jitsu Academy. They are pretty good teachers and their stuff works in real case scenarios..

Fjold
07-06-2009, 11:43 AM
Best way to defend against a rifle attack?

Be able to hit from further away than the guy shooting at you.

supermario
07-06-2009, 11:50 AM
I feel you there. I believe that its more effective in the classroom...I made it to a Brown belt in Kajukenbo before I realized it was really no help. My Dad is a instructor..(sifu).

I will say that kicking arse just comes natural to some people...Martial Arts will help you if you are born with out the ability to fend for you self.

"Having no way as way, Having no limitation as limitation".;)

I believe that too, you either got it or you dont!! It wont matter how much you train if you simply dont possess the "*** kicking gene" ;) Its either fight or flight! I realized i was a fighter when i got into a barfight with a bunch of loser gang members. Thats when you find out who your real friends are, only one of my friends helped me against 6guys, but hey i learned that gang members are not tuff at all. We held our own and it was actually fun as hell:D
I remember after security broke it up, i was smiling at them as they left!! My first bar fight! It was special..;)

supermario
07-06-2009, 11:58 AM
wonder what happens if the ar doesn't have a carrying handle... lol

+1, There in trouble if you got a flat top:)

BigBamBoo
07-06-2009, 12:03 PM
..............

BigBamBoo
07-06-2009, 12:07 PM
.............

maschronic
07-06-2009, 12:40 PM
ok. everybody is wrong. if someone comes at you with a shotgun or rifle, you need 1 of these.

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7017/371pxm67grenade.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/371pxm67grenade.jpg/)

Grayblue
07-06-2009, 12:48 PM
"Martial arts do/ don't work" is a generalized statement. Generalized statement is usually wrong.

The demonstration is a "might work if all the stars are aligned right" type technique.

It's also a technique based on poor science. What kind of martial art expert grabs away a long object by grasping where the opponent's grip is most strongest? For example, when taking a baton away, the usual method is to grab at the edge for leverage and twist it out at the opponent's grip. They don't get a single point grip between the opponent's both hand grip on the baton where opponent's grip is most strongest and your leverage is close to none, meaning you'll have to use one hand with no leverage trying to out muscle the opponent's two hand grip. Where does this instructor grab? The carrying handle of the AR-15 type rifle which is at the middle of the opponent's two hand grip on the rifle.

cortayack
07-06-2009, 12:54 PM
Personally I know a gent that has more black belts in 4-5 different disciplines then a Sears store....a few years ago he was at the fair and had words with 3 skinheads. They ended up following him into a bathroom and beat the holy crap out of him.

I asked him WTF grasshopper!??! I mean your like Bruce Lee, Norris, the Drunken Master,etc., all rolled into one. He has won many national championships.

Well...he told me they crowed him into a corner and he could not execute any moves.

Best way to survive a fight? DON'T GET IN ONE! Going up against someone with a knife,stick, or gun with your bare hands is a very last life or death resort.
Look around you....everywhere there are weapons...learn to use them...if this is something your interested in. Otherwise...again...avoid putting yourself in harms way and you will live a much happier life....trust me..BTDT.

Take care,Stan

And thats so true....People stick to what they know! and when they get stuck in a situation, there F8cked! Its good to know stuff and have skills but you most be able to adjust to the environment around you....i would chose a close quarter fighting style myself....;)

MasterYong
07-06-2009, 1:05 PM
I have a good friend who is a third-degree black belt in Isshyn-Ryu (I don't know if I spelled that correctly). He once told me of his Master's super-secret move for when some one pulls a gun on you:












Ready for it???










First, you slowly raise one hand in the air. Then, you slowly raise the other hand in the air. Congratulations, you've now successfully executed the Master's super-secret gun reaction!

nrakid88
07-06-2009, 1:10 PM
I believe that too, you either got it or you dont!! It wont matter how much you train if you simply dont possess the "*** kicking gene" ;) Its either fight or flight! I realized i was a fighter when i got into a barfight with a bunch of loser gang members. Thats when you find out who your real friends are, only one of my friends helped me against 6guys, but hey i learned that gang members are not tuff at all. We held our own and it was actually fun as hell:D
I remember after security broke it up, i was smiling at them as they left!! My first bar fight! It was special..;)

Soungs like I need to getg in a bar fight to find out if I got it.

CAL.BAR
07-06-2009, 1:11 PM
+1 on the variability of all training including firearms as well. How many times have we seen real life situations where a guy will unload a full mag at point blank range and not hit a thing (this includes cops as often as not). Just b/c a guy has a gun, it doesn't mean he will actually hit anything with it, and just b/c a guy can perform kata in a dojo doesn't mean he can do anything with it.

Vinz
07-06-2009, 4:44 PM
I have a good friend who is a third-degree black belt in Isshyn-Ryu (I don't know if I spelled that correctly). He once told me of his Master's super-secret move for when some one pulls a gun on you:
Ready for it???
First, you slowly raise one hand in the air. Then, you slowly raise the other hand in the air. Congratulations, you've now successfully executed the Master's super-secret gun reaction!

haa haaa thats great. I'd rather smash a chair over the guys head if you are relying on surprise.

Side note, its very difficult to succesfully stab someone with a pen. Unless he is naked and has been soaking in a pool for the last 2 hours. Buy a knife and carry it everywhere.

Hide, call police and stay alive. Every situation calls for different reactions.


vinz

JohnnyRooks
07-06-2009, 4:46 PM
Side note, its very difficult to succesfully stab someone with a pen.

it's a molle tactical pen made of S30V ballpoint. :p

Vinz
07-06-2009, 4:50 PM
it's a molle tactical pen made of S30V ballpoint. :p

well.....he didn't say that in the vid....I retract my statement. LOL :p

sizzors, everyone should carry sizzors!

vinz

supermario
07-06-2009, 4:57 PM
Soungs like I need to getg in a bar fight to find out if I got it.


:D Thats funny. I hadnt been in many fights before that day, so thats why i was kinda proud of myself becus i thought i would be really scared but i wasnt scared at all and i did an ok job defending myself considering i was drunk:). My point is, you really dont know what you would do unless you already have done it or been in the situation. Since that day, i took some classes with Gracie Jiu Jitsu and some Muay Thai classes. I feel alot more
confident with fighting but still wouldnt start a fight, i would rather talk myself out of a fight unless it was becus i am defending my family. There are alot of people on this site that "think" they could defend themselves with their tacticool AR's if they had to, but you would be suprised how many persons would actually get scared to the point that they run and hide. I dont think anything is wrong with that becus every person isnt built to fight but dont be suprised if you get scared and run. I have not been in many fights but i grew up in a bad nieghborhood and i have been shot at ALOT of times and i dont run but i have seen one family member almost cry and use the bathroom. You just never know until it happens. By the way, i am not a loser thug or bad guy in anyway, but i just grew up in a bad neighborhood with some family members that were bad people. The best thing to do, is distant yourself from those trouble people.

stix213
07-06-2009, 5:05 PM
How to defend against a shotgun or rifle?

Shoot first

oneone
07-06-2009, 6:58 PM
Thank you. I gotta go practice that move.

nicoroshi
07-06-2009, 7:30 PM
My rule:
Be aware of your surroundings, and avoid conflict if you can. If not revert to most deadly of all martial arts........Click Pow.

SJgunguy24
07-06-2009, 7:45 PM
Rex will teach you:p


<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/N3FQCZrFS94&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/N3FQCZrFS94&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

socomIInato
07-06-2009, 10:00 PM
move too complicated for life or death situation. should have used pen to trechea, that would be the soft spot below adams apple. no time for prisoners.

gazzavc
07-06-2009, 11:13 PM
What about pointed sticks...........

Apollo
07-06-2009, 11:56 PM
I swear the way that instructor moves I bet he can't even dance.

OutbreakPLZ
07-07-2009, 12:50 AM
That would be a lot easier with a gun of your own. :p

+1

and i always say when ever i watch horror movies or any movie involving a bad guy "you wouldnt have to worry about it if you had a CCW, you dumb b****!!"

"if all good ppl carried a gun there would be no bad ppl" is usually said to ppl who are "trying" to watch the movie with me and theyre like "oh god here he goes again. shut up josh"

LOL! :stuart:

anniepoks
07-07-2009, 10:47 PM
+1, There in trouble if you got a flat top:)

hahahaha! +1 there brothers! (flat top saved the intruders day!)

by the way, wont the video maker consider this: - intruder as always having their finger at trigger, thus firing the weapon at his initial blow?......
only steven seagal i believe would, could and his director will allow that maneuver to be really successful i believe.
with the weapon knowingly in the possession of the invader, wont you consider grabbing your shotgun or 1911 instead of heroic moves that might cost your life or limb? or a stray hitting your family member?
is this really worth doing? please reconsider!:o

anniepoks
07-07-2009, 10:59 PM
Rex will teach you:p


<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/N3FQCZrFS94&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/N3FQCZrFS94&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

WOW....Rexwondo rocks!
for $300 bucks that a decent shotgun at BIG5!.lol...

dwtt
07-08-2009, 11:15 AM
Damn.... so all I really need is my Monte Blanc? My wife is gonna be pissed!

Monte Blanc?? Waterman, FTW!

Cjones38
07-08-2009, 11:27 AM
So you have the element of surprise? I'm thinking you yell at him so he turns around, then put a single shot between his eyes (my 45 would do just fine). No more robber, he can't sue you, and now you can peacefully go back to sleep :18:

ar15barrels
07-08-2009, 2:27 PM
Though my #1 plan is to avoid ever getting into a confrontation, my first response would probably be to follow my competition shooting experiences.

3 rules to winning a combat match:
Shoot fast.
Don't miss.
Don't shoot white guys.

If I get attacked by a bunch of hostages, I'm probably in trouble.

WeekendWarrior
07-08-2009, 3:39 PM
I would rely on Krav Maga any day in a street fight, but that's not classic martial arts. Brazilian jujitsu seems like a solid option as well, considering most street fight end up on the grown if someone isn't K.T.F.O. within the first couple punches. If you could quickly maneuver into an arm bar or something like that i'm guessing the attacker would give up very quickly. This is why people with wrestling experience are so effective in street fights because they control the action on the ground which is inevitable in 75% of fights.