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mitchsti
05-25-2009, 7:36 PM
Thinking about buying or building an AR10
need advice and input on complete uppers, complete lowers, kits, pre assembled rifles, gas or piston?
do not worry about prices just want as much advice as I can get about the good and bad and I will sort it out later :thumbsup:

agental1934
05-25-2009, 7:40 PM
I bought an Armalite AR10 pre 2000. It has been a great rifle to shoot. Down side is that magazines cost a ton (even 10 rounders)...and so does the ammo now.

H2H
05-25-2009, 7:42 PM
parts are very very hard to come by right now...

CHS
05-25-2009, 8:44 PM
You need to do more research on your own and then come back with specific questions.

swerv512
05-25-2009, 9:13 PM
You need to do more research on your own and then come back with specific questions.

my thoughts exactly...

mitchsti
05-26-2009, 12:05 AM
dpms lr 308 ap4 is one rifle I was looking at
also the pof 308 20 mrr with a armalite lower
really like the knights armament sr 25 is it calif legal or can it be made calif legal

but a friend showed me a jp in .308 and that thing was nice huge price diff tho

i guess what i am trying to find out is besides the jp being machined billet what makes them so costly compared to other brands
is it that good ?

juts really trying to get some feedback before i make a jump that i might regret

Solidsnake87
05-26-2009, 12:12 AM
AR-10s are excellent rifles. Just keep in mind that parts are VERY hard to come by right now. If you think the prices for AR-15s are looking rediculous then you'll drop a nut when you see AR-10 prices.

Other that that Direct impingement will be more accurate then piston--at least that is the general consensus. I have not been able to shoot a piston to compare. Is this a plinker or a target weapon? big $$$$ difference between the two.

mitchsti
05-26-2009, 12:21 AM
might be a fine line but i want it to be somewhere in the middle of plinker and target.
I might take it hunting but who knows that is mainly what the 700 vtr is for.
I own a m1a scout and love that rifle but i just got my first ar15 in over 20 years ( will bring it home in 10 days) and who knows i might like shooting .223 better than .308 but thats kinda where an ar10 would be great. ar look with the wonderful .308 round.

TheRifleman
05-26-2009, 5:51 AM
the .30 cal is more suited to hunting, whereas the .22 cal is better for target/match/plinking. In terms of AR platform, direct impingement is a superior operating system over piston, and particularly in terms of accuracy.

EBR Works
05-26-2009, 8:04 AM
I have a DPMS .308 upper on a POF lower that I finished in March of this year. I had some initial teething issues to work out but it is now one of my favorite rifles. My best groups so far with it at 100yds are sub .5 MOA with my handloads. I have shot steel with it out to 600 yards so far. I need to find a range with steel past 600!

DPMS 24" stainless upper
POF GIII billet lower
Jewell trigger
KNS gen II pins
Bullet button
DPMS 10 rd mags
Magpul PRS stock
Harris bipod
Accushot monopod
Bushnell 4200 6-24 x50 w/ mil dot reticle
AD Recon mount
Falcon ergo grip
Miculek brake


http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g302/impactco/ar10outside1.jpg

munkeeboi
05-26-2009, 8:12 AM
dpms lr 308 ap4 is one rifle I was looking at
also the pof 308 20 mrr with a armalite lower
really like the knights armament sr 25 is it calif legal or can it be made calif legal

but a friend showed me a jp in .308 and that thing was nice huge price diff tho

i guess what i am trying to find out is besides the jp being machined billet what makes them so costly compared to other brands
is it that good ?

juts really trying to get some feedback before i make a jump that i might regret


there are 2 types of Ar10 platform

DPMS, POF, SR25 type

and

Armalite style(aero, noveske)

they upper and lower receivers have different shapes, You can put a armalite upper on a DPMS lower, but will leave a pretty large gap near the buffer tube. Armalite style lowers will only accept armalite style uppers.


Ar15.com has a good FAQ on the AR10

Jpach
05-26-2009, 2:48 PM
dpms lr 308 ap4 is one rifle I was looking at
also the pof 308 20 mrr with a armalite lower
really like the knights armament sr 25 is it calif legal or can it be made calif legal

POF rifles are of the DPMS style, Not Armalite. I suggest going the DPMS style, they use SR-25 mags and for some reason (to me at least) look prettier than the Armalite types. I love my DPMS .308 upper. I shot a 1.100 inch group at 200 yards with some hand loads the last time I took it out

laphua
06-26-2009, 4:37 PM
What type of Buffer, Tube and Spring Combo are you AR308 guys using for your PRS stocks?

EBR Works
06-26-2009, 5:02 PM
DPMS proprietary buffer and spring. Rifle tube.

Clark_Kent_X
06-26-2009, 5:03 PM
the dpms/pof upper wont fit on the armalite lower.

EBR Works
06-26-2009, 6:29 PM
Yep, DPMS is the way to go for easier parts availability. I shot a .4 moa group with mine at 100yds last month.

Jpach
06-26-2009, 7:08 PM
Impacto, you really lucked out with your rifle! Mine shoots pretty well but hasnt produced consistend .5in groups at 100 like yours. Maybe Ill try playing with some more bullets, I have been using mostly 168 and 178gr amaxs. It sucks, at Angeles one time with my .308 my first 3 shots were all in the same hole and then the next 2 went about .5" to the right/up and right/down. Im thinking of getting my upper rebarreled by GAP in .260

EBR Works
06-26-2009, 8:36 PM
It's been a lot of work to get there. First off I used the Tubbs final finish bore lapping bullets for the first 50 rounds. I could definitely feel the difference pushing a patch through after this process was done and the rifle now consistently cleans up with only one or two patches. I then worked up an accuracy load with a chronograph and ended up at 42g of Varget with 175K SMKs, CCI BR-2 primers in Magtech brass. I then used the Hornady bullet comparator and overall length gauges to try different bullet seating depths. I saw my 5 shot groups shrink from .8 MOA to under .5 MOA just by seating the bullets right on the lands. I have to single load the rounds since they are so long but I have just about hit my accuracy goals with this rifle. Still searching for .3 MOA but I'm not sure this can be done with a DI gas rifle.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g302/impactco/175smk005-1.jpg

C.G.
06-26-2009, 9:38 PM
I, on the other hand, suggest an AR-10. Armalite has been in the .308 game the longest and have worked out the bugs. I also have to disagree with Jpach, I think the AR-10 looks better.

slappomatt
06-26-2009, 9:48 PM
second what CG said. the only advantage the DPMS system has is the incoming availability of Pmags. armalite has released their gen 2 mags which are supposed to be great. I have two of them but no upper so I cant comment on their feeding. I have shot an AR10 before and it was awsome.

huckberry668
06-26-2009, 10:04 PM
I just built this AR10T with a 24" Armalite upper bought 12, 13 years ago and a new Aero lower with Armalite NM lower kit. the ammo was handloaded mag length. It was windy out at Angeles Ranges today. I think I can get rid of some of the horizontals if I doped the wind a little. I'm going to develop a load for it and try again.

First group was shot with freshly cleaned barrel cold bore. I adjust the windage to the right before shooting the 2nd group. All shots counted.

168 Nolser Custom Competition
43gr of Varget
Win brass full length sized & trimmed
WLR primer
2.800" OAL

http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa83/huckster357/groupscropped1small.jpg
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa83/huckster357/AR10T-24left.jpg

Jpach
06-27-2009, 12:31 AM
It's been a lot of work to get there. First off I used the Tubbs final finish bore lapping bullets for the first 50 rounds. I could definitely feel the difference pushing a patch through after this process was done and the rifle now consistently cleans up with only one or two patches. I then worked up an accuracy load with a chronograph and ended up at 42g of Varget with 175K SMKs, CCI BR-2 primers in Magtech brass. I then used the Hornady bullet comparator and overall length gauges to try different bullet seating depths. I saw my 5 shot groups shrink from .8 MOA to under .5 MOA just by seating the bullets right on the lands. I have to single load the rounds since they are so long but I have just about hit my accuracy goals with this rifle. Still searching for .3 MOA but I'm not sure this can be done with a DI gas rifle.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g302/impactco/175smk005-1.jpg

You know what Impacto, I have that Tubbs final finish as well but Im afraid to use them. But now that I think about it, even if it somehow takes a lot of life out of the barrel Im probably going to rebarrel it in .260 anyways (unless it kicks major *** post Tubbs). I was going to say...How on earth are you seating according to that hornady bullet comparator when the OAL needs to be sooo long like in mine! I single load mine anyways so I might as well load them to that length now. Hmm...now I think Im really going to use that Tubbs thing.

BTW, if you havent already, try the 178gr AMAX! Its amazing. I got virtually the same group at 200yds as I did at 100 yards with it. Maybe after the Tubbs it will be substantially smaller

EBR Works
06-27-2009, 5:45 AM
You know what Impacto, I have that Tubbs final finish as well but Im afraid to use them. But now that I think about it, even if it somehow takes a lot of life out of the barrel Im probably going to rebarrel it in .260 anyways (unless it kicks major *** post Tubbs). I was going to say...How on earth are you seating according to that hornady bullet comparator when the OAL needs to be sooo long like in mine! I single load mine anyways so I might as well load them to that length now. Hmm...now I think Im really going to use that Tubbs thing.

BTW, if you havent already, try the 178gr AMAX! Its amazing. I got virtually the same group at 200yds as I did at 100 yards with it. Maybe after the Tubbs it will be substantially smaller


I'll try the AMAX bullets sometime for sure. Give the Tubbs system a go and then buy these parts to determine the optimal seating depth:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=479963

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=231904

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=459683

Clark_Kent_X
06-27-2009, 10:04 AM
dpms lr 308 ap4 is one rifle I was looking at
also the pof 308 20 mrr with a armalite lower
really like the knights armament sr 25 is it calif legal or can it be made calif legal

it can only be made california legal if you buy the upper with a different lower. however an ar10 lower is a little wider and wont fit. it will be very hard to come by a lower that will fit the KAC sr25. you'll have to get it custom made or *not sure about this* move out of state buy the KAC sr25 then move back

the pof 308 and the armalite lower will not fit together. one is an ar10 style and the other is dpms style. so when you put the pof upper on the armalite lower they wont be able to fit at all, as in you wont be able to get the rear takedown pin close the the hole.