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View Full Version : Lever Action as your Go-to rifle


Okami
05-23-2009, 10:03 PM
How many of you primarilly use a levergun?
Post pics if you have them. :)

Futurecollector
05-23-2009, 10:07 PM
thats a definite NO lol

Sam .223
05-23-2009, 10:37 PM
i have a Marlin but i'm to lazy to pull it out of the safe to take a pic right now, and its not my "go to gun", i have maybe 2 boxes of rounds for it. i usually shoot it once a year if i feel like taking it out.

mgone
05-23-2009, 10:44 PM
I have a marlin 1895 guide in 45-70, just in case a car attacks me. rem. 870 is my go to.

jdberger
05-23-2009, 10:48 PM
Yes.

Winnie '94 in .45 Colt.

Passes Massad Ayoob's "show it to the jury" test.

Also keeps me clear of CA AWB laws (and the anticipated LEO misinterpretation of same).

God Bless The Mauser
05-23-2009, 11:06 PM
My dad uses them almost exclusivly. He's a cowboy guy so all he uses is cowboy guns. I told him if SHTF he's going to have to use one of my AKs.

CSACANNONEER
05-23-2009, 11:13 PM
My dad uses them almost exclusivly. He's a cowboy guy so all he uses is cowboy guns. I told him if SHTF he's going to have to use one of my AKs.

I doubt that. Have you ever been to a SAS or some other type of cowboy action match? BTW, it's just as easy to convert a lever gun to FA as it is to convert an AR or AK and you don't need special auto sears or other machined parts. So, in a real SHTF scenario, a lever gun might be a whole lot better than an AK. But, that also depends on how competent the shooter is.

DULLYJAY
05-23-2009, 11:25 PM
it's just as easy to convert a lever gun to FA as it is to convert an AR or AK and you don't need special auto sears or other machined parts.

Don't think so? I think for full auto you need some type of gas system or blow back system? A lever action has none of that. It will take alot of work to make a L.A. go full auto.

Turo
05-23-2009, 11:32 PM
Can't say they're my first choice, but definitely fun to shoot!

cortayack
05-23-2009, 11:34 PM
Why do you need a full auto in SHTF situation....LOL! I have a 357 L.A and I would use it as a go to..Its light, hits hard and up to 100 yards I'm good.......

CooldadE
05-23-2009, 11:35 PM
I've got a winchester 94 Trapper in 30.30 cool little gun, kicks like a mule. I've also got 2 safes full of firearms and my go to gun to protect them all is a short barreled 12 ga. full of #4 Buck

Young Version
05-23-2009, 11:35 PM
They're handy and just about the quickest manually-operated-action rifles. The tube mag is the only thing that prevents them from being more viable as a SHTF rifle.

ro442173
05-23-2009, 11:46 PM
Why do you need a full auto in SHTF situation....LOL! I have a 357 L.A and I would use it as a go to..Its light, hits hard and up to 100 yards I'm good.......

I agree with this. Although, I'd prefer to have the option available for whatever unforseeable circumstance I might find myself in... just in case I do need to go full auto... not saying that I do have the capability now.

dmckean44
05-24-2009, 12:27 AM
I doubt that. Have you ever been to a SAS or some other type of cowboy action match? BTW, it's just as easy to convert a lever gun to FA as it is to convert an AR or AK and you don't need special auto sears or other machined parts. So, in a real SHTF scenario, a lever gun might be a whole lot better than an AK. But, that also depends on how competent the shooter is.

I don't think I want to be on either end of a lever gun going FA.

AfricanHunter
05-24-2009, 5:02 AM
I doubt that. Have you ever been to a SAS or some other type of cowboy action match? BTW, it's just as easy to convert a lever gun to FA as it is to convert an AR or AK and you don't need special auto sears or other machined parts. So, in a real SHTF scenario, a lever gun might be a whole lot better than an AK. But, that also depends on how competent the shooter is.

Care to explain that statement? I am guessing you dont mean FA in the typical sense as the loading/ejecting on a LG wouldnt allow this to be possible.

Okami
05-24-2009, 7:02 AM
While Gabe Suarez is a die hard AK guy, he seems to think that they can work well for most circumstances. http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?t=649 Btw, i'm an AK guy too, but i also have a lever action. :chris:

grahlaika
05-24-2009, 7:20 AM
I'm not sure what an FA lever rifle looks like (:13:), but I could definitely use my Marlin 336 as a 'go-to' in a pinch. Lite, portable, decent range and power, decent mag capacity - what's not to like? With the right loads you can even use it indoors without worrying about over-penetration. I'm getting a second one to convert to a 'tactical' model.

caldude
05-24-2009, 7:44 AM
While it's not my 'go-to' gun, it's definitely one of the guns going to a neighbor to help protect the neighborhood if the SHTF.

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 7:47 AM
I don't see why a lever gun and mating wheel gun wouldn't be a good setup for a SHTF scenario. A looped belt to hold ammo, one ammo type with the ability to use others (if setup properly), reliable actions, easily cleared in case of duds, etc.

It may not be the absolute best and ideal setup, but it is far and away from a bad setup.

dchang0
05-24-2009, 7:48 AM
My dad uses them almost exclusivly. He's a cowboy guy so all he uses is cowboy guns. I told him if SHTF he's going to have to use one of my AKs.

Better for him to use what he's been training with all these years--he probably can fire faster with his cowboy guns faster than with an AR (unless of course he gets some training with the AR).

thefurball
05-24-2009, 7:54 AM
The tube mag is the only thing that prevents them from being more viable as a SHTF rifle.

Agreed.

Picking up each round and poking it in the little hole (1... 2... 3... 4... ) in a high stress situation could prove problematic.

Kokopelli
05-24-2009, 8:00 AM
:useless:

.357 stable mates. The Marlin lever is my fun gun #1.

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk239/avmusician/Guns/Feb07008.jpg

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 8:14 AM
Agreed.

Picking up each round and poking it in the little hole (1... 2... 3... 4... ) in a high stress situation could prove problematic.

And that's any different from a shotgun or from a magazine loaded rifle how? I've seen pictures of guy who crammed magazine into their M16s (US mil) backwards to the point that the weapon was rendered unuseable. Round cartridge into a round hole, round shotgun shell into an elongated hole, square box into a square hole, etc.

High stress can cause ANY firearm to fail. Training is the key in that scenario.

tankerman
05-24-2009, 8:23 AM
thats a definite NO lolWhy is that funny, because the rifle is not all black?

Do you think you could do better with you AR in tight quarters in a house than someone trained with a levergun? Do you think that 223 is a better defensive round at short distances than some of the calibers leverguns are offered in, which include 357 mag, 45 Colt, 44 mag, 30-30 and 45-70?

ERdept
05-24-2009, 8:32 AM
I think they're great guns. I love levers. The only draw back it how slow they are in a close quarters, room clearing situation with 3-5 subjects in different hallways.

Tooo Sloooow.

sorensen440
05-24-2009, 8:33 AM
Its my go to deer gun

tankerman
05-24-2009, 9:11 AM
I think they're great guns. I love levers. The only draw back it how slow they are in a close quarters, room clearing situation with 3-5 subjects in different hallways.

Tooo Sloooow.Good thing my house doesn't have 5 hallways. Sounds like folks that live in mansions should avoid using them for defensive purposes. Never knew it took so long to work the action that you wouldn't have time to do it in between walking to different hallways in a mansion.:rolleyes:

I bet a pump shotgun is much faster.:rolleyes:

Thanks for the pro-opinion.:thumbsup:

DirtRacer151
05-24-2009, 9:20 AM
I think in a "shtf" situation i'd rather have something with low recoil and fast follow up shots. That said i also think after "shtf" and i was left in the wild with no modern resources i think i'd rather have my Marlin .444 with me at that point. Simple, reliable, super knock down power for hunting, and if the going get tough and im getting really hungry it tenderizes my shoulder for me :p

sierrawoodsman
05-24-2009, 9:22 AM
The winchester 94 30-30 is my favorite rifle of all time. everybody needs to have one. I killed the first of many deer with my Grandma's winchester. I shoot mine with fairly good accuracy (water bottles at 100 yards standing).

gtmmark
05-24-2009, 9:26 AM
In regards to the FA lever action, one of John M Browning's early experiments in automatic firearms was a coverted 1886 Winchester lever action. Although easly done it is also completely impractical.

CSACANNONEER
05-24-2009, 9:38 AM
Care to explain that statement? I am guessing you dont mean FA in the typical sense as the loading/ejecting on a LG wouldnt allow this to be possible.

Yes, I mean it is easy to convert a lever gun to fire continuously as long as the trigger is pulled. This was done and patented before the turn of the 20th century! It is really simple to do. I saw an article in an American Rifleman back in the late '70's or early '80's about this. Basically, you would attach a large flat plate, with a hole in it to let the bullet pass through it, on a hinge at the muzzle. As this plate catches the escaping gasses at the muzzle, it would be pushed down parrelle to the bore. This plate is connected to a rod which, in turn, is connected to the slightly modified lever mechanism. So, it cycles the action and fires again until the trigger is released. This mechanism is simple enough that it could be made with some scrap steel and tools found in almost any garage. I am posting this for educational purposes ONLY. Please, DO NOT try this unless you are a licensed manufacturer with a post dealer sample letter!

So, to all of you who didn't believe me: ...............................That's OK. The bottom line is that if some guy dressed up as a B movie cowboy can accurately shoot his lever gun as fast as many SAS shooters can, there is no need for this type of conversion. Instead, practice with your stock lever gun will make you very fast and accurate with it.

.454
05-24-2009, 9:43 AM
I've got a winchester 94 Trapper in 30.30 cool little gun, kicks like a mule.

Heh!
You never tried a Puma 92 in .454Casull
Or a Marlin Guide Gun in 45-70

DirtRacer151
05-24-2009, 9:44 AM
Yes, I mean it is easy to convert a lever gun to fire continuously as long as the trigger is pulled. This was done and patented before the turn of the 20th century! It is really simple to do. I saw an article in an American Rifleman back in the late '70's or early '80's about this. Basically, you would attach a large flat plate, with a hole in it to let the bullet pass through it, on a hinge at the muzzle. As this plate catches the escaping gasses at the muzzle, it would be pushed down parrelle to the bore. This plate is connected to a rod which, in turn, is connected to the slightly modified lever mechanism. So, it cycles the action and fires again until the trigger is released. This mechanism is simple enough that it could be made with some scrap steel and tools found in almost any garage. I am posting this for educational purposes ONLY. Please, DO NOT try this unless you are a licensed manufacturer with a post dealer sample letter!

So, to all of you who didn't believe me: ...............................

Lets see a vid or....It Didn't happen :43:

CSACANNONEER
05-24-2009, 9:47 AM
Lets see a vid or....It Didn't happen :43:

In regards to the FA lever action, one of John M Browning's early experiments in automatic firearms was a coverted 1886 Winchester lever action. Although easly done it is also completely impractical.

What more can I say. If you want to see one in action, go ask JMB!

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 9:47 AM
I love it when people think it's difficult to make FA firearms.

FA firearms have been around longer than semi-auto firearms for a reason. It's the select fires and semi-autos that are a pain in the ***...

BigDogatPlay
05-24-2009, 9:48 AM
FWIW, if I have to throw just a couple of guns in the trunk and head out the Marlin 1894c in .357 Mag along with one of my S&W revolvers is going to be the ticket. A looped belt full of cartridges along with all the speedloaders I have and four or five boxes of ammo and I'm pretty well set. If you allow me three guns then one of the 12 gauges goes along.

The .357 is potent enough in the little carbine to take any small to medium size game, and you can certainly fight with it.

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 9:49 AM
And in all fairness, just because JMB did it doesn't mean anything. He'd have won WWII with a soup can, a fork, and a couple rocks. Seriously, even McGuyver and Ethan Hawking get together every now and then and are like "How the **** did he do that?..."

Okami
05-24-2009, 10:08 AM
Think about what distances you would be using a rifle as a civilian in a DS mode. Less than 25m i would imagine depending on your area. If you were engaging a threat would you really try to put as many rounds down as possible or take aimed snap shots? Each one of those rounds is going somewhere and you may have to account for who/what they hit. Even in a hypothetical civil disturbance/shtf situation those rounds that don't hit your target may hit innocents. Even at ranges greater than 25m you may decide that it's better to break contact if it's possible.

Just sayin'

DirtRacer151
05-24-2009, 10:09 AM
What more can I say. If you want to see one in action, go ask JMB!

I was just hopingyou could provide a vid. It would be crazy to see!!

DirtRacer151
05-24-2009, 10:11 AM
And in all fairness, just because JMB did it doesn't mean anything. He'd have won WWII with a soup can, a fork, and a couple rocks. Seriously, even McGuyver and Ethan Hawking get together every now and then and are like "How the **** did he do that?..."

haha ok so i cant figure out who JMB is. Are we talking about browning?

thefurball
05-24-2009, 10:21 AM
And that's any different from a shotgun or from a magazine loaded rifle how?

Shotgun - no difference.
Magazine - different in that it is not one...round...at...a...time.
I save that routine for loading the magazines prior to needing them.

I've seen pictures of guy who crammed magazine into their M16s (US mil) backwards to the point that the weapon was rendered unuseable.

No doubt. High stress can cause otherwise well trained individuals to loose it completely.

Training is the key...

Agreed. Practice practice practice! :thumbsup:

slowjonn
05-24-2009, 10:47 AM
Hhhhmmm....my go-to gun is whatever one is closest at the time I need it. But a lever/ revolver combo in the same caliber is not a bad choice at all. I love my '94 in 30-30. i have recently been bitten by the bug to get a 1873 repo and a SAA in .45LC.

I would much rather go up against a herd of gang bangers with FA weapons than a few guys from the country with their lever guns!

thefurball
05-24-2009, 10:58 AM
I would much rather go up against a herd of gang bangers with FA weapons than a few guys from the country with their lever guns!


:rofl2: Agree! The gang bangers are generally too busy trying to look tough or make sure that their latest tatoo is showing well for the news cameras to aim properly.

X-NewYawker
05-24-2009, 11:04 AM
in a total "Obama-SA turn them in a la Austrailia" ban situation, a 13 shot .44 magnum or 45 Colt Lever action would be the bomb. Guys will say, "That will never happen" (Did you ever think the gov't would in a few short months basically reverse 200 years of economics and take over the US car industry, the banks, the credit card companies and the medical system?) but Teddy Rooselevt said, "if you're perpared for trouble you won't have any."

That's why I got this stainless EMF -- just in case... They are accurate, fast to fire, no slower to reload than a shotgun and easy to maneuver.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p54/Fasanoland/_MG_7879.jpg
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p54/Fasanoland/_MG_7888.jpg
That .45 caliber hole means business from hereto 75 yards, further out is what tactical bolt guns are for...

sorensen440
05-24-2009, 11:06 AM
Yes, I mean it is easy to convert a lever gun to fire continuously as long as the trigger is pulled. This was done and patented before the turn of the 20th century! It is really simple to do. I saw an article in an American Rifleman back in the late '70's or early '80's about this. Basically, you would attach a large flat plate, with a hole in it to let the bullet pass through it, on a hinge at the muzzle. As this plate catches the escaping gasses at the muzzle, it would be pushed down parrelle to the bore. This plate is connected to a rod which, in turn, is connected to the slightly modified lever mechanism. So, it cycles the action and fires again until the trigger is released. This mechanism is simple enough that it could be made with some scrap steel and tools found in almost any garage. I am posting this for educational purposes ONLY. Please, DO NOT try this unless you are a licensed manufacturer with a post dealer sample letter!

So, to all of you who didn't believe me: ...............................That's OK. The bottom line is that if some guy dressed up as a B movie cowboy can accurately shoot his lever gun as fast as many SAS shooters can, there is no need for this type of conversion. Instead, practice with your stock lever gun will make you very fast and accurate with it.
Capacity is the only limitation I see with a lever gun

and this fa lever gun sounds significantly tougher to do then a fa sear or a LL

X-NewYawker
05-24-2009, 11:11 AM
The key is you don't need FA with 230 grain bullets you want aimed fire, not suppressive spraying and praying. Work that lever and put one round in each zombie's head.

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 11:21 AM
I just had a great thought....

You know the next time some random DOJ JBT inspects a gun at a gun range they are going to be meat mitting some poor guys lever gun and looking at it from every angle with that confussed "...how the f..." look on their face.


As for JMB, that would John Moses Browning. Arguably one of the greatest inventors of the last two centuries and he didn't even graduate high school.


And to thefurball, I'm not trying to say you're wrong or even attack your opinion. I too am of the mindset that a semi-auto magazine firearm is the best option out there at this time. But it too has it's drawbacks and requires dedicated training for it to be an effective tool in the hands of it's user. Getting the magazine in the gun isn't the end of your troubles; frequently it's just the start. Like I said, I've seen AR mags put in reverse to where it required power tools to get the magazine out. I've seen people doing high speed drills, slap a magazine home, get on target, pull the trigger to have the gun fire and the mag fall to the floor. I've seen someone smack the bottom of their magazine to seat it properly, only to rip off the 'ranger' style floor plate and have the spring, follower, and all the cartridges dump to the floor. I've seen pictures of several people who haved slipped and fallen on their belt pouch hard enough to crush the magazine that the cartridges were bound and the rifle became a single shot then reload to new magazine rifle. Not to mention the numerous other occurances that can occur, like stack surge and having it dump rounds through the feed lips, nose diving, etc.

Again, I think the semi-auto magazine fed platforms are the best there is right now, but they still have flaws and defects. A well trained marksman with a single shot .22 would be more dangerous than your random gang banger with a FA. It may be inferrior in some regards but that does not mean it is obsolete.

Grumpyoldretiredcop
05-24-2009, 11:25 AM
There's a lot to be said, even in a SHTF situation, for a lever action carbine and handgun chambered for the same cartridge. I suppose the same could be said for having an AR and an AR pistol or an AK and an AK pistol if all we're considering is logistics... :D

CSACANNONEER
05-24-2009, 11:46 AM
Capacity is the only limitation I see with a lever gun

and this fa lever gun sounds significantly tougher to do then a fa sear or a LL

Capacity would be an issue and personally, I would not want any FA in a SHTF situation because, I could only carry a limited number of rounds anyway. So, why waste them on FA? Anyway, JMB's design could be made with scrap metal and a little know how but, a FA sear and making it fit a firearm would require much more exacting tolerances and parts that can not be made at most homes. OK, I'm not talking about a shoestring, paperclip or lightening links but instead, I'm talking about permanent alterations that can be made with a few hand tools and a scrap metal pile.

M. Sage
05-24-2009, 11:57 AM
Agreed.

Picking up each round and poking it in the little hole (1... 2... 3... 4... ) in a high stress situation could prove problematic.

If you're in an encounter where you need more than the tube mag on a lever gun will give you, you're likely in an encounter where you'll be dead before it gets to that point anyway.

Shoot and scoot in SHTF, not stand your ground and die.

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 12:18 PM
My levergun is my go-to gun. I have complete confidence in it, particularly with 240gr loads and it looks completely innocent and inconspicuous. I just took it out shooting yesterday and I was showing my group the more practical side of the levergun. With a little practice you can really light up the range. I was doing speed shooting at 25, 60, 70 and 80 yds and I was pretty damned accurate. That rifle feels like an extension of my body whenever I use it. It is light, easily carried, easy to maintain, practical, cheap, pretty damned sexy (if you ask me), etc. Like an SKS, everyone should have a levergun.

As practical and lethal as the levergun is though, having a back up gun is a good idea. Fortunately, I have a choice between my Browning Hi-Power, Bulgarian Makarov and the Tracker as BUGs.

FLIGHT762
05-24-2009, 12:19 PM
Lets see a vid or....It Didn't happen :43:

Here you go:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX2oZ6Kv_qo

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 12:22 PM
The winchester 94 30-30 is my favorite rifle of all time. everybody needs to have one. I killed the first of many deer with my Grandma's winchester. I shoot mine with fairly good accuracy (water bottles at 100 yards standing).

Your grandma is automatically cool.

If she makes good cookies, she is even cooler ;)

Okami
05-24-2009, 12:38 PM
+1:chris:
If you're in an encounter where you need more than the tube mag on a lever gun will give you, you're likely in an encounter where you'll be dead before it gets to that point anyway.

Shoot and scoot in SHTF, not stand your ground and die.

Crusader
05-24-2009, 12:43 PM
If I had a lever action rifle, I would have no hesitation in using it in SHTF scenarios. Just look at Shaun of the Dead, that rifle did wonders for them. Actually, no it didn't because he was a horrible shot at 10 feet.
But still, it didn't jam...

My only thing with a lever action is that if I want a high capacity, I would need to run it in a pistol cartidge, but if I want power, I only get a few in the tube. But I suppose I would get one in .357 mag.

1859sharps
05-24-2009, 12:48 PM
CSACannon, was going to come to your defense on the FA lever gun. others beat me to it. The young pup's scoffing at you aren't up on their history ;)

Don't under estimate the value of a good lever gun or bolt action for personal defense. These type of rifles are not as obsolete as you might think.

even in the worst shtf scenario, the vast majority of us are not going to be house clearing or holding off human wave attacks. your basic survival needs are more then covered with a solid lever gun or bolt action.

Now so you don't think I am anti semi auto rifle (which I am not), I can think of a few semi rifles that might give a little extra warm and fuzzy feeling in this situation, however none are 223 or 762x39 based.

God Bless The Mauser
05-24-2009, 1:17 PM
On Resident Evil Extinction they had a lever action they were using and that would be the the ultimate SHTF situation.

Mssr. Eleganté
05-24-2009, 1:49 PM
My only thing with a lever action is that if I want a high capacity, I would need to run it in a pistol cartidge, but if I want power, I only get a few in the tube. But I suppose I would get one in .357 mag.

Forget .357Mag. Just get a Puma 1892 clone in .44Mag with a 10 round magazine.

http://www.legacysports.com/images/_products/PUM_M92.jpg

God Bless The Mauser
05-24-2009, 2:05 PM
I envy that my dad pretty much only has 2 calibers to reload and find ammo for, .45LC and 44 magnum, I've lost track of how many calibers I have, its a logistics nighmare. There is not disputing the stopping power of those rounds, we were shooting steel with .45LC one day and it sounded like it was getting hit by a sledge hammer. The issue with the lever actions is range, at 100 yards I was spotting for my dad and the rounds were starting to drop before they hit the target but, it was a short trapper carbine, the regular carbine did a little better, I've been telling him he needs to get one of the rifles with tang mounted sights.

MikeinnLA
05-24-2009, 2:22 PM
I'd put Lucas McCain up against Rambo any day of the week. Watch some SASS Cowboy tournaments if you want to see some really fast lever gun shooting. I'd really like a Marlin in .357 and/or .44 mag, but since I haven't seen .357 or .44 mag AMMO in the past 6 months, there's no rush.

Mike

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 3:36 PM
Forget .357Mag. Just get a Puma 1892 clone in .44Mag with a 10 round magazine.

http://www.legacysports.com/images/_products/PUM_M92.jpg

That is the gun I have, but in SS. I will get a picture of it with my Trapper sometime in the next week.

phamkl
05-24-2009, 4:34 PM
I would not mind at all having a .44 magnum lever gun if the SHTF. It's plenty fast and shoots harder than most SHTF semi-automatics.

I'd rather have a .308 autoloader but I wouldn't feel like I'm compromising if I picked up a lever gun.

jazman
05-24-2009, 4:40 PM
Here is my SS (bead blasted) .357 Trapper. Customized, slicked up, safety removed, etc, by Nate Kiowa Jones the Rossi 92 expert. I have a butt cuff for it that holds 6 rounds, makes it a great and legal trunk/car/truck gun. Fast loading to get ready if needed, and the 16 inch barrel makes it easy in any space. Great little gun, I really like this one.
http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/ff199/jazman23/DSC01392.jpg

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 4:55 PM
You also have to remember that 9 times out of 10 in a SHTF scenario, you are not playing Terminator style one man against everything. It's more like Get the **** out of Dodge and save your family. If that means dropping out of the urban areas for several months or more, than that's what you need to do. Things like wild animals, especially predators, because the biggest issue. Bear attacks will be especially dangerous, so it would be a great idea, if traveling in small numbers, to have someone with either a slug gun or a larger caliber bolt/lever gun to take down bears.

I forget who originally posted it (I want to say Ivan but I think I may be wrong on that one) but this Youtube video really made it quite clear that lever actions, just like all firearms, can serve a purpose in an arsenal when used properly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-AVr7gNmrU&feature=related

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 5:10 PM
Why is that funny, because the rifle is not all black?

Do you think you could do better with you AR in tight quarters in a house than someone trained with a levergun? Do you think that 223 is a better defensive round at short distances than some of the calibers leverguns are offered in, which include 357 mag, 45 Colt, 44 mag, 30-30 and 45-70?

Maybe, just maybe because I sold it :confused::confused::confused: just maybe, so yeah I can do A LOT better with my 10/22 than the Lever gun I dont have.


also, I would rather have my AR inside rather than a lever gun, something about a quick 10-30 rounds compared to my 7 .30-30

tombinghamthegreat
05-24-2009, 5:30 PM
also, I would rather have my AR inside rather than a lever gun, something about a quick 10-30 rounds compared to my 7 .30-30

+1. Lever guns can be cool and useful for hunting but it is not a go to gun for SHTF,trunk gun or home defense. I would take my shotgun or my AK style rifle over a lever action gun any day but that's just my personal choice.

TheBundo
05-24-2009, 5:47 PM
I had a 44 lever and revolver combo 30+ years ago. Now I had a 357 revolver, so I want a 357 lever to match. I have a chance to get a new Puma for $399. Sounds like a good deal, but I've never had a Puma. How does it compare to the Marlin? Oh, and 3 cheers for Lucas McCain

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 6:19 PM
I had a 44 lever and revolver combo 30+ years ago. Now I had a 357 revolver, so I want a 357 lever to match. I have a chance to get a new Puma for $399. Sounds like a good deal, but I've never had a Puma. How does it compare to the Marlin? Oh, and 3 cheers for Lucas McCain

Go for the Puma. Marlins are nice but the open top of the 1892 is just SOOO much nicer. I got my 1892 after experiencing the inconvenient jams of the 1894, as the 1894 was designed for long rifle cartridges, not short pistol cartridges. It has been blissful ever since. :)

GO PUMA!

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 6:30 PM
Here is my SS (bead blasted) .357 Trapper. Customized, slicked up, safety removed, etc, by Nate Kiowa Jones the Rossi 92 expert. I have a butt cuff for it that holds 6 rounds, makes it a great and legal trunk/car/truck gun. Fast loading to get ready if needed, and the 16 inch barrel makes it easy in any space. Great little gun, I really like this one.
http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/ff199/jazman23/DSC01392.jpg

I am so stoked that other people on this forum love leverguns too. WOO HOO! :)

Next time I am out with mine, I am taking a picture. ;)

DirtRacer151
05-24-2009, 6:31 PM
Lever guns have their place and all and i love shooting mine. In a SHTF event i think any gun you can use to solve the problem is a wise choice. Lets be honest guys. The military uses semi auto carbines for a reason though. The most highly trained cowboy shooter against Chris costa would be a no brainer. Chris would "bust em" no doubt. I can never see our military giving a contract to Marlin for the navy seals LMAO. Yes, an experienced lever shooter can handle many situations with speed and accuracy.. i'd have to say most of us regular civilians though would fare better with a semi auto mag fed gun. Sure theres a lot to go wrong with mag fed weapons but i'd love to see one of you hardcore lever guys try to clear a backward 45-70 round in the tube of your gun. Give it up guys. The best gun for the job is the one that YOU are comfortable with. Mine just happens to be my pink AR15 for my girlfriend. The zombies dont even look twice before they run :p I do lovez me some old school lever action at the range though and have even thought about doing a cowboy shoot for fun sometime because it looks so bad ***. Actually i just wanna dress up like them one time haha looks fun

Two Shots
05-24-2009, 7:05 PM
Care to explain that statement? I am guessing you dont mean FA in the typical sense as the loading/ejecting on a LG wouldnt allow this to be possible.

I believe he's talking about this.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1354017079367711775

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 7:11 PM
7shots, VS. 30 shots, hmmmm. so easy a caveman could do it right?

TheBundo
05-24-2009, 7:14 PM
I believe he's talking about this.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1354017079367711775

That's can't be it. That hardly qualifies as FA. All Mike has done in that video is what The Rifleman did, had a thumbscrew in the truggerguard that he can turn in to cause the trigger to be tripped as the lever closes

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 7:20 PM
That's can't be it. That hardly qualifies as FA. All Mike has done in that video is what The Rifleman did, had a thumbscrew in the truggerguard that he can turn in to cause the trigger to be tripped as the lever closes

wouldnt a full auto lever gun kinda be a oxy-moron? I mean I dont know what Bronings idea was/looked like but still if you have to use the lever to cycle a round then its not FA:confused: im I just seeing it wrong?

Quiet
05-24-2009, 7:25 PM
SHTF? I'll use whatever I can get my hands on.

A friend of mine's goto long gun is a Winchester Model 94A in .44Magnum.

If capacity is an issue?
Remember that under CA law, lever-action tube fed rifles are exempt from the large capacity magazine laws.
So, extend the magazine capacity if you can and post pics. It might get impractical, but it'll be fun to see. ;)

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 7:27 PM
You guys are missing the concept.

They're not talking about opperating the action quickly, they are talking a conversion, similar to the Mk1/Pederson conversion for the Springfield 1903 except it wouldn't alter the caliber of the lever gun. It's already been explained; essentially a tipping arm on a hinge connected to a spring loaded op rod that opperates the bolt and fires on closing. The lever is taken out of the equation - or rather it is elongated, runs down the length of the gun, and is actuated by muzzle blast rather than by hand.

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 7:30 PM
SHTF? I'll use whatever I can get my hands on.

A friend of mine's goto long gun is a Winchester Model 94A in .44Magnum.

If capacity is an issue?
Remember that under CA law, lever-action tube fed rifles are exempt from the large capacity magazine laws.
So, extend the magazine capacity if you can and post pics. It might get impractical, but it'll be fun to see. ;)

That's when you modify it to use a PP-19 Bizon style tubular feeding device. ;)

tankerman
05-24-2009, 7:31 PM
7shots, VS. 30 shots, hmmmm. so easy a caveman could do it right?Where did you get 30 shots from? You're new to this game, so you wouldn't be in posession of 30 round mags right?:rolleyes:

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 7:35 PM
Where did you get 30 shots from? You're new to this game, so you wouldn't be in posession of 30 round mags right?:rolleyes:

right, but im sure with the collapse of the world as we know it there wont be 30 rd mags laying around, which under if you find there are no legal sanctions to destroy them :D

bussda
05-24-2009, 7:36 PM
haha ok so i cant figure out who JMB is. Are we talking about browning?

Yes

I was just hopingyou could provide a vid. It would be crazy to see!!

Lets see a vid or....It Didn't happen :43:

Got a time machine?

Browning was out shooting/hunting one day and he noticed the muzzle gases pushing the grass down in front of the rifle. He got to wondering how much energy was going out that way, so he quit shooting for the day and went into the shop. Made the device as earlier described. He started with a lever gun because he was the one who significantly improved the Winchester line after its initial introduction.

The end of the process was the M1919(?) (.30 cal), and later the M2 (.50 cal.) machine guns.

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 7:36 PM
SHTF? I'll use whatever I can get my hands on.

A friend of mine's goto long gun is a Winchester Model 94A in .44Magnum.

If capacity is an issue?
Remember that under CA law, lever-action tube fed rifles are exempt from the large capacity magazine laws.
So, extend the magazine capacity if you can and post pics. It might get impractical, but it'll be fun to see. ;)

Tottaly off topic but what about tube fed semi autos, I have never looked into that lol

CSACANNONEER
05-24-2009, 7:38 PM
7shots, VS. 30 shots, hmmmm. so easy a caveman could do it right?

30 rounds? That's it? I've got 250 cloth belts for my 1919 but, I'd still take a good lever gun instead of a 30 round spray and pray AK.

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 7:40 PM
You guys are missing the concept.

They're not talking about opperating the action quickly, they are talking a conversion, similar to the Mk1/Pederson conversion for the Springfield 1903 except it wouldn't alter the caliber of the lever gun. It's already been explained; essentially a tipping arm on a hinge connected to a spring loaded op rod that opperates the bolt and fires on closing. The lever is taken out of the equation - or rather it is elongated, runs down the length of the gun, and is actuated by muzzle blast rather than by hand.

So its no longer a lever gun, it is a semi-automatic tube fed gun lol

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 7:42 PM
30 rounds? That's it? I've got 250 cloth belts for my 1919 but, I'd still take a good lever gun instead of a 30 round spray and pray AK.

haha, that works to, but im thinking short term urban fighting, If its the end of the world everyone is a happy go lucky and you just need a gun for hunting self protection then fine a .357 or .44mag would be great but LA riots I want to spray and pray or whip out a 1919 lol

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 7:55 PM
Tottaly off topic but what about tube fed semi autos, I have never looked into that lol

Ruger .44mag Carbine is one good example.

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 8:01 PM
Ruger .44mag Carbine is one good example.

No like do I still have to fallow the 10 rd rule?

VegasND
05-24-2009, 8:06 PM
The 'lever action' type auto and semi-auto arms included rifles, pistols, and most famously, the 1895 'Potato Digger'
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/colt-machine-gun-potato-digger/3514459991
I've seen pictures of the others, but the 1895 is the only one I've actually seen in action. I don't know if any others made it into production.

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 8:11 PM
The 'lever action' type auto and semi-auto arms included rifles, pistols, and most famously, the 1895 'Potato Digger'
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/colt-machine-gun-potato-digger/3514459991
I've seen pictures of the others, but the 1895 is the only one I've actually seen in action. I don't know if any others made it into production.

I see why that would be considered a lever auto gun but still, Im not seeing it

Ishoot
05-24-2009, 8:13 PM
I have a Marlin 30-30 that I love to shoot...never really thought of it as my go to gun in a SHTF situation but I would definitely rather have it than without.

chsk9
05-24-2009, 8:19 PM
Agreed.

Picking up each round and poking it in the little hole (1... 2... 3... 4... ) in a high stress situation could prove problematic.

I'm guessing you've never shot SASS with rifle reloads... not to say it doesn't increase the blood pressure a bit!

VegasND
05-24-2009, 8:20 PM
I see why that would be considered a lever auto gun but still, Im not seeing it
Just face it, while it would be possible to convert a lever to gas operation, why would anybody do so today? Browning worked with what he had as a prototype. The semi-auto pistol I saw (not in person, on film) had the lever on top of the barrel and popped up and down as the pistol was fired, and I don't remember what the caliber was. If/ When SHTF, you're not opening a machine shop, you're working with what you've got.

If the only thing available to me is a lever (bolt, single-shot)--I'm using it...

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 8:27 PM
Just face it, while it would be possible to convert a lever to gas operation, why would anybody do so today? Browning worked with what he had as a prototype. The semi-auto pistol I saw (not in person, on film) had the lever on top of the barrel and popped up and down as the pistol was fired, and I don't remember what the caliber was. If/ When SHTF, you're not opening a machine shop, you're working with what you've got.

If the only thing available to me is a lever (bolt, single-shot)--I'm using it...

I agree, I think lol

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 8:28 PM
No like do I still have to fallow the 10 rd rule?

Tube feeds are exempt.

Axewound
05-24-2009, 8:39 PM
man i want a lever action in 460 S&W to go with my revolver

Quiet
05-24-2009, 8:41 PM
Tottaly off topic but what about tube fed semi autos, I have never looked into that lol

Needs to be lever action. Unless it is a .22, then it can be semi-auto, bolt-action, lever-action or pump-action.



Penal Code 12020
(c)(25) As used in this section, "large-capacity magazine" means any ammunition feeding device with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds, but shall not be construed to include any of the following:
(A) A feeding device that has been permanently altered so that it cannot accommodate more than 10 rounds.
(B) A .22 caliber tube ammunition feeding device.
(C) A tubular magazine that is contained in a lever-action firearm.

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 9:14 PM
man i want a lever action in 460 S&W to go with my revolver

Now THAT would be interesting. The biggest I have seen is .50 Alaskan. http://www.leveractions.com/leveractions.htm

You could always ditch the .460 and go to a .454 Casull, that is a KILLER cartridge with some lethal characteristics. Taurus Raging Bull or Ruger Redhawk plus a Puma 92 .454= Good to go.

Got to shoot the Puma .480 Ruger Trapper and .454 Casull Standard 20" as well as two .44s (Winchester Trapper 94AE and my current Puma 92 Trapper) and they are all a joy.

pullnshoot25
05-24-2009, 9:19 PM
Needs to be lever action. Unless it is a .22, then it can be semi-auto, bolt-action, lever-action or pump-action.



Penal Code 12020
(c)(25) As used in this section, "large-capacity magazine" means any ammunition feeding device with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds, but shall not be construed to include any of the following:
(A) A feeding device that has been permanently altered so that it cannot accommodate more than 10 rounds.
(B) A .22 caliber tube ammunition feeding device.
(C) A tubular magazine that is contained in a lever-action firearm.

What about the Taurus Thunderbolt? That is Cali legal and accepts more than 10rds IIRC and it is a pump. PLUS, you can get them in this state.

dmckean44
05-24-2009, 9:53 PM
Needs to be lever action. Unless it is a .22, then it can be semi-auto, bolt-action, lever-action or pump-action.



Penal Code 12020
(c)(25) As used in this section, "large-capacity magazine" means any ammunition feeding device with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds, but shall not be construed to include any of the following:
(B) A .22 caliber tube ammunition feeding device.

Now we just need tube fed ARs. It doesn't say anthing about .22 LR just .22 caliber.

tankerman
05-24-2009, 10:15 PM
Let's not forget that all lever actions are tube fed. I've got a non-tube fed levergun.

Winchester 1895, fixed magazzine
Winchester 88, 100 - Hell make a hi-cap for them.

NeoWeird
05-24-2009, 10:24 PM
Now we just need tube fed ARs. It doesn't say anthing about .22 LR just .22 caliber.

Problem arises that the point of a bullet behind a loaded cartridge can set off the bullet in front of it. I doubt you'd want to see a half dozen high pressure rifle cartridges go off at the same time in a thin sheet metal tube just a couple inches from the underside of your arm, inner neck, and face.

tankerman
05-24-2009, 10:27 PM
Problem arises that the point of a bullet behind a loaded cartridge can set off the bullet in front of it. I doubt you'd want to see a half dozen high pressure rifle cartridges go off at the same time in a thin sheet metal tube just a couple inches from the underside of your arm, inner neck, and face.
http://www.hornady.com/story.php?s=198

God Bless The Mauser
05-24-2009, 10:29 PM
The Hornady leverevolution rounds are pretty neat.

Texas Boy
05-24-2009, 10:35 PM
I'm a big lever gun fan. There are a number of guns ready to rock in my safe - and which one I grab will probably depend on the situation and my mindset at the time. However, the only gun I've ever carried in a real situation where my life depended on it was my Alaskan co-pilot (a modified Marlin 1895 in 457 Wild West Magnum - a version of 45-70 that shots a 350gr bullet at 2200fps for 3760 ft lbs:eek:! By comparison a magnum 12 gauge slug is only 2361 ft lbs, and a standard 45-70 is 1590 ft lbs):

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/2939538906_3432404330_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3056/2938686595_efb9366ea1_o.jpg

This gun was my constant companion for several weeks in the Alaskan back country as I explored the state in a small plane. Four in the tube, one in the chamber and half cocked at all times. Something about being north of the arctic circle hundreds of miles from any town in a small tent on the tundra...I wana go back!!!!

Before the trip I spent some quality range time with this gun - I could easily put all 5 in a milk jug at 100 yards, off hand, inside of 5 seconds starting with the gun slung over my shoulder. Of course you would need a Chiropractor afterward if you tried that with the big loads. Truth be told, I only ever fired 3 of the 457 Mag loads - that was enough. Standard 45-70 loads are mild by comparison.

[Edit] I should also mention it fires 410 shotgun shells too! Use the bullets for defense, and the shells for anything you want to be able to recognize afterward.

forgiven
05-24-2009, 10:38 PM
:no:but I do enjoy shooting my levers.

forgiven
05-24-2009, 10:39 PM
I'm a big lever gun fan. There are a number of guns ready to rock in my safe - and which one I grab will probably depend on the situation and my mindset at the time. However, the only gun I've ever carried in a real situation where my life depended on it was my Alaskan co-pilot (a modified Marlin 1895 in 457 Wild West Magnum - a version of 45-70 that shots a 350gr bullet at 2200fps for 3760 ft lbs:eek:! By comparison a magnum 12 gauge slug is only 2361 ft lbs, and a standard 45-70 is 1590 ft lbs):

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/2939538906_3432404330_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3056/2938686595_efb9366ea1_o.jpg

This gun was my constant companion for several weeks in the Alaskan back country as I explored the state in a small plane. Four in the tube, one in the chamber and half cocked at all times. Something about being north of the arctic circle hundreds of miles from any town in a small tent on the tundra...I wana go back!!!!

Before the trip I spent some quality range time with this gun - I could easily put all 5 in a milk jug at 100 yards, off hand, inside of 5 seconds starting with the gun slung over my shoulder. Of course you would need a Chiropractor afterward if you tried that with the big loads. Truth be told, I only ever fired 3 of the 457 Mag loads - that was enough. Standard 45-70 loads are mild by comparison.

Wow!!!

God Bless The Mauser
05-24-2009, 10:40 PM
I was watching one of gun shows on the Outdoor Channel, I think it was one of the Best Defense episodes and they were talking about the practical use of the lever actions for home defense. They were also showing some of the tactical stuff which I thought was a little funny looking on a lever action, rails with a light and red dot. Pretty interesting stuff though. I liked the look of the black stock with a stainless rifle.

tankerman
05-24-2009, 10:40 PM
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/2939538906_3432404330_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3056/2938686595_efb9366ea1_o.jpg

Didn't know they made those sights in stainless, mine are black.

Any problem with glare?

Texas Boy
05-24-2009, 10:48 PM
Didn't know they made those sights in stainless, mine are black.

Any problem with glare?

Nope. Wild West guns offers a few different finishes - mine is "satin hard chrome". The ghost ring is actually black and the front bead is fluorescent - even in bright sunlight I've never noticed any glare.

BTW - once I work up a cheap load for this gun I'm gona take it to the Chabot tactical rifle comp! The 4 round tube will make it slow, but should be fun!

Futurecollector
05-24-2009, 11:17 PM
TB (haha funny initals)

That is the COOLEAT lever gun I have ever seen, I want one, where can I get one?

pullnshoot25
05-25-2009, 12:24 AM
TB (haha funny initals)

That is the COOLEAT lever gun I have ever seen, I want one, where can I get one?

Wildwestguns.com. Be prepared to shell out a pretty penny. If you beat your ticket you might not want to get your 1911 :)

pullnshoot25
05-25-2009, 12:26 AM
Let's not forget that all lever actions are tube fed. I've got a non-tube fed levergun.

Winchester 1895, fixed magazzine
Winchester 88, 100 - Hell make a hi-cap for them.

I had a Savage 99 in .300 Savage in my possession for about 5 hours before I sold it. Beautiful rifle that I snagged through Craigslist. No tube feed either and completely 100% badass!

pullnshoot25
05-25-2009, 12:28 AM
I'm a big lever gun fan. There are a number of guns ready to rock in my safe - and which one I grab will probably depend on the situation and my mindset at the time. However, the only gun I've ever carried in a real situation where my life depended on it was my Alaskan co-pilot (a modified Marlin 1895 in 457 Wild West Magnum - a version of 45-70 that shots a 350gr bullet at 2200fps for 3760 ft lbs:eek:! By comparison a magnum 12 gauge slug is only 2361 ft lbs, and a standard 45-70 is 1590 ft lbs):

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/2939538906_3432404330_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3056/2938686595_efb9366ea1_o.jpg

This gun was my constant companion for several weeks in the Alaskan back country as I explored the state in a small plane. Four in the tube, one in the chamber and half cocked at all times. Something about being north of the arctic circle hundreds of miles from any town in a small tent on the tundra...I wana go back!!!!

Before the trip I spent some quality range time with this gun - I could easily put all 5 in a milk jug at 100 yards, off hand, inside of 5 seconds starting with the gun slung over my shoulder. Of course you would need a Chiropractor afterward if you tried that with the big loads. Truth be told, I only ever fired 3 of the 457 Mag loads - that was enough. Standard 45-70 loads are mild by comparison.

[Edit] I should also mention it fires 410 shotgun shells too! Use the bullets for defense, and the shells for anything you want to be able to recognize afterward.

That is a beautiful gun. It makes me happy :)

Kokopelli
05-25-2009, 7:05 AM
As a cool aside, the Turks decimated the Russian army at Plevna with lever action rifles. You can read about it here:

http://www.militaryrifles.com/Turkey/Plevna/ThePlevnaDelay.html (The Plevna Delay)

And here:
http://www.xenophon-mil.org/milhist/modern/russoturk.htm (Russo-Turkish War)

Small numbers of Turks in trenches were easily over*come and allowed to flee. Resistance seemed to have ended. The Russian infantry walked right into the town, acting like visiting tourists. Osman Pasha, who had carefully concealed his main force inside houses and barns and behind other sheltered locations, allowed the Russians to enter the town in considerable numbers before springing the trap. With a bugle signal, the Turks revealed themselves and began pouring massive rifle fire into the startled Russians. Only a small number of those who made it into Plevna man*aged to escape the town. Their leader, Maj. Gen. Knorring, fell as did the commander of the Archangel Rgt., Col. Rosenbaum. At virtually point-blank range, the Winchesters had poured out the majority of the bullets, and the Peabody-Martinis kept up a lingering long-range fire upon the retreating Russians. Turkish losses were only 12 killed and 30 wounded. In this first battle at Plevna. Russian losses amounted to 74 officers and 2,771 men who fell in a fire fight that lasted only 15-20 minutes. They left behind on the field 17 wagons of ammunition.

So, it appears that a lever action is fast enough for homeland security. =)

MrTenX
05-25-2009, 9:04 AM
May not be first choice, but I like to have options.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y134/MrTenX/Guns%20and%20stuff/HPIM1587.jpg

Gotta admit, it's a lot more sheeple and LEO friendly than an AR that many preceive as a machinegun.

1894 Marlin .44 Mag.

Ashley Express sights
Safety removed
One piece firing pin
Replaced factory plastic mag. follower with SS follower
Action slicked up

Ammo- Handloads with max charge of Alliant 2400 with Hornady 240 gr. XTP's and a heavy crimp.

oddjob
05-25-2009, 10:52 AM
I do have several 10-22's, but for me my Browning BL-22 is my secondary/backup rifle (family member weapon). Its accurate, fast, lots of light weight ammo, and I don't have to worry about spare mags. My S&W M-63, 4" is it's companion.

1859sharps
05-25-2009, 11:57 AM
As with many SHTF discussions, I guess it all depends on what SHTF turns out to be.

If you mean fight your way out of New Orleans after a devastating hurricane to a safe zone, lever gun might not be the best choice.

If you mean an Apocalyptic collapse of society. you might want to give that ol' lever gun or bolt gun a second look.

in the second scenario, you need as close to a one gun do it all as you can. AR/AK doesn't really fall into this category.

Oh, an yes, Browning made a full auto lever gun. Full auto in the literal sense. Not just working the lever fast. I can't remember which, but it was either guns and ammo or American riflemen ran an article on this back in the 90's. Had pictures and everything. Others have already explained how it was done.

pullnshoot25
05-25-2009, 12:05 PM
May not be first choice, but I like to have options.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y134/MrTenX/Guns%20and%20stuff/HPIM1587.jpg

Gotta admit, it's a lot more sheeple and LEO friendly than an AR that many preceive as a machinegun.

1894 Marlin .44 Mag.

Ashley Express sights
Safety removed
One piece firing pin
Replaced factory plastic mag. follower with SS follower
Action slicked up


Exactly. I bet I could walk down the street carrying my levergun and not have a bunch of people freak out, as most people that I show it to think it isn't real at first.. Little do they know...

drdanno84
05-25-2009, 12:13 PM
24076

24077

hawk81
05-25-2009, 12:51 PM
SHTF scenario. I am going with an ar-15. No bullet button.

Kokopelli
05-25-2009, 12:57 PM
24076

24077

Cool! Do you own that autographed photo?

I have some old original photos of Roy Rogers & Trigger.

Futurecollector
05-25-2009, 1:34 PM
Wildwestguns.com. Be prepared to shell out a pretty penny. If you beat your ticket you might not want to get your 1911 :)

Yeah, I guess ill just stick with a donation to CGF, and my 1911.... Hoperfully :thumbsup:

Okami
05-25-2009, 3:08 PM
I don't think anyone is saying that a Lever Action is the best rifle for taking down zombies and chasing down bad guys running around in your house, what i was origionally looking for whas who actually uses one as their go to rifle and what are thier thoughs on it. My LA isn't my go to rifle atm, but if something happens that that is what's available, information that's shared by users would be nice to hear.

For some people that may be all they have, let's get some info in this thread on users thoughts on ancillary equipment, ammunition used, and additions to the rifle and what works. :)

tankerman
05-25-2009, 3:39 PM
For some people that may be all they have, let's get some info in this thread on users thoughts on ancillary equipment, ammunition used, and additions to the rifle and what works. :)Ok, Marlin 1895 GG 18.5" barrel, ghost ring sights, 45/70 - 530 grain LRFN/GC hard cast.

Back-up Winchester 1907 351 S.L.R. 180 grain LRN W/2-10 round mags.

drdanno84
05-25-2009, 3:43 PM
24088

24089

24090

pullnshoot25
05-25-2009, 5:00 PM
Puma 92 .44mag 16", standard sights, no sling (yet) shooting pretty much any 200-300gr load with damn good accuracy.

Working on getting/making a slung dump pouch for it.

Texas Boy
05-25-2009, 6:28 PM
I don't think anyone is saying that a Lever Action is the best rifle for taking down zombies and chasing down bad guys running around in your house, what i was origionally looking for whas who actually uses one as their go to rifle and what are thier thoughs on it. My LA isn't my go to rifle atm, but if something happens that that is what's available, information that's shared by users would be nice to hear.

For some people that may be all they have, let's get some info in this thread on users thoughts on ancillary equipment, ammunition used, and additions to the rifle and what works. :)

As a survival gun, lever actions are extremely versatile and reliable, not to mention light weight and un-obtrusive. It is the KISS concept - so additions are minimal:

ghost ring sights with florescent front sight (almost as quick and easy as a red dot)
sling

Ammunition comes in 5 flavors:

1. low energy 45-70 round for general shooting. About the same energy as 45ACP. Cast lead bullet, minimal powder. Idea is to save cost.
2. standard 45-70 round - when you need a more lethal round.
3. modern 45-70 hunting round. Good for deer, Elk, pigs. Any med to large non dangerous game.
4. 457 WW Mag round (3760 ft lbs) - Grizzly or dangerous animal defense. I don't hunt Grizzly or dangerous game, but you could use it for that too.
5. 410 shotgun shell - only in survival situation for small game hunting.

Texas Boy
05-25-2009, 6:45 PM
Yeah, I guess ill just stick with a donation to CGF, and my 1911.... Hoperfully :thumbsup:

Yea, I understand. The Co-Pilot from Wildwestguns cost more than a nice 1911 and AR combined! If you want just a basic 1895 from Marlin I think they are pretty reasonable - but the WW conversion isn't cheap. And don't forget all the extras - like finish, big loop lever, transfer fees, etc. My final bill topped the "base" price by almost $1000 - for an un-scoped rifle.

I bought mine in 2004 when money was good and it was something I really wanted. I figure my great grandchildren might or might not give a flip about grampa's AR, but hopefully the Co-Pilot will be a cherished piece of family history.

VegasND
05-25-2009, 7:10 PM
yes this is the weakness of the lever guns for shtf scene. We need to find a way to reload them real fast. Similar to how an sks can reload fast with stripper clip.
Are there versions of the Winchester 1895 that take stripper clips? Can the 30-06 be adapted for .308?
http://world.guns.ru/rifle/win95-0.jpg

sierrawoodsman
05-25-2009, 7:15 PM
We must remember that a lever gun can be loaded on the go, shoot and scoot style. Fire off three and still have six in the tube one in the chamber and top off as needed. No need to drop the mag or open the action. I took a patrol rifle class with a guy that used a slicked up marlin .357 that was shooting hot hard cast wadcutter loads. His loads were knocking the hell out of the plates at the 125 mark. He said that the loads were loaded to .35 rem levels and I don't doubt it one bit. The best part of it all was he never ran out of ammo! When his plates were down he would just slip a few rounds in the tube and he was topped off. I still would use my AR in a SHTF but that little marlin changed my view of "Tacticool" long guns.

smle-man
05-25-2009, 7:19 PM
Are there versions of the Winchester 1895 that take stripper clips? Can the 30-06 be adapted for .308?
http://world.guns.ru/rifle/win95-0.jpg

The 95 was made in 7.62x54R for the Russians in WW1 and were fitted with a charger clip bridge. Some were imported into the U.S. in the 50s in beat up condition. More 95s were made in 7.62x54 than any other caliber! Unfortunately most expired in Russia and were never seen again.

BroncoBob
05-25-2009, 7:39 PM
My Marlin 30CS is my go to gun when I'm hunting for some of those beastly California 60 pound deer,,,,, :smilielol5:

Bukowski
05-25-2009, 8:16 PM
o-tbT3iSvGM&feature=related

I've seen these at CAS shoots. Not "tactical" by any means, but technically you can reload a lever gun pretty fast.

My go to lever is a Puma 92 in .357 :gnorsi:

BroncoBob
05-25-2009, 8:17 PM
if you ever even get to see one:eek:

just came back from Utah had to work hard not to hit them while driving ha

Saw one once right after a hunting buddy of mine plugged it with his Winchester lever rifle in 357 mag, now that being said I do see others almost daily on 580 going over the Dublin grade.

pullnshoot25
05-25-2009, 8:25 PM
Yea, I understand. The Co-Pilot from Wildwestguns cost more than a nice 1911 and AR combined! If you want just a basic 1895 from Marlin I think they are pretty reasonable - but the WW conversion isn't cheap. And don't forget all the extras - like finish, big loop lever, transfer fees, etc. My final bill topped the "base" price by almost $1000 - for an un-scoped rifle.

I bought mine in 2004 when money was good and it was something I really wanted. I figure my great grandchildren might or might not give a flip about grampa's AR, but hopefully the Co-Pilot will be a cherished piece of family history.

There is just something about leverguns that are so nostalgic. Maybe because they aren't black or harsh looking, they kind of have a warmth about them.

tankerman
05-25-2009, 8:32 PM
Are there versions of the Winchester 1895 that take stripper clips? Can the 30-06 be adapted for .308?
I own a 1895 Winchester. There are better leverguns for this kind of work. Reread the thread, you'll see I listed other non-tube-fed leverguns which already do come in 308 and have box magazines that are not fixed.

GuyW
05-25-2009, 8:40 PM
Don't think so? I think for full auto you need some type of gas system or blow back system? A lever action has none of that. It will take alot of work to make a L.A. go full auto.

....search for the picture of John Moses Browning with a semi-auto-converted lever gun...

Ooops, prolly a dozen of you beat me to that...

Baxter
06-10-2009, 2:17 PM
Seeing as I don't have an ar this would be my go to rifle with a glock 22 sidearm, I got this thing for my 16th birth day many moons ago. Great gun, everyone I meet has never shot a la gun but they always love it afterhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/Baxter75th/IMG_0099.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/Baxter75th/IMG_0101.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/Baxter75th/IMG_0107.jpg it has the elevated rings, really thinking of taking the scope off seeing as it is slow to acquire with it but great with the irons. Oh yeah it is a winchester ranger 30/30

5hundo
06-10-2009, 2:35 PM
My dad uses them almost exclusivly. He's a cowboy guy so all he uses is cowboy guns. I told him if SHTF he's going to have to use one of my AKs.

You have obviously never seen "Bruce Campbell vs. the Army of Darkness"...

Lever guns are a great option for taking out demons, or demonically possessed humans in his case...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-wj-vuNm88

oreamnos
06-10-2009, 3:51 PM
Not mine, but I like it!

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh300/enis75/Krinkov004.jpg

gadjeep
06-10-2009, 6:46 PM
I was raised on leverguns and will never part with my 1892 in 38wcf. I have hunted deer with a model 88, savage 99 and I have a Model 100. To be honest, I prefer the 88. Locks up tighter, well balanced and more reliable. A 92 or 94 would be a great SHTF weapon. To answer the concern about reloading speed; if you really need to put a bunch of lead downrange quickly you can use these

http://cgi.ebay.com/CAS-SASS-LEVER-RIFLE-SPEEDLOADER-.32%2F.38%2F.357_W0QQitemZ120431244528QQcmdZViewIt emQQimsxq20090607?IMSfp=TL090607219001r21550
I have heard of guys using a quiver to hold 8-10 of these and moving very quickly. I wouldn't give my lever guns up for nuthin'!

Kokopelli
06-10-2009, 6:51 PM
All right! Stripper clips for levers! :D

gadjeep
06-10-2009, 6:53 PM
here is another source. http://www.luckysloader.com/riffle/

luchador768
06-11-2009, 5:26 AM
And in all fairness, just because JMB did it doesn't mean anything. He'd have won WWII with a soup can, a fork, and a couple rocks. Seriously, even McGuyver and Ethan Hawking get together every now and then and are like "How the **** did he do that?..."


Steven Hawking=really smart guy, Ethan Hawk= crappy actor.:)

Okami
06-11-2009, 7:24 PM
Lol, glad to see this thread still going. :)

trashman
06-11-2009, 9:34 PM
I have a marlin 1895 guide in 45-70, just in case a car attacks me.

ROFL! Exactly. I reaaaally want one of those special Marlin's they previewed at the SHOT show this year...

--Neill

jcm42398
06-13-2009, 4:07 AM
Not mine, but I like it!

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh300/enis75/Krinkov004.jpg


wow! looks sweet

any more info on this?

otteray
06-13-2009, 7:57 AM
http://shootersforum.com/attachment.htm?attachmentid=1313&d=1092623818
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f179/otteray/M1%20Carbine/1943InlandM1CarbinefromCMP004.jpg

If I could only find a magazine with a capacity greater than 4!

Slash2
06-13-2009, 8:12 AM
If it happens in my house: 12 ga, 1911, M1 Carbine, In my yard: M1 carbine, 12 ga, 450 Bushmaster (they may be in vehicles), in my neighborhood: Savage 99 .308, Marlin 30-30, 450 Bushmaster (they may be in vehicles). Further out than that I'm screwed because I don't have a sniper rifle, but at least I've got time to scoot or hide.

Lever guns are usually simple and reliable and it's easy to clear jams or duds. Simple is good when stress is mixed into the equation.

The Savage 99 is a beautiful gun and because it has a rotary magazine you don't need special "lever gun" ammo. FMJ's, HP's, Nato, whatever. Eats 'em and spits 'em out.

pullnshoot25
06-13-2009, 11:34 AM
If it happens in my house: 12 ga, 1911, M1 Carbine, In my yard: M1 carbine, 12 ga, 450 Bushmaster (they may be in vehicles), in my neighborhood: Savage 99 .308, Marlin 30-30, 450 Bushmaster (they may be in vehicles). Further out than that I'm screwed because I don't have a sniper rifle, but at least I've got time to scoot or hide.

Lever guns are usually simple and reliable and it's easy to clear jams or duds. Simple is good when stress is mixed into the equation.

The Savage 99 is a beautiful gun and because it has a rotary magazine you don't need special "lever gun" ammo. FMJ's, HP's, Nato, whatever. Eats 'em and spits 'em out.

+1. I owned one for about 12 hours in .300 Savage (I think that is the caliber) before selling it to my neighbor. Absolutely beautiful rifle. Just didn't fit in the collection, unfortunately...

pullnshoot25
06-13-2009, 11:38 AM
Also, I took a photo with my cell phone last night of my .44s. Not the best pic but here it is.

http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r369/calgunfun2/4543_202838855211_733635211_7442661.jpg

elSquid
06-13-2009, 12:50 PM
wow! looks sweet

any more info on this?

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh300/enis75/Krinkov002-1.jpg

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=2&t=256285

-- Michael

Slash2
06-13-2009, 1:35 PM
If it happens in my house: 12 ga, 1911, M1 Carbine, In my yard: M1 carbine, 12 ga, 450 Bushmaster (they may be in vehicles), in my neighborhood: Savage 99 .308, Marlin 30-30, 450 Bushmaster (they may be in vehicles). Further out than that I'm screwed because I don't have a sniper rifle, but at least I've got time to scoot or hide.

Lever guns are usually simple and reliable and it's easy to clear jams or duds. Simple is good when stress is mixed into the equation.

The Savage 99 is a beautiful gun and because it has a rotary magazine you don't need special "lever gun" ammo. FMJ's, HP's, Nato, whatever. Eats 'em and spits 'em out.

http://www.satellitemodels.com/pics/leverguns.jpg

Outlaw Josey Wales
06-13-2009, 7:36 PM
I'm a big lever gun fan. There are a number of guns ready to rock in my safe - and which one I grab will probably depend on the situation and my mindset at the time. However, the only gun I've ever carried in a real situation where my life depended on it was my Alaskan co-pilot (a modified Marlin 1895 in 457 Wild West Magnum - a version of 45-70 that shots a 350gr bullet at 2200fps for 3760 ft lbs:eek:! By comparison a magnum 12 gauge slug is only 2361 ft lbs, and a standard 45-70 is 1590 ft lbs):

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/2939538906_3432404330_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3056/2938686595_efb9366ea1_o.jpg

This gun was my constant companion for several weeks in the Alaskan back country as I explored the state in a small plane. Four in the tube, one in the chamber and half cocked at all times. Something about being north of the arctic circle hundreds of miles from any town in a small tent on the tundra...I wana go back!!!!

Before the trip I spent some quality range time with this gun - I could easily put all 5 in a milk jug at 100 yards, off hand, inside of 5 seconds starting with the gun slung over my shoulder. Of course you would need a Chiropractor afterward if you tried that with the big loads. Truth be told, I only ever fired 3 of the 457 Mag loads - that was enough. Standard 45-70 loads are mild by comparison.

[Edit] I should also mention it fires 410 shotgun shells too! Use the bullets for defense, and the shells for anything you want to be able to recognize afterward.

That's one impressive firearm. Did you have an opportunity to do any hunting with it or was it primarily intended as defense against large bears? I'm also interested in hearing more about your adventures in the Alaskan back country.

otteray
06-13-2009, 8:28 PM
http://www.tvacres.com/images/wanted_mares.gif

http://maresleg.com/joshr.jpg

Amacias805
06-13-2009, 8:35 PM
got a win 1894 octagon barrel in 30-30... recoil usually isn't that bad, but its metal stock sure hurts if you dont have the stock and your shoulder square

FeuerFrei
06-13-2009, 9:16 PM
Lever gun in 357 is a good choice for close range and if you have a revolver with same caliber as backup.
However, having had a similar setup in 44Mag and shooting them I found heat to be a huge problem when using magnum ammo. The barrel will burn you in an instant if your not careful after 10rds through your long gun. Using gloves is out of the question for reloads but necessary to not burn yourself.
Using lower power loads will reduce the heat buildup time but then you get low power loads for low penetration so what's the point.
Basically you have a logistical setup that looks good on paper but real world shooting and or SHTF situation the heat and slow reload speed would not be to your benefit. Having said that...some guns are better than no guns.
Whatever it takes to sleep well at night.:hide:

pullnshoot25
06-13-2009, 11:13 PM
Lever gun in 357 is a good choice for close range and if you have a revolver with same caliber as backup.
However, having had a similar setup in 44Mag and shooting them I found heat to be a huge problem when using magnum ammo. The barrel will burn you in an instant if your not careful after 10rds through your long gun. Using gloves is out of the question for reloads but necessary to not burn yourself.
Using lower power loads will reduce the heat buildup time but then you get low power loads for low penetration so what's the point.
Basically you have a logistical setup that looks good on paper but real world shooting and or SHTF situation the heat and slow reload speed would not be to your benefit. Having said that...some guns are better than no guns.
Whatever it takes to sleep well at night.:hide:

You typically don't use magnums for SD. The low end of .44spl is the same as the high end of .357mag. Decent .44spl loads will at least match if not beat the pants off of the hottest .45ACP loads. (correct me if I am wrong here)

Using magnums does build up a pretty good amount of heat, I will agree to that.

Leverguns, while not the quickest loading firearms, are generally lighter, slimmer and more handy than the average semi-auto rifle and are generally looked favorably upon for self-defense use. They are on par with the average pump shotgun in training and maneuverability so nearly everyone knows how to use one. With 10+1 rounds of piping hot lead death in my levergun, I have complete confidence in at least quickly diffusing the situation, if not neutralizing it, should such an occasion rise. If necessary, you can always "top off" you gun and just keep on going.

Leverguns are just about perfect :)

-N8

Slash2
06-14-2009, 7:00 AM
Anyone familiar with the Firefly Sci-Fi series will remember Zoe and her lever guns.


JJR7xxI-Mko

forgiven
06-14-2009, 7:25 AM
Semi-auto is my choice.

.454
06-14-2009, 8:30 AM
LSI stopped importing Puma M92 in .454 from Rossi :(
Now all their levers are made by Chiappa in Italy (http://www.legacysports.com/products/puma/index.html), are a lot more expensive and the biggest caliber offered is .44 Mag
Now I'm so glad I got my stainless carbine in .454 Casull two years ago

http://www.northeasttrading.com/Puma454_SS_HiViz.jpg

Slash2
06-14-2009, 11:53 AM
I'm a big lever gun fan. There are a number of guns ready to rock in my safe - and which one I grab will probably depend on the situation and my mindset at the time. However, the only gun I've ever carried in a real situation where my life depended on it was my Alaskan co-pilot (a modified Marlin 1895 in 457 Wild West Magnum - a version of 45-70 that shots a 350gr bullet at 2200fps for 3760 ft lbs:eek:! By comparison a magnum 12 gauge slug is only 2361 ft lbs, and a standard 45-70 is 1590 ft lbs):

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/2939538906_3432404330_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3056/2938686595_efb9366ea1_o.jpg

This gun was my constant companion for several weeks in the Alaskan back country as I explored the state in a small plane. Four in the tube, one in the chamber and half cocked at all times. Something about being north of the arctic circle hundreds of miles from any town in a small tent on the tundra...I wana go back!!!!

Before the trip I spent some quality range time with this gun - I could easily put all 5 in a milk jug at 100 yards, off hand, inside of 5 seconds starting with the gun slung over my shoulder. Of course you would need a Chiropractor afterward if you tried that with the big loads. Truth be told, I only ever fired 3 of the 457 Mag loads - that was enough. Standard 45-70 loads are mild by comparison.

[Edit] I should also mention it fires 410 shotgun shells too! Use the bullets for defense, and the shells for anything you want to be able to recognize afterward.

Tell me about the sights! I've been looking for some good peep sights for my Marlin.

GoodEyeSniper
06-14-2009, 5:01 PM
Hmm. Been looking around trying to figure out what I want for my FIRST rifle (sad, I know) and lever action never even entered my mind, but is looking appealing now :)

Before was debating a simple magazine fed .22, something more powerful in semi auto like a mini 14, or a Big 5 surplus type bolt action-Mosin, whatever...

hmm

otteray
06-14-2009, 7:31 PM
The Savage 99 is a beautiful gun and because it has a rotary magazine you don't need special "lever gun" ammo. FMJ's, HP's, Nato, whatever. Eats 'em and spits 'em out.

What is really handy: it has a little window on the receiver that shows exactly how many rounds are left in the magazine!:cool:
http://www.gunsamerica.com/userimages/172/900697711/wm_1225554.jpg

Slash2
06-14-2009, 8:25 PM
What is really handy: it has a little window on the receiver that shows exactly how many rounds are left in the magazine!:cool:
http://www.gunsamerica.com/userimages/172/900697711/wm_1225554.jpg

And you gotta love the little pin that pops up on top behind the bolt that tells you it's cocked. A lean, clean well designed gun, too bad Savage quit making them.

pullnshoot25
06-15-2009, 12:24 AM
And you gotta love the little pin that pops up on top behind the bolt that tells you it's cocked. A lean, clean well designed gun, too bad Savage quit making them.

They were just too cool I guess...

Slash2
06-15-2009, 5:36 AM
They were just too cool I guess...

Naw, they were discontinued due to high production costs, but nice jab.:D

pullnshoot25
06-15-2009, 1:49 PM
Naw, they were discontinued due to high production costs, but nice jab.:D

Same difference! Anything cool apparently costs too much. Steel sewing machines, metal barrel bands on 10/22s, the Savage 99, the Model 12, etc.

ArnFromVA
06-16-2009, 2:02 AM
Tell me about the sights! I've been looking for some good peep sights for my Marlin.

http://www.skinnersights.com/index.html

I got the ghost ring for my new 1894C, and not only is it easy to acquire the target, but it's also half the price of any other ghost ring, you can change out the aperture, and it also looks like it belongs on the 1894. Check out what forum members on Marlin Owners (http://www.marlinowners.com/) have to say about them. Doc Skinner also does special requests, like if you want additional tiny target apertures, and he also makes a cool combination ghost ring/ladder sight that doesn't go on the tang.

My 1894 is currently my go to. I might have missed it, but I don't think anyone has mentioned that a standard .357 load coming out of an 18" carbine barrel gains about 300 to 400 fps. If I remember correctly from what I've read in the past, .357 out of the carbine is about equivalent to the low end of .30-30 (which is equivalent to 7.62x39) out to 100 yards. Acting as a civilian and not part of a coordinated military unit, I don't think I'd be engaging targets any further than that, especially in urban/suburban areas. If the need did arise, I'd try to get my hands on a scoped .308 bolt action. Also consider that civilians don't have the supply lines that military forces maintain, so I would think that each round spent is like a blow against you; you won't catch me shooting CAS style in a SHTF situation.

So in the end, although I don't think it's the perfect be-all-end-all, I look at my 1894 as a firearm with the handling characteristics of an M1 Carbine, with the ability to top off like a shotgun, can share ammo with a companion revolver, has knockdown power approaching an AK, and possesses looks that are low-profile among the Sheeple. I can live with that :D.

Okami
06-16-2009, 2:28 AM
Well said Arn!

iolaus
04-04-2010, 4:41 PM
Anyone familiar with the Firefly Sci-Fi series will remember Zoe and her lever guns.

I was wondering if those would be brought up. http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/717004/fullsize/biggthumpup.gif

I have a 16.5" .44 Marlin, and I have an extra set of wood for it. I'm thinking about cutting the butt down to the minimum 26" legal length, and adding an XS Scout mount and lightweight red dot of some sort. That, and my .44 Mountain Gun, and I'm happy.

Of course, I'd rather have a 13" Para-FAL, but I am in Kali. http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/716998/fullsize/banghead.gif

Slash2
07-05-2010, 6:28 AM
Marlin model 1894 .45 Colt. Shortened to 16.25", 8 + 1 capacity, oil finished furniture, Brockman front sight, Skinner receiver peep sight with my fabricated hood. Shoots 240 gr hp at 1800 fps. 2' groups at a 100 yrds.

http://www.satellitemodels.com/pics/45colt/standing3.jpg
http://www.satellitemodels.com/pics/45colt/muzzle3.jpg
http://www.satellitemodels.com/pics/45colt/receiver3.jpg
http://www.satellitemodels.com/pics/45colt/sighthood3.JPG
http://www.satellitemodels.com/pics/45colt/profile3.jpg

Quick, light, accurate and sheeple freindly. Oh, and it is FUN to shoot!

Kokopelli
07-05-2010, 6:50 AM
Since my post on page one, I've gotten a 1976 Winchester model 94 in thuddy-thuddy. It's a great shooter with Rem 170gr core-lokt ammo.

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk239/avmusician/Guns/Winchester2009.jpg

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk239/avmusician/Guns/IMG_1365.jpg

smle-man
07-05-2010, 8:43 AM
Care to explain that statement? I am guessing you dont mean FA in the typical sense as the loading/ejecting on a LG wouldnt allow this to be possible.

John Browning converted a lever action Winchester 73 to full automatic. It kind of resembled a Colt 'Potato Digger' MG and eventually was developed into the Colt 1895 MG.


http://lewrockwell.com/shirtz/shirtz15.html


"The idea to create a machine gun came to Browning in 1889 during a shooting meet at the Ogden Rifle Club. He observed how the blast from a friend’s rifle parted the tall weeds in passing. Piqued about the waste of excess energy, he instantly was struck with inspiration. Browning immediately abandoned the shoot, and hailed his brothers to take him home. Ed Browning, responding to the puzzled looks of the other shooters seeing John leave suddenly, simply said, "We’ve got to go back to the shop. Looks like John just thought of something." Heading to the horse rig, Ed asked his brother Matt; "What the hell’s struck him, Matt?" Matt in turn asked John, "Yes John, what the hell’s struck you now?" John replied: "An idea hit me, Yes sir! An idee, as pappy was used to say – biggest one I ever had. Get the damn horse going, Matt."

As they rode, John explained how the blast from the shooter’s gun gave him an idea to harness the wasted gas energy to make a fully automatic firearm. Within two days after arriving back at the shop, John mounted an old, worse-for-wear Model 73 .44 caliber Winchester rifle on a wooden platform, added some components, and made it fire continuously at 16 shots per second. The sheer audacity to make an old black powder cartridge lever action rifle fire in full automatic is nothing short of miraculous – for anyone other than John Browning, of course.

By 1890, Browning had a practical working prototype, along with canvas ammunition belts made by a professional tent maker. The prototype had no water-cooled jacket, nor a ventilated barrel. It had no tripod, or anything approaching a firing grip. Its finish was very rough, with blacked heat welds and hammer strikes embarrassingly visible. It would be easy to mistake the weapon as some kind of a piston and tube component of a larger machine. But it worked, and it worked extremely well. In 1891, Browning demonstrated the machine gun to the Colt Manufacturing Company, personally firing 200 rounds of 45/70’s without a hitch. In a second demonstration before an audience of several military representatives, the test required that he fire 1800 rounds in three minutes. The barrel turned red hot, a lead mist enveloped John Browning, and his body cramped terribly securing the gun during firing. But when it was over, every round had been expended, and none of the weapons’ components failed during the stress of the demonstration. To say those who witnessed the event were impressed is an understatement. They were awestruck and wild with enthusiasm at the gun’s performance. They saw his machine gun vastly superior to the current Gatling guns in service. But without military contracts, Browning’s wonder gun would lie fallow until 1895, and even then only the U.S. Navy contracted with Colt for a small number of the Browning-designed machine guns. His Colt Model 95 "Peace Maker" machine gun received its first baptism by fire in China, where the U.S. Marines used them to great effect defending the foreign legations during the Boxer Rebellion."

a.tinkerer
07-05-2010, 9:04 AM
OuKz8brpH0I

GoX90HfI99U&feature=related

O8bJ3TLEbZw&feature=related


There's plenty more out there like this, and it's not why I almost always have my Winchester 92 with me, but check out how these guys run the lever rifles!


My 92 is a very early compact rifle, chambered in 25-20.
It's amazingly handy, slender and light -- and it hits what I point it at.
I really like it a lot.
Here in our valley there's millions of jackrabbits and field rats, also coyote at night.
If I'm outside or on the quad running errands the 92 is with me and it always gets the job done.
My 1911 set up in 460 is more powerful - but the little lever rifle is just sweet and I really like it a lot.
Not necessarily the best 'first choice' for dumbass patrol, but I wouldn't hesitate to use it for home defense if it was right-there when something was needed.





Cheers
Tinker

GuyW
07-05-2010, 10:12 AM
Not technically a rifle - but no one's posted the new Rossi "Mares Leg"....

.

H2O MAN
07-05-2010, 2:53 PM
Marlin .45-70 Guide Gun with +2 mag tube and other mods.

http://www.athenswater.com/images/GuideGun.jpg

GuyW
07-05-2010, 5:05 PM
2' groups at a 100 yrds.


Um - wow...if you're happy, I'm happy...

Kool-looking gun...
.

GuyW
07-05-2010, 5:16 PM
John Browning converted a lever action Winchester 73 to full automatic....

Yep, and so easy a middle school metal shop kid could do it...
.

SoCalRandy
07-05-2010, 6:20 PM
Um - wow...if you're happy, I'm happy...

Kool-looking gun...
.

I'm hoping he meant 2" groups! :p

Slash2
07-05-2010, 6:45 PM
Um - wow...if you're happy, I'm happy...

Kool-looking gun...
.

2 feet from behind my back on a galloping horse!:D

2" from the bench at the range, with no wind and only one cup of coffee. Oops:rolleyes:

thayne
07-05-2010, 8:19 PM
I have a Marlin 30-30 lever gun. Im thinking about putting a red dot sight on it, or maybe a 1x4 for a backup SHTF rifle.

1st5
07-05-2010, 8:31 PM
My .30-30 Marlin is my go to hunting rifle for pigs and deer. I don't expect to use it as a house clearing long gun, although I suspect it would do just fine in that role. The distance from access points to anywhere in my house is so short that I prefer my .45. Actually, the bad guy would have to get past my ridgebacks first...he'd have to be one dedicated bad guy.
As far as the SHTF question...if it's all you have, and you are good with it, why not? It'd be better than nothing!

joedogboy
07-05-2010, 9:57 PM
I have a Marlin 30/30 LA that is probably my first choice as a "brush" gun, and is certainly the easiest of my guns for a non-gun person to think is cool (due to cowboy movies, tv, etc.).
If I didn't have a .357 pump carbine, I'd probably want to get a .357 LA to go as a companion to my .357 revolver for outdoor adventures (where firearms are legal, but I don't want people I run into to think I'm a terrorist or something).
Lever actions, pump actions, and revolvers with wood furniture tend to be good "PR" guns.

aznanimekid
07-07-2010, 1:58 PM
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh300/enis75/Krinkov002-1.jpg

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=2&t=256285

-- Michael

anyone know how to access this thread? can see it even when logged in

Sheepdog1968
01-18-2011, 12:15 PM
When I travel to visit friends, we will often go either social plinking or hunting. I typically will bring one long arm and one pistol. The rifle is almost always my lever action in 30-30 and is set up like H2O man shows above with his 45-70. The pistol is typically either a Sig 220 (45 ACP) or an XD (in 45 ACP). I feel very comfortable in terms of safety with this set up. We can all think of situations where it wouldn't work but for 99% of the things likley to happen, I feel fine with this set up.

pyromensch
01-18-2011, 7:26 PM
marlin 1895 45-70 is my go to the mountains/desert gun. i take it for those things the 30 rds of 223 won't deter

pyromensch
01-18-2011, 7:32 PM
John Browning converted a lever action Winchester 73 to full automatic. It kind of resembled a Colt 'Potato Digger' MG and eventually was developed into the Colt 1895 MG.


http://lewrockwell.com/shirtz/shirtz15.html


"The idea to create a machine gun came to Browning in 1889 during a shooting meet at the Ogden Rifle Club. He observed how the blast from a friend’s rifle parted the tall weeds in passing. Piqued about the waste of excess energy, he instantly was struck with inspiration. Browning immediately abandoned the shoot, and hailed his brothers to take him home. Ed Browning, responding to the puzzled looks of the other shooters seeing John leave suddenly, simply said, "We’ve got to go back to the shop. Looks like John just thought of something." Heading to the horse rig, Ed asked his brother Matt; "What the hell’s struck him, Matt?" Matt in turn asked John, "Yes John, what the hell’s struck you now?" John replied: "An idea hit me, Yes sir! An idee, as pappy was used to say – biggest one I ever had. Get the damn horse going, Matt."

As they rode, John explained how the blast from the shooter’s gun gave him an idea to harness the wasted gas energy to make a fully automatic firearm. Within two days after arriving back at the shop, John mounted an old, worse-for-wear Model 73 .44 caliber Winchester rifle on a wooden platform, added some components, and made it fire continuously at 16 shots per second. The sheer audacity to make an old black powder cartridge lever action rifle fire in full automatic is nothing short of miraculous – for anyone other than John Browning, of course.

By 1890, Browning had a practical working prototype, along with canvas ammunition belts made by a professional tent maker. The prototype had no water-cooled jacket, nor a ventilated barrel. It had no tripod, or anything approaching a firing grip. Its finish was very rough, with blacked heat welds and hammer strikes embarrassingly visible. It would be easy to mistake the weapon as some kind of a piston and tube component of a larger machine. But it worked, and it worked extremely well. In 1891, Browning demonstrated the machine gun to the Colt Manufacturing Company, personally firing 200 rounds of 45/70’s without a hitch. In a second demonstration before an audience of several military representatives, the test required that he fire 1800 rounds in three minutes. The barrel turned red hot, a lead mist enveloped John Browning, and his body cramped terribly securing the gun during firing. But when it was over, every round had been expended, and none of the weapons’ components failed during the stress of the demonstration. To say those who witnessed the event were impressed is an understatement. They were awestruck and wild with enthusiasm at the gun’s performance. They saw his machine gun vastly superior to the current Gatling guns in service. But without military contracts, Browning’s wonder gun would lie fallow until 1895, and even then only the U.S. Navy contracted with Colt for a small number of the Browning-designed machine guns. His Colt Model 95 "Peace Maker" machine gun received its first baptism by fire in China, where the U.S. Marines used them to great effect defending the foreign legations during the Boxer Rebellion."

never heard of that, thank you for the lesson.

pyromensch
01-18-2011, 7:45 PM
Yea, I understand. The Co-Pilot from Wildwestguns cost more than a nice 1911 and AR combined! If you want just a basic 1895 from Marlin I think they are pretty reasonable - but the WW conversion isn't cheap. And don't forget all the extras - like finish, big loop lever, transfer fees, etc. My final bill topped the "base" price by almost $1000 - for an un-scoped rifle.

I bought mine in 2004 when money was good and it was something I really wanted. I figure my great grandchildren might or might not give a flip about grampa's AR, but hopefully the Co-Pilot will be a cherished piece of family history.

if you handload for the 45-70 (in the 1895) you can get very impressive results, approaching the 457. i have loaded some hot 350 gr, 405 gr, and 500 gr, (have to single load those, too long for the mag to feed) a session of shooting those, and recoil from the lesser calibers, is negligible.
(a question though), can you shoot a 410 shot shell in a 45-70? it seemed feasible, just never tried.

pyromensch
01-18-2011, 7:51 PM
Let's not forget that all lever actions are tube fed. I've got a non-tube fed levergun.

Winchester 1895, fixed magazzine
Winchester 88, 100 - Hell make a hi-cap for them.

brownings

Droppin Deuces
01-18-2011, 8:13 PM
I would love to have a lever action in .223. Does such a beast exist?

Grumpyoldretiredcop
01-18-2011, 8:36 PM
Content removed

robcoe
01-18-2011, 8:51 PM
I would love to have a lever action in .223. Does such a beast exist?

Browning BLR

Snapping Twig
01-18-2011, 11:59 PM
I have bolt, semi auto and of late I joined the lever action club.

My levers are short and sweet, both Marlins. One is a pre safety 1894 .44 and the other is an 1895 Guide Gun in 45-70, the GBL.

They both are the same length overall as a Mini 30, so they are easy to swing and unknown to me before I owned them, every bit as accurate as a fine bolt gun.

The 45-70 is set up with a scout scope and I am certain Jeff Cooper would be proud of it as a scout rifle. Since I cast and reload, my rounds take full advantage of the raw power of the 45-70. 350 & 420g rounds hit with authority and of all the .458 caliber rifle loads, 45-70 is the penetration king. This is due to the massive bullet moving under 2K fps - just under.

Speaking of power, the .44 takes an average 265g bullet moving @ 1200fps in a revolver and uses the 20" tube to full advantage giving @ 1800fps for the same load. That means that at 100 yards the bullet is moving @ 1600fps or 400fps faster than the at muzzle of a revolver. Think about that.

So, combine short length and easy target acquisition, 10 rounds in the tube for the .44 or 6 rounds in the 45-70, bolt gun accuracy, lightening reloads and ultimate power with large chunks of lead and ask yourself if a lever gun is a good go-to rifle.

Redleg61
01-19-2011, 9:36 AM
A 30-30 Lever Action is my go to gun when hunting hogs in dense brush. I'm not sure about the full auto talk, I've been in a few sh!* sandwiches overseas and well aimed shots won the day, along with a little supression from my SAW Gunners :)