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View Full Version : Are "Rare" guns allowed into CA(Even if they aren't C&R)?


popgun
03-24-2005, 4:18 PM
Would it be possible, to bring into CA, a revolver that is 33 years old, and is very rare(Only 2 known to exist, in the USA!)even though it isn't old enough, to qualify as a C&R gun? Is there any exceptions, for guns that are this rare-or? I'm asking, because I would like to acquire such a gun, if it could somehow be allowed, here in the(PRK)for me to buy it? Any possible, exemptions?

popgun
03-24-2005, 4:18 PM
Would it be possible, to bring into CA, a revolver that is 33 years old, and is very rare(Only 2 known to exist, in the USA!)even though it isn't old enough, to qualify as a C&R gun? Is there any exceptions, for guns that are this rare-or? I'm asking, because I would like to acquire such a gun, if it could somehow be allowed, here in the(PRK)for me to buy it? Any possible, exemptions?

Rumpled
03-24-2005, 4:25 PM
If it's a single-action revolver with a barrel length of at least 3" and an overall length of 7" it should be OK.
Otherwise wait 17 years.

bwiese
03-24-2005, 4:58 PM
Rumpled's right.

(BTW, single-action exemption mandates 5 or more rounds too, besides >3" bbl length etc.)

If it's not exempt due to single-action revolver status, you just can't get one here - unless you could locate someone moving into CA with one, and who'd establish residency, get a DL, etc. and then do a face-to-face private party transfer ("PPT") at a CA FFL dealer.

If you are a police officer there may be a LEO exemption.


Bill Wiese
San Jose

Anonymous Coward
03-24-2005, 7:34 PM
The federal C&R definition allows for "rare" guns (see parts b) and c) of the quote below). I'm not sure about how C&R laws relate with federal ones. You need help from a museum curator anyway, so they might now the whole story...

From: http://www.atf.gov/firearms/relics/
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Curios or relics" is defined in 27 CFR ┬ž 178.11, as follows:

Firearms which are of special interest to collectors by reason of some quality other than is associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons. To be recognized as curios or relics, firearms must fall within one of the following categories:

(a) Firearms which were manufactured at least 50 years prior to the current date, but not including replicas thereof;

(b) Firearms which are certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum which exhibits firearms to be curios or relics of museum interest; and

(c) Any other firearms which derive a substantial part of their monetary value from the fact that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or because of their association with some historical figure, period, or event. Proof of qualification of a particular firearm under this category may be established by evidence of present value and evidence that like firearms are not available except as collector's items, or that the value of like firearms available in ordinary commercial channels is substantially less.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

pogo
03-24-2005, 8:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AnonymousCoward:
The federal C&R definition allows for "rare" guns ..... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AnonymousCoward:
The federal C&R definition allows for "rare" guns ..... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Here's my take on this, I'm sure someone'll chime in with corrections if needs be....

It's true that the BATFE's definitions can include designated guns less that 50 years old, such as commemoratives, S&W model 39, and so forth, do you see it on the list seen here at
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/relics/#SEC.%20III:

However California has their own 50 year rule and doesn't allow handguns less than 50 years old to come in unless they're on the approved safety test list.

The exception is if the revolver IS on the designated post-1954 C&R list, then a C&R holder can travel out of state to that location and purchase it. He can then legally transport it back home to California (or ship it to his C&R address in Calif via UPS or Fedex), fill out a BCIA 4100, send it in, and log it into the bound book, this is all kosher.

If it's not on the C&R list then I've heard it's possible to ask the BATFE to try and get it included, I've heard of people doing this successfully but don't recall the particulars on the process.

Mssr. ElegantÚ
03-24-2005, 10:07 PM
For the C&R exemption to the "drop test" approved safey list requirement for handguns, the handgun just has to be C&R. It does not have to be 50 years old.

California's 50 year rule for C&R's only applies to long guns being transfered without going through a California FFL Dealer.

Your right about BATFE adding guns to the list if you ask them. A fellow recently got the Ishapore 2A1 7.62 Enfields added to the list by writing to BATFE. I think he had to write a very detailed and well-researched explanation for them though.

imported_EOD Guy
03-25-2005, 5:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by pogo:



Here's my take on this, I'm sure someone'll chime in with corrections if needs be....


However California has their own 50 year rule and doesn't allow handguns less than 50 years old to come in unless they're on the approved safety test list.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not true. The California definition of a C&R firearm is exactly the same as that of the Feds. California references 27CFR 478.11 for the definition.

pogo
03-25-2005, 6:12 AM
Thanks for the correction on the C&R handguns, I'm glad to know I was mistaken. A few local 01 FFLs wouldn't do transfers on any C&R handgun under 50 years old for me, and I came to the wrong conclusion about the regs. I'll have to keep looking for a dealer who knows that they are OK to bring in.