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Clark_Kent_X
04-23-2009, 11:05 PM
i just installed the maritime springcups on my G19 but nervous to test it out....anyone tried shooting while coming out of the water?

saki302
04-24-2009, 12:30 AM
Though not recommended, the 9mm glocks will fire successfully while submerged. I tried it with my G19 quite a few years back- my barrel is worn and I thought if it got messed up I didn't care. It's still working fine!

Save your gun the wear and tear and just watch the videos on youtube. It does work (you must make sure you get ALL the air out), but why test where others have tested?


PS- I don't know about firing while exiting the water- extra water inside mixed with air might be VERY bad juju.

-Dave

slick_711
04-24-2009, 12:38 AM
Brief answer: Make sure the gun has been submerged a few seconds, kinda wiggled around a bit, and tilted barrel up. Also, don't get completely under water with the gun (quick way to blow your ear drums). Also, don't do this in a pool you care about. If shooting while exiting the water come out with barrel tipped down to make sure your barrel isn't clogged with water prior to firing.


Better answer: Don't do stupid s***. Take tv & youtube with a grain of salt, and spend your spare time and money practicing for more realistic scenarios. Go shoot IDPA or something. Your Glock will work wet/submerged. You don't need to try it. ;)

cal3gunner
04-24-2009, 6:49 AM
if you were to try it which I recommend you don't.

You have to use military ball ammo or a law enforcement type fmj. You have to shoot fmj because a hollow point may expand while still in the barrel. You also want the military or police ammo because it has waterproofed primers and the grease around the crimp where the bullet and casing meet inside. If you don't use waterproofed ammo, the powder can get wet and your gun would work but your ammo wouldn't

On the other hand, I always thought it would be cool while spearfishing to pull out the glock and plug some fish. If I could figure out how to do it without blowing up my eardrums, I would consider it. Then again, on mythbusters, they did the shooting fish in a barrel and it was the concussion of the bullet moving through the water that killed the fish, not the bullet hitting them. I think the vibrations in the water tore their gills and they suffocated.

Since the marine spring cups have less friction due to their shape, did your trigger pull improve at all?

Turbinator
04-24-2009, 7:01 AM
I find all the cautionary advice in interesting. If the maritime spring cups exist, and they do, and they were made specifically for firing underwater, why not test it out? Obviously this is all done at the user's risk!

Turby

cineski
04-24-2009, 7:10 AM
Kinda hard core with the war game fantasies? Why are you bringing your gun in the water aside from trying to gain youtube fame?

Turbinator
04-24-2009, 7:45 AM
Kinda hard core with the war game fantasies? Why are you bringing your gun in the water aside from trying to gain youtube fame?

Come on. Same reason why people shoot IDPA, IPSC, airsoft, paintball, Tannerite, hard targets, paper targets. It's part of the hobby and we want to enjoy it.

Turby

rkt88edmo
04-24-2009, 7:59 AM
I could be wrong but I thought the maritime springcups (which have little drains on the sides) were for drainage after being submerged, not for firing while submerged.

In any case, plenty of people have proven that the gun will function under water, so I wouldn't feel the need to test it myself, except for the fun factor.

Greg-Dawg
04-24-2009, 9:27 AM
ktTC1RUf3ik

BTF/PTM
04-24-2009, 9:40 AM
Does anyone make a barrel that's specifically designed to withstand underwater firing pressures and thus work alongside these special spring caps? It seems like that would be a logical progression since the barrel is the next weak point when firing under water.

I'm not gonna try it cuz I really don't care that much and don't anticipate this happening, but will my Sigs fire under water? I'm gonna take all this knowledge and just translate it into carrying a revolver should I ever end up in a situation where submerged firing be an imminent scenario. Logic > Youtube

Shane916
04-24-2009, 9:44 AM
Does anyone make a barrel that's specifically designed to withstand underwater firing pressures and thus work alongside these special spring caps? It seems like that would be a logical progression since the barrel is the next weak point when firing under water.

I'm not gonna try it cuz I really don't care that much and don't anticipate this happening, but will my Sigs fire under water? I'm gonna take all this knowledge and just translate it into carrying a revolver should I ever end up in a situation where submerged firing be an imminent scenario. Logic > Youtube

I don't think there is a big enough market for such a barrel.

Realistically you're never going to need to fire your gun underwater in self-defense.

Tony.
04-24-2009, 10:24 AM
google is your friend

http://www.topglock.com/content.aspx?Ckey=glockfaqs

Can I shoot my Glock underwater?

Just about any handgun will fire underwater -- at least once. :-) However, firing underwater is NOT recommended because it can have devastating effects on the pistol and the shooter -- a potentially dangerous activity that should only be utilized by trained personnel wearing proper equipment for protection against potential pressure wave effects of underwater detonation. The shock/pressure waves in water can really damage internal organs (ever heard of lithotripsy?). Shooting a pistol underwater can lead to property damage, serious bodily injury or even death.

NOTE: Glock, Inc., specifically disclaims any and all liability from anyone performing or attempting to perform underwater firing with a Glock pistol -- you do so at your own risk.

The Glock 17 may be equipped with an optional set of maritime spring cups for use in water environments. Maritime spring cups are not intended for submerged firing, but for surface use by special ops teams who operate in and around water. The maritime spring cups are two small parts within the firing pin assembly and are not included on any Model 17 sold by Glock (civilians can only get them through 3rd parties). They insure that water can pass by the firing pin within the firing pin channel, thus preventing the creation of hydraulic force within the firing pin channel -- which would slow the firing pin down, causing light primer strikes. With the special cups, the action will cycle reliably while submersed, if a little bit slower. NATO specification ammunition (such as Winchester's Ranger RA9124N) with waterproof sealed primers and case mouths is recommended.

Although you may install the maritime spring cups on any Glock model, *only* the Glock 17 was designed and intended to use the modified spring cups for aquatic firing -- and only then using 9mm ball ammunition to remain within acceptable pressure limits. The foolhardy who insist on living dangerously must keep several things in mind: The Glock 17 must be fully submersed underwater. There must not be any air left within the pistol as the muzzle is pointed towards the surface of the water after submersion to allow the air in the barrel to escape. Use only full metal jacket, ball-type ammunition because the water within the barrel can spread a hollow point out within the barrel upon firing. This increases the bearing surface of the bullet to the barrel and could catastrophically increase pressures. Even if the barrel doesn't burst, the expanded bullet would get even bigger upon exiting into the water and would slow down very quickly while tumbling. Accuracy would be terrible.

The marinized Glock 17 is primarily for use by various Special Warfare units operating in aquatic environments. At least one specialized Scuba diving group regularly uses G17's to dispatch sharks where they dive. The Glock 17 using NATO specification ball ammunition will completely penetrate a minimum of one 1/2" pine board at a distance of ten feet from the muzzle when fired underwater.

Trained personnel who use Glocks underwater know they must obey several rules:
1) use only a Glock Model 17 with amphibious spring cups (reliability issue);
2) use only 9mm FMJ subsonic, sealed primer ammo;
3) completely immerse the pistol and get *all* the air out of the barrel;
4) wear protective ear plugs, gloves, wet suit, face mask, etc.;
5) do not fire near solid objects or in enclosed spaces to prevent return
concussion.

However, any Glock -- even those not equipped with maritime spring cups -- will normally fire while submersed underwater. But doing so may generate excessive internal pressure and may cause the pistol to literally blow up. This is especially true with the use of high-pressure rounds (such as the .40 S&W/357 SIG) or hollow-point bullets.

I recall a reported incident where a Glockster on a boating holiday decided to show some friends how his Glock would fire underwater (because Tommy Lee Jones said so in the movies). He stuck his hand overboard, pulled the trigger and came back with a bunch of shredded plastic and a badly injured hand.

Another reported case was the Glockster who decided to try out his Glock 23 .40 S&W in the swimming pool after seeing pictures of Glocks being fired underwater on the web. He was totally submerged, with the gun, as he fired at a piece of wood on the bottom of his pool. The Glock did fire, the .40 S&W FMJ round left the barrel and went into the wood. The chamber also exploded and implanted shrapnel into his leg. Thinking that the water would muffle the blast, he did not wear hearing protection (the blast is actually about 4 times louder underwater). He is now mostly deaf in one ear and hears high-pitched tones most of his waking life.

As you can see, firing a pistol underwater is a *very* dangerous endeavor.
Several things could happen:
1) the firing pin may be slowed enough to not detonate the primer
(without the maritime spring cups)
2) the pistol could blow up in your hand;
3) the concussion could damage ears, eyes or internal organs;
4) the bullet may not go where you intend it to.

Even if you have the right equipment, know what you're doing and follow the rules -- the risks for underwater firing are minimized -- but not eliminated. Your pistol's barrel could be affected by water obstruction and your body by damaging concussion. By using hollow point bullets (water may cause the bullet to expand in the barrel), high pressure ammo, etc. -- you're asking for an underwater kaBoom! It you fire near solid or hard objects, the bouncing concussion can cause extensive, perhaps even fatal external/internal tissue injury. Why risk it?
Rev 2/2000 by JT 2000 Blue Ridge Bullseye

Clark_Kent_X
04-24-2009, 12:07 PM
I could be wrong but I thought the maritime springcups (which have little drains on the sides) were for drainage after being submerged, not for firing while submerged.

In any case, plenty of people have proven that the gun will function under water, so I wouldn't feel the need to test it myself, except for the fun factor.


the maritime springcups have drain slots are made so when you come out of the water and immediatly fire MOST of the water will be drained from your gun and not backfire or explode in your hand.

i'd never fire my gun underwater though.

adamsreeftank
04-24-2009, 1:25 PM
Your bigger concern should be the loose screw behind the trigger.

Voo
04-24-2009, 2:11 PM
Why are you nervous?? Just go fill up your gun with water and shoot.

Repeat as necessary. :rolleyes:

I can probably think of a million reasons to NOT do it, but obviously you've given it a lot of consideration and have deemed the rewards outweigh the risks involved. Make sure you video it though (there's no sarcasm in this request btw)

becxltoo984
04-24-2009, 5:06 PM
Let us know how it works out for you .

slick_711
04-24-2009, 5:53 PM
I find all the cautionary advice in interesting. If the maritime spring cups exist, and they do, and they were made specifically for firing underwater, why not test it out? Obviously this is all done at the user's risk!

Turby

As others have said, these cups don't exist so you can fire underwater. They exist so if your guns HAPPENS to be submerged, it can still function after you retrieve it / come out of the water.