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hoffmang
04-22-2009, 10:28 PM
Nordyke gave me reason to reach out to OAL this week. In so doing I found out some good news and some bad news.

First, the bad news is that the OAL has declined (http://www.hoffmang.com/firearms/oal/OAL-Decline-Letter-NRF-2009-03-26.pdf) to review the NRF underground regulation petition. They do not comment on the substantive reasons or the merits of the petition. They apparently wrote the letter at the end of March but due to a clerical error on their end, the mail never arrived (you can see that the suite number is missing in the letter back.)

The good news is that they are still reviewing the Capacity to Accept underground regulation and their deadline to act on that is this Friday if I'm reading the calendar correctly. I had asked them to consider that firearms regulations are subject to heightened scrutiny in both cases post Nordyke and I now believe that they will in the CTA petition.

That may lead some to ask what is next on the NRF front. Let me just say a couple of small changes on the field of battle may have given us an idea...

-Gene

Shotgun Man
04-22-2009, 10:33 PM
Too bad. Your NRF petition was bullet-proof and air-tight.

I hope something good results from it ultimately.

PolishMike
04-22-2009, 10:46 PM
Is there really much point in fighting one ****ed up bureaucracy with another?

Monte
04-22-2009, 10:57 PM
That's truly disappointing. I hope they do better with the Capacity to Accept underground reg.

hoffmang
04-22-2009, 10:57 PM
Is there really much point in fighting one ****ed up bureaucracy with another?

Yes. It looks like the Capacity To Accept silliness will be accepted.

-Gene

pavlov
04-22-2009, 11:10 PM
Thanks for the update -- Keep up the good fight!

domokun
04-23-2009, 12:41 AM
Awww... Thanks for the update. *sad panda*.

Soldier415
04-23-2009, 5:41 AM
Yes. It looks like the Capacity To Accept silliness will be accepted.

-Gene
:lurk5:


:D

BroncoBob
04-23-2009, 6:00 AM
Well this is not good news on the NRF petittion, let's hope the CTA petition is more successful. Thanks Gene for all the hard work.

glockk9mm
04-23-2009, 6:54 AM
Well atleast you tried, let's hope nordyke changes this. Hopefuly it's a different result with the cta.

elenius
04-23-2009, 7:42 AM
What criteria do OAL use to dedice whether to take a case or not? What is their mission statement?

WokMaster1
04-23-2009, 8:41 AM
Gene, could it be a political move to deny you a review so as not to give us too much "happy happy"? Shouldn't they give you a reason for denying you a review? Lack of staffing due to budget crunch? Personal hatred for guns after hanging out with Mrs. Merrilees?:toetap05:

Maybe your name just got moved up to the top of the "Just say No" list.:D

xxdabroxx
04-23-2009, 10:20 AM
Thats to bad, very sad panda indeed.

DDT
04-23-2009, 10:33 AM
Gene, could it be a political move to deny you a review so as not to give us too much "happy happy"?

I'm pretty sure the letter was written before Nordyke.

madmike
04-23-2009, 11:55 AM
Does this mean that I'll have to wait and exercise my rights without flipping off DOJ? Bummer... NeRFs looked like such a nice big middle finger, I was all excited.
:(

-madmike.

drjake
04-23-2009, 12:05 PM
Pardon my ignorance, but what is the NRF petition? I'm up to speed on the Capacity to Accept and am following that one very closely. If some kind soul can either briefly explain or point me in the right direction that would be great.

Also, Thanks for the update.

nic
04-23-2009, 12:07 PM
^^ I am in the opposite boat. I understand the NRF thing, but not the Capacity to Accept.
Can anyone point me in the right direction?

ke6guj
04-23-2009, 12:18 PM
Pardon my ignorance, but what is the NRF petition? I'm up to speed on the Capacity to Accept and am following that one very closely. If some kind soul can either briefly explain or point me in the right direction that would be great.

Also, Thanks for the update.

NRF petition.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=157784


^^ I am in the opposite boat. I understand the NRF thing, but not the Capacity to Accept.
Can anyone point me in the right direction?

Capacity to Accept petition.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=157492

yellowfin
04-23-2009, 12:27 PM
I guess they didn't have the capacity to accept the NeRF petitition yet.

Sleepy1988
04-23-2009, 12:51 PM
^^ I am in the opposite boat. I understand the NRF thing, but not the Capacity to Accept.
Can anyone point me in the right direction?

I'm not up to speed on either, so an explanation of both would be welcome.

CHS
04-23-2009, 12:58 PM
How is it that they are allowed to just ignore when one department is breaking the law?

Since the law is absolutely crystal clear on the legality of NRF's (like someone else said, your petition was bullet-proof), should we just go ahead with them?

The part that irks me the most though, is that the DoJ/BoF is BREAKING THE LAW, and the group in charge of that oversight is choosing to ignore it.

Can we just resubmit the petition over and over again until it goes through?

ke6guj
04-23-2009, 1:01 PM
I'm not up to speed on either, so an explanation of both would be welcome.posted above,
NRF petition.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=157784

Capacity to Accept petition.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=157492

hoffmang
04-23-2009, 8:45 PM
Since the law is absolutely crystal clear on the legality of NRF's (like someone else said, your petition was bullet-proof), should we just go ahead with them?


Hold off. Just give us... TWO WEEKS!

-Gene

Trader Jack
04-23-2009, 9:31 PM
Hold off. Just give us... TWO WEEKS!

-Gene

Good one Gene. Just two more weeks:sleeping:

Sam
04-24-2009, 12:16 AM
ugh, that hurts. I have faith however that my 1911 frame craze will come one way or another!

chiefcrash
04-24-2009, 9:17 AM
Hold off. Just give us... TWO WEEKS!

-Gene

let me guess, the two weeks has something to do with Nordyke and the "DC uses the CA roster" thing...

artherd
04-24-2009, 9:29 AM
You're getting warm...

bwiese
04-24-2009, 11:52 AM
let me guess, the two weeks has something to do with Nordyke and the "DC uses the CA roster" thing...

;)


<bseg>

curtisfong
04-24-2009, 11:58 AM
First off; Gene, thanks so much for your time and efforts here.. especially in the patience you have to explain legal stuff to laymen.

I have a question about the OAL: why would they do anything *but* decline to comment? Is there any oversight? What incentive do they have to do *anything*? Do we have any recourse if they decline to comment on an especially egregious issue?

bwiese
04-24-2009, 12:24 PM
First off; Gene, thanks so much for your time and efforts here.. especially in the patience you have to explain legal stuff to laymen.

I have a question about the OAL: why would they do anything *but* decline to comment? Is there any oversight? What incentive do they have to do *anything*? Do we have any recourse if they decline to comment on an especially egregious issue?

The OAL could decide that the issue - by their thought - did not rise to the level of underground regulation. Or, they may not have fully understood the issue.

In any case, as you've seen from their letter, that doesn't stop us from going forward.

CHS
04-24-2009, 1:57 PM
Well, it's friday:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=2371036&postcount=265

hoffmang
04-24-2009, 4:45 PM
I must have miscounted and the OAL's 60 days is up for next Friday.

-Gene

CapS
04-26-2009, 4:57 PM
Fiona: 'Can we shoot them?'

/C

:iggy:

Joe
04-26-2009, 5:01 PM
booo

jjperl
04-26-2009, 5:05 PM
Oh god... two weeks? not two weeks! We all know what that means. ;)

dirtyJ
04-26-2009, 5:14 PM
Read through both of the petitions the first time, and again just now, and I'm still getting lost in the legalese :(. I know the gist of both though, so I'll just wait until things are settled out and laymens terms are spelled out nice and slow for me :).

N6ATF
04-26-2009, 7:14 PM
Fiona: 'Can we shoot them?'

/C

:iggy:

YES, Burn Notice! :cool2:

WokMaster1
04-29-2009, 7:50 AM
YES, Burn Notice! :cool2:

you need a permit for that. You also need to show "good cause".:eek:;)

jlh95811
05-10-2009, 4:28 AM
Well? It's past Friday.

hoffmang
05-10-2009, 11:27 AM
Well? It's past Friday.

? Did you not notice that both petitions were denied so we just sued on the Roster?

-Gene

ke6guj
05-10-2009, 12:34 PM
? Did you not notice that both petitions were denied so we just sued on the Roster?

-Genehow could he, didn't you notice where his head was :D

bigcalidave
05-10-2009, 12:36 PM
lol. I like the lawsuits much more

copenhagen269
05-10-2009, 12:53 PM
how could he, didn't you notice where his head was :D

:rofl: