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You-Two
04-09-2009, 7:46 PM
Hi...

I am AD Air Force stationed in Utah, but will be PCSing to CA soon. I grew up in CA and still claim the state as my "State of Residence" for tax reasons (none if out of state). Never thought I'd end up back in the state though!

My question is - what would be the best option for me concerning firearms issues:
1) Retain CA residency - Easy, but I would have to follow all the rules like a normal CA resident.
2) Change to UT - Not difficult, but would require getting a new DL.

Would changing to UT allow me to still purchase guns in UT and then bring them into CA (even after my PCS)? I will be in CA for at least 4-5 yrs and might possibly move back to UT after that. I would still have to pay UT state income tax so it may be a wash. But, then again, the car registration would be cheaper. Downside is I won't have a "home" here in Utah (assuming my house sells) after I move. I could probably use a friends address though.

I don't have any assault weapons, but would like the opportunity to purchase handguns not on the approved state list.

Appreciate any help or advice!
Beau

dustoff31
04-09-2009, 9:23 PM
Well, I was going to say change your residency to UT, for both firearms and tax reasons, until I read the part about not having an actual residence there.

But then, if you reside with your friend when you go back to UT on leave or whatever, that would probably work.

Off roster pistols are not a problem, but no >10 rd mags.

1923mack
04-10-2009, 6:40 AM
Change to Utah residency. You will be able to purchase off roster handguns. Legal transfer into California "latter" will be possible.

EOD Guy
04-10-2009, 7:24 AM
It doesn't matter what your domicle is, if you are active duty military, BATF considers you a resident of the State in which you are stationed as far as purchasing firearms is concerned.

There is a difference between domicile and residence as far as the military is concerned. Your domicile is the place in which you intend to reside when leaving the military. Your residence is where you are actually living.

Legally you would not be able to purchase firearms in Utah if you were stationed in California, even if you changed you domicile to Utah.

Now, having said that, I know that military personnel have routinely purchased in both their home States and the States in which they are stationed. I haven't heard of any problems as far as BATF is concerned.

Untamed1972
04-10-2009, 7:56 AM
I think under the military exemption you can keep your D/L from whatever state you claim as your home state whether you have an actual house there or not. So since you would have UT ID, although it would prolly be a "gray area", you would have the required ID to purchase in UT.

You-Two
04-10-2009, 9:05 AM
Thanks for the advice everyone!

My intention is not to skirt the law, just take advantage of an opportunity I may have. I'll have to do some more research and think it through completely.

Some info on military residency:
While on Active Duty you can change your "legal residence" or "domicile" given certain requirements (like below). That is different than your "Home of Record" which changes only by exception.
1. Live in the state on permanent orders (i.e. > 90 days)
2. Have the intention to permanently return to the state upon release from AD

Basically - if you have good cause to call the new state your home and also plan to return, then you can change your residency. By default your residency is whichever state you lived in when you entered uniformed service.

http://usmilitary.about.com/cs/militarylaw1/a/homeofrecord.htm

You-Two
04-15-2009, 11:39 PM
I decided, regardless of firearms issues, to switch to Utah. It was a fairly painless process and I even completed the CCW class tonight. FWIW, CA is about 4-5% higher for Income tax (no surprise). Utah has a flat 5% rate and the vehicle registration fees are much lower!

EOD Guy: As a Utah resident I can purchase handguns in UT just by having a valid ID and doing the background check. In CA (as a UT resident), I would have to show military orders and a few utility bills showing I'm living in CA and comply with any CA specific rules. It does seem like a gray area though. Your state of residence considers you a resident, then the state where you are permanently stationed also considers you a resident (if you have proof). Does the BATF specifically outline this somewhere? Are you saying a military member can only purchase firearms in whatever state they are permanently assigned to? What if you're stationed overseas and want to buy a firearm in your state (i.e. while on leave at your parents house)?

Does the rule about bringing in non-roster handguns work only for the initial move into the state (on military orders), or does it also account for handguns purchased at a later date and brought in? Assuming they are registered as required and no hi-cap magazines.

Thanks...just want to make sure I'm going about this right!

ST5MF
04-16-2009, 4:21 AM
Active duty Military can purchase firearms in their state of legal/claimed residence. Not restricted by stupid California Laws. Just can't do it through a CA dealer; they have to do it through a dealer in the state of purchase with that states ID.

Declare UTAH residence and you can also have so called "assault weapons" I.E. "Black rifles," you just have to file and register with CADOJ under the military clause.

Yolanda Garcia 916 263 0296 is the POC with the CADOJ. You can register as many "black rifles" as you want but it is per set of orders. Unless you leave and come back on a new set of orders then it is a one time deal. Also, if you leave active duty and stay in CA you have to get rid of your Black Rifles. Not that any Red Blooded American would stay here after their time in the service...

FYI don't bring any Black Rifles until you have filed and have been approved.

There is no clause for mag capacity however...

You-Two
04-16-2009, 7:27 AM
Active duty Military can purchase firearms in their state of legal/claimed residence. Not restricted by stupid California Laws. Just can't do it through a CA dealer; they have to do it through a dealer in the state of purchase with that states ID.

Declare UTAH residence and you can also have so called "assault weapons" I.E. "Black rifles," you just have to file and register with CADOJ under the military clause.

Yolanda Garcia 916 263 0296 is the POC with the CADOJ. You can register as many "black rifles" as you want but it is per set of orders. Unless you leave and come back on a new set of orders then it is a one time deal. Also, if you leave active duty and stay in CA you have to get rid of your Black Rifles. Not that any Red Blooded American would stay here after their time in the service...

FYI don't bring any Black Rifles until you have filed and have been approved.

There is no clause for mag capacity however...

Thanks a lot!

sleepiemonkee
04-16-2009, 2:00 PM
Does this apply to reservist as well? Especially when they get activated on Active Duty for training and come back to CA after their training is over and continue to drill with their CA reserve unit?

dustoff31
04-16-2009, 2:10 PM
Does this apply to reservist as well? Especially when they get activated on Active Duty for training and come back to CA after their training is over and continue to drill with their CA reserve unit?

I would think it depends on the length of time you are activated. For example, a PCS move vs TDY or AD for training.

You-Two
04-16-2009, 2:46 PM
Does this apply to reservist as well? Especially when they get activated on Active Duty for training and come back to CA after their training is over and continue to drill with their CA reserve unit?

Most states require military members to show their residence in that state with a set of Permanent Duty Station orders and a current utility bill or other proof of residence. Unless you are activated and then assigned to a base outside of CA with PCS orders, then you probably won't be allowed to do that. You would still be considered a resident of CA while TDY and therefore subject to CA Law.

Example: You join the Guard/Reserves and are activated for basic training. You receive PCS orders to Base X in Texas for a certain amount of time. Then later, you get another set of PCS orders to Base Y in Kansas. While stationed at those bases during the time-frame indicated on the orders, you can claim to be a resident of that state (TX or KS). Once your Active Duty orders expire and you receive PCS orders back to your unit in CA, you then become a resident of CA. I don't know if you can claim one of those states as your permanent residence as a Guard/Reserve member, like you can on Active Duty (assuming you meet the criteria I mentioned in a previous post). If all you receive is a set of TDY orders for training, whether your Activated or not, you cannot switch your residence from CA. Confusing enough?

Hope that helps! Correct me if I'm wrong please...

ST5MF
04-16-2009, 8:11 PM
Does this apply to reservist as well? Especially when they get activated on Active Duty for training and come back to CA after their training is over and continue to drill with their CA reserve unit?

Only if the reservist is Active Duty Status on PCS Orders. PCS orders in California.