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CavTrooper
03-22-2009, 10:36 AM
Ya know, I hear alot about how the Marine Corps has the best training, theyre the best at this and that. Made me start thinking and I have a question for all the Marines out there:

Why havent I ever seen a Marine Corps Field Manual for the Infantry, Armor, Artillery, etc. ?

Darklyte27
03-22-2009, 10:56 AM
you arent looking hard enough?.. and those FMs you find at your bookstore were probably printed in 70s or 80s

frigginchi
03-22-2009, 12:19 PM
Maybe that's how they get you to join?

Desert_Rat
03-22-2009, 1:10 PM
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t112/jcmorris10/035-1.jpg
Here Ya go....We called them B.S.T's Battle Skills Training handbooks
All yer getting here is the basics...Not alot of high speed low drag stuff in these.

striker3
03-22-2009, 3:00 PM
You can find digital copies of all of the FMs through google. Most of them do not capture current TTPs, but are good for what they are made for, teaching the basics. For more current stuff, you have to go through the Marine Corps Center for Lessons Learned. That is where all the good stuff is brought together and disseminated to the schools.

I do not know offhand about any of the other MOS', but for Infantry, look for FMFM 6-5.

Prowler
03-22-2009, 8:19 PM
Use the advanced search mode in Google and click on file type as a PDF. You'll be amazed on what you can find using the advanced search, if you know what you're looking for.

Rck'n'ROll
03-22-2009, 9:50 PM
Just look up the Marine Corps Institute (MCI) this will have all the knowledge you are looking for.

One more thing, the Marine Corps has been "Uncle Sams Bastard Children" since 1775 and gets no love from the him. By love I mean no funding! So most of our higher end training comes from the Army (they have all the money along with the Air Force and Navy) and with the Navy. Basic training we get from within the Marine Corps. So what makes us better than any other service (I think this is your main question) is our attitude. We are broken down from civilian pukes and made into Marines by the baddest men on the planet, D.I.'s. D.I.'s will always have my respect for having the hardest job in the Marine Corps!

Semper Fi

CavTrooper
03-23-2009, 8:05 AM
Here Ya go....We called them B.S.T's Battle Skills Training handbooks
All yer getting here is the basics...Not alot of high speed low drag stuff in these.

Those are the same as our SMCTs (Soldiers Manual of Common Tasks), FMs (Field Manuals) are MOS/subject specific publications.

dwa
03-23-2009, 1:28 PM
Just look up the Marine Corps Institute (MCI) this will have all the knowledge you are looking for.

One more thing, the Marine Corps has been "Uncle Sams Bastard Children" since 1775 and gets no love from the him. By love I mean no funding! So most of our higher end training comes from the Army (they have all the money along with the Air Force and Navy) and with the Navy. Basic training we get from within the Marine Corps. So what makes us better than any other service (I think this is your main question) is our attitude. We are broken down from civilian pukes and made into Marines by the baddest men on the planet, D.I.'s. D.I.'s will always have my respect for having the hardest job in the Marine Corps!

Semper Fi

i believe you have no funding because the navy owns you. (hence no department of the marine corps) And yes you are better than everyone and thing in the world all the the great attitude of the marine corps.

Nordschleife
03-26-2009, 12:46 PM
i believe you have no funding because the navy owns you. (hence no department of the marine corps) And yes you are better than everyone and thing in the world all the the great attitude of the marine corps.

MARINE = My *** Rides In Navy Equipment.

I saw that written inside a porta-pisser while at Ft. Lost in the Woods, going through the 3531 course for the Marines.

Anyways, spending five months inside an Army base made me glad I joined the Marine Corps.. with the exception of the chow halls.

If you really want to grasp the awesomeness of Marine training, I recommend experiencing the School of Infantry... I was pretty impressed by what I saw from the LAV Scouts (infantry) in my unit.

dwa
03-26-2009, 1:15 PM
MARINE = My *** Rides In Navy Equipment.

I saw that written inside a porta-pisser while at Ft. Lost in the Woods, going through the 3531 course for the Marines.

Anyways, spending five months inside an Army base made me glad I joined the Marine Corps.. with the exception of the chow halls.

If you really want to grasp the awesomeness of Marine training, I recommend experiencing the School of Infantry... I was pretty impressed by what I saw from the LAV Scouts (infantry) in my unit.

one of my soldiers went. he had some weird heart thing that got him dropped and he later joined the army. he said army basic was harder but everyones home team is the best ever right?

Manong0369
04-27-2009, 8:51 PM
one of my soldiers went. he had some weird heart thing that got him dropped and he later joined the army. he said army basic was harder but everyones home team is the best ever right?

How far that he get in boot camp? He made have said that Army basic was harder because that is what he accomplished. IMHO, the training in the Marine Corps was a bit more difficult in the sense that we spent more time on things such as drilling and marksmanship. Marksmanship was a long two weeks vise the three or so days that I spent at the range at Fort Sill. Another thing that I noticed was that most of your DS are the same MOS as the post you were in (i.e. Fort Sill=Artillery, Fort Benning=Infantry). Not always true though, I had a kick *** 11B SSg as a DS.

coyote43g
10-06-2010, 7:55 PM
I've done both Army and Marine boot camp and let me say that Army basic training lacks a lot of things that Marine boot camp has to offer.

- Better weapons training
- better hand to hand combat training (MCMAP)
- Longer hikes with a heavier load
- WE DONT HAVE STRESS CARDS!
- The most phone calls you get is two
- Harder drill instructors
- Three months (1 month at every phase)
- More physically and mentally gruelling
- More field time
- You actually have to pass a knowledge exam to graduate

I'm not saying that Marines are far better than the Army but from MY experience, MC's training is a lot better than what I have seen in the Army both recruit training and beyond. But I guess you'd have to experience both to really tell.

Josh3239
10-06-2010, 8:34 PM
My buddy graduated Army boot and afterwards told me that one of the guys in his class was prior USMC and said the Army basic was harder. I'll bet it is one of those things were whichever was more recent was harder to complete.


- WE DONT HAVE STRESS CARDS!

Haha, you shouldn't believe everything you hear from chain emails.

Spanky8601
10-06-2010, 8:39 PM
MARINE = My *** Rides In Navy Equipment.

I saw that written inside a porta-pisser while at Ft. Lost in the Woods, going through the 3531 course for the Marines.

Anyways, spending five months inside an Army base made me glad I joined the Marine Corps.. with the exception of the chow halls.

If you really want to grasp the awesomeness of Marine training, I recommend experiencing the School of Infantry... I was pretty impressed by what I saw from the LAV Scouts (infantry) in my unit.

Motor T out in three. I got my training in Area 25 for 3531. Have not seen that MOS for years. :chris:

coyote43g
10-06-2010, 8:49 PM
Haha, you shouldn't believe everything you hear from chain emails.

I wish I was lying about this brother. But at AIT, my buddy that came through Ft. Sil OK showed me his stress card that he saved up. This was back in 2002 when I was still in the Army. It allowed a recruit 30 min of "time out". Maybe this didn't happen across the board but it happened somewhere.

stphnman20
10-06-2010, 10:02 PM
Hit up a gun show. There's a lot out there.

Hornetsnest
10-07-2010, 7:21 AM
My buddy graduated Army boot and afterwards told me that one of the guys in his class was prior USMC and said the Army basic was harder. I'll bet it is one of those things were whichever was more recent was harder to complete.
So he did a full enlistment in the Marine Corps...Joined the Army...And went through Army bootcamp???

:icon_bs:

When was this???

I know lots of soldiers who used to be in the Marine Corps and not one had to go back through bootcamp. That's one of the draws of switching over.

stphnman20
10-07-2010, 8:09 AM
Last time I heard was that prior Marines don't have to go to through any of the basic training the other branches have when switching over.

CavTrooper
10-07-2010, 8:43 AM
I wish I was lying about this brother. But at AIT, my buddy that came through Ft. Sil OK showed me his stress card that he saved up. This was back in 2002 when I was still in the Army. It allowed a recruit 30 min of "time out". Maybe this didn't happen across the board but it happened somewhere.

http://www.snopes.com/military/stress.asp

http://www.militarytimes.com/forum/showthread.php?1575314-The-quot-Stress-Card-quot-Urban-Legend

Rumor and completeley untrue, what else that you are saying is BS?

CavTrooper
10-07-2010, 8:46 AM
So he did a full enlistment in the Marine Corps...Joined the Army...And went through Army bootcamp???

:icon_bs:

When was this???

I know lots of soldiers who used to be in the Marine Corps and not one had to go back through bootcamp. That's one of the draws of switching over.

Last time I heard was that prior Marines don't have to go to through any of the basic training the other branches have when switching over.


PS Marines do not go through Army basic training.

Maybe he was talking about his AIT being harder, which if it involved numbers, is probably true! ;)

stphnman20
10-07-2010, 8:53 AM
What is AIT? Is it like our SOI (school of infantry) or MCT (Marine Combat training)??

biglou
10-07-2010, 9:15 AM
i believe you have no funding because the navy owns you. (hence no department of the marine corps) And yes you are better than everyone and thing in the world all the the great attitude of the marine corps.

Yes, the Marines are a Department of the Navy. The Mens Department ! From my experience the Marine Corps doesn't hand out FM's to every Marine going through any particular training/class. Those are usually kept by the Training Staff.

coyote43g
10-07-2010, 11:39 AM
http://www.snopes.com/military/stress.asp

http://www.militarytimes.com/forum/showthread.php?1575314-The-quot-Stress-Card-quot-Urban-Legend

Rumor and completeley untrue, what else that you are saying is BS?

I'm not making it up. Now did I say that I experience this (stress card) myself? Not at all. But I was shown one of these. And I don't appreciate you trying to imply that I am making up some other bs. I have served my time for eight faithful years and held billets beyond my pay grade. Oh and just because you saw two sources on the internet does not make it necessarily true. I wont keep arguing the existence of stress cards because it wasn't the issue to begin with. I apologize for even mentioning it or hurt any soldier's feelings on the matter. Marines aren't perfect either. My post was about how much harder Marines trained based on MY experience. If anyone else actually went through both service (career not Boot Camp or BCT AIT/MCT SOI) like I did and had a different opinion then so be it.

What is AIT? Is it like our SOI (school of infantry) or MCT (Marine Combat training)??

AIT stands for Advance Individual Training. Its basically their version of MOS school. Basic trained soldiers don't go through the extra two weeks of MCT like basic trained Marines do.



Back to the original question/topic:

I don't think Marines write FM's. Don't know how exactly pubs works in the military. What I do know is that there's a reason why Marines do things better, and that is discipline. In every grunt unit that I've ever trained and taught to during my instructor experience, squads are trained to do each others job. Meaning a team leader can do what a squad leader can do, a saw gunner can switch to a point man if need be. A squad leader is trained do what a Platoon Sgt's job and platoon Sgt can act as a platoon commander.

We send our squad leaders to an infantry squad leader's course in order for them to be truly qualified to lead a squad. Its two months of rigorous training and learning the organics of an infantry squad. The skills that they know are honed and they learn new skills such as calling for fire, calling for air, operating every weapons that is organic to his squad, etc. Even weapons based squad leader (mortars, machine gunner, assault men, etc) have to go through their own leader course. Even our Platoon Sgt's go through more school.

I know the Army also has similar schools to these. I think the difference is the fact that Marines will always find a way to keep training these skills because we know its perishable. As a grunt, we went to the field a lot of times back in Lejeune as much as we can because our BC wanted us to to keep training and not get complacent in the rear. I used to hate it but when I became an instructor, I realized how right he was about being brilliant in the basics and why we have to keep our tools sharp. The level of discipline and their dedication to mission accomplishment is what sets them apart from the other branches. It's like a little brother working so hard to show big brother why he is better. That's how I see it at least.

kurupted
10-07-2010, 4:16 PM
MARINE = My *** Rides In Navy Equipment.

I saw that written inside a porta-pisser while at Ft. Lost in the Woods, going through the 3531 course for the Marines.

Anyways, spending five months inside an Army base made me glad I joined the Marine Corps.. with the exception of the chow halls.

If you really want to grasp the awesomeness of Marine training, I recommend experiencing the School of Infantry... I was pretty impressed by what I saw from the LAV Scouts (infantry) in my unit.

What LAR Unit were you with...? Im guessing 1st.. 03 Motor T..oorah...gotta love those trunk monkeys in LAR :D

iaredavid
10-10-2010, 2:18 AM
FMs are Army publications, i.e. FM 1 The Army. Marine training and publications will reference them from time to time. For Marine publications, you'd want MCWP and MCDP (warfighting publications and doctrinal publications). Someone also stated earlier about MCI booklets. Those are great primers, and typically reference FMs and MCDP/WPs.

steelrain82
10-19-2010, 9:42 PM
I have a whole stack of mci's like 23 of them a bunch of the bst's 1-8 I believe. My 6-5 and a security forces nonlethal/ riot control book. And a few warfighting publications. I feel like getting rid of them but I think I would miss them. I also have the a binder that has all the questions that would be asked on a meritorious board.

themailman
10-22-2010, 3:53 PM
Lets not go into who's Basic/Boot was harder. The Marine Corps has the toughest basic training in the United States, and that statement is based purely on facts. Im not a motard posting on here to be a motard, just stating the truth. And in reality, it wasnt that hard.

Anyways, as far as FM's, is the OP possibly referring to MOS specific MCI's? Trying to see how this would corrolate.

REDPATCHUSMC
10-22-2010, 4:32 PM
You join the Army, Navy and Air Force .. you become a Marine.

'Nuf said!

BoJackUSMC
10-22-2010, 4:55 PM
This statement and fact says it all. Marines who actually graduated and finished their service requirement do not have to go through any boot camps at all because our boot camp is the longest and most challenging boot camp.
After all, it is all up to one's own decision and opinion. However, in my opinion, being a part of USMC was the best experience of my life.

KALIDAWG8996
10-25-2010, 8:51 AM
My buddy graduated Army boot and afterwards told me that one of the guys in his class was prior USMC and said the Army basic was harder. I'll bet it is one of those things were whichever was more recent was harder to complete.



Haha, you shouldn't believe everything you hear from chain emails.

Why would he have to go through Army basic??? If prior M.C., he wouldn't need to do it if he was prior enlisted, the army takes lat moves from the Marine Corps without needing to go through basic again. The Marine Corps , on the other hand, does not take lat moves from other services without going through their basic training.

I call bum gouge on this one....

frankm
11-04-2010, 9:15 AM
Why would he have to go through Army basic??? If prior M.C., he wouldn't need to do it if he was prior enlisted, the army takes lat moves from the Marine Corps without needing to go through basic again. The Marine Corps , on the other hand, does not take lat moves from other services without going through their basic training.

I call bum gouge on this one....

Me too.

Stress cards?! In the Marines, you get your *** kicked in the head if you need a timeout. LOL!

Bootcamp was 3 months in the 70's, that didn't include a couple weeks of intake. Then, you didn't get "weekends off" and BS like the Army does. Heck, we didn't see women until Visitation Day the week before graduation! And we didn't wear namby-pamby tennies to run either. LOL!