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View Full Version : Bullseye FFL transfer issues with River City GE


thesch
03-13-2009, 8:55 AM
So I'm working with Bullseye in San Rafael to be the destination of my GSG-5 from River City Gun Exchange in Sac and I've been having some issues.

First off, from what I understand its not standard for the receiving FFL to request the FFL# and CAID# from the shipping location before they will send out their own info. Does anyone know why they might do this?

Secondly, 6 days after receiving the fax from River City with their FFL info (and a half dozen calls) Bullseye finally decides to fax over over its information with an unsigned FFL certificate. The signature area said "see copy on file". Is this standard? River City called me to let me know that they would not accept this without a signed copy. Bullseye claims they've never had an issue with this for any other other FFL's in the past.

I'm dont know much about this process, but it seems like there is a disconnect somewhere. Should River City be accepting the FFL without signature or should Bullseye be sending FLL's with a signature?

The only reason I'm dealing with this is b/c River City has the GSG's in stock but has ****ty hours and I live and work in SF and can't viably make it to Sac by 5pm on 2 separate occasions (10 days apart).

Ideas?

RobG
03-13-2009, 9:04 AM
Seems like an issue between two shop's policies. One wants a signature, one does not think its needed. I would guess neither really wants to do this transfer and would rather you buy in person. Why not drive down on a Saturday then pick up two Saturdays later? They are open 10-6 Tues-Sat. That way you can avoid all these issues.

ohsmily
03-13-2009, 9:59 AM
The only reason I'm dealing with this is b/c River City has the GSG's in stock but has ****ty hours and I live and work in SF and can't viably make it to Sac by 5pm on 2 separate occasions (10 days apart).

Ideas?

With the shipping and transfer fees all said and done, it would be easier and cheaper for you to make it to RCGE on two different Saturdays. Do you work all day Saturday? If not, just make it two separate weekend trips. Seriously, how much in fees are you paying for this transfer (RCGE is going to charge to ship plus the actual shipping, and Bullseye is going to charge their transfer fee of at least 75 bucks). I bet you are adding at least $150.00 to the price of the $500-600 GSG.

rue
03-13-2009, 12:11 PM
Oh no,
Please don't slam Don at River City or the guys at Bullseye. That's favorite gun shop #1 and #2 in my world. Just PM redeye or someone over at Bullseye and have them sign the FFL form. It sounds like an easy fix to me but you need to call someone at Bullseye that can help you.

MajorBoothroyd
03-13-2009, 1:52 PM
Find me a Bay Area gun store that doesn't need serious help in workflow and paperwork and organizational skills and procedures and I'll have a new place to shop! :)

thesch
03-13-2009, 1:53 PM
Yes, I'm out of town 3 out of 4 weekends a month so that doesnt work well for me either. RCGE charges $550 for the gun while BE charges $699, so I'll still be ahead after all the shipping and fees.....although maybe not if you include all the time spent dealing with this. Also consider the fact that BE doesnt have them and wont be getting any for a decent amount of time.

Ya, Don at River City as been more than helpful and I've bought 3 guns from Bullseye and the guys there, including Bill, have always been very friendly. Don read me the FFL form and it appears that the signature is the only holdup in this whole process. I havent been dealing with Bill, but I think its time to start asking for him directly.

barrykay
03-13-2009, 9:02 PM
Yes, I'm out of town 3 out of 4 weekends a month so that doesnt work well for me either. RCGE charges $550 for the gun while BE charges $699, so I'll still be ahead after all the shipping and fees.....although maybe not if you include all the time spent dealing with this. Also consider the fact that BE doesnt have them and wont be getting any for a decent amount of time.

Ya, Don at River City as been more than helpful and I've bought 3 guns from Bullseye and the guys there, including Bill, have always been very friendly. Don read me the FFL form and it appears that the signature is the only holdup in this whole process. I havent been dealing with Bill, but I think its time to start asking for him directly.

Why waste your time, money, and effort. Dublin Guns has at least six GSG-5 Carbines in stock now:thumbsup:

Seesm
03-13-2009, 11:07 PM
Just buy where someone is working FOR you not AGAINST you....Done deal and if THIS deal does not work just wait the deals are out there...

Stormfeather
03-14-2009, 3:35 AM
Why waste your time, money, and effort. Dublin Guns has at least six GSG-5 Carbines in stock now:thumbsup:

Im usually the last guy to ever talk bad about a FFL, but this place probally has the worst Customer Service of any place I have been in, and that includes TargetMasters in Milipitas! I was home on emergency leave, taking my son around to gunshops, just browsing, looking for a new rifle for him for xmas, when I saw this place and walked in. The old guy behind the counter was rude, very short, refused to even acknowledge my presence. Kind of disheartening when I was just explaining to my son how friendly gun shops are. We was there only people in the shop as well. I asked a few questions about transfers and ammo availability. Which he didnt even acknowledge I was talking to him. Then when he finally got off his stool, refused to show me anything in the display cases. His explanation was "you have to be a LEO for me to show you this. . . that. . . etc etc" Since when is a Glock 17 a LEO ONLY weapon?!?!? Of course a better question could have been. . ."are you a LEO, those are restricted to LEo only for ourchase" But he didnt even ask that. And then to top it off, They had a gsg-5 on the wall behind the counter that I asked to see, to which his response was. . "oh, thats not for sale, we just hang that there to drum up business" The funny thing is, if he would have shown me one, I would have bought 3 of them on the spot !

Did he lose a sale, you betcha,
Will he not get my return business, possibly, I will always give a place a second chance.
Will I give them my business? Not if they treat me the same way as they did last time.
Will I tell everyone here about my experiences there, good or bad? You know it.

USN CHIEF
03-14-2009, 3:49 AM
Don't have nothing to add to this thread, but I just wanted to say..

HI STORMFEATHER....

donbing
03-14-2009, 7:51 PM
The license says

'The licensee named above shall use a copy of this license to assist a transferor of firearms to verify the identity and the licensed status of the licensee provided by 27 CFR Part 478. THE SIGNATURE ON EACH COPY MUST BE AN ORIGINAL SIGNATURE. A faxed, scanned or e-mailed copy with a signature intended to be an original signature is acceptable. The signature must be that of the Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) or a responsible person of the FFL. I certify that this is a true copy of a license issued to the licensee named above to engage in the business specified above under 'Type of License.'

Our interpretation of the FFL swap when doing FFL transfers is that it's a worthless piece of paper if it isn't signed by the licensee. If I'm wrong, show me the code where it's legal and the GSG will be billed and outbound to the OP with freight on our dime.

Don

Seesm
03-14-2009, 8:23 PM
Cool stuff for Don to reply!! Right on Don!

barrykay
03-14-2009, 9:37 PM
[QUOTE=Stormfeather;2165573]Im usually the last guy to ever talk bad about a FFL, but this place probally has the worst Customer Service of any place I have been in, and that includes TargetMasters in Milipitas! I was home on emergency leave, taking my son around to gunshops, just browsing, looking for a new rifle for him for xmas, when I saw this place and walked in. The old guy behind the counter was rude, very short, refused to even acknowledge my presence. Kind of disheartening when I was just explaining to my son how friendly gun shops are. We was there only people in the shop as well. I asked a few questions about transfers and ammo availability. Which he didnt even acknowledge I was talking to him. Then when he finally got off his stool, refused to show me anything in the display cases. His explanation was "you have to be a LEO for me to show you this. . . that. . . etc etc" Since when is a Glock 17 a LEO ONLY weapon?!?!? Of course a better question could have been. . ."are you a LEO, those are restricted to LEo only for ourchase" But he didnt even ask that. And then to top it off, They had a gsg-5 on the wall behind the counter that I asked to see, to which his response was. . "oh, thats not for sale, we just hang that there to drum up business" The funny thing is, if he would have shown me one, I would have bought 3 of them on the spot !

QUOTE]

Just what store are you refering to?:confused:

dfletcher
03-14-2009, 11:47 PM
So I'm working with Bullseye in San Rafael to be the destination of my GSG-5 from River City Gun Exchange in Sac and I've been having some issues.

First off, from what I understand its not standard for the receiving FFL to request the FFL# and CAID# from the shipping location before they will send out their own info. Does anyone know why they might do this?

Secondly, 6 days after receiving the fax from River City with their FFL info (and a half dozen calls) Bullseye finally decides to fax over over its information with an unsigned FFL certificate. The signature area said "see copy on file". Is this standard? River City called me to let me know that they would not accept this without a signed copy. Bullseye claims they've never had an issue with this for any other other FFL's in the past.

I'm dont know much about this process, but it seems like there is a disconnect somewhere. Should River City be accepting the FFL without signature or should Bullseye be sending FLL's with a signature?

The only reason I'm dealing with this is b/c River City has the GSG's in stock but has ****ty hours and I live and work in SF and can't viably make it to Sac by 5pm on 2 separate occasions (10 days apart).

Ideas?

While I happen to believe the FFL must be signed to be valid, my suggestion is to simply tell the guys @ Bullseye - "I'm trying to be a CUSTOMER here and spend a few bucks - who cares about who's right & who's not right, help me out please". I mean really, you're trying to convince them you should be allowed to spend a few bucks in their store? One signature, one fax. Done. You live in San Fran - go to City Arms, they charge $70.00 total for a transfer and are open until 7pm.

thesch
03-17-2009, 11:06 AM
You live in San Fran - go to City Arms, they charge $70.00 total for a transfer and are open until 7pm.

City Arms is about 25-30 min south of SF in Pacifica. Trust me I've thought of this place. The fact that i have to bus home to get my car doesnt help either.

Bullseye's main draw was its hours. I've given up on them.

G17GUY
03-17-2009, 2:27 PM
The license says

'The licensee named above shall use a copy of this license to assist a transferor of firearms to verify the identity and the licensed status of the licensee provided by 27 CFR Part 478. THE SIGNATURE ON EACH COPY MUST BE AN ORIGINAL SIGNATURE. A faxed, scanned or e-mailed copy with a signature intended to be an original signature is acceptable. The signature must be that of the Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) or a responsible person of the FFL. I certify that this is a true copy of a license issued to the licensee named above to engage in the business specified above under 'Type of License.'

Our interpretation of the FFL swap when doing FFL transfers is that it's a worthless piece of paper if it isn't signed by the licensee. If I'm wrong, show me the code where it's legal and the GSG will be billed and outbound to the OP with freight on our dime.

Don


Now thats customer service!

rivviepop
03-17-2009, 2:51 PM
City Arms is about 25-30 min south of SF in Pacifica. Trust me I've thought of this place. The fact that i have to bus home to get my car doesnt help either.

25-30 mins? Are you bicycling there? :) Admittedly my bus ride after work isn't horribly long, but I can easily make it to C.A. by 6:15pm or so after work having bussed home to get my car. You can do it man, think positive.

battlehatch
03-17-2009, 3:30 PM
Hello, my name is Joe and I am really sorry that you are having problems with your FFL transfer at our store. I just thought I would shed some light on your problems and see if there is something I can do to help out.

First off, it is our policy that we do not just give our FFL information out to anyone. We have had some problems in the past and the owner has decided that before we give our FFL and CAID info out, that we verify where it is going first.

There really is no excuse for the FFL info being sent without the signatures, for that, I truly apologize. We do want your business and we want to do everything reasonably possible to serve our community, but in our defense, things have been extremely busy at the store and we don't even have enough bodies to make sure that the phones are being answered. Top that with head honcho being out on medical, it makes for a tough situation. If you PM me with your information and specifics of the transfer, I will be happy to research and remedy it for you as soon as I get back to work on Thursday.

Thanks,

Joe Furry
Bullseye

So I'm working with Bullseye in San Rafael to be the destination of my GSG-5 from River City Gun Exchange in Sac and I've been having some issues.

First off, from what I understand its not standard for the receiving FFL to request the FFL# and CAID# from the shipping location before they will send out their own info. Does anyone know why they might do this?

Secondly, 6 days after receiving the fax from River City with their FFL info (and a half dozen calls) Bullseye finally decides to fax over over its information with an unsigned FFL certificate. The signature area said "see copy on file". Is this standard? River City called me to let me know that they would not accept this without a signed copy. Bullseye claims they've never had an issue with this for any other other FFL's in the past.

I'm dont know much about this process, but it seems like there is a disconnect somewhere. Should River City be accepting the FFL without signature or should Bullseye be sending FLL's with a signature?

The only reason I'm dealing with this is b/c River City has the GSG's in stock but has ****ty hours and I live and work in SF and can't viably make it to Sac by 5pm on 2 separate occasions (10 days apart).

Ideas?