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HotRails
03-06-2009, 11:40 PM
Anyone know who has flats and rivets in stock at the moment? Prefer one with rails.

HR

Beatone
03-06-2009, 11:53 PM
http://ak-builder.com/index.php

G17GUY
03-07-2009, 12:28 AM
http://ak-builder.com/index.php

Which flats should a first time ak builder get?

JeffM
03-07-2009, 12:43 AM
Which flats should a first time ak builder get?

A 100% receiver like an NDS.

m60gunner29
03-07-2009, 3:29 AM
or here:

www.redhotgundeals.com

Beatone
03-07-2009, 8:41 AM
Which flats should a first time ak builder get?

Flats are a lot of work if you don't have the tooling. I would go with these guys for a complete receiver. Very easy to build from. http://www.nodakspud.com/page2.htm
If you still want flats give Curtis a call at AK builder a call and he will help you out on what you need.

weezil_boi
03-07-2009, 11:48 AM
A 100% receiver like an NDS.


This is so funny. As soon as I read tis thread, I knew you were gonna post this :) . Seems you have inherited Fedup's legacy.

but... +1 to the OP. Bent a flat on my first build... tough deal. Had I learned on an NDS3... the flat would have been soooo much more fun.

HotRails
03-07-2009, 11:54 AM
This is so funny. As soon as I read tis thread, I knew you were gonna post this :) . Seems you have inherited Fedup's legacy.

but... +1 to the OP. Bent a flat on my first build... tough deal. Had I learned on an NDS3... the flat would have been soooo much more fun.

Not to hijack my own thread but out of curiosity, how long did your first build take?

ke6guj
03-07-2009, 12:00 PM
Which flats should a first time ak builder get?

you get the flats that are the correct ones for the parts kit that you have. If you have a Romy-G kit, then you buy the flat for that. A Yugo underfolder, the flat for that, etc.

SJgunguy24
03-07-2009, 12:03 PM
This is so funny. As soon as I read tis thread, I knew you were gonna post this :) . Seems you have inherited Fedup's legacy.

but... +1 to the OP. Bent a flat on my first build... tough deal. Had I learned on an NDS3... the flat would have been soooo much more fun.

aahhhh......yeah?

I was told the same thing about doing a flat build. To the OP do you have any sheetmetal experiance? I work with the stuff for a living and I might try a flat build but after I try a 100% receiver first.

HotRails
03-07-2009, 2:15 PM
aahhhh......yeah?

I was told the same thing about doing a flat build. To the OP do you have any sheetmetal experiance? I work with the stuff for a living and I might try a flat build but after I try a 100% receiver first.


i have no sheet metal experience, but I plan on attending a build party and may not be able to find an NDS-3 in time :( Hoping maybe people at the build party can help.

SJgunguy24
03-07-2009, 5:44 PM
i have no sheet metal experience, but I plan on attending a build party and may not be able to find an NDS-3 in time :( Hoping maybe people at the build party can help.

I was thinking of getting a 100% receiver and laying the holes out on the flat and send it into my shop. They have one of those million $ laser cutters that runs of auto cad. Burn about 50 of those.....I hope I would have it mastered after those.

CSACANNONEER
03-07-2009, 8:06 PM
I was thinking of getting a 100% receiver and laying the holes out on the flat and send it into my shop. They have one of those million $ laser cutters that runs of auto cad. Burn about 50 of those.....I hope I would have it mastered after those.

To build your own receiver, YOU have to do the work, not a shop. Besides, if a shop is going to make a receiver, they need to be a licensed firearms manufacturer!

goober
03-07-2009, 8:20 PM
A 100% receiver like an NDS.

have to say that these kind of posts are pretty annoying... the OP didn't ask if he should try bending a flat, or whether it was easy, or if he should just buy a 100% receiver instead...
he asked a question about which flat he should buy.
this response does nothing to answer the question.
i'm not trying to be any sort of posting cop.... i just see a fair number of folks nay-saying first-time builders and trying to talk them out of it. classic examples were the threads about bending your own G3 flats a while back. lots of folks saying "no, that's not possible" without any real firsthand knowledge or experience. well, it IS possible, and many rifles have been made that way.
i'm not saying this is quite the same thing, just that bending an AK flat is really not hard at all. A LOT (probably thousands at least, if not tens of thousands) of folks have done it successfully on their first try. yes, like any other build it takes care and patience and the right tools. but the answer to "which flat should i use?" should not be "buy an already made receiver".
sorry for the rant.
to the OP- yooocandoooittt! as suggested by another helpful poster, be sure to choose a flat that is designed for the parts kit you will be using in your build.

HotRails
03-07-2009, 9:54 PM
Ok everybody i found this on Youtube...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDppu3Mcj6E

pretty helpful for first timers to get an idea of what we are giong to be doing.

SJgunguy24
03-07-2009, 10:36 PM
To build your own receiver, YOU have to do the work, not a shop. Besides, if a shop is going to make a receiver, they need to be a licensed firearms manufacturer!

The shop would cut the receiver and blow out the holes in the flat with the laser. I think the computer will do a better job of making every flat exactly the same. Then I can use a press brake or a leaf brake or make a jig and do it that way. I know the rules.

JeffM
03-07-2009, 10:59 PM
This is so funny. As soon as I read tis thread, I knew you were gonna post this :) . Seems you have inherited Fedup's legacy.

:thumbsup: He taught me everything I know about AK building.

have to say that these kind of posts are pretty annoying... the OP didn't ask if he should try bending a flat, or whether it was easy, or if he should just buy a 100% receiver instead...
he asked a question about which flat he should buy.
this response does nothing to answer the question...

1. Sometimes people don't ask the right questions. The answer I gave may not have not fit the question exactly, but it is the right answer.

2. There are soooooo many posts like this, I don't think they need to be answered with any length. The information is out there. I just summed it up.

3. Flat building is not something that a first time builder should attempt. The OP said that it would be his first build, so he obviously wanted advice to suite his skill level. 100% is the way to go for a fist build. With a flat, there is a high likelihood of failure.

JeffM
03-07-2009, 11:04 PM
The shop would cut the receiver and blow out the holes in the flat with the laser. I think the computer will do a better job of making every flat exactly the same. Then I can use a press brake or a leaf brake or make a jig and do it that way. I know the rules.

There is no set standard for non-gun AK flats. Each manufacturer has to decide how far they are willing to go in the process before they reach a level the BATFE are uncomfortable with. AK-Builder flats, IMHO, are the best and most complete flats out there. They still require a lot of work to make right, including reaming the holes that are pre-cut.

The issue with AKs is that every parts kit is different. There is a good reason why the "premium" NDS receivers don't have the trunnion holes pre-drilled/cut. There is a good amount of fitting required.

B.D.Dubloon
03-07-2009, 11:08 PM
I gotta disagree with people saying that you shouldn't bend a flat for your first one. Bending the flat is way easy if you have a press, jig and a welder to attach the rails. I still haven't finished riveting mine up and might need a bit of help getting the guts in it, but getting a serviceable receiver bent is not hard. Thanks to Scott for the help and guidance.

BDD

SJgunguy24
03-07-2009, 11:12 PM
There is no set standard for non-gun AK flats. Each manufacturer has to decide how far they are willing to go in the process before they reach a level the BATFE are uncomfortable with. AK-Builder flats, IMHO, are the best and most complete flats out there. They still require a lot of work to make right, including reaming the holes that are pre-cut.

The issue with AKs is that every parts kit is different. There is a good reason why the "premium" NDS receivers don't have the trunnion holes pre-drilled/cut. There is a good amount of fitting required.

Ya know someone told me that exact thing a few weeks ago.At a gunshow.

hawk81
03-08-2009, 12:22 AM
copes distributing.

goober
03-08-2009, 12:31 AM
:thumbsup: He taught me everything I know about AK building.



1. Sometimes people don't ask the right questions. The answer I gave may not have not fit the question exactly, but it is the right answer.
I agree that at times the question might be better formed....
However, I disagree with your judgement in this case on what the "right question" was or whether you gave the "right answer".

2. There are soooooo many posts like this, I don't think they need to be answered with any length. The information is out there. I just summed it up.
You summed up nothing. You told the OP that he shouldn't try to bend a flat for his first build. If you don't think the post should be answered at any length then how about just not answering it?

3. Flat building is not something that a first time builder should attempt. The OP said that it would be his first build, so he obviously wanted advice to suite his skill level. 100% is the way to go for a fist build. With a flat, there is a high likelihood of failure.
Sorry, but that's crap. Flat bending is not some arcane art that only the anointed should attempt. It's not child's play, but it is totally doable for the first-time builder. I know dozens of people that have done it successfully on their first try. I also know those who have screwed up their first attempts, but at $35 or less for a flat, big deal if it takes a couple tries...
Personally I think building an AK from a flat and parts kit is easier in many ways than building an AR from a n 80% receiver... And many folks succeed with that build on their first try as well.
Hey- I'm not out for a fight here... I don't want to argue with anyone. But I think that aspiring builders need encouragement and realistic guidance, not to be told that it's too hard and they shouldn't even try. Obviously some things are beyond the grasp of the amateur gunsmith. But IMO AK flat builds are not one of those things.

JeffM
03-08-2009, 4:25 AM
Sorry, but that's crap...

Not looking to pick any sort of fight either. I just give the best advice I can. And my advice usually comes from experience. From my experience-biased point of view, flat builds are not for the beginner. If you have honestly encountered "dozens" of people who have done it on their first try, then my hat is off to that very large group of exceptions. If you mean that you have read dozens of success stories on the internet, well it is the internet after all. Most people would not admit to failure, and a few dozen success stories is a small sample group compared to how many people attempt it.

Most "first time builders" that I have run into have never touched a piece of sheet metal, operated a drill press, or even know how to use a hand file properly.

If a person has their heart bent on learning to build an AK, they should start on a 100% receiver.

wayoutwest
03-08-2009, 10:37 AM
I didnt read all the other posts, but flats are pretty cheap, order a couple from several vendors and thy them all, that way you will allow for some mistakes.

Also consider a receiver blank from coldsteel, it is already folded but you are then required to locate and drill all holes, openings,and fit and weld rails, a much less expensive way to go about making a receiver.

My first 3 receivers were from blanks with only a hand drill and a dremmel, then folded some more and then bought the rest.

goober
03-08-2009, 11:33 AM
I just give the best advice I can. And my advice usually comes from experience.

fair enough, me too. i guess we have differing advice to offer due to differing experiences.... and that's a good thing. you know, diversity 'n all that... :D
cheers!
:cheers2: