View Full Version : Certificate of Eligibility and C&R questions
10-15-2005, 9:42 AM
So I finally got sick of having to stratagize and plan my handgun purchases for 1 in 30 days so I just sent in my application for my COE (already have my C&R), so I can buy more than 1/month.
Does anyone know how long it takes to get the COE? And how exactly does the C&R/COE combo work? Do I show the FFL my C&R and COE? Or is it all automatic/computerized and part of the DROS process? I think I also read something on the old board that Turners doesn't follow this rule?
10-15-2005, 11:28 AM
Can anybody get a COE and be able to buy more than one handgun at a time??
10-15-2005, 12:15 PM
"If you possess a valid federal Curio & Relics Collector's license and a valid California Certificate of Eligibility, you are exempt from the one-handgun-per-30-day restriction. (PC section 12072(a)(9)(x))"
So as long as you have both a C&R (03 FFL) license and the COE you can buy more than 1 in 30.
10-15-2005, 1:51 PM
IIRC it only took about a week to get my COE. The one time I tried to do the two handguns in 30 days thing the FFL didn't know how to handle it and didn't want to mess with it.
10-15-2005, 5:40 PM
I believe the Dealer just has to check one of the 10 day waiting period exemption boxes on the DROS worksheet.
In the case of a modern handgun he would check the exemption box that says "Transaction exempt from 1 handgun per 30 day limit".
In the case of a C&R handgun he would check the exemption box that says "Collector status". This will exempt you from the 10 day wait and the 1 per 30 day limit. He should not check both boxes in this case, just the "collector status" box. CalDOJ says this is because anybody exempt from the 10 day wait is automatically exempt from the 1 in 30 day limit.
It's kind of confusing that they added the 1 in 30 day exemption to the list of 10 day waiting period exemptions on the form, but that's what they did.
Then I think the Dealer just has to keep a copy of your C&R FFL and COE on file with the DROS in case CalDOJ audits him and wants to see proof of the exemption status.
10-16-2005, 1:06 PM
I just picked up a Ballester from out of state with my C&R and COE. It was sent to my local FFL dealer and then passed through to me, no added charges, same day delivery to me. I just paid cost plus shipping, no DROS.
I do have a question though, do I need to fill out any Kalifornia paperwork/forms informing the state bureaucrats of another handgun in the state? I don't think so but someone else may know different.
I have started the bound book and recorded as such. I think I'm done.
My COE took about a month, the C&R was about 6 weeks.
10-16-2005, 5:53 PM
Your Dealer should have DROS'd the pistol to you. You should take it back to him for that. The handgun needs to be registered in your name with CalDOJ. The C&R Collectors Handgun Report Form FA4100 is only used to register handguns that C&R FFL's buy while out of state and bring back with them.
10-16-2005, 8:36 PM
He has copies of my C&R as well as my COE on file. He may have already accomplished that and I'm just ignorant of the fact. Regardless, I'll get with him in the morning and verify the DROS.
I think we just used dros as a verb and a noun.
Thanks for the heads up,
10-17-2005, 6:01 AM
I just picked up a Ballester from out of state with my C&R and COE.
The COE doesn't have any standing other than with California dealers. Did you buy the handgun in person while out of state? If so, you should have been able to take possession and bring it back with you.
10-17-2005, 8:05 PM
No, I bought the gun online (THR) and had it shipped here to the FFL, he then passed it to me. I was not present when the BBT delivered it to his shop. I received it from him the next afternoon.
Therein was my thinking maybe I had to fill out separate documentation, the FA 4100 for the bureacracy. Thanks EOD Guy.
I figure to use the COE when I'm out and about so I don't have to plan a second trip ten days later. Pawn shops and junk stores are magnets for me. I like to dig around in the corners behind the dust.
I didn't get to connect with the FFL today, so I'm a bit hesitant to name names without his prior consent.
10-17-2005, 8:55 PM
I'm guessing that your Dealer did not DROS the handgun. He would have to pay a fee to do that and you said he charged you nothing. Just a guess though. Or maybe you've bought so many guns from him over the years that he paid the DROS out of his own pocket as a favor to a good customer.
10-29-2005, 1:28 AM
Rather than start a new thread I'll continue with this where it started a few weeks earlier.
Okay, I took the gun back to the FFL and we examined the DROS requirements again due to the inputs from this forum. The only thing he and I could come up with as far as a requirement to DROS was the "capable of concealing on the person" or some similiar language. We DROS'ed it and all is well.
As I was leaving the shop I asked about a Blackhawk and as luck would have it, I wanted it also. This is a non C&R Ruger.
I then filled out another form for the Blackhawk, a private party transfer.
Then he needed a copy of my drivers license for proof of citizenship.
Then a copy of my military ID in lieu of a Handgun Safety Certificate.
And finally a copy of my vehicle registration for proof of residency.
After that was all done I left with the Ballester in hand and the Blackhawk still in his safe.
According to the DoJ FAQ's http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/dlrfaqs.htm I must wait 10 days for the Blackhawk since I just got the Ballester on a C&R/COE. The 30 day wait is not necessary due to my COE, but I have to wait 10 days for the Blackhawk because it is not C&R and I just took delivery on the Ballester.
Seems odd that I have to wait 10 days for the Blackhawk, yet if it was a C&R I wouldn't have a waiting period. If the 10 days are a "cooling off" period why doesn't it apply to C&R? If one was to off someone they would be just as offed with an old gun.
So my thinking is I should have taken the Blackhawk first with the COE avoiding the 10 day wait. Then picked up the Ballester with the C&R and COE the next day.
Is that correct thinking or am I twisting the intent? Won't be long and we'll have to have an attorney to represent us in this confusing fiasco of firearm purchasing.
I have a rifle on the way and it starts all over again.
My pusher is charging $45 for an online type purchase shipping to him and then transfer, covers 10 day storage and lock. That also covers the $25 DROS fee.
I could buy alot of ammo with this fee money.
10-29-2005, 2:41 AM
You have to do the 10 day waiting period on the Ruger no matter what since it is not C&R, so it doesn't matter which one you bought first. Your C&R + COE only exempt you from the 10 day wait on C&R firearms.
And yes, the 10 day cooling off period is useless for anybody that already owns another gun. But our gun laws weren't all written at one time and they weren't always written by reasonable people. Gun laws in California have been written in layers over several decades, with exeptions added and taken away on a regular basis.
The "one handgun per month" exemption that your C&R + COE gives you on all handguns was part of a different law. It doesn't seem to make sense that even modern handguns are exempted, but pro-gun legislators were able to somehow get that exemption into the final bill. So we'll take what we can get.
In the old days, gun laws were often written in an honest (but misguided) attempt to fight crime and/or improve public safety. But now they are more often written in a deliberate attempt to deter firearm sales and ownership. So you have cases where anti-gun lawmakers will pass a bill to add restrictions to a previous, well thought out gun control law, and then other cases where pro-gun lawmakers will succeed in adding a few common sense exemptions to a ridiculous new gun control law. And when all of these laws get piled on top of each other you end up with some pretty comical (so funny you cry) situations. Like where a cheap Bryco .25 is considered a "safe" handgun but a $4000 custom M1911 is a "junk gun" or "Saturday Night Special". Or where you can walk out the door with your semi-automatic Ballester Molina but have to cool off for 10 days before picking up your new single action revolver.
12-09-2013, 1:58 PM
We revive a 2005 thread for a 1-word reply?
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