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Paladin
02-26-2009, 9:34 PM
I know that AARP has historically been "liberal" (i.e., statist). But does anyone know if they've ever taken a position on guns?

I would think that many of their constituents would be pro-gun since they are weaker and more vulnerable than the average person. They are more likely to have served in the military (Korea or Vietnam) or come from a pro-gun culture/family.

AARP is a huge organization, with ~8 times as many members as the NRA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AARP
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Rifle_Association

Has the NRA ever taken out ads in their magazine? Has the NRA ever targeted an outreach to seniors/the elderly? If not, why not?

We need to reach out to our natural allies.

Dr Rockso
02-26-2009, 9:43 PM
I've heard accusations that they are actively anti-gun, but don't know any specifics.

Tier One Arms
02-26-2009, 10:10 PM
They are on the NRA list of anti-gun business and associations.

Sam
02-27-2009, 1:16 AM
what makes you think that a group that supports "weaker" citizens would use logic and support the 2nd Amendment? I was laughed when one of my friend's friends was talking about an organization putting on self defense classes for women and I suggested giving them all CCWs.

johnny_22
02-27-2009, 8:12 AM
"Unacceptable Ad Messages

AARP deems some industry sectors as unacceptable for its publications. These include:

* Guns, firearms, weapons
* Age-related membership organizations recruiting members
* Political, religious or public policy messages
* Tobacco and related products"

http://www.aarp.org/aarp/About_AARP/advertising_guide/Articles/Advertising_Policies/

johnny_22
02-27-2009, 8:18 AM
"Gun Control
AARP believes in the Constitutional right to bear arms. But to make the nation safer, we must do what we can to keep guns out of hands of children and criminals. AARP supported the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act, which went into law in 1994 with bi-partisan support, but was allowed to expire this year.

AARP supports measures to eliminate firearm possession by juveniles, convicted domestic abusers and those under domestic violence restraining orders."

http://www.aarp.org/aarp/presscenter/pressrelease/articles/oreilly.html

Sam
02-27-2009, 8:21 AM
"Gun Control
AARP believes in the Constitutional right to bear arms. But to...

http://www.aarp.org/aarp/presscenter/pressrelease/articles/oreilly.html

You either believe in the right or you don't. The AARP just said they believe in the right because they know people can read the Bill of Rights.

7x57
02-27-2009, 9:05 AM
what makes you think that a group that supports "weaker" citizens would use logic and support the 2nd Amendment?

Let's ask the rice-bowl question. Will more people join AARP if they are more afraid or less afraid? And are armed seniors more afraid, or less afraid?

It's quite possible that scared seniors are more likely to join, same as they are more likely to vote more money and power to the state.

The other question is public perception: will more people *refuse* to join if they are publicly for or against gun control? Sadly, I bet th answer is "for."

My guess is that counting all factors, being anti puts rice in their bowl. :(

Now let's ask the ideology question: does AARP believe in giving up government largesse for the sake of the Law, or will they push for more benefits regardless of the law and regardless of Federalism?

Again, as an advocacy group for a specific demographic, I would guess (though I don't know) that their fundamental charter is getting their hand in the public till first and foremost. That's not exactly gun-rights oriented, but it's probably correlated.

So, in the end, I can't see much percentage for them to be pro- but some for them being anti. :(

7x57

BroncoBob
02-27-2009, 9:47 AM
I'm glad I just keep throwing their junk mail in the trash.

Paladin
02-27-2009, 9:57 AM
Great finds, johnny_22! I esp like the one where they gripe about O'Reilly not allowing alternative views (O'Reilly "typically does not allow for an open dialogue to take place. Its colorful and controversial host has a history of placing various special interests over those of average Americans by slamming, insulting and silencing those who hold opposing points of view" -- emphasis added). Yet they take positions (ant-2nd A RKBA, pro-illegal aliens ("migrant workers" who "often do not qualify for Social Security or income assistance programs")), and don't allow opposing views (AARP deems some industry sectors as unacceptable for its publications. These include:

* Guns, firearms, weapons
* Age-related membership organizations recruiting members
* Political, religious or public policy messages)."

Typical hypocrisy!

Since AARP is on record as being anti. Two follow up questions: (1) Is there a "conservative" alternative to the AARP? IIRC, I remember hearing about one a decade or so ago. Does anyone know if it is still around, and if so, what is its name?

(2) Since the AARP won't accept political or gun ads, how can the NRA focus an outreach to seniors?

BB63Squid
02-27-2009, 11:44 AM
I'm all for keeping dangerous automobiles out of the hands of senior citizens who are dangerous to the general populace.

Sam
02-27-2009, 11:53 AM
Let's ask the rice-bowl question. Will more people join AARP if they are more afraid or less afraid? And are armed seniors more afraid, or less afraid?

It's quite possible that scared seniors are more likely to join, same as they are more likely to vote more money and power to the state.

The other question is public perception: will more people *refuse* to join if they are publicly for or against gun control? Sadly, I bet th answer is "for."

My guess is that counting all factors, being anti puts rice in their bowl. :(

Now let's ask the ideology question: does AARP believe in giving up government largesse for the sake of the Law, or will they push for more benefits regardless of the law and regardless of Federalism?

Again, as an advocacy group for a specific demographic, I would guess (though I don't know) that their fundamental charter is getting their hand in the public till first and foremost. That's not exactly gun-rights oriented, but it's probably correlated.

So, in the end, I can't see much percentage for them to be pro- but some for them being anti. :(

7x57

good analysis, although I would have gone with "they know which side their bread is buttered"

yellowfin
02-27-2009, 12:09 PM
AARP being anti religion and anti gun seems strange since most seniors I've ever known have been both pro 2A and religious. You can't find a firing range or a church that's not at least 50% over 60.

7x57
02-27-2009, 12:17 PM
AARP being anti religion and anti gun seems strange since most seniors I've ever known have been both pro 2A and religious. You can't find a firing range or a church that's not at least 50% over 60.

OTOH, minorities living in the most dangerous neighborhoods where the police never seem to show up being anti-2A also seems strange, yet 'tis so.

But your claim that you can't find a church that isn't gray is simply wrong, and I'll be happy to take you to a bunch within driving distance of my house if that's what it takes to prove it. It's been a while since I was church-hopping but I can probably still remember which ones were the youngest if I think about it for a while.

I'm sorry to report that some of the youngest were also the whackiest by secular *or* religious standards.

7x57

MudCamper
02-27-2009, 1:51 PM
AARP members don't fit into any categories. People join for the benefits. I will join as soon as I am old enough for the discounts on medical plans, as I am self-employed, and currently I get the bend-over-and-pay-out-the-nose medical plans. I couldn't care less what their political persuasion is.

7x57
02-27-2009, 2:32 PM
good analysis, although I would have gone with "they know which side their bread is buttered"

I could have used that metaphor, but "rice bowl" is an analogy I became familiar with. As I first heard it in the context of the economics of teaching martial arts, "rice bowl" was pretty appropriate. :D It probably came from someone's sensei, in fact.

IIRC the specific issue was competition between schools that got intensely violent (in the US, recently, not legends about something that happened in Asia a century ago)--so much so that CCW in fact would have been a prudent measure. :chris:

Still, as someone wisely said about martial artists getting really hot arguing on the net: "What? You get a bunch of people who are interested in fighting, watch people fighting, and spend a great deal of time studying fighting, and then you're shocked when they start...fighting?" :D

7x57

Yankee Clipper
02-27-2009, 8:44 PM
Let's ask the rice-bowl question. Will more people join AARP if they are more afraid or less afraid? And are armed seniors more afraid, or less afraid?

It's quite possible that scared seniors are more likely to join, same as they are more likely to vote more money and power to the state.

The other question is public perception: will more people *refuse* to join if they are publicly for or against gun control? Sadly, I bet th answer is "for."

My guess is that counting all factors, being anti puts rice in their bowl. :(

Now let's ask the ideology question: does AARP believe in giving up government largesse for the sake of the Law, or will they push for more benefits regardless of the law and regardless of Federalism?

Again, as an advocacy group for a specific demographic, I would guess (though I don't know) that their fundamental charter is getting their hand in the public till first and foremost. That's not exactly gun-rights oriented, but it's probably correlated.

So, in the end, I can't see much percentage for them to be pro- but some for them being anti. :(

7x57
Good perspective but Iíll offer a different slant on the AARP 'as far as we are concerned' . The organization seems to be made up of and run by people from the print media but still believe their defending, supporting and championing those over 50. Why they don't support senior citizens arming themselves when they are otherwise so vulnerable escapes me. They know that no where in the country are the local LE people going to show up before the perpetrator is on them, does what ever they want to do and fled. In that respect, as Paladin states in a later post, senior management of ARRP are hypocrites: espousing support and PROTECTION of senior citizens while trying their best to keep the defensive wherewith-all out of the hands they believe they are protecting. I guess when you live in an ivory tower itís kind of hard picture yourself living in a neighborhood thatís changed to a Ďhoodí.

Satex
02-27-2009, 8:52 PM
AARP believe in whatever serves the interests of their membership. The do not believe in property rights, they were running amok here in CA fighting Prop 98. I see them no different from the ADL. They find it easy to justify gun control because "bigots" will use it against their membership, and govt should "do more" to protect vulnerable elderly citizens...

MudCamper
02-27-2009, 11:21 PM
Trying to pigeonhole AARP members into a single category makes about as much sense as putting all AAA members in one category.

7x57
02-27-2009, 11:35 PM
Trying to pigeonhole AARP members into a single category makes about as much sense as putting all AAA members in one category.

But I don't think the discussion was primarily about AARP *members*. It was about the AARP as an organization, and that we can rationally discuss. If the AARP takes a stand against the 2A then it is an anti-2A organization, even if it's members feel differently. Their money is still going to the wrong side no matter what words come out of their mouth.

Huh. Replace "AARP" with "union" and that paragraph becomes even more profound.

7x57

cousinkix1953
02-28-2009, 5:05 AM
But I don't think the discussion was primarily about AARP *members*. It was about the AARP as an organization, and that we can rationally discuss. If the AARP takes a stand against the 2A then it is an anti-2A organization, even if it's members feel differently. Their money is still going to the wrong side no matter what words come out of their mouth.

Huh. Replace "AARP" with "union" and that paragraph becomes even more profound.

7x57
On the other hand, I don't recall the American Automobile Association leaders mouthing off about issues unrelated to the primary mission. They have no opinions about gun control, gay marriage, medical marijuana or much anything else. I throw any AARP mail that arrives into my box in the recycle bin...