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View Full Version : $1,000,000 liability insurance or no gun ownership.


mecam
02-19-2009, 2:47 PM
Illinois Bill HB0687. Hopefully this is not a dupe cause this is F*&^ing ridiculous.

http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/BillStatus.asp?DocTypeID=HB&DocNum=687&GAID=10&SessionID=76&LegID=41158

Synopsis As Introduced
Amends the Firearm Owners Identification Card Act. Provides that any person who owns a firearm in this State shall maintain a policy of liability insurance in the amount of at least $1,000,000 specifically covering any damages resulting from negligent or willful acts involving the use of such firearm while it is owned by such person. Provides that a person shall be deemed the owner of a firearm after the firearm is lost or stolen until such loss or theft is reported to the police department or sheriff of the jurisdiction in which the owner resides. Provides that the Department of State Police shall revoke and seize a Firearm Owner's Identification Card previously issued under this Act if the Department finds that the person to whom such card was issued possesses or acquires a firearm and does not submit evidence to the Department of State Police that he or she has been issued in his or her name a liability insurance policy in the amount of at least $1,000,000 specifically covering any damages resulting from negligent or willful acts involving the use of such firearm while it is owned by such person. Effective January 1, 2010.

rrr70
02-19-2009, 2:49 PM
Isn't this a discrimination based on income level?

mecam
02-19-2009, 2:49 PM
Fudge, I found the dupe. :90:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=154878&highlight=HB0687

johnny_22
02-19-2009, 2:50 PM
Doubt it will go anywhere.

halifax
02-19-2009, 2:53 PM
This is a modern-day Jim Crow law intended to keep the poor from exercising their 2nd amendment rights.

Courts should recognize it for what it is.

IMHO

dreyna14
02-19-2009, 2:58 PM
Imagine what would happen if they tried to do this with auto insurance. Auto collisions kill twice as many people than guns, why not?

EZ G
02-19-2009, 3:04 PM
"Courts should recognize it for what it is."

Yeah but that means it becomes law and then gets challenged and litigated. Not good for us if it goes that route. Glenn Beck was going nuts on this today and I had to laugh. Guess he hasn't heard about micro stamping and "safe" handguns. MMmmmm I think I have an email to send.

bwiese
02-19-2009, 3:05 PM
A fundamental enumerated civil right cannot be taxed/licensed or require insurance.

Post-incorporation in the 9th this will defintely be another incorp case in Chicagoland circuit (lost track of their #).

yellowfin
02-19-2009, 3:26 PM
This is a modern-day Jim Crow law intended to keep the poor from exercising their 2nd amendment rights.

Courts should recognize it for what it is.

IMHO That hasn't stopped them from not stopping any of Illinois other absurd anti 2A laws.

halifax
02-19-2009, 3:37 PM
That hasn't stopped them from not stopping any of Illinois other absurd anti 2A laws.

I was assuming incorporation. :o

sb_pete
02-19-2009, 7:30 PM
A fundamental enumerated civil right cannot be taxed/licensed or require insurance.

Post-incorporation in the 9th this will defintely be another incorp case in Chicagoland circuit (lost track of their #).

What about NFA items?

kermit315
02-19-2009, 7:57 PM
That hasn't stopped them from not stopping any of Illinois other absurd anti 2A laws.

Which other anti 2A laws have they enacted, not including Chicago?

1859sharps
02-19-2009, 8:39 PM
problem with the proposed insurgence law, is unlike "assault weapons" laws, this would unite all gun owners. The other side knows to be successful, they need to continue the chip away us/divide and conquer approach. I would surprised if this bill progressed too far.

I almost hope one of these days a bill like this one gets some traction and gets close to passing. might finally drive home that gun control isn't about the EBR/Handguns...its about all weapons. Hunting rifles, duck guns, blackpowder, air rifles, pepper spray etc. It would be nice to see even 25% of gun owners active politically.

If I remember right, this got proposed in the 90s too.

kermit315
02-19-2009, 8:47 PM
As I said in the other thread:

I will say the same thing here that I said on THR.us: IF this passes, and incorporation happens, it will PROBABLY be ruled unconstitutional as an infringement on the Second Amendment, a la poll taxes of yesteryear. Even without incorporation, I dont see this getting too much traction. Too much liability to the assembly critters in Illinois come reelection time.

The one upside to this is that if they decide to pass this, and it gets thrown out as unconstitutional, there is the slim possibility that FOID could go with it.

sholling
02-19-2009, 10:30 PM
This is a modern-day Jim Crow law intended to keep the poor from exercising their 2nd amendment rights.

Courts should recognize it for what it is.

IMHO
You're surprised? Democrats wrote the original Jim Crow laws. :whistling:

Jamez
02-20-2009, 12:12 AM
ok, this bill passes. What are they going to do when no one wants to be an armed security guard in that state because the monthly "gun insurance" is too much for a $12-13 to pay? no more armed cars. OR! Businesses would have to pay it or you could write it off on taxes as a business expense.
Just a thought.

Dont Tread on Me
02-20-2009, 6:27 AM
"Amends the Firearm Owners Identification Card Act."
"Department of State Police shall revoke and seize a Firearm Owner's Identification Card previously issued "

I love the way these registration cards start out benign and then more and more crap gets tagged on. Another example of an anti gunner stepping stone.

Auto collisions kill twice as many people than guns, why not?

Looking at 2003 death data it is more like 4 times: Auto collision ending in death 44,700, gun assaults ending in death 11,600?

I'm sure if we look at the distribution of soccer moms vs. crack dealing gang bangers, we're see even more people who benefit our society killed in car accidents than through guns. I also want to know how many of the deaths where a gun was the mechanism would have happened anyway (suicide, murder etc) vs pure accidents.

dreyna14
02-20-2009, 10:57 AM
"Amends the Firearm Owners Identification Card Act."
"Department of State Police shall revoke and seize a Firearm Owner's Identification Card previously issued "

I love the way these registration cards start out benign and then more and more crap gets tagged on. Another example of an anti gunner stepping stone.

More than just a stepping stone, they just got out the scissor lift and are going all the way.

Looking at 2003 death data it is more like 4 times: Auto collision ending in death 44,700, gun assaults ending in death 11,600?

The "half" I was mentioning is the total deaths, but you're right, about half of the total are suicides.

Shotgun Man
02-20-2009, 11:12 AM
So how much does the insurance cost? Do such policies exist independent of home owner policies?

Curtis
02-20-2009, 11:22 AM
I have an umbrella policy that would cover such an issue. However, I'm sure the coverage would increase if it had to specifically state guns.

The definition of ownership was my main concern. Ownership defined as when the gun is reported stolen is crazy. I am now responsible for the actions of a thief....until I file a police report. I'm sure the insurance underwriter would kick out my application just for that line alone.

As for security guards, I'm sure they have some type of policy in place currently. It wouldn't take much to expand to cover employees....and add more cost to the companies.

eflatminor
02-20-2009, 11:42 AM
I just sent a letter and left a phone message for this bum Dunkin. Probably won't help but it can't hurt and it felt good.

swhatb
02-20-2009, 12:05 PM
A fundamental enumerated civil right cannot be taxed/licensed or require insurance.

Post-incorporation in the 9th this will defintely be another incorp case in Chicagoland circuit (lost track of their #).

very good point:thumbsup:

stag1500
02-20-2009, 4:45 PM
They're just making it so much easier for incorporation to happen. :D

Seesm
02-21-2009, 1:01 AM
Bad idea.

tankerman
02-21-2009, 5:23 AM
Just ask Obama for the money, have him send it over with your housing bailout welfare check.

motorhead
02-21-2009, 9:45 AM
another good reason not to live in IL.

kermit315
02-21-2009, 10:28 AM
Illinois isnt that bad other than FOID and Chicago. They dont have class 3, but neither does california. You can do true FTF transfers in Illinois, and there are no magazine capacity limits.