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View Full Version : carrying in national parks.


gir007
02-15-2009, 3:25 PM
I know its illegal in state but I coulda swore that not too long ago they legalized open carry or sumthing in national parks and was wanting to know if someone knew the penal codes or section of that law because I can not find it. wanted to know before I go camping in april.

dieselpower
02-15-2009, 3:35 PM
I thought only CCW holders are now allowed, when at one point no one was allowed....I have no idea.

rayra
02-15-2009, 3:58 PM
Fails for both of you.

Carry, Open OR Concealed, was forbidden in National Parks.
CA bans carry of any kind in State Parks.
The Interior Dept had a comment period open for six months last year and just before the end of the Bush administration decided to legalize CCW in National Parks, bringing them into alignment with the CCW laws of the States they were located in.
Rank and file tree-huggers in teh NPS pissed themselves. Anti-gun groups pissed themselves. Sierra Club et all pissed themselves.
The order / rule change went out.
And almost the very day they took office, the Obama Adminstation has said, 'waitaminute on that, we don't like it'. They actually can't reverse it without a proper establishment of new appointees, a formal review period and such, but they've been doing an awful lot of things in a big hurry lately, so it's in limbo right now.

Harbinger
02-15-2009, 4:03 PM
Concealed means concealed.

gir007
02-15-2009, 5:23 PM
ok so its a no no then ok i thought i heard there was open that means im not bringing em, ill just have to trust a ka-bar to defend against bears and cougars blah... so lame..

p.s. thanks for the info guys.

SDgarrick
02-15-2009, 8:07 PM
If you carry concealed at a state park, is a ranger or some other type, allowed to physically search you? What authorities do rangers have, especially if you aren't open carrying, or doing anything that might offer PC.

azn_wrx
02-15-2009, 10:25 PM
ok so its a no no then ok i thought i heard there was open that means im not bringing em, ill just have to trust a ka-bar to defend against bears and cougars blah... so lame..

p.s. thanks for the info guys.

:TFH:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap_travel/20081205/ap_tr_ge/travel_brief_guns_national_parks

You can carry as long as you follow the applicable laws in each state.

DisgruntledReaper
02-15-2009, 11:36 PM
Having been an offroader ,camper hiker etc for years...you come to realize that you are on your own in the woods,especially the interior of the BIG parks like Yellowstone,yosemite,etc or ANYWHERE in the woods for that matter. Also, nothing like stumbling across a pot farm, having some 'mountain man' sneak up on you while hunting,etc,etc.....I alsways have something that 'spits' also according to the law in Kali..your camp site is your residence and you are allowed(BS term that is) to have a firearm with you....so there is a strange overlap of what is/is not legal.

I for one am more worried about running across some wigged out person or pot farm or ? than any animal..those I know how they act/react....it is the 2 legged bastards you need to worry about.
That is my .02 and the fact that LAST time I was camping..SOMEONE came snooping around the camp, circled the tent like 3 times,paused,eventually went away...this was at like 2 am and yes I did have my Glock out....

So just keep anything low profile...or have a 26.5mm flare gun and some flares...work for emergency or self defense..nothing like a big fireball..:thumbsup:

gir007
02-16-2009, 4:06 AM
Having been an offroader ,camper hiker etc for years...you come to realize that you are on your own in the woods,especially the interior of the BIG parks like Yellowstone,yosemite,etc or ANYWHERE in the woods for that matter. Also, nothing like stumbling across a pot farm, having some 'mountain man' sneak up on you while hunting,etc,etc.....I alsways have something that 'spits' also according to the law in Kali..your camp site is your residence and you are allowed(BS term that is) to have a firearm with you....so there is a strange overlap of what is/is not legal.

I for one am more worried about running across some wigged out person or pot farm or ? than any animal..those I know how they act/react....it is the 2 legged bastards you need to worry about.
That is my .02 and the fact that LAST time I was camping..SOMEONE came snooping around the camp, circled the tent like 3 times,paused,eventually went away...this was at like 2 am and yes I did have my Glock out....

So just keep anything low profile...or have a 26.5mm flare gun and some flares...work for emergency or self defense..nothing like a big fireball..:thumbsup:

the crappy part is that not even the risk of the pot farms et isn't enough to convince our stupid state govt that we need to protect ourselves but they don't like us doing that in our homes even and i like how yosemites website says no guns ect but then says if you encounter a cougar or bear to just yell and make noise and look bigger and if it attacks you FIGHT BACK. how the f are you going to fight back against a 1000 plus lb bear which I don't know how much they weigh just random number and a cougar? huge sticks don't hurt em much and the cougars are fast as hell, I know I cant run 30-35 mph... I think both of those are good reasons why we need to carry there, but if I have to i will invest in the flare gun idea and try to set the anilmal on fire if I get attacked or the person if I hopefully don't run into running drugs?

btw what is ca state law on flare guns and smoke rounds and making your own tubed rounds that launh a variety of random objects hehehheh.

tombinghamthegreat
02-16-2009, 10:29 AM
What about open carrying bowie knives? I always found laws to be more of a suggestion...kidding or am i?:D

dieselpower
02-16-2009, 10:53 AM
Fails for both of you.

Carry, Open OR Concealed, was forbidden in National Parks.
CA bans carry of any kind in State Parks.
The Interior Dept had a comment period open for six months last year and just before the end of the Bush administration decided to legalize CCW in National Parks, bringing them into alignment with the CCW laws of the States they were located in.
Rank and file tree-huggers in teh NPS pissed themselves. Anti-gun groups pissed themselves. Sierra Club et all pissed themselves.
The order / rule change went out.
And almost the very day they took office, the Obama Adminstation has said, 'waitaminute on that, we don't like it'. They actually can't reverse it without a proper establishment of new appointees, a formal review period and such, but they've been doing an awful lot of things in a big hurry lately, so it's in limbo right now.

So what you are saying is, at one point no one was allowed to carry at all, then the law changed to allow only CCW to carry" How is this a fail for me? What am I missing from my first staement or am I reading what you are saying wrong?

BigDogatPlay
02-16-2009, 11:11 AM
If you carry concealed at a state park, is a ranger or some other type, allowed to physically search you? What authorities do rangers have, especially if you aren't open carrying, or doing anything that might offer PC.


Put simply a state park peace officer, otherwise known as a ranger, is a peace officer. All rights, duties, privileges, etc. That includes search and seizure within the law. If the ranger can articulate a Terry frisk, then you will get frisked. If you are carrying concealed you'll get arrested on the spot for that as well as for bringing a firearm into a state park (seperate charge).

They also have, to a degree, the authority of a DFG warden as relates to resource protection and can enforce all DFG rules and regs. That includes warrantless inspection of you and your stuff if you are fishing to make sure you haven't gone over the limit.

mej16489
02-16-2009, 1:30 PM
So what you are saying is, at one point no one was allowed to carry at all, then the law changed to allow only CCW to carry" How is this a fail for me? What am I missing from my first staement or am I reading what you are saying wrong?

If you have your rice paper you're fine in National Parks (not State Parks though) However, I understand there is some contention/gray area with regard to 'federal buildings' which might even include a standalone restroom if a fed worker is inside cleaning.

IIRC the orginal wording of the new rules were to 'align them with State Parks' but it evidently changed at the 11th hour ... for our neck of the woods it ended up better for us but I know that change irritated allot of folks in other states. Especially those with open carry rights.

SDgarrick
02-16-2009, 4:36 PM
I can open carry at the mall...But not in a forest. That's some :icon_bs:

Alaric
02-16-2009, 4:57 PM
Fails for both of you.

Carry, Open OR Concealed, was forbidden in National Parks.
CA bans carry of any kind in State Parks.
The Interior Dept had a comment period open for six months last year and just before the end of the Bush administration decided to legalize CCW in National Parks, bringing them into alignment with the CCW laws of the States they were located in.
Rank and file tree-huggers in teh NPS pissed themselves. Anti-gun groups pissed themselves. Sierra Club et all pissed themselves.
The order / rule change went out.
And almost the very day they took office, the Obama Adminstation has said, 'waitaminute on that, we don't like it'. They actually can't reverse it without a proper establishment of new appointees, a formal review period and such, but they've been doing an awful lot of things in a big hurry lately, so it's in limbo right now.

That's :fud:. Sierra Club has no position on gun rights (http://www.sierraclub.org/pressroom/releases/pr2005-01-28.asp). They are a mainstream conservation organization, not a radical fringe group of tree huggers. There is a difference.

I can open carry at the mall...But not in a forest. That's some :icon_bs:

Most malls have a sign posted at the entrance banning firearms, knives, etc. If you are caught open carrying in a mall where it is expressly forbidden you would be subject to at least a trespassing charge and possibly more. Don't assume that just because it seems like a public place that it is. Malls are usually private property.

GuyW
02-16-2009, 5:27 PM
That's :fud:. Sierra Club has no position on gun rights (http://www.sierraclub.org/pressroom/releases/pr2005-01-28.asp). They are a mainstream conservation organization, not a radical fringe group of tree huggers. There is a difference.


Right.

The Sierra Club encouraged nutcases like Earthfirst! so that the Sierra Club could appear "normal" by comparison.

Its still a biiig-money club populated by tree-huggers and anti-hunting, anti-self-defense nuts.
.

Alaric
02-16-2009, 5:45 PM
Right.

The Sierra Club encouraged nutcases like Earthfirst! so that the Sierra Club could appear "normal" by comparison.

Its still a biiig-money club populated by tree-huggers and anti-hunting, anti-self-defense nuts.
.

That's like saying the Republicans encouraged nutcases like Timothy McVeigh.

Sierra Club has been around for a loooong time and actually does a respectable job distancing itself from whackjobs. It's had a long running internal feud between those who want to take a pro-gun and pro-hunting position and those who don't. Dismissing them all as treehuggers just plays into the hands of the antis who want to claim the prestige of backing from org's like the Sierra Club. It doesn't help us in the gun rights movement one iota.

7x57
02-16-2009, 5:57 PM
Sierra Club has been around for a loooong time and actually does a respectable job distancing itself from whackjobs. It's had a long running internal feud between those who want to take a pro-gun and pro-hunting position and those who don't. Dismissing them all as treehuggers just plays into the hands of the antis who want to claim the prestige of backing from org's like the Sierra Club. It doesn't help us in the gun rights movement one iota.

I gave up my SC membership because the Angeles chapter ran a quote in the local rag that was intolerably bigoted toward basically every ancestor my boy has. I pointed this out to the editor and was not satisfied with the response. My money will go to the Angeles chapter about the time Jesse Jackson joins the KKK. Not kidding. :chris:

National SC is more conflicting for me. They certainly don't do enough to oppose the animal-rights people, as far as I'm concerned. OTOH they recently started Sierra Sportsmen (http://www.sierraclub.org/sierrasportsmen/). At first I figured it was as much a Trojan Horse as AHSA, but I'm not so sure now. They do sponsor events for first-time hunters and shooters, which *is* a win for all of us.

On the gripping hand, I think they were happy to support the lead ammo ban (I need to check into that more).

They tried almost as hard to get me back as the NRA when lapsed (nobody sends quite as much mail as the NRA :chris:), and even called me sometime around the election. I told the guy I was a "Sarah Palin environmentalist," which he laughed at and seemed to get. :D

7x57

GuyW
02-16-2009, 6:35 PM
That's like saying the Republicans encouraged nutcases like Timothy McVeigh.

Sierra Club has been around for a loooong time and actually does a respectable job distancing itself from whackjobs.

Earthfirst! was started by Dave Foreman - a member of the Sierra Club and EarthFirst at the same time.

"From 1995 to 1997, he served on the Sierra Club’s board of directors, but departed after the organisation rejected his proposed policy on restrictive immigration."

So unless you have proof that McVeigh was a registered Republican, your defense is invalid.

Here in San Diego, the Sierra Club proposed and lobbied for closing MORE of Cleveland National Forest to humans. Fortunately, the FS didn't see things their way.

Elitest tree huggers.
.

Alaric
02-16-2009, 7:16 PM
The Republican Party has no control who registers to become a member, and neither does the Sierra Club, that's the point.

chico.cm
02-16-2009, 8:00 PM
Someone please post a citation for me that says my CA CCW is no good in a CA State Park. I always do and have seen nothing to state that I can't.

Alaric
02-16-2009, 8:05 PM
Someone please post a citation for me that says my CA CCW is no good in a CA State Park. I always do and have seen nothing to state that I can't.

Ask and ye shall receive: http://www.parks.ca.gov/default.asp?page_id=21300

Illegal except in those areas designated for hunting.

Alaric
02-16-2009, 8:09 PM
Then again, there is this: http://www.calccw.com/Forums/where-can-t-i-carry/1103-can-i-carry-ca-state-park.html
...which seems to say you can. Someone remind me, what was the final word on this from past threads? I'm too lazy to look.

N6ATF
02-16-2009, 8:27 PM
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=136167&highlight=national+parks
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=146976

Drew28973
02-16-2009, 9:47 PM
Not Sure what the difference is between National Park and National Forest, But It seems legal in El Dorado national Forest.

http://www.fs.fed.us/r5/eldorado/recreation/shooting/