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eflatminor
02-10-2009, 4:36 PM
NBC4 was just sucking from the tite of mother socialism. The piece they did just now on the OC CCW meeting was nothing more than "there appears to a be some mild confusion over this issue. No worries, the sheriff's on it". What a load of dung.

NORDYKE!

That is all.

Edit: Oh, and they lied, saying that 400 some permits were found to be tied to corruption and Corona. Hutchins herself said today it was something like 92.

KWA-S
02-10-2009, 4:54 PM
NORDYKE!


2 more weeks...

also in before merge.

Kid Stanislaus
02-10-2009, 5:24 PM
Boy, when this Nordyke thing goes bust a lot of you folks will really have the wind let out of your sails.

Black Majik
02-10-2009, 5:25 PM
Boy, when this Nordyke thing goes bust a lot of you folks will really have the wind let out of your sails.

It's ok. We're used to it.

TWO WEEKS!

Stubby
02-10-2009, 5:37 PM
Yeah! Just wait, if Nordyke is a grand slam decision I cant even begin to think of the spin the media will put on it! Stand by to watch the anti's cry:D

CCWFacts
02-10-2009, 6:01 PM
I can't predict the future, but... the Supreme Court found that abortion is a fundamental protected right. Never mind that it's not mentioned anywhere in the Constitution, and has never been fundamental to the concept of ordered liberty (it has been illegal around the world until very recently).

If they can find that abortion is an individual right that binds the states, it's hard to see how they could find the 2A to be anything else.

I'm feeling good about Nordyke.

Anyway, if the 2A isn't incorporated, progress in this state is going to be glacial at best.

LOW2000
02-10-2009, 6:04 PM
I'm generally a pretty positive person, but from the comments I read from the people who attended the Nordyke session, I don't think it is going to be all that we are wishing for.

I put much more hope in the DOJ BOF having administratively screwed themselves on the AW permit issue.

jas000
02-10-2009, 6:16 PM
I put much more hope in the DOJ BOF having administratively screwed themselves on the AW permit issue.

What does this mean?

M. D. Van Norman
02-10-2009, 7:00 PM
Boy, when this Nordyke thing goes bust a lot of you folks will really have the wind let out of your sails.

Nordyke is just one of several irons in the fire. It just happens to be the local one that could have an impact sooner rather than later.

But I shared your opinion until the events of the last four years. Now, I see that the circumstances have changed. The quiet resignation of law-abiding gun owners is over.

LOW2000
02-10-2009, 7:02 PM
What does this mean?

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=107974

eflatminor
02-10-2009, 7:04 PM
[i] The quiet resignation of law-abiding gun owners is over.

So true. Might UOC be the thing to get CCW to shall issue status?

Cypren
02-10-2009, 7:15 PM
So true. Might UOC be the thing to get CCW to shall issue status?

I don't think so. The state legislature is solidly on the side of the gun-grabbers, and if it escalates to a state issue, they'll simply outlaw UOC, just as they outlawed LOC in 1967.

I'm afraid I don't hold the same glowing hope that Nordyke will go our way that some of the posters on this forum do. If you think that "because they found <insert other right here> incorporated, 2A must be!" then you haven't been paying close attention to the courts. A lot of (I daresay most) judges, on precedent-setting Constitutional questions, start with their personal policy preferences and then work backward to come up with a tortured legal justification for it. That's how we got the gun bans in the first place, before someone invented the collective-rights bull pockey and it became fashionable in academia. (Because it gave them an excuse to ignore a very inconvenient part of the Constitution for their policy preferences.) The Ninth Circuit, in particular, is notorious for this kind of legislation-from-the-bench, and notoriously leftist. (Yes, I realize that they did initially find our way in Stewart, though the Supreme Court basically overruled it, but I consider that to be an aberration, not a prediction.)

That said, smarter people than me seem to be optimistic about Nordyke, and I fervently hope I'm wrong. But given the massive assault all of our other freedoms are under thanks to Premier Obama and his vision of a Glorious Soviet Socialist Republic, I'm not holding my breath that this one will go against the grain.

bulgron
02-10-2009, 7:29 PM
All you have to do is look into the personal history of the judges on the Nordyke panel in order to see where the optimism comes from. I think these guys are going to take care of us. What happens if Nordyke goes en banc is another story (and, actually, kind of a crap shoot given how the 9th circuit operates). But after that there's the Supremes, and we get to continue to be optimistic about that so long as our five friends are still on the bench.

M. D. Van Norman
02-10-2009, 7:52 PM
Again, Nordyke is only one of several cases that may win incorporation.

Look at the bigger picture of what has happened in California and nationwide since 2004. How many pro-RKBA people would have shown up for a CCW item at a Board of Supervisors meeting in 1990?

DDT
02-10-2009, 8:25 PM
All you have to do is look into the personal history of the judges on the Nordyke panel in order to see where the optimism comes from. I think these guys are going to take care of us. What happens if Nordyke goes en banc is another story (and, actually, kind of a crap shoot given how the 9th circuit operates). But after that there's the Supremes, and we get to continue to be optimistic about that so long as our five friends are still on the bench.

I'm starting to think that Nordyke will never go en banc. I suspect that the next stop is SCOTUS if the losing side chooses to appeal.

RomanDad
02-10-2009, 8:31 PM
I thought the NBC report was great....

Liberty1
02-10-2009, 10:22 PM
The quiet resignation of law-abiding gun owners is over.


Yes, and hopefully the complacency of the "we have our CCWs w/ our heads in the sand - just move out of LA/SF and get yours too" crowd is also over. We need to be united in the pursuit of court protected Rights for everyone (CCW/OC/Hunting/Shooting Sports/FFLs, etc...) so sheriffs and legislative bodies can not infringe any more (even if that end result is just loaded open carry w/ a restricted CC privilege).

Liberty1
02-10-2009, 10:38 PM
I don't think so. The state legislature is solidly on the side of the gun-grabbers, and if it escalates to a state issue, they'll simply outlaw UOC

Even better I hope they ban it soon!



I'll just quote Gene on this issue at the post Nordyke 1:45am bar hopping in SF:

"Pppppplease brother fox, pppplease don't fling me into that briar patch" :D


at 2:30
lRnGyWE0vvE&feature

Cypren
02-10-2009, 11:08 PM
Even better I hope they ban it soon!

I don't. If Heller doesn't incorporate from Nordyke, overturning a UOC ban will mean years of appellate litigation to get a good test case to certiorari with the Supreme Court. In the meantime, the legislature will probably go hog wild banning everything they can come up with, since they'll figure that they'll either lose everything or lose nothing, and either way it will win them tons of friends in areas like San Francisco and Los Angeles where citizens are very pro-gun-control.

I'm all for overturning the ridiculous gun laws we have right now. But I'd rather things didn't get substantially worse for half a decade in order to do it.

Also, my absolute haunting nightmare at the moment is that one of "our five" on the high court retires/dies and Obama gets to replace him. We may as well kiss the 2A goodbye forever at that point -- not only won't it incorporate, but they'll make sure they overturn (or more likely, "supplement")Heller with a new precedent that makes any concept of a right to bear arms meaningless.

escon1
02-11-2009, 7:24 AM
Anyone surprised that NBC bought the Weather Channel? A convenient propaganda tool for the global warming BS.