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View Full Version : What was it like back in the 80s and 90s before bans set in?


pfl101
01-28-2009, 8:23 PM
So I've googled various topics including "B&B" guns in search of stories from people who were involved in firearms back in the "good old days" pre-Roberti-Roos, as well as the days leading up to the circa-2000 bans.

For those of us who came into the game late, it's fascinating to hear about Uzi's, AK's, FAL's, etc. being sold over-the-counter. I remember working at a KMart (LOL, lame, I know) during high school and selling rifles, etc. without any real background check (that I recall, at least--this was the 1980s) being required.

I'm particularly interested in the period leading up to the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans. Yes, I know in general that there was mass buying, but any annecdotes about specific experiences would be very interesting to read...

strangerdude
01-28-2009, 8:27 PM
I remember seeing ak-47, uzi, ar-15, etc... at big 5. Angeles mountain waa fun place to shoot at too, back then there wasn't an official range, you just pull up and shoot.

Saigon1965
01-28-2009, 8:33 PM
Ah the days of horse trading - We knew the ban was coming as opposed to now - Guns were flying off the shelves - I sold a few pieces that I had double of -

acolytes
01-28-2009, 8:33 PM
I remember getting a Mak 90 for $280. They also had Ar's for around $600, and Steyr Aug for $1100. Also remember high cap mags all day long on the shelves. Oh the good ol' days.........

CCWFacts
01-28-2009, 8:35 PM
Before '86, in most of the US, you could buy machine guns. In California, you could buy almost everything but machine guns.

A lot of this wouldn't have happened if the Internet had existed. We're now able to mobilize vast numbers of calls, donations, workers, etc, when some bill comes out. We are a true grass-roots movement and the Internet allows a grass-roots movement to use its strength (numbers), in a hurry. Before the Internet forums started taking off a few years ago, a lot of people may have sympathized with our movement but didn't get informed early enough to get active.

The one area of gun law that has really improved since the 80s in most of the US has been the sweep of the CCW movement. We lost machineguns but got CCW. I'm ready for CCW reform to finally make its way to the Golden State, and I wish we could get MGs back, but at least now 85% of Americans have reasonable access to CCWs, and their CCWs are (in most cases) valid in a large swath of the country.

chico.cm
01-28-2009, 8:37 PM
I worked for Wally world back in the mid to late 80's. Those were the days.
We sold both handguns and long guns. It was 4473, cash & carry.
We actually carried the gun to the front door and handed it to them as they left. I probably sold 5-10 guns per shift, everyday.
I bought a mini 14 for $275. I bought a marlin semi auto .22 for $100. The single shot shotguns went on sale for $59.
I bought a police trade in model 66 for $150 at a pawn shop.
I miss those days.

jjperl
01-28-2009, 8:49 PM
I really wish I "lived" in those days. I remember in 92', my older brother bought me my first .22, when I was around 8, and we went into the hills behind my house to shoot it. It was no problem back then, now its is. :43:

old-trapper
01-28-2009, 8:53 PM
Bought a winchester 94 30/30 bicentenial year 1976 with a box of commerative ammo ...they had a special price a 94 for 94 $94.00 dollar us Grant Boys Costa Mesa. In the mid 80s my buddies and i all bought guns between us it was Hk91(G3),Colt AR15 green label,Colt series 70,Norinco ak and HK94. I sold the HK94 and still dream about that weapon. Living in costa mesa i met the creator of the m16 he had a shop next to a car battery rebuilder in a old industrial area. very nice guy. Now if we had a adult beverage and a quality cigar this could go on al night......

bridgeport
01-28-2009, 8:54 PM
I do feel sorry for you young fellers.... you can always move to a free state
though.

Charliegone
01-28-2009, 8:55 PM
So I've googled various topics including "B&B" guns in search of stories from people who were involved in firearms back in the "good old days" pre-Roberti-Roos, as well as the days leading up to the circa-2000 bans.

For those of us who came into the game late, it's fascinating to hear about Uzi's, AK's, FAL's, etc. being sold over-the-counter. I remember working at a KMart (LOL, lame, I know) during high school and selling rifles, etc. without any real background check (that I recall, at least--this was the 1980s) being required.

I'm particularly interested in the period leading up to the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans. Yes, I know in general that there was mass buying, but any annecdotes about specific experiences would be very interesting to read...


Lytle Creek was dangerous, but I could shoot anything ANYTHING I wanted. I miss those days so much...:(

kris&bela
01-28-2009, 8:56 PM
If I only had enough /extra money or smarter then......I would have gotten a Poly-tech and the folding Mini-14.I see them all the time at the gun stores when I was active duty in San Diego.I figured then that all I really wanted was a M1 Carbine, a 1911 and a Hi Power.I was wrong....but I was able to get an AR15 and that's the good thing about it.

pfl101
01-28-2009, 9:03 PM
"We actually carried the gun to the front door and handed it to them as they left."

Back at good-ole KMart, we just handed the gun to the guy and wished them well.

LOL

Amazed to hear about Big 5 carrying AKs, although I guessed it was pretty wide-spread back in the day. Now, you get people looking worried when you ask them to handle the damned Mossberg behind the counter...

Joe
01-28-2009, 9:06 PM
It was terrible and extremely dangerous! Machine guns were walking down the street and shooting babies. It was like a scene out of terminator.

pfl101
01-28-2009, 9:06 PM
"Living in costa mesa i met the creator of the m16 he had a shop next to a car battery rebuilder in a old industrial area. very nice guy. Now if we had a adult beverage and a quality cigar this could go on al night......"

You met Stoner? Cool, must have been an interesting guy to talk to.

Regarding the beer/whisky and cigar, I'd be down for a Calguns get-together sometime.

Salty
01-28-2009, 9:15 PM
I'm curious as to what the public sentiment towards "black guns" was then as compared to now.

pfl101
01-28-2009, 9:20 PM
I'm sure that incidents like Columbine, the Stockton slayings and the San Ysidro attack helped polarize people.

But the more insidious stuff like Michael Moore's tripe hurt us a lot more.

People fall head-over-heels for stuff that "intellectually demonstrates the evils of guns" more than they do any particular event.

rayra
01-28-2009, 9:21 PM
HK SP89s (HK94 variant) at Turners for all of $899 in the mid 80s.

Sherwood International in Northridge had army footlockers full of GI surplus 30-rd AR mags for 2.95ea.

A box of (20) .223 from PMC was $2.49.

A Colt AR15A2 was $800.

BobB35
01-28-2009, 9:37 PM
Visit Free America (pretty much any state except CA and the NE) and that is what is was like in the 80s. CA is jacked when it comes to common sense gun laws and I doubt it will get better. No gain for the politicians....

1911man
01-28-2009, 9:44 PM
I bought my first black gun in Fremont at Tri-City it was a HK 91 for $666, then I bought a used ColtA2 for $550 from a gun in Los Gatos, I remember renting an uzi pistol at Traget Masters in Milpitas. All of these were cash and carry. I really got scared about the first ban and gave my HK 91 to the gun exchange in San Jose and wanted to trade it for a lighter black gun so he gave me a Valmet 223, I shot it the next day and did not like the groupings it shot so I went back the same day for my HK and he said that he had sold it. So I said ok give me a gun that will shoot one holers at 100 meter and he said I do not have one , but the most accurate gun that I have is a old remington 778 in 222. I was young and dumb, people do stupid things.....Haaaa the days when California was a free as the rest of the country.

Which brings me to a reality check, I just bought my wife a youth model 870 and had to fill out four form of paper and I let it slip that I was buying this for my wife and the dealer was almost not going to sell it to me because I was buying it for my wife. I realllyyy getting tried of this state!!!!!! I have lived here all my life and would be sad to leave it. When I was a teen I remember riding in back of a minibike with our BB guns across our back for a mile to a field so we could shoot frogs and crawdads in the stream, and this was not far, it was in Milpitas!!!

Sorry for the rant I've got a little carried away.

Zebra
01-28-2009, 9:54 PM
To put these numbers in perspective:

Average wage index for calendar year 2007: $40,405.48
Average wage index for calendar year 1987: $18,426.51
(source: http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/COLA/awidevelop.html)

Still....
*sigh*

HK SP89s (HK94 variant) at Turners for all of $899 in the mid 80s.

Sherwood International in Northridge had army footlockers full of GI surplus 30-rd AR mags for 2.95ea.

A box of (20) .223 from PMC was $2.49.

A Colt AR15A2 was $800.

Frank

EBR Works
01-28-2009, 10:17 PM
I remember back in 1976 on my 17th birthday I went to the local gun shop and bought a Colt AR and half a dozen 30 round mags for $185 cash and carry. I was too young to buy ammo for it and had to have my dad pick some up for me. That rifle is long gone since I pawned it for $250 in the early 80's during a difficult financial moment. :(

dwtt
01-28-2009, 10:22 PM
The Cow Palace gun show back in 1986-87 took up two halls, with rows of tables crowded with guns. FAL's, AK's, AR-15's, Calicos, M1A's, FN-49's, bolt action rifles, M1 carbines, M1's, and tons of handguns. There were also lots of reloading supplies and ammo.h

jamesob
01-28-2009, 10:41 PM
guns were easy to buy, music was better and the girls had really puffy hair.

EBR Works
01-28-2009, 10:43 PM
the girls had really puffy hair.

On their heads also! :eek:

GW
01-28-2009, 11:00 PM
There's a store in Santa Clara called Airsoft Extreme

I thought I'd walked into a timewarp back to the Mid-80's :tt1::tt1: until I remembered they were airsoft
Oh well...
I bet they get a lot of wistful old farts in their store.
AR's AK's HK91's FAL's You name it.

They also have a very friendly staff

BigRich
01-28-2009, 11:03 PM
I'm curious as to what the public sentiment towards "black guns" was then as compared to now.

No one really cared. They were just "ugly guns" when everyone thought guns were supposed to be polished steel and Walnut. I bought my first AR type rifle in 1974. It was a Colt CAR-15. I paid full retail for it at Markell's in San Francisco. It was $280 or so out the door. There was no wait. Fill out the paperwork, pay and go. The gunshop guy wanted to know why I would want such an ugly gun. He had to order it for me. He sold me magazines (20 rounders) for less than a buck a piece.

pullnshoot25
01-28-2009, 11:15 PM
"Living in costa mesa i met the creator of the m16 he had a shop next to a car battery rebuilder in a old industrial area. very nice guy. Now if we had a adult beverage and a quality cigar this could go on al night......"

You met Stoner? Cool, must have been an interesting guy to talk to.

Regarding the beer/whisky and cigar, I'd be down for a Calguns get-together sometime.

Dude, +1! I will bring the gin! Thats a decently manly alcohol, right? I've discovered gin and tonics and I'm kinda hooked on them...

old-trapper
01-28-2009, 11:26 PM
"Living in costa mesa i met the creator of the m16 he had a shop next to a car battery rebuilder in a old industrial area. very nice guy. Now if we had a adult beverage and a quality cigar this could go on al night......"

You met Stoner? Cool, must have been an interesting guy to talk to.

Regarding the beer/whisky and cigar, I'd be down for a Calguns get-together sometime.

Stoner was a character..Talk about putting your foot in your mouth..I was talking to him and didnt know who he was and i said to him in the ignorance of the day" i would never own anything in .223 the bullets tumble and you cant kill anything with them you only wound stuff" he was gracious LOL LOL looking back quite a faux pa..

Give me a when a where in the get togather....

Cigars are evil...we must burn them up to get rid of them! i have a partagas 150 with a target on it

Saigon1965
01-28-2009, 11:45 PM
That was the feathered look - Now the other areas are just grown -

On their heads also! :eek:

Meplat
01-28-2009, 11:59 PM
EBRs where not well accepted, nor were handguns. I think the expansion of the number of women shooters interested in self defense saved us nationally on handguns.

When I was 10 years old I could put a .22 rifle across the handlebars of my bicycle and peddle down the main street of town without being molested. Twenty two RF and 12 gauge shells were available at every rural service station and market. Twenty two LR were .25 cents a box (9 three cent pop bottles) and shorts were 21 cents (seven bottles), a pack of BBs was a nickle. The local farmers welcomed us as pest control aids as it was a given that all the local kids had gun safety training before they could ride a bicycle. :thumbsup:

I'm curious as to what the public sentime) nt towards "black guns" was then as compared to now.

giarcpnw
01-29-2009, 12:28 AM
In 1985 my dad bought me an HK91 NIB for 500 at a gun show in Houston. I sold that cause it was too effing heavy to carry at 14 with a full 30 round mag. So i bought an HK94 for 500 NIB. Kept it for a couple years. Sold it for 800 to get a paint job on my 69 Mustang. The car is long gone and the gun is completely out of anyone's price range now. sigh....

Decent revolvers cost 150 bucks back then too. They were ridiculously cheap. What happened?

C

bohoki
01-29-2009, 12:37 AM
i remember tri-city sports commercials where they had racks of ar-15s

funny not many people wanted that stuff till they said you couldnt have it

pfl101
01-29-2009, 6:14 AM
Cool stories, thanks!

My dad just DROS'd a lower, after wading through the many documents showing its legality--Calguns flowchart, Bill's memorandum, Lockyer's AB 2728 letter to Schwarzenegger, etc.

I asked him why he didn't buy this stuff back in the 80s when they were cheap and plentiful. Like others have said, there are regrets about not buying into the field when it was at its cheapest.

Appreciate the stories, guys. Keep 'em coming!

CSACANNONEER
01-29-2009, 6:27 AM
I remember the owner of Atascadero Guns handing me a SPAS-12 to fondle, being able to buy any legal firearm FTF from roommates, newpaper ads, garage sales, etc. and being able to walk down the street (in San Bruno) at 12 years old with a long gun on my shoulder and nobody having a problem with it. I also remember hunting waterfowl and condors with lead shot.

aileron
01-29-2009, 6:33 AM
I remember seeing ak-47, uzi, ar-15, etc... at big 5. Angeles mountain waa fun place to shoot at too, back then there wasn't an official range, you just pull up and shoot.

Yea, uzi's with their stupid 16 inch barrels, what a crack up. It so ruined an awesome looking gun. Don't forget the calico...

http://world.guns.ru/smg/calico950.jpg

I use to hike and shoot in the Angeles forest, no one bothered me, good times... I miss hiking with a rifle on my back with no one around for miles but a few buds also with rifles. :)

Sadly I didnt have the money back then to buy the cool toys, but I would ogle the black rifles.

randy
01-29-2009, 6:42 AM
People bought black guns and nobody cared. There wasn't the pajama crowd then. It's funny there wasn't all this bolt on, clamp on, glue on cheeses grater looking crap to put on your AR and they still went bang when you pulled the trigger. Imagine that.

People went shooting and had fun but didn't destroy stuff. Then a growing group of people started shooting screwed up the Angeles forest for everybody. They left their trash and brought trash to leave...... disgusting.

If there wasn't a restriction on EBR's there wouldn't be as many sold.

I wouldn't have bought them if they weren't going to ban them. When it's no big deal to walk into a gunshop and see the walls lined with them nobody cared.

Blademan21
01-29-2009, 7:28 AM
I remember opening the LA Times one Sunday morning and Grant Boys in Costa Mesa had a sale on Colt Ar's,$299.00,earely 70's. I called my buddy and we made a road trip from San Bernardino to buy two.
The Orange Show grounds had great gun shows back then,gone now. Three buildings full of gun related stuff. Bought a new 1911 there once for $300.00 cash and carry.

The day after Stockton I called my local FFL and bought a Uzi 9mm/45acp for $550.00. Sad part is the Uzi was stored at a friends,I didn't have a safe then, and it got stolen. Stil have the AR and the 1911 was sold(borrowed) to my brother.
Now days I wait the 10 days like everyone else.:(

Mute
01-29-2009, 7:35 AM
Ah! The good 'ol days of $800 Steyr AUGs and Galils. How I miss them.

Full Clip
01-29-2009, 8:25 AM
Working on a time machine if you gents want to still take advantage of those great deals...

CAL.BAR
01-29-2009, 10:48 AM
This thread brings up a idea that I had been kicking around for a while. Do you think that older shooters who have the really good stuff (i.e. banned by name like uzi, HK etc) should make an effort to allow newer shooters to see what they're missing.

I mean it has been 20 years since anyone was able to buy or bring in a real uzi, styer AUG, spas 12 etc. Wouldn't you like a chance to try them out? For many of the new shooters AW means and AR with a large cap mag! There was a time it was different.

I have some of the good old stuff and definitely make an effort to allow shooters at the range with me to hold them, play with them and shoot them if they'd like. Seems the right thing to do -

What if we began to arrange for these special "show and tells" every so often? We already have local meets like the OC shooters etc. After all, if we want the younger generation to continue the fight, they have to know what they're fighting for!

FortCourageArmory
01-29-2009, 10:54 AM
I remember paying $329 for my first Colt AR in 1982. When I worked at Turners Reseda in 87, I bought a Norinco AK for $269. Those were the great days. HK rifles for $500. An M1A for $750. Now I'm getting sad......

pfl101
01-29-2009, 11:19 AM
"This thread brings up a idea that I had been kicking around for a while. Do you think that older shooters who have the really good stuff (i.e. banned by name like uzi, HK etc) should make an effort to allow newer shooters to see what they're missing.

I mean it has been 20 years since anyone was able to buy or bring in a real uzi, styer AUG, spas 12 etc. Wouldn't you like a chance to try them out? For many of the new shooters AW means and AR with a large cap mag! There was a time it was different.

I have some of the good old stuff and definitely make an effort to allow shooters at the range with me to hold them, play with them and shoot them if they'd like. Seems the right thing to do -

What if we began to arrange for these special "show and tells" every so often? We already have local meets like the OC shooters etc. After all, if we want the younger generation to continue the fight, they have to know what they're fighting for!"

I'm sure there are quite a few people who'd be interested in seeing these things up close...

radioburning
01-29-2009, 11:25 AM
There were rainbows and flying unicorns everywhere. JK. I remember the Turner's in Signal Hill had AK's not even behind the counter. You could buy one for about $250 and walk out the door with it. Mac-10's, and Tec-9's were cheap as dirt, and were looked down upon because they weren't "precision weapons".

rayra
01-29-2009, 11:38 AM
The Cow Palace gun show back in 1986-87 took up two halls, with rows of tables crowded with guns. FAL's, AK's, AR-15's, Calicos, M1A's, FN-49's, bolt action rifles, M1 carbines, M1's, and tons of handguns. There were also lots of reloading supplies and ammo.h


Man, the Crossroads show at the Pomona / L.A. Fairgrounds was 11-13 HUGE buildings, each as big or larger as the buildings at Costa Mesa / OC. And most of the spaces between them. JAMMED with stuff of all variety. Dozens of powder / primer / reloading vendors, instead of just 1-2. Parking, entrance, and food prices were still a gouge. But the SHOW. Man it was so huge my buds and I would make MAPS so we could take notes of where the stuff was we wanted so we could even find it again. We'd blitz the whole show, snap up the really good deals on what we wanted at the time, then double back to pick up the mere bargains and the heavier crap like ammo, ammo cans, etc etc. HUGE show.
And the Liberal Democrats infesting the L.A. County Board of Supervisors banned it.

rayra
01-29-2009, 11:43 AM
Oh and the Recycler had a firearms section. And the L.A. Daily News had a swarm of gun-related ads every Thurs/Fri. Now you have to peep at the Big5 ad to find any gun on sale.

Cato
01-29-2009, 11:47 AM
Anyone remember that sign that used to be in gunstores in the mid 80s that said something like "if you own a fully auto firearm it must be reworked to become semi auto or moved out of state" ? Does anyone remember full auto in California?

bwiese
01-29-2009, 11:49 AM
It was very cool.

In the mid/later 80s I used to frequently visit H&H Enterprises in Redwood City (right by the police station) and Arms & Ammo in San Bruno.

Wall-to-wall AWs - HKs, Uzis, Colts, Galils, etc. There was a short time at H&H where half of one wall rack was filled with Colt HBAR Delta Elites.

I can remember when Arms & Ammo sold 'smokers' (colored-smoke 'grenades' - actually something the size of a V8 juice can with a pull-ring release head). I remember looking at an Australian Auto Arms 223 pistol (or perhaps stockless rifle, not sure - had around a 16" bbl and pistol grip, no buttstock, with an FNC style operating system).


Rifles were 4473 and out the door, no waiting period. Handguns had 15 day wait though.

csmintel
01-29-2009, 11:52 AM
good music in 80's....not so good in 90's. more sunshine. there was definately more sun. I was still a kid in 80's so I played with toy guns. But i did have an excellent quality western german made AKM....it was on batteries.:rofl:

aileron
01-29-2009, 12:20 PM
I cant believe how much of this stuff I forgot about.

Grant Brothers, smoke grenades, ads in the papers which I forgot about; heck there were army navy stores everywhere I don't even know where one is now. Oh and I remember seeing dummy grenades, back then too.

I forgot about the Delta Elite Colt, I think I still have that guns and ammo magazine from 89... and yea, I miss the Pomona crossroads gun show. I loved going to that show, it was incredible how huge that show could be.

Beelzy
01-29-2009, 12:21 PM
Ahhhh, the Good Old days.

One could buy an HK91 for 6 bills, one could also go to the local gunshow
and buy a used Handgun with NO paperwork.

Life was good.

Then that ugly Beast known as The Ban came and everyone went into hiding.

pfl101
01-29-2009, 12:30 PM
I think the closest to experiencing this I've ever come is watching the "Alamo Guns" scene in the Terminator.

LOL

Was there much of a clamor to implement a ban after San Yysidro, or was it after the Stockton incident that the ban really took off?

macadamizer
01-29-2009, 1:09 PM
I bought my CAR-15A2 at B&B in North Hollywood for $599 in 1986, if I remember correctly. I still have it, fortunately. I wish I had bought an FAL or HK91 too, but they seemed so expensive -- $1000 or even more.

Fate
01-29-2009, 1:12 PM
I moved to CA from TX in 1980. You really couldn't tell a difference between either state and guns/laws back then. Now, it makes me sad to realize how far we compromised our freedoms in this state. The sad thing is how much of the regulations slipped under the radar. We just didn't know or see it coming.

Meplat
01-29-2009, 1:30 PM
That's a pack of lies. Every one knows you need at least #2 sterling silver shot to kill a condor!:p

P.S. Gold is better but in my experience too many cripples get away if you use platinum.:TFH:


I remember the owner of Atascadero Guns handing me a SPAS-12 to fondle, being able to buy any legal firearm FTF from roommates, newpaper ads, garage sales, etc. and being able to walk down the street (in San Bruno) at 12 years old with a long gun on my shoulder and nobody having a problem with it. I also remember hunting waterfowl and condors with lead shot.

ojisan
01-29-2009, 1:33 PM
The Pomona Show was 8 miles of tables. Yes, we made maps, too, just so we could visit at least the important places. We used "Walkie Talkies" a couple times. You had to get there in the morning and walk all day to see even 1/2 of it. You could buy your lead bullets for reloading in the morning, and they would hold them at the booth for you until it was time to leave at closing. Lots of people pulling carts. You could UOC with no fear. Lots of PP sales. Yes, the Macs and stuff were looked down on. Take your choice of 1911 and other accessory vendors.MRE's were legal to sell, about $12 a case.
My best purchase was at the end of a show heading for the exit. We turned down an outdoor aisle between buildings and there was a huge pile of Russian SKSs there. A sign read " SKS $100". I had exactly $100 cash in my pocket. I asked the guy how much with tax and 4473 etc. He sneered at me and said "Read the sign! SKS $100". So the rifles were only about $87.50 IIRC, $100 total w/ tax and fees, cash and carry. Yes, I bought one.
All my EBRs and others were removed from CA when the ban started. Someday I hope to bring them all back. Of course, you young 'uns will be more than welcome to shoot them when that happy day happens.
Heller, Nordyke, Incorporation...10 day waits are nothing....I've been waiting years...
Rayra...I am sure our paths have crossed! Given how crowded that show was, I probably have bumped into you or stepped on your foot at least once or twice! LOL
After Nordyke...Great Western at Pomona again? Oh, PLease!!!

Meplat
01-29-2009, 1:35 PM
I still have a 950, registered of course. Most accurate 9mm I ever owned. A lot of unique features.



Yea, uzi's with their stupid 16 inch barrels, what a crack up. It so ruined an awesome looking gun. Don't forget the calico...

http://world.guns.ru/smg/calico950.jpg

I use to hike and shoot in the Angeles forest, no one bothered me, good times... I miss hiking with a rifle on my back with no one around for miles but a few buds also with rifles. :)

Sadly I didnt have the money back then to buy the cool toys, but I would ogle the black rifles.

ojisan
01-29-2009, 1:41 PM
I had to shoot against a Calico once in a 40 target handgun speed shoot event. I thought I was "Mr Hi-Cap" with my extended 25 round mags. That Calico guy never had to reload. (Calico's had 50 and 100 round mags).
:cool2:
(The ups and downs of the "Good Ol' Days").

Meplat
01-29-2009, 1:51 PM
Hell, I remember a public service notice in the news paper written by the Shasta Co. Sherifs department about how the feds were getting serious about full autos after the passage of GCA-68, and saying they would no longer look the other way on WWII and Korean war trophies.

Anyone remember that sign that used to be in gunstores in the mid 80s that said something like "if you own a fully auto firearm it must be reworked to become semi auto or moved out of state" ? Does anyone remember full auto in California?

bohoki
01-29-2009, 2:13 PM
Working on a time machine if you gents want to still take advantage of those great deals...

oh i know if i could just transport a cargo container full of pentiums computers with windows 95 installed to trade one for one for galils ,daewoos and valmets


and they would be thinking they got the good deal

pfl101
01-29-2009, 2:17 PM
They sure did whittle down our firearms rights.

The mere mention of a semi-automatic rifle sends liberals into a tittering frenzy.

Imagine that just 41 years ago we could own a full automatic without any serious issues...

HotRails
01-29-2009, 2:18 PM
Hell, I remember a public service notice in the news paper written by the Shasta Co. Sherifs department about how the feds were getting serious about full autos after the passage of GCA-68, and saying they would no longer look the other way on WWII and Korean war trophies.


Interesting, was there any evidence that these trophies were being used in crime? Shoulda got an MG42 when the goin was good...:cool:

MudCamper
01-29-2009, 2:22 PM
I think times are better now. Yeah, we have greater restrictions, but it feels like we're gaining ground rather than constantly losing. And pre-internet, pre-CalGuns, firearms law was a foggy haze of FUD and misinformation. And there was no easy or coordinated way to keep track of or fight our insane legislature. I speak partly from personal experience. I was ignorant back then. As a result, I didn't register my Colt lowers, and ended up having to destroy them. Sucks big time.

akira
01-29-2009, 3:03 PM
i remember adds in the news paper for Colt AR15s, Aks for 200-300 bucks.
Gun shows were actually good. Gunshows with HK sp89s for 800 bucks.

sigh......

drdanno84
01-29-2009, 4:42 PM
It was absolutely wonderful! Went to the 4 annual great western gun shows at the pomona fairlplex. Made lots of friends there and had an opportunity to learn alot about firearms. Purchased several ar 15's sp1's for around 500.00/piece, 1000 rounds 0f .223 norinco for around 90.00. You could by polytech ak 47's for around 400.00 and 762/39 ammo was really cheap, 1000 rounds for around 70.00.

Outlaw Josey Wales
01-29-2009, 5:11 PM
Rifles were 4473 and out the door, no waiting period. Handguns had 15 day wait though.

Total DROS fee was only $5 and you could still DROS longguns and handguns together. You also weren't limited to one new handgun per 30 days!

ldivinag
01-29-2009, 5:21 PM
shadup....

just shadup....

you people are just drepressing me...

(un)fortunately, my father was into olympic style shooting. although he is an NRA and CPRA lifer.

so i was raised on anshutz (SP?) etc...

bwiese
01-29-2009, 5:22 PM
Total DROS fee was only $5


The DROS fee isn't such an irritant.

You also weren't limited to one new handgun per 30 days!

That's why I'm getting my C&R and COE.

anthonyca
01-29-2009, 5:40 PM
i remember tri-city sports commercials where they had racks of ar-15s

funny not many people wanted that stuff till they said you couldnt have it

I remember seeing those racks and thinking that I could have a real version of my plastic guns. I had a toy UZI and MAC 10 in plastic. My cousin came home from the Marines and he had all kinds of toys just like mine but real. I asked him if they cared that he took his "ARMY" guns home and he said he was NOT in the ARMY and they were HIS guns. I thought wow, what a great country and I can't wait to grow up.

Then I grew up into a different country.

SchooBaka
01-29-2009, 5:43 PM
I can remember tearing up when I went to the first gunshow after the 89 ban. :(
Then getting angry. :mad:

tuolumnejim
01-29-2009, 6:05 PM
I worked for Wally world back in the mid to late 80's. Those were the days.
We sold both handguns and long guns. It was 4473, cash & carry.
We actually carried the gun to the front door and handed it to them as they left. I probably sold 5-10 guns per shift, everyday.
I bought a mini 14 for $275. I bought a marlin semi auto .22 for $100. The single shot shotguns went on sale for $59.
I bought a police trade in model 66 for $150 at a pawn shop.
I miss those days.

The last one of those I bought new at a store they were 40.00, guess it's been awhile. :D

TheBundo
01-29-2009, 6:08 PM
I remember less people wanting them until after the ban. I think the ban stirred up interest, and sale of similar OLL's are probably much higher now than before.

grammaton76
01-29-2009, 6:09 PM
i remember adds in the news paper for Colt AR15s, Aks for 200-300 bucks.
Gun shows were actually good. Gunshows with HK sp89s for 800 bucks.

The sad thing is that 20 years from now, we'll all be saying, "Back in 2009, gun shows were actually good, and you could find deals".

Ford8N
01-29-2009, 6:16 PM
Pomona was awesome. First time I walked fast and it took me a whole day to just skim and still not see everything. It was cash and carry. And most sellers were just selling from their private collections. Hand over the cash and take your gun, NO 4473! Even for EBR's. I remember the Ammo Bunker in Oildale, strange biker crowd but lots and lots of EBR's. I remember at a gun show this guy had a table with nothing but Colt SP-1's for $425 each, out the door, as fast as you could hand over the cash. I saw a HK93 on a gun store rack for $850 just before the '89 ban. As to how people thought of "black guns", it was neutral from what I observed. Most people didn't care one way or another. But now since they have been demonized by the media they are more popular than ever. Just go to ANY gun show and you can tell which table is selling by the huge crowd. The more the Brady's and their puppets try to regulate out of existence EBR's, the more regular gun owners want those types of firearms.

pfl101
01-29-2009, 7:07 PM
"The sad thing is that 20 years from now, we'll all be saying, "Back in 2009, gun shows were actually good, and you could find deals."

Yep, that very suspicion is motivating many people I know to indulge in purchases beyond that which they would have made if we were in different political circumstances.

zatoh
01-30-2009, 12:19 AM
It was nice. Even after Roberti-Roos there was stuff to be had but I think people knew what was on the horizon. We used to hit the Pomona show - both the "small" one and the big one. Man was I ever tired from all that walking! I bought mostly mags at that time from the shows - mags for stuff I didn't even have yet. I think AK mags were like $6- $7. I did see the pile of SKSs but I never bought one from a show and of course in hindsight, I should have bought the whole pallet.:D

freonr22
01-30-2009, 10:37 AM
my brother was a gun dealer in the 70's-early 80's i was 10. i remember seeing the big mac attack t-shirts, w/ ronald mcdonald getting sprayed, i even wore a cobray t-shirt for a while. he got a "new" thing, a laser, i think 3-5mw, it was like a 2x6 size, about 10" long, to mount on an ar. well somebody, im not sure who, if it was the atf, or the dept of energy, came and said, ohhh you cant have a laser that powerful, and came and confiscated it. lets see what else, i remember him as a dealer buying 50-75 mac 10's at a time, i remember a 20mm dewat lahti in his shop, i remember shooting ar type rifles and macs he worked on to test them with his customers present in a quarry, i remember carrying 4 ar-15's through an office of a cheese company as a 12 year old, to the owner, and the secretaries just stared wide eyed.. those were cool times even as a kid

scrat
01-30-2009, 10:47 AM
you could walk into big 5 and buy a 25 round magazine no problem. i had a ruger 10-22. i bought one of those round barrel magazines it was a 100 round magazine. in the package just grab it and buy it. walk up to the counter. fill out the paperwork and buy a shotgun with the ammo and walk out. ahhhh the good old days.

aklon
01-30-2009, 11:35 PM
Back when I was 14 (1963) I lived in Poway in San Diego County and one day five of us were going out to do some shooting, plinking, whatever. I had a Ruger Single-Six, Dave and Gael had .22s, Gary had a .410, and Allen had his dad's Mauser. We were walking along Pomerado Road when a Sheriff's car pulled up.

"Where you boys going with all that?" he asked.

"Out to Rattlesnake Canyon."

"You want to go way out there? Do you know old man Annorino? He's got one hell of a problem with ground squirrels and he'd sure be happy to see you boys come help him out."

"Hey, thanks" says Dave. "We'll go over there."

The deputy starts to pull away, then stops his car and points at us. "Now, you boys be safe, you hear?" We all say "Yessir!" then he drives away.

Can you imagine what would happen today? We'd all be in juvie, the parents would be under arrest, the guns confiscated ...

I tell people I grew up in America, but I haven't lived there for years.

Outlaw Josey Wales
01-31-2009, 12:06 PM
I tell people I grew up in America, but I haven't lived there for years.

It's heartbreaking to read such a statement and the saddest part is that it's the truth! :(

Centurion_D
01-31-2009, 12:16 PM
Oh man...why did you guys make me flash back to the good ol days. I miss them days! :(

homerm14
01-31-2009, 12:29 PM
I bought my first black gun in Fremont at Tri-City it was a HK 91 for $666, then I bought a used ColtA2 for $550 from a gun in Los Gatos, I remember renting an uzi pistol at Traget Masters in Milpitas. All of these were cash and carry. I really got scared about the first ban and gave my HK 91 to the gun exchange in San Jose and wanted to trade it for a lighter black gun so he gave me a Valmet 223, I shot it the next day and did not like the groupings it shot so I went back the same day for my HK and he said that he had sold it. So I said ok give me a gun that will shoot one holers at 100 meter and he said I do not have one , but the most accurate gun that I have is a old remington 778 in 222. I was young and dumb, people do stupid things.....Haaaa the days when California was a free as the rest of the country.

Which brings me to a reality check, I just bought my wife a youth model 870 and had to fill out four form of paper and I let it slip that I was buying this for my wife and the dealer was almost not going to sell it to me because I was buying it for my wife. I realllyyy getting tried of this state!!!!!! I have lived here all my life and would be sad to leave it. When I was a teen I remember riding in back of a minibike with our BB guns across our back for a mile to a field so we could shoot frogs and crawdads in the stream, and this was not far, it was in Milpitas!!!

Sorry for the rant I've got a little carried away.

I worked at Tri-City sporting goods in the 80's (high school job). I could by guns at cost plus 10%, those were the days.

AJAX22
01-31-2009, 12:30 PM
I seriously think we will either look back on the restrictions we have now and laugh.... or we will be reminiscing with our kids about 2008-2009 as the good ol days....

But either way, we've made some serious progress from how it was back in 2001...

I don't know how much better it can get than this....

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=149896

titan
01-31-2009, 12:38 PM
Oh the good old days in Orange County gun shops. B&B Sales, B&E Guns, Southland Guns, Brea Guns, Bullseye Sports.

Going shooting at Lytle Creek (well, that was a little scary!) Remember that little gun shop in Lytle Creek back in the mid-80s to early 90s. The Big Pomona gun show in Nov, 3 days of walking and being broke, I feel bad for guys just getting into the hobby and never getting a chance to attend that show, it was insane!! I went at least two full days to see all the stuff. There was like 5 miles of tables in like 6 of those buildings alone, those were the days.

HK 91 = $799
AR-15 =$550 or $599 can't remember.
SP89s were like 800-900 at Turners,
M1 Garands $225
M1 Carbines $125
HK p7 and P9s 600-700
Poly Tech Legend Ak 275-300
Spingfield M1A $600-650
Russian SKS for $125
Norinco SKS for $69
Norinco 223 1000 round case of the yellow box stuff $150
Mags so cheap I makes me sick

I remember being at Brea Guns, and had a HK 91, FN FAL 50.00, Galil 308 on the counter deciding on which to get, oh and take home that after paying for it. I went with the HK.

Passed on a AUG, I think they were about $1200. Oh and the Sig 550, I can't remember what they were selling for, $1200 or $1400. Sure beats the $8-10k the can sell for now. Oh if I had only been about 10 years older I would have had more $$ to get stuff.
Yes the good old days!!

slowjonn
01-31-2009, 12:48 PM
Great stories here guys! I got my first rifle, a Ruger 10/22 when I was seven (1976). I can remember going to Cody's liquor in Winters and buying a soda, some beef jerky and a couple hundred rounds of 22. Then it was off to the bottoms of Putah creek for some squirrel shooting. Later that year I got my first motorcycle, a Honda 50. Now my firepower was mobile!

Dad would give me some gas and a 100 rounds of ammo while he was driving tractor on our ranch. That was his way of watching me. He knew I would have to come back for more ammo before long. If I didn't he knew something was wrong. Can you imagine?

We had a 100 acres of almonds to farm. This was surrounded by all kinds of ag land. As a kid I could ride and shoot for miles without anyone caring. It was awesome. During the winter, we would sell almond wood by the cord.

One day we roll out to the ranch and discover two guys stealing our wood. I was around 10-11 years old at this point. My dad had me hold the two guys at gunpoint with my folding stocked, banana mag'd 10/22. His instructions were to shoot them if they tried anything while he drove back to a neighboring ranch to call the cops. When he got back with the deputy, these two guys were arrested. I got a "good job kid" from the deputy. Can you imagine?

I can remember taking a rifle to school and leaving it in the car because I was going deer hunting after classes got out. Gun racks in trucks, with guns, were the norm. No body even thought twice about it and it was a rare day to have one stolen, even when the windows were left rolled down and the truck unlocked.

About my senior year, me and two friends had been out at the levee shooting near Woodland. On our way home, I got stopped by a motorcycle cop for speeding. When he walked up we told him we were on our way back from shooting. He asked if we had guns in the truck. I said about 20 guns between the three of us. He ran two of the guns serial numbers and then sent us on our way with a drive careful. Can you imagine?

There are a ton more stories like these. Too bad I didn't really appreciate how precious those times were. I look at my son now and fear for him and the world he will have. Hope you enjoyed my rambling.

pfl101
01-31-2009, 2:02 PM
"There are a ton more stories like these. Too bad I didn't really appreciate how precious those times were. I look at my son now and fear for him and the world he will have. Hope you enjoyed my rambling."

I am amazed at what I missed out on, partly due to being too young for some of the best stuff, and too unaware to take advantage prior to 2000.

Love the stories. Looking forward to more, especially those pertaining to the frenzy surrounding the final days before the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans.

titan
01-31-2009, 2:29 PM
Speaking of 1989 Cali ban, I was in my Junior year of college and I believe in Jan or Feb that loser shot up that school in Stockton, I will not mention his name out of respect of the victims. The Black Gun industy went crazy overnight. I was at B&B the day after the SHTF, those $250 AKs were selling for $800-$1000. It was a complete MAD HOUSE at B&B, hardly any standing room, anything simi-auto was selling for 3-4 times the price it sold for a month earlier. Like a dummy, I sold both my AR-15 A2, and HK 91. I was scared they were going to confiscate them and I could not afford to lose that kind of $$ at 21 yrs old. I sold both of them for something like $900 and $1200. Boy was that dumb!

I was later able to get a HK 911 and the Colt Sporters, but it sure would have been nice to have the originals. Live and learn.

In 1993/94 it was really ugly. hi-cap sig, glock, whatever mags selling for $85-$120 a piece and people fighting to buy them at the shows. Backlogs that existed back then make the backlogs today look like paradise. It was nuts because Nobody thought it would ever sunset. I would have bet my 401k that the 94 Crime Bill would have just been rubberstamped back into effect in 2004. The 1999 Cali-ban was pretty uneventful for me because high cap mags and scary black guns were already hard to come by and very expensive. For people living in free states, Sept 2004 must have been like winning lotto. It just kills me to miss out on all those great things, but the laws are the laws.

Electric Factory
01-31-2009, 2:37 PM
I moved to So California from Boston MA in the late 80's. That was when I discovered the Recycler [ is there a Recycler still ?], and back then you could sell your used firearms, cash+carry.
I bought many guns during those times- a Colt 1911 Commander, an AK, a semi-auto Uzi Carbine just to name a few, right out of the Recycler Want Ads. Coming from Boston I couldn't BELIEVE you could just open the paper, call the guys ad and go over and buy the gun- yea California !
By the way the Colt Commander and Uzi each cost me exactly 500.00.

Meplat
01-31-2009, 3:29 PM
No crime except no tax stamp.

Interesting, was there any evidence that these trophies were being used in crime? Shoulda got an MG42 when the goin was good...:cool:

Pvt. Cowboy
01-31-2009, 6:00 PM
I'm particularly interested in the period leading up to the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans. Yes, I know in general that there was mass buying, but any annecdotes about specific experiences would be very interesting to read...

We've talked about this before in the archives, but here's some quick recollection:

The prices people recall in this thread are pretty close, but I never saw Steyr AUGs for $800. The price on those was $1200 at the lowest I ever saw with my own eyes and I ended up paying more. They came with six mags at B&B Sales.

A lot of the reason that 'assault weapons' became popular was from the TV crime dramas of the time, particularly Miami Vice . Folks would go to gun stores looking for a Bren Ten pistol like Don Johnson had, find out that it was an unobtanium rare gun with serious problems, the salesman would instead show them a Glock 17 for $450-$500 and scare them off when they told them the gun is made of plastic, then the customer would look up on the wall and see an Hk91 for $525-$550. They'd realize that for a little more they could have a gun like Arnold uses and buy that instead. Hk91s and SAR3/SAR8s were common, Hk93s were less common and cost more ($625), and the Hk94 cost the most at $700-$750 or so. Then the Hk SP89 came out in 1989 for $900. They'd sell them in the 'assault pistols' case with the freakishly long barreled Mini-UZIs that nobody wanted. When the big bans came, prices jumped up by hundreds of dollars every week until the price pinnacle in the mid-90s.

I recall seeing some rare military semi-autos turn up at the best stores: B&B Sales had two FAMAS F1 rifles for $1000 each which was a eye-widening price for anything at the time. AUGs were regarded as the Mercedes-Benz rifle, along with the SIG-550 (and they both are, really). People would ooh and ahh over them, ask the annoyed counter guy to handle it, then hand it back delicately a few moments later. Rarest rifle I ever saw was an Hk G41S semi that was a variant of the Hk33/93 which had an M16 mag well. They wanted $1999 for that one and it wasn't there the second time I visited just a few weeks later. The price on an M82 Barrett was $5000 and everyone used to point at it and say 'That's the personal cannon from Robocop that blew up that car!'. Only occasionally would you see Galil ARM 5.56 or 7.62 rifle or FN-FNCs. At least a few Daewoo rifles were always around, and FN-FAL guns were also common and higher priced than the Hk91s. The nicest FALs at the time were SAR-48/4800s with the exception of the Australian L1A1 SLRs. A lot of shooters I knew thought that the FN-FAL was a big goofy fishing pole of a rifle at the time, but they did manage to all get sold anyway.

Lastly, Desert Eagles were popular then. Everyone had to have one. I resisted. B&B Sales even sold their 18k gold-plated .44 Magnum to someone who probably wore it on a gold chain around his neck.

SVRider
01-31-2009, 10:14 PM
"Back in the day", I came very close to buying a USAS-12. It was in the neighborhood of $1k from what I recall (considering the price of a Saiga 12 now-a-days, that was a downright steal). Not a real practical use for it (as I wouldn't have been able to get a full-auto one), but cool piece none the less.....

http://world.guns.ru/shotgun/usas-12.jpg
http://world.guns.ru/shotgun/usas-12-1.jpg

SVRider
01-31-2009, 10:18 PM
I'm particularly interested in the period leading up to the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans. Yes, I know in general that there was mass buying, but any annecdotes about specific experiences would be very interesting to read...

Let's just say I racked up some serious credit card debt back in those days

....and today..........I'm glad I did! ;)

shooterdave
01-31-2009, 10:32 PM
i remember tuans corp in rowland hts (out of business) i think they became gunrunners. anyway i remember right before the 2000 ban i was still in HS and i would go there all the time with my dad and they had wall to wall ar's ak's i went one day and i saw a springfield armory m21 with the scope and everything and that was also the first time i saw a PSL. they had footlockers full of 30 ak mags then the ban came and there was hardly anything there and a few yrs ago they were gone i don't blame them there was nothing left in that store:(

CALI-gula
01-31-2009, 10:52 PM
So I've googled various topics including "B&B" guns in search of stories from people who were involved in firearms back in the "good old days" pre-Roberti-Roos, as well as the days leading up to the circa-2000 bans.

For those of us who came into the game late, it's fascinating to hear about Uzi's, AK's, FAL's, etc. being sold over-the-counter. I remember working at a KMart (LOL, lame, I know) during high school and selling rifles, etc. without any real background check (that I recall, at least--this was the 1980s) being required.

I'm particularly interested in the period leading up to the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans. Yes, I know in general that there was mass buying, but any annecdotes about specific experiences would be very interesting to read...

Great Western Gun Show at Pomona. Of course. But long before that?

Getting the Sears Christmas catalog each year (about 4 inches thick) and flipping to the GUN section (and I don't mean BB guns and airsoft). Even thought they lacked quality, it was still cool. Going to Sears and SHOPPING at the GUN counter and walking out with great ammo at cheap prices was even cooler.

Rifles, shotguns, and ammo of ALL kinds for sale at the sports counter at K-Mart IN CALIFORNIA.

Going in to an ACE Hardware with a list in hand that says: "Oil for the compressor tools, a new thermostat for the A/C, 6-penny nails for the deck, a rifle in .308, Winchester ammo, a new 3/8" drill and set of drill bits, can of lacquer thinner, a new window screen for the back room....

Shopping for HKs, FN FALS, UZIs, Colt ARs, SIGs, AUGs, etc., and being bored by all the numerous AK47s, SVT40s, Russian SKSs, MAS 49/56s, Egyptian Hakims, and FN-49s at all of the gun stores cluttering the racks, which seemed like one big glob of surplus junk there were so many of them.

.

wilshire1412
01-31-2009, 10:57 PM
I can recall asking about the HK 94 at one of the old shops about 20 years ago, they actually had a hard time selling them since nobody thought a 9mm carbine was actually that useful-I think the prices were about $450 then:eek: I was just around 18 then and the only thing that kept me from buying one was the fact that $450 was quite a small fortune for me at that time. Once the bans started it became apparent that the $450 would have been a good investment.

CALI-gula
01-31-2009, 10:59 PM
I moved to So California from Boston MA in the late 80's. That was when I discovered the Recycler [ is there a Recycler still ?], and back then you could sell your used firearms, cash+carry.
I bought many guns during those times- a Colt 1911 Commander, an AK, a semi-auto Uzi Carbine just to name a few, right out of the Recycler Want Ads. Coming from Boston I couldn't BELIEVE you could just open the paper, call the guys ad and go over and buy the gun- yea California !
By the way the Colt Commander and Uzi each cost me exactly 500.00.

Yes, but now it's free and it's about as flimsy as a church bulletin. Things like Ebay and Craigslist killed it.

.

Max-the-Silent
02-01-2009, 9:04 AM
Boy, I'm going to have to start earlier than the poster's time frame.

Before the GCA '68, all of the mail-order surplus rifle houses pretty much sold out of quality surplus rifles, and the dealers of DEWAT MG's sold out as well.

Just for you guys that really missed out on things, there was a DEWAT dealer in San Mateo, Pacific Armaments, that had every type of MG available under the sun, for prices that would make your head explode - TMSG 1928's for $75.00, BAR's for $99.00, all types of belt feds for under $200.00, including M2's, M3, and water cooled .50's, STG-44's etc. You get the picture. Everyone of them was eligible for amnesty registration in '68.

Fast forward:

I remember the old Gun Rack on ECR in Belmont/San Carlos, buying a Costa Mesa AR180 for $200.00, an HK 41 for $400.00ish (mags were expensive though, $20.00ish) G series FAL's were off-the-charts expensive at $1000.00 traded in a pre-model 27 non-registered .357 and a Garand to get the price down to $500.00...

Open bolt MAC's under $200.00 in box with extra mags. Colt AR's NIB under $300.00 w/ two 20 rounders.

Going to the Great Western show with 5K in my pocket, getting another G FAL with 20 mags, a NM Garand, a NM M1A (Devine, Texas) and a SIG 510-4, and having money left over...

Reno SGN show. Para FAL w/ 21" barrel for $1000.00, gently used.

Going to Los Altos with my shooting buddies with two truck loads of ammo, one truck load of mags (really) and one truck load of 7.62 battle rifles. Bystander tells us it sounded like Iwo Jima, and he was there, so he would know. Compliments us on hitting the little cans we had out there, and being able to keep hitting them when they were rolling around, and again when they were shot into pieces. 8K rounds down range in a day. For each of us.

Getting in on the ground floor of H. & H. (Vic Holbrook) building AR-10 lowers and rifles from kits from Dan's Sales in Fla. Bringing him the Amnesty reg'd Portuguese AR-10 I owned to measure. Ordering, waiting and waiting and waiting... getting two other's on different lowers, one from Paragon, one from a private seller, while waiting on Vic. Not paying anymore than $900.00 apiece for any of 'em...

To sooth me while I waited, Vic gives me a deal on an HK91 with fixed and collapsible stocks, scope mount, issue scope (Hensoldt) a bunch of mags including two 30 rounders, for $500.00ish.

As a SOT, things were good too - dealer sample BAR's for $400.00, dealer sample M1A1 TSMG's for $200.00. Love letters easier to get, and 100% legal.

First civilian legal AK's are inported by Steyr - Egyptian, first ones out are in the $800.00 range at retail, with no affordable ammo available. No problem. My partner and I purchase two examples, keep one Title 1 and using an Amnesty reg'd Chinese 56 as a pattern make a jig to facilitate the machining for conversion. (What my partner came up with is the predeceesor to the jigs that were eventually sold by various companies. Should've got a copyright)

Get the full-auto parts out of Canada. Whoo-Whee! Wish we would've kept that rifle too.

IMI gets the UZI here. Traders blew them out the door with mags etc. for under $500.00.

Clayco imports Chinese AK's and ammo and mags. The days of affordable AK's are upon us - dealer prices under $200.00 - AK's OTD in CA for under $400.00 with three mags, a sling, cleaning kit, and oil bottle.

Pre-Roberti-Roos:

Post 86 my partner and I make the biggest mistake ever - I believe that the writing's on the wall wrt NFA weapons and devices, before everything blows sky high in price, we don't mortgage everything we own and borrow everything we can to turn out registered NFA stuff...we close up shop, split up our inventory.

I've been advising friends for years to buy black rifles now before the anti's get their collective teeth into them.

I'm proved correct.

AK's that were previously under $400.00 go to $600.00 overnight, then to $800.00, then to highest offer - no **** - HK rifles go to over 1K overnight, FAL's go to 2K for Belgium FN, parts rifles go to 1K from $600.00. Watched a guy purchase a Mars Cetme at the SF Gun Exchange for 2,800.00 w/o batting an eye - previous price 1250.00 iirc.

Post R-R:

Things settle down to some extent, fed. import ban brings about the rise of US manufacture of previously imported rifles. Some are better than others.

Rommy AK74's come in for under $200.00 dealer. I likey. Mags $5.00 a shot, ammo under $100.00 a K, happy days are here again!

pre SB23:

Much the same as pre RR, but the funniest thing I've ever seen wrt panic market pricing - at the Cal Expo show my buddy and I happen upon a parts rifle aussie FAL on an Enterprise Arms receiver - how much? $6000.00 !!! beater parts kit, US receiver? guy is quick to say that he didn't price it, etc. Never saw a guy run away from a price so quick in my life.

Man, I wish I could remember all the stuff to put it down here, but you get the idea.

pfl101
02-01-2009, 10:31 AM
Max, thanks for the detailed summary. I sure missed a ton, although I'm keen to what's available now...

I talked with a guy at Retting's a while back who told me that he had a MG at home that was confiscated because the BATFE (or equivalent) showed up and asked for his registration. It was back around the onset of the 1968 law, and he was out of the country on business. His mom called him long distance, told him what was going on, and since he was "opening for Led Zeppelin", he told her he wouldn't be back in time to register it and that the agents should take it.

Hope the Zep tour was a fun one to open...

Gator Monroe
02-01-2009, 10:39 AM
You could build a nice XM177E2/Colt Commando replica and get every thing at MBR (Martin B. Retting Guns of Culver City) in one week or less ...

pfl101
02-01-2009, 10:59 AM
I am assuming that MBR used to sell many of the black guns, but are now too leery of the OL stuff to bother, right?

Gator Monroe
02-01-2009, 11:10 AM
Friend bought a Valmet there in or around 1980 and built a Colt Commando Replica with their help just prior to that , but their gig was pristine perfict Enfield Jungle Carbines and WW1 PO8's til the cows came home ...

Max-the-Silent
02-01-2009, 11:16 AM
Max, thanks for the detailed summary. I sure missed a ton, although I'm keen to what's available now...

I talked with a guy at Retting's a while back who told me that he had a MG at home that was confiscated because the BATFE (or equivalent) showed up and asked for his registration. It was back around the onset of the 1968 law, and he was out of the country on business. His mom called him long distance, told him what was going on, and since he was "opening for Led Zeppelin", he told her he wouldn't be back in time to register it and that the agents should take it.

Hope the Zep tour was a fun one to open...

MBR used to be one of the better sources for DEWAT MG's back before the GCA. I remember getting their catalog in the early 60's with beautiful line drawings of various MG's - lots of off-the-wall Axis MG's like Japanese Nambu SMG's.

I also clearly remember them having STG 44's for $75.00, Mags for same? $3.00. Do you know how much afterschool and weekend work it takes...

Max-the-Silent
02-01-2009, 11:23 AM
You could build a nice XM177E2/Colt Commando replica and get every thing at MBR (Martin B. Retting Guns of Culver City) in one week or less ...

I remember back in the wild and wooly pre-86 days finding "real" Commando uppers w/ the "suppressor" for sale OTC with no tax stamp...

The subject of what was available w/o paper pre-86 could be a thread in itself. Lots of people, some right here in the Bay Area ended up in deep trouble over what was advertised to death in SGN, Gun List and in magazines like Firepower.

One of the old Firepower advertisers ended up on America's Most Wanted. I had met the guy at a show years back and knew in 5 minutes that he was a nut. ATF raided him for selling complete suppressor kits (SIONAC) through the mail, he jumped bail and AWW profiled the guy.

Gator Monroe
02-01-2009, 11:32 AM
The Ronald Reagan Special Task Force (Militia of Inland Empire/Riverside) was really into "No Paper" ! Friend from their group obtained an M14 from Pendelton and that Rifle was sooooo purdy ! He was shooting it in Desert and Ranger/LEO drove up so he tossed M14 into a nearby bush and after he survived the fear Hassle & search without it being found he later sold it to some bikers (Hessians or Heathens ?) for 2 grand (a lot of money then) but he was a little guy and M14 DID NOT FIT HIM LIKE A AR shorty ,but he always regretted selling it anhoo...:(

63 tango
02-01-2009, 11:35 AM
I bought a Remington 870 Wingmaster at Big 5 in 85 or 86 for $189. Walked in said I wanted the shotgun. Paid for it showed them my ID. Walked out with the shotgun. Wish then I would have known what was going to happen and wish I had the money to buy evil black rifles.

Pvt. Cowboy
02-01-2009, 1:14 PM
I remember the old Gun Rack on ECR in Belmont/San Carlos, buying a Costa Mesa AR180 for $200.00, an HK 41 for $400.00ish (mags were expensive though, $20.00ish)

My five-rounds fired AR15SP1 with the four digit serial was sold in Orange CA in 1972 at a long gone sporting goods store for a price of $235. I have the receipt in storage along with the original khaki shipping box, green Fiberglas box pads, plastic rifle sleeve, owner's manual, warranty card, GI comic book, and all the accessories (sling, cleaning rod, sight tool) are in unopened plastic bags with typewritten USGI serial numbers tags inside. I have an unopened Colt khaki envelope containing a 30-round mag and loose two steel-follower 20-rounders that came with it. One is a factory modified five-rounder. Both 20s have Colt AR15 floorplates.

Also have the original red Federal .223 SP box with the old Federal logo and red plastic bandoleers with five rounds missing. The old man I got it from gave it to me for building a cinder block wall on his property. He fired five rounds and put it away in the closet for twenty-some years before he gave it to me. I've done nothing to it since then but lightly oil the steel. No disassembly. The rifle is as dry as an old chicken bone left out in the desert. Not a single blemish on it, even inside the mag well. Only the hammer face shows some barely discernible abrasion.

Anyone who would like to acquire it as a collector's item when they move out of CA should contact me. :D

REDHORSE
02-01-2009, 1:40 PM
I remember getting a Mak 90 for $280. They also had Ar's for around $600, and Steyr Aug for $1100. Also remember high cap mags all day long on the shelves. Oh the good ol' days.........

Local small guns shop was selling Chinese SKS for $70 and the MAK-90s were going for $90. They were selling tons of them.

I didn't buy any, as I was in for the RU SKS & Eastern Euro AKMs. Regret not buying at that price though now.

It was fun just walking into a gun shop a buying what you wanted. The shops would often let me pay down to get DROS started and pay the balance after the 15 day wait.

Buying the fun EBR toys at one SOCAL gun show, then going to another SOCAL guns show (Anaheim, Orange, Del Mar, Pomona) two weeks later to pick it up from the dealer. Walking around the show with your new toy slung on your shoulders.

There was nice older lady in the large Building #7 (? I forget now) at the Pomona show, selling USGI M16 30 mags, 5 each NIW for $20. I would buy a 5 pack every time I saw her.

Then another vendor selling Chinese AK 45 rds drums for $45. I'd get one every now and then

bodger
06-17-2009, 4:04 PM
Okay, I'm reviving a dead thread so flame away.
I was reading in here and wondered if anyone remembers the days when "The Recycler" classified newspaper was still accepting ads for firearms. Handguns, longarms, what have you. I must have bought and sold a dozen guns just through ads in that paper alone. Back when you could just sell it and walk away, no paperwork and no worries. Or meet someone at a Denny's and buy their gun on the spot. If I recall, that was all legal back then.

I also used to shoot frequently in San Francisquito Canyon before they cleaned it up and the outdoor range A Place To Shoot was born.

Francisquito was dangerous as hell, but all you had to do was drive in, set up and fire away. We hauled an old white refrigerator up there once and blew the doors off the hinges with a Franchi Spas 12, amongst other ordnance.
Back when the Franch was just another shotgun, not an insidious assault weapon worthy of registration.

Sorry, slow day, digging through the archives.

B Strong
06-17-2009, 5:29 PM
What a thread. Brings back lots of memories - I did business with lots of the dealers mentioned, Traders, H & H, Arms & Ammo, but the biggest dealer on the S.F. peninsula was Ellingsons's on El Camino Real in San Mateo. They were the predecessors of today's holier than thou dealers, but they carried every single EBR ever sold in the U.S.

The Gun Exchange in S.F. was another big dealer, much better to deal with than Ellingson's, and I bought many rifles from Nate Posner - what a great guy! - and he had the single best selection of fine custom knives I've ever encountered. I purchased many Randall made knives and my first Bagwell bowie from Nate.

The closing of their store after Nate passed and his son Bob took it over was the single biggest loss to the local firearms community imo.

Other posters made reference to 500.00 HK's and I can testify to that. AR's were in the 400.00 range, FAL's on sale at the Traders went as low as 1200.00 iirc. Post RR I bought an NHM-91 at the Traders for 189.00 + tax. I picked up one of the first Rommy AK74 variants for less than 300.00.

bill104
06-17-2009, 7:01 PM
I think I was 14 or 15, when I bought my first Marlin Glenfield 22, paid 49:99 for it at JC Pennys, back then I could just walk out the back gate and shoot all I wanted, today I would have to walk days just to get out side city limts.

GaryV
06-17-2009, 7:31 PM
I remember going into a gun shop in Santa Ana (don't remember the name) and talking guns with the guys behind the counter, handling the Valmets, Galils, AR-180s, AR-15s, HKs, FALs, etc. Most were in the $300-$500 range. Galils and FALs were around $1000 or so. I remember my father buying a Radom 9mm at a swap meet.

I went back in after I got out of the Army, and there wasn't a black gun on the rack. :(

johnlee
06-17-2009, 7:36 PM
This thread brings back a lot of memories for me as well. I'm 40 now, so I just barely caught the end of the glory days as an adult. But what little I was exposed to was gravy.

In my freshman year at UCLA, my roommate and I rode my Honda 150 Elite scooter (that Grace Jones model) from Westwood and up Sepulveda to Sherwood International on Parthenia. Sherwood back then was literally packed with all sorts of semi-autos. They even had semi-auto M60s and M2s. Ammo was sold largely in four forms: boxes, bandoleers, cases, and belts. No kidding. AUGs, ARs, HKs were everywhere. The racks were jam packed too. And the television there was hooked up to some Sony Betamax that was usually playing either an HK USA porno video, or those big-haired babes in bikinis shooting full auto. It was sweet. My roommate picked up a Norinco AK with folding buttstock for $199, cash and carry. It came in a big cardboard box with a bayonet and something like four or five 30-shot mags. My roommate and I rode back to Westwood with the box between us, Saigon style. That was fun. I remember having to accelerate the scooter slowly because my friend was holding onto the cardboard box with both hands. Fortunately, my roommate didn't fall off the scooter and nothing spilled out of the box on the way home.

I still remember going to B&B and they were selling 30-shot AK mags for $3 apiece. They had pallets of them too. They were Norinco mags if my memory serves. My friend asked the guy behind the counter how they could sell the mags for so cheap, and the guy answered that B&B paid three cents apiece for the mags.

Remember Pony Express? That was a sweet store. All kinds of collectible Smiths and Colts were there. The first Model 40 Centennial I ever saw was at Pony Express, and it was mint new in the cardboard box. What a gem that was. (This was before Smith re-introduced the Centennial, and Centennials were hot stuff back then.)

It was also common at the time to have guns on the floor rather than behind the counter. The last store that I can remember having this is Retting's, which still has the C&R and used guns on the floor. But it was much more common a long time ago. Even stores like Big Five used to do it.

Even generic stores like Turners was full of HK91s, HK93s, and HK94s. I think they were something like $700 or $800 at the time. There used to be a Turner's in Culver City and my friends and I would go there at night to check out the guns. I remember seeing the $800 HK prices and thinking to myself, "what a rip-off". Boy, was I wrong. That was a lot of money back then, but I'd pay several times that today if I could. I paid $3,500 for my HK43 before it was banned, and I'm very glad I did.

All long guns were cash and carry back then. But I remember the waiting period for handguns was 21 days. That was an eternity when buying my first pistol, a Beretta 92SB-F. I had just seen Lethal Weapon and I just had to have that Beretta. Hey, I was a kid.

And the Great Western Gun Show at Pomona was amazing. For the people who have seen only shows like the Costa Mesa or Ontario or Del Mar shows, I can't even describe the atmosphere at Pomona. As some people have said, there were buildings upon buildings of tables. The spillover of tables into the walkways between the buildings was huge as well. Pomona had its share of turquoise jewelry and beef jerky tables like today's shows, but there were all kinds of sweet things there.

I miss the re-enactment people who used to dress up for the gun show. I still see that here and there, but these people sort of look out of place at today's shows because there are so few of them. The dress-up factor at Pomona was HUGE. And not just some USGI or Wehrmacht stuff. People dressed up in all kinds of costumes.

Some guys dressed up like Russians. Others dressed up in Imperial Navy uniforms with the full-on Captain Crunch epaulets and Horatio Nelson headgear. It was awesome. Other guys dressed up in their Theodore Roosevelt buckskins. This was well before the popularity of Cowboy Action Shooting, and yet tons of different people came dressed in cowboy garb. Others dressed up in Victorian British Army soldiers with their Martinis, white pith helmets, and .577 Tranter revolvers with that cool white pistol lanyard. All kinds of people came together for Pomona. I really miss that. Today, all I seem to notice at the shows are the chumps wearing their standard tactical casual wear (black tee shirt with some tactical school logos, jeans, lightweight hiking books, and some kind of tan-is-the-new-black nylon backpack with tons of MOLLE loops).

Remember taking your hand truck to Pomona? I'd never take a hand truck to Costa Mesa today, but bringing your own hand truck to Pomona was common practice. The parking lot was a long way away from the buildings, and you needed the hand truck if you were going to stash up on ammo. Lots of people would wheel in their hand trucks and lock them with a cable lock to one of the perimeter fences. Then they would scope out the show and make notes as to where the stuff they wanted to buy was. Then, at the end of the day, they would truck around and pick it all up and then truck it to their vehicles. You'd always see some rookies trying to carry cases of ammo back to their cars. Too funny.

How many guys at Pomona used to walk around with a rifle slung over their shoulders, and in the bore was a maple dowel with a for-sale sign and the asking price? It was very common. Who does that today? I almost never see that today.

And some of the best tables at Pomona weren't even selling anything. There were all sorts of tables displayed by collectors or collector groups with all kinds of sweetness displayed. There was some Swiss guy who had all kinds of minty Schmidt-Rubins and SIG 210s and 550s and StG57s on display. (And remember when the Swiss shooters would shoot at Fish Canyon for their annual qualifications? That was fun to watch.)

There was another guy at Pomona who had all kinds of Wehrmacht sweetness that I couldn't believe he could afford. From looking at this guy, I would be surprised if he knew how to read. He was dirty and unshaven and basically looked like white trash. But his stash was just superb. G41s, G43s, G43 snipers, K98s, K98 snipers, G98s, StG44s, FG42s, Artillery Lugers--it went on and on. All mint condition. I was stunned.

The Smith & Wesson collectors had a table at Pomona as well. I've never seen so many Triple Locks in one place. All mint too. Just unreal. The Colt collector tables were just as impressive, with lots and lots of minty Cobras, Dick Specials, Agents, Woodsmans, New Services, Aces, and so on. Just unbelievable amounts of minty gun porn in one place.

Even the so-called undesirables at Pomona were sweet. Remember those big tables with the Neo-Nazi clothing? I'm not talking about the tables with the Wehrmacht and Luftwaffe uniforms and Knights Crosses for sale. Rather, I'm talking about those tables that were selling tee shirts with runic symbols on them and where you got the distinct feeling the vendors were actual Neo-Nazis? I just took these guys as part of the show. They never gave me any trouble, and I'm a little bummed I don't see those tables any longer at today's shows.

I even miss those people with serious body odor. Every one in 1,000 people at Pomona smelled as though he hadn't bathed in a year. You'd walk by him and I swear the BO was really bad. It was like walking into a public bathroom in the middle of a humid July in the South. His smell would hit you like a brick wall. But these smelly chaps sort of added to the ambiance of the Great Western Show. I won't lie. I sort of miss it.

Aaah, those were the days. I try not to live in the past, but I can't help but remember how much fun those days were. Fortunately, some things are actually better today than they were 20 years ago.

For example, remember when MSRP on the P7M13 was $1,100? That's a lot of money even today. 20 years ago to a kid still in school it may as well have been a million dollars. That was a pile of money back then. This is when a Colt AR-15 was something like $450 if I recall. And an HK91 was $700 to $800. HK USA even had to have that ad that went something like "Why the P7 is the most expensive handgun in the world" to justify the steep asking price. This ad:

http://www.gunfaqs.org/P7FAQ/Magazine_Articles/P7%20Ad%20July%201988.jpg

And the HK market today is flooded with relatively cheap stuff. I'm not talking about stupid add-on Pic rails or stuff like that. Rather, genuine HK stuff is cheaper and more available now than it was 20 years ago. Remember when the HK41 cost $400 and the claw mount cost $400? That was ridiculous. When the HK91 cost $600, the .22LR conversion kit cost $600. And the G3 magazines today go for $10 apiece when they used to cost $40 back then. Even the steel G3 magazines that cost $50 today used to cost $40 or so 20 years ago. And the flood of ex-police P7s on the market for $600 is a steal.

I try to take the good with the bad. Some things have improved.

truthseeker
06-17-2009, 7:43 PM
I was born and raised in Florida and I remember owning a Calico, a SPAS (first firearm I ever purchased, one week after I turned 18), and a Valmet.

Before I went into the military I sold them since my MOM did not want them in the house without me there. So, before I went to boot camp, I sold them to a friend of mine, who still owns them today in Florida.

leitung
06-17-2009, 9:04 PM
It was probably like the gun stores in Montana when I was there, rows of AKs with detachable 30 round mags.
That sight does things to a man.. it's truely awesome!

NRAhighpowershooter
06-17-2009, 9:04 PM
aahh.... yes.. mid 80's... 1200rnd cases of AK ammo.. $99 HK-91's $485
A REAL FN Heavy barrel $550...... M80ball Port ammo 1K for $120 or less.....

high_lander
06-17-2009, 9:06 PM
I used to go to the Angeles range as a kid (38) with my dad to shoot his .22. I remember a guy up there shooting a cannon with beer cans stuffed with dirt.

I bought my first rifle, a Russian 1951 Tula SKS with a 1000 rounds of 7.62 for $79.00. This was at the old surplus place in South El Monte. Cash n carry. I still have the SKS.

johnlee
06-17-2009, 9:22 PM
Remember in the 90s when Turners was selling the SKS for $99, and there was some promo where you could score an SKS and 1000 rounds for like $179? I think those were the prices.

One of my friends picked up six of these tag teams, all in one shebang. I think he paid something like $1200 out the door.

Of course, I passed on the deal. Good Lord.

luchador768
06-17-2009, 10:10 PM
I remember being a fairly little kid and going into a place called Krasnies (SP) in downtown San Diego, I asked the guy behind the counter to see the SPAS-12 and he just about crapped himself! They had everthing, FN FALs, FN PARA's AR's AK's, UZI, MAC-10, etc. This was in 1983-84, I was 11.

luchador768
06-17-2009, 10:12 PM
Remember in the 90s when Turners was selling the SKS for $99, and there was some promo where you could score an SKS and 1000 rounds for like $179? I think those were the prices.

One of my friends picked up six of these tag teams, all in one shebang. I think he paid something like $1200 out the door.

Of course, I passed on the deal. Good Lord.



I worked at the Riverside store in 1994 and we had a deal on Tokorov's for $70, some guy came in and bought 10, and I had to fill out the DROS, on each one of those damn things!

veeklog
06-17-2009, 10:33 PM
In 1993, bought my first handgun, a Browning BDM for $400 USD. You could buy hi-cap mags everywhere. If you went to B&B in Westminster, you would find wall to wall AR's, AK's, Springfiled Armory Sar-48's, Springfiled Armory copies of H&K 91's, etc. B&E Guns in Cypress was the same. Bought a Mini-14 for $250 USD there. In 1996 bought a Armalite M-15A2 from Turners in Garden Grove for $599 USD and put the sucker a layaway!! (poor college student). Three years later registered it before the ban on hi-caps and listed AR's. Since then the upper and A2 stock is gone, an the only thing left is the registered lower. I still have the Mini-14, and it is still a shooter. Ah, I miss the good old days!!!

garandguy10
06-17-2009, 10:40 PM
I remember walking into Tri City in Fremont the day after Patrick Purdy did his thing in Stockton and walking out with two SKS carbines a Ruger M14 with factory folding stock and several 30 round Ruger mags and waiting the the ten days for the dros to clear on my Colt 1911 officer model, I spent less the $800.00 for all four. I also handled a HK93 with collapsible stock [$1100.00] and several colt AR15's that night.

shooter308
06-17-2009, 10:59 PM
I got out of high school in the late 90's and bought cheap rifles, got 4 MAADI AK47/MISR 90 for only $189 each at Gold Coast trading guns in HB.

Bushmaster AR15 for $590 at Gold coast trading in HB.

Paratrooper SKS for $99 at the same place. Norinco SKS for $70 used at a gunshop called Cliffs gunsmithing.

These guns are now regged AW.

Bought several 75 round drum at the costa mesa gunshow for $45 each. I thought I got ripped off seeing the 30 rounders were selling for only $4 each if you buy a dozen.

Lots of nice weapons at gun stores and the price was reasonable.

bodger
06-18-2009, 8:56 AM
I'm glad I revived this thread.
Beer cans stuffed with dirt fired from a cannon...friggin' priceless.

And Pony Express, I haven't thought about that store in years. I bought a 1911 Colt Gold Cup from that store in 1981.

All these gun laws that now prohibit us from enjoying the freedoms we had 25 years ago or so. And is crime any lower?

Reading these memories of the days when we weren't so hamstrung really drives home the point of how over-regulated this state's gun laws are.

Roadrunner
06-18-2009, 9:07 AM
I'm a little late into this thread, but in 1982 a buddy of mine wanted a six inch model 19 and I wanted a 4 inch. We just swapped straight across, no transfer, no ffl. That's the way it should be.

I might also add, that I helped a buddy buy his first handgun in 1977. He was under 21 and wanted a Ruger Security Six. I bought it for him and he was a happy camper. No such thing as "Straw Purchase" back then.

HotRails
06-18-2009, 9:49 AM
Reading these posts is fantastic! Its sad to see how the populus has sloughed off personal responsibility in favor of government regulation. My old man always talked about how free things used to be in the 1940's,50's, and up until mid 60's when everything started to slide. I wonder what someone would write in a post like this 30 years from now about what was available now!

yellowfin
06-18-2009, 9:58 AM
Reading these posts is fantastic! Its sad to see how the populus has sloughed off personal responsibility in favor of government regulation. My old man always talked about how free things used to be in the 1940's,50's, and up until mid 60's when everything started to slide. I wonder what someone would write in a post like this 30 years from now about what was available now!

Two possibilities:

A. They'll laugh at the ridiculous limitations we have now. They'll be able to buy anything they want short of DD's at their local shop, thread whatever they want on the end of it (maybe not with a $200 tax, even), etc. Their holster will have the newest model Kimber or Sig in it they bought the day before.

or

B. They won't be able to write anything at all online here because the 1st Amendment is gone, maybe 10 days after the 2nd was lost.

socalsheepdog
06-18-2009, 10:49 AM
To put these numbers in perspective:

Average wage index for calendar year 2007: $40,405.48
Average wage index for calendar year 1987: $18,426.51
(source: http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/COLA/awidevelop.html)

Still....
*sigh*



Frank

Average wage index for calendar year 2011: $11,623.56 <---- it's coming
Average wage index for calendar year 2007: $40,405.48
Average wage index for calendar year 1987: $18,426.51

dwtt
06-18-2009, 11:08 AM
... and waiting the the ten days for the dros to clear on my Colt 1911 officer model, I spent less the $800.00 for all four.

I had to wait 15 days for my Hi Power and Grendel. Maybe I wasn't as special as you were. :)

mrhappy
06-18-2009, 12:11 PM
Just found this thread. I attended Lassen College gunsmithing school from '81 to '83. You could get a CCW in Lassen county by just applying, being a gunsmith student. Moved down to the High Desert and started a shop, sold umpteen black rifles--AR's, AR-180's, Spas shotguns, just about anything evil or exotic looking. Back then in the 80's the San Bernardino County Sheriff's dept had an annual firearms auction, open to dealers, and you could buy all those "crime guns" that are now being melted down and turned into rebar. I still have the Charter Arms Undercover .38 that I bought for $80. The funniest stuff was the number of Glenfield/Marlin Model 60's for sale, most "complete with fingerprint powder", as they were the most commonly used rifles foe the drive-by shooting crowd. I believe the were like $50 or $60 new at K-Mart. On weekends you could go to thge local swap meet and find people selling guns, a friend picked up a Colt AR-15 at one and brought it in for me to check out. People advertised guns for sale in the classifieds, and you could find guns for sale at yard sales. Boy, those were the days.

bohoki
06-18-2009, 3:21 PM
i vaguely remember going to walmart and paying $9 for an eagle 30 round mag for my 10/22

and butler creeks at big 5 for $13.50

but at that time all i had was a 10/22 and a 12 ga

Ivanhoe
06-18-2009, 4:20 PM
I brought my Remington 870 20ga lightweight to High School for a "how to" speech on proper cleaning of a shotgun. circa '84 or '85. :eek:

BroncoBob
06-18-2009, 6:07 PM
1989 I stood in line three deep at the old Traders in San Leandro and watch AR-15 after AR-15 come off the racks and be bought. I really should have bought one back then but I just didn't have the cash. I had just secured my freedom from my ex. Had to settle for a Norinco SKS packed in cosmo that cost me $129.00 out the door.

Stanze
06-18-2009, 8:15 PM
My BRD started in the early 80's when my dad was about to buy an UZI carbine at Gemco. I'm 37 now.

Unfortunately, my mom talked him out of it.

WE COULD OF HAD SNAKE EYE'S GUN!!!1 ARRRGGGHH!!!!

So close!:(

Yeah, good times. Unfortunately, as soon as I turned 18, Roberti-Roos kicked in and I had no money to stock up.

Seriously, **** CA's gun laws and the people who write the bills and sign them!!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

BroncoBob
06-18-2009, 8:21 PM
[QUOTE=Stanze;2653737]My BRD started in the early 80's when my dad was about to buy an UZI carbine at Gemco. I'm 37 now.

Unfortunately, my mom talked him out of it.




Classic.............Uzi's at Gemco :gunsmilie:

Brown Rock
06-18-2009, 10:12 PM
Wow, these are some cool stories you guys have. Anyway I remember back (I was 4 years old) in 1986 new years eve, my dad and his friend had a target shooting session in the backyard. This was in the city of San Diego, in the burbs :cool:. Try that now and you will have the swat team at your house.

Werewolf1021
06-18-2009, 10:42 PM
My Dad remembers driving to school with his .22 and shotgun sitting in the front seat of his truck and grabbing his friends after classes (riding in the bed of the truck) and going to shoot squirrels at his place. And exactly how many school shootings were there? I mean, if kids brought their guns to school well there should have been shootings between classes right:eek:? His stories of those times led me to believe gun control was BS before I ever got on the internet or watched TV.

bodger
06-18-2009, 11:07 PM
I grew up and attended high school in a small town in Ohio. During hunting season, we always had our rifles or shotguns in the car. With ammo.
The boys got the first day of pheasant season off school, no note required from parents. The girls, did not. If they were absent, they still needed a note. This was early 1970's.

Man, things have sure changed. Not for the better. Neither of my two sons has any interest in firearms.

bootcamp
06-18-2009, 11:16 PM
A sincere thank you for the history guys! I'm not too young but I wasn't old enough to buy before those 92 bans went into place.

I recently bought a bunch of reloading gear from a 74 year old retiree and I found a pack of 100 small pistol primers for $0.59 from GEMCO. Gawd it's been a while since I heard the name Gemco!

Ivanhoe
06-19-2009, 2:28 PM
A sincere thank you for the history guys! I'm not too young but I wasn't old enough to buy before those 92 bans went into place.

I recently bought a bunch of reloading gear from a 74 year old retiree and I found a pack of 100 small pistol primers for $0.59 from GEMCO. Gawd it's been a while since I heard the name Gemco!

I worked there one Christmas season, gathering shopping carts, emptying garbage and mopping up puke from some poor sick kid... good times.

Turbinator
07-08-2009, 5:56 PM
Remember in the 90s when Turners was selling the SKS for $99, and there was some promo where you could score an SKS and 1000 rounds for like $179? I think those were the prices.

One of my friends picked up six of these tag teams, all in one shebang. I think he paid something like $1200 out the door.

Of course, I passed on the deal. Good Lord.

I'd like to revive this thread a little bit.

In the 90's, Tri City in Fremont was selling Chinese SKS's for $79. I couldn't find the place, so I gave up and didn't get one.

7.62x39mm was going for $99 per 1000 around that time, mail order.

Good times...

Turby

bodger
07-09-2009, 2:36 PM
Does anyone have any stories about unloaded open carry, or loaded open carry, say 30 years ago? What were the laws like back then as opposed to now?
I did it a lot, but I was always so far into the bush it didn't matter to me. I wasn't likely to see any LEOs. Probably broke the law and didn't know it at the time.

Steyr_223
07-09-2009, 3:28 PM
Does anyone have any stories about unloaded open carry, or loaded open carry, say 30 years ago? What were the laws like back then as opposed to now?
I did it a lot, but I was always so far into the bush it didn't matter to me. I wasn't likely to see any LEOs. Probably broke the law and didn't know it at the time.

This gets deleted every time I post this, but it is the truth..

It was Governor Ronald Reagan of California who signed the Mulford Act in 1967, "prohibiting the carrying of firearms on one's person or in a vehicle, in any public place or on any public street." The law was aimed at stopping the Black Panthers, but affected all gun owners.

Twenty-four years later, Reagan was still pushing gun control. "I support the Brady Bill," he said in a March 28, 1991 speech, "and I urge the Congress to enact it without further delay."

Why I'm for the Brady Bill , By Ronald Reagan; Ronald Reagan, in announcing support for the Brady bill yesterday, reminded his audience he is a member of the National Rifle Association.

Published: Friday, March 29, 1991

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/03/29/opinion/why-i-m-for-the-brady-bill.html

PatriotnMore
07-09-2009, 3:57 PM
I don't remember many people opting to use the right to OC, here in CA. I do remember when registration as we have now in the DROS form was a hot topic here in the early-mid 70's, you could hardly drive around without seeing a "from my cold dead hands" sticker, or "registration leads to confiscation".

Then again, your neighbors didn't call the cops from seeing you carry your guns to or from your car, and the attitude towards guns from LE was different also.

I do remember an old 70's movie, the location in the movie was Hollywood blvd. There was one character who dressed in cowboy clothes and walked up and down the blvd with his two six guns, unloaded of course. They showed a scene where an LAPD officer checked his guns, made sure it wasn't loaded and handed it back to him, no big deal, no swat team, just check and on my way.

Does anyone have any stories about unloaded open carry, or loaded open carry, say 30 years ago? What were the laws like back then as opposed to now?
I did it a lot, but I was always so far into the bush it didn't matter to me. I wasn't likely to see any LEOs. Probably broke the law and didn't know it at the time.

SgtDinosaur
07-09-2009, 4:15 PM
I remember when Big 5 quit selling handguns. Don't remember the year, though. It annoyed me. All this gun control crap has been building up since the sixties off and on. Things were a lot more lax in the 70's and early 80's, though. I remember around 1979 I lost a handgun in San Francisco and reported it to the police. When I apologized for carrying without a permit the cop just laughed and asked me if I knew how many people were carrying in SF. Didn't even get a lecture. It wasn't too many years later that DiFi started going after handguns.

FeuerFrei
07-09-2009, 4:27 PM
If only we had a time machine...
I bought my first rifle over the counter at a hardware store at age 18.
30-06 Springfield for 100 bucks + tax.
Transaction went something like this.
I walked in, looked for something in my price range, laid down my cash, got the receipt and walked out. All in about 15-20 minutes.
Maybe things will change back to this. How? Who knows.
I just want to be as free as our fore fathers were.

Beelzy
07-09-2009, 4:49 PM
It was great!

HK91's going for $600.00, Auggies for $800, ammo so cheap you could shoot
all weekend.

Oh and bricks of .22 for $5.00.

Those were the good old days.

hawk81
07-09-2009, 6:05 PM
It was like how it is today, if you were living in a free state. Actually the guns today are better.




So I've googled various topics including "B&B" guns in search of stories from people who were involved in firearms back in the "good old days" pre-Roberti-Roos, as well as the days leading up to the circa-2000 bans.

For those of us who came into the game late, it's fascinating to hear about Uzi's, AK's, FAL's, etc. being sold over-the-counter. I remember working at a KMart (LOL, lame, I know) during high school and selling rifles, etc. without any real background check (that I recall, at least--this was the 1980s) being required.

I'm particularly interested in the period leading up to the onset of the 1989 and 2000 bans. Yes, I know in general that there was mass buying, but any annecdotes about specific experiences would be very interesting to read...

bridgeport
07-09-2009, 6:15 PM
And who signed GCA 86? you guessed it. Ronnie.

Ford8N
07-09-2009, 6:20 PM
We used to drive to high school in our pickup's with guns in the racks then go to class......nobody cared.....and nobody ever got hurt.

The Wingnut
07-09-2009, 6:28 PM
A friend that attended high school in San Francisco in the '80s tells me of being on the school's rifle team and carrying his AK to school slung over his shoulder. He was once stopped in the hall way by the principal and brought into his office...so they could talk shop about shooting and look at the principle's rifle!

HotRails
07-09-2009, 8:37 PM
It was like how it is today, if you were living in a free state. Actually the guns today are better.

Not necesarily, other states have changed their laws and outlooks too. Anyone who brought a rifle to school in their truck was automatically expelled from school permanently. This was before Columbine in the mid 90's in NC. I have also heard that now they have see through book bags and metal detectors. Most pro-2A was limited to hunting. I can imagine that prices everywhere due to the election are high and much is unobtainable still.

B Strong
07-10-2009, 6:19 AM
A friend that attended high school in San Francisco in the '80s tells me of being on the school's rifle team and carrying his AK to school slung over his shoulder. He was once stopped in the hall way by the principal and brought into his office...so they could talk shop about shooting and look at the principle's rifle!


In the 1980's?

I think your friend is reality challenged in the extreme.

baldoHHO
07-10-2009, 8:20 AM
I'd like to thank my Dago friend for introducing me into
guns again and finally purchased my first Ruger gp100 which actually outshot his Colt 6in revolver then sold it here at Calguns for the same price i got it for. That guy had impressive collections of guns including the Devel 9mm with see thru grip, Colt this, Colt that, bombs, mines,
chromed short barreled elephant gun that doubled as a club and some many other exotic stuff that i couldnt name at the time. Of course i spent most of my income on women, wine and song...ahh memories.

SeanCasey
07-10-2009, 9:27 AM
Dang it this thread brings a tear to my eye. I missed all of the good times (born in 82, so by the time I could ourchase guns I was SOL). This thread really just wants to make me push harder to regain the freedoms that those before me were able to enjoy...

PatriotnMore
07-10-2009, 9:34 AM
Personally, I think it is more frustrating living through the changes, and watching them use the law to remove them. As far as I am concerned anti gun laws are repugnant to the Constitution, what part of "Shall Not Be Infringed" do they not understand?

This has been ignored, and not addressed.

Dang it this thread brings a tear to my eye. I missed all of the good times (born in 82, so by the time I could ourchase guns I was SOL). This thread really just wants to make me push harder to regain the freedoms that those before me were able to enjoy...

highpowermatch
07-10-2009, 9:53 AM
No one really cared. They were just "ugly guns" when everyone thought guns were supposed to be polished steel and Walnut. I bought my first AR type rifle in 1974. It was a Colt CAR-15. I paid full retail for it at Markell's in San Francisco. It was $280 or so out the door. There was no wait. Fill out the paperwork, pay and go. The gunshop guy wanted to know why I would want such an ugly gun. He had to order it for me. He sold me magazines (20 rounders) for less than a buck a piece.

Markell is in Santa Rosa now, they are a couple of nice guys but they will not touch OLL and think anyone is crazy for trying to do so. But most nor-cal shops in the Sonoma area are that way.

FullMetalJacket
07-10-2009, 1:17 PM
I bought my Colt AR-15A2 at Tri-City Sporting Goods in Fremont for $549. Kicked myself later that I didn't pony up the extra $50 and get the collapsible stock carbine...


...but now I have a California legal one of those, too.

Barney Gumble
07-10-2009, 2:10 PM
Back in high school in the 80s a student dressed up for Halloween as the Terminator...in addition to the leather jacket and boots and correct Gargoyles sunglasses, he brought his dad's SPAS 12 (the movie-correct top-folder) and an AK, both of which were real and functional but unloaded and the firing pins were removed. Of course everyone was in awe! He carried them around school openly and everyone thought his costume was the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Around lunch time the principal decided it would be better to keep the firearms in his office for the rest of the day. But that was all. No one got in trouble, no hysteria or anything. I think there was some latitude given because it was Halloween but even so there's no way you could do that today.

Californio
07-10-2009, 2:13 PM
In the early 80's I bought a 30-06 in a mall from J.C. Penny's, cash and carry:)

lomalinda
07-10-2009, 2:56 PM
I think the stories about people buying AKs and Uzis in Turner's and other mainstream places is the most amazing thing.

Great thread!

Paradiddle
07-10-2009, 3:38 PM
B&B Guns on Edwards was a fantastic store for black rifle stuff in the "day". I remember dropping hundreds on rifles back then. You could own all the cool stuff. I also used to shop at Gemco - bought several shotguns and rifles from them - they had great prices. This is pre-Walmart in So California - there was only Gemco and Kmart for those types of places - and Kmart didn't sell guns.

Cato
07-10-2009, 3:51 PM
And who signed GCA 86? you guessed it. Ronnie.

I'll never forgive him for that.

GuyW
07-10-2009, 3:55 PM
and Kmart didn't sell guns.

Sure did in San Diego County....not handguns that I remember, but long guns into the late '80s....
.

SickofSoCal
07-10-2009, 4:04 PM
And who signed GCA 86? you guessed it. Ronnie.

Ronnie also ran a platform that he would abolish the Department of Education. Once he got in, nothing happened (big surprise)

rorschach
07-10-2009, 5:38 PM
I remember saving up for an HK SR9 when I was 17, it was 1000 dollars at Euroarms in Alhambra. A week after the Klinton ban it was up to 3000.

bwiese
07-10-2009, 5:46 PM
What was it like "way back when"? In 1986-88 timeframe:



no AW ban - stores had black rifles etc all over the walls.
9mm dbl-stack pistols were the hot items (Beretta 92, Sig 226, etc.)
no such thing as a 'hicap mag'. Lo-caps existed only for thinness.
new handgun purchase waiting period was 15 days, not 10.
no state paperwork on rifle purchases at CA FFL, just 4473
no waiting period for buying rifles @ CA FFL. I 4473'd an AK in 10 min.
private party transfers were exactly that: paper-free and dealer-free.



Fond memories of...
- Arms'N'Ammo (Millbrae): lotsa HK, Galil + had colored 'grenade' smokers
- H&H Enterprises (Redwood City): walls of Colt HBARs, Uzis, HKs, AKs, etc.
- Trader's (San Leandro): walls of black rifles
- Tri-City Sports (Fremont): huge wall'o'guns
- Coyote Point firing range (San Mateo): centerfire handguns were allowed
- Sharp Park range (San Bruno/SSF): easy/convenient

bwiese
07-10-2009, 5:51 PM
And who signed GCA 86? you guessed it. Ronnie.

Um, GCA was in 1968. It was signed by Lyndon Johnson.

FOPA was in 1986. It actually offered a helluva lot of benefits. The MG stuff was added in at the last minute before it could be suppressed.

bodger
07-10-2009, 6:14 PM
In the early 80's I bought a 30-06 in a mall from J.C. Penny's, cash and carry:)

That's how "L.H. Oswald" got his Mannlicher Carcano too. Although I don't think it was from J.C Penney's

Talk about never fired and only dropped once.....

Sgt Raven
07-10-2009, 7:44 PM
Bill, how can you post that and not mention the San Francisco Gun Exchange? :confused:
What was it like "way back when"? In 1986-88 timeframe:



no AW ban - stores had black rifles etc all over the walls.
9mm dbl-stack pistols were the hot items (Beretta 92, Sig 226, etc.)
no such thing as a 'hicap mag'. Lo-caps existed only for thinness.
new handgun purchase waiting period was 15 days, not 10.
no state paperwork on rifle purchases at CA FFL, just 4473
no waiting period for buying rifles @ CA FFL. I 4473'd an AK in 10 min.
private party transfers were exactly that: paper-free and dealer-free.



Fond memories of...
- Arms'N'Ammo (Millbrae): lotsa HK, Galil + had colored 'grenade' smokers
- H&H Enterprises (Redwood City): walls of Colt HBARs, Uzis, HKs, AKs, etc.
- Trader's (San Leandro): walls of black rifles
- Tri-City Sports (Fremont): huge wall'o'guns
- Coyote Point firing range (San Mateo): centerfire handguns were allowed
- Sharp Park range (San Bruno/SSF): easy/convenient

bwiese
07-10-2009, 7:52 PM
Bill, how can you post that and not mention the San Francisco Gun Exchange? :confused:

Sadly, I never got up there before it closed.

Steyr_223
07-10-2009, 10:38 PM
1982 and got my first real job at Computerland in Hayward. I remember Traders had gun ads every Thursday in the Oakland Tribune. There was a really cool Colt AR15 SP1 carbine I wanted, it was around $550. However, my mom was against be getting one. However, when I turned 18, my dad drove me to San Leandro to get the SP1. It was onsale for $495!

Since only had the cash for the rifle. Dad got me 600rds of ammo and some 30rd mags and we went to Chabot..The SP1 came with 2 20rd mags blocked to 5rds.

Great times!

Thanks dad..

:)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/51/AR-15_Sporter_SP1_Carbine.JPG

aileron
07-12-2009, 12:59 PM
In the 1980's?

I think your friend is reality challenged in the extreme.

While I agree that the 80's sounds suspicious, more like 60's, 70's, some more rural areas I could believe it.

I do remember having butterfly knives in the 80's in school from 10th grade on tell I graduated, and never had any issues with the teachers or principle. We didn't advertise but we didn't hide them either.

We would teach each other different tricks in school during lunch and show off our latest balisong stainless, or 6 inch monster, or all black balisong that was double edged, ad nausea. No one ever threatened a soul with them. They were mostly toy's that sometimes we'd use to open stuff, or cut rope, string, etc.

That was in Garden Grove of all places.

Spacestuff4me
08-04-2009, 11:44 AM
I was general manager of B&B in North Hollywood during the assault rifle ban in 1989. It was a fun time to be into guns, the feeding frenzy was truly amazing and at the time, we all thought it was the end of the baby killing, mass murdering, evil self shooting black guns.

I remember going to other stores incognito and buying guns to be banned and putting them in B&B for sale. Bob Kahn (owner of B&B) had me find guns at other stores, buy them and then jack up the prices where we were selling a standard AR15 for $2k, Mini 14's for $800, Hk91 for $3k and such. Imagine the surprise of those who spent big money for preban guns, when the identical "sporters" came out a month later.

I can remember Hk 91 & 93 on sale for $399, Norinco, Polytech, Russian milled AK's for $159 / 179 for folders, Sig 550 & 551 for $1499, Sig AMT $1300, Beretta AR70 $699, AR15 for $450, imported M1 Carbines for $79, imported Garands $159, SA M1a $599, Thompson 45 for $599 and lots more. Ammo was so cheap, that we really didn't appreciate it. I was buying cases of Winchester 308 for $100, SS109 for $85 per 1000rds, Norinco 762x39 AP for $75 per 1000rds and 50 cal AP USGI for 25 cents a round. We would think nothing of taking out 5000 rounds of various calibers and go out to little Tujunga and come home with no ammo.

The best deal I remember was the Hk94a3 on sale for $350 because who in their right mind would ever want a 9mm rifle ??? I also remember Galil's on sale for $499.

There's a large color photo of me on the front page of the LA Times Sunday edition, where I'm holding a Sig AMT and the caption says "Ray Holt, General Manager of B&B Guns says the Uzi is made to kick in doors and kill everyone inside".

I received no shortage of ***** for that one and I got calls from the NRA, CRPA and other pro gun groups. The reality is that I was told by Bob Kahn (owner of B&B), to show Harold Green (ABC 7 antigun lying scumbag), everything about "assault rifles". The LA Times reporter came with Harold to document how easy it was to buy an AK47 and they did a video report on the purchase.

I gave them a 1.5 hour education of every assault rifle in the store, plus I bought out my personal Sig AMT and that's when they took the photo that appeared on the front page. The LA Times writer asked me why the Uzi was invented in the first place. So I explain to him that that Israeli army fought 4 wars in close combat and they needed a small submachinegun to fight house to house. I made the mistake of telling this lowlife, that the prime use of the Uzi was to clear a room, where the Israeli soldiers would ID the bad guys, kick in a door and spray the room to kill the terrorists. I guess their ears weren't working too well that day.

The gold old days were really a lot of fun, I've got a million stories, but after seeing what's happened in the last 20 years, I seriously doubt that private gun ownership will be a right in the next 20, especially given the confirmation of the new Supreme Court Justice.

God help us.

Ray

bodger
08-04-2009, 11:50 AM
1982 and got my first real job at Computerland in Hayward. I remember Traders had gun ads every Thursday in the Oakland Tribune. There was a really cool Colt AR15 SP1 carbine I wanted, it was around $550. However, my mom was against be getting one. However, when I turned 18, my dad drove me to San Leandro to get the SP1. It was onsale for $495!

Since only had the cash for the rifle. Dad got me 600rds of ammo and some 30rd mags and we went to Chabot..The SP1 came with 2 20rd mags blocked to 5rds.

Great times!

Thanks dad..

:)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/51/AR-15_Sporter_SP1_Carbine.JPG

Why were the mags blocked to five rounds back then?

lomalinda
08-04-2009, 6:58 PM
"I made the mistake of telling this lowlife, that the prime use of the Uzi was to clear a room, where the Israeli soldiers would ID the bad guys, kick in a door and spray the room to kill the terrorists. I guess their ears weren't working too well that day."

Seems like a weird thing to say to people who were unlikely to be fans of guns. Essentially, you were relying on them to differentiate between fully and semi-automatic carbines, and it failed big-time.

Oh well.

microstencil
08-04-2009, 7:07 PM
If I remember correctly crime was much lower. I guess all of the rules and bans stoped guns from getting into the hands of all of the bad guys. They just don't learn from history do they. There needs to be a new movement to vote out all of the incumbents. We need new blood in Sacramento and DC.

Vectrexer
08-04-2009, 8:02 PM
Growing up back in Tulsa I remember being in the fourth grad in the mid '70s. Everyone (girls and boy) I knew either had a BB gun, or could borrow it from their brother or sister.

We all would get together and target shoot in the small fields in town probably close. Some of these "fields" were really no more than the undeveloped parts of church grounds. Other times we just went to the nearest creek to plink.

This required a ride of course. It wasn't unusual to see four or five kids on bikes riding down a major street with rifles or pistols as we went to our favorite shooting spot for the day.

After we had gotten to out shooting spot we were careful to have a look around for possible ricochet issues. NOBODY wanted to have to explain to their dad or mom why they broke a window, shot a pet, or hurt someone. Even if your parents didn't find out there were enough eyes send you to hell just because you were in the area. Those eye followed you to school and church too.

Fast forward a year. My dad offered to buy me a 22 rifle or a more powerful Crossman. The only thing running through my head was the cost of the ammo. So I opted for the Crossman at the time. The possibility I wouldn't have a place to shoot never crossed my mind. I definitely still would have shot the rifle in town in an appropriate spot with a backstop. I probably would have knocked on the door of the nearest houses as well to give people notice of what was going on. And to check if anyone was day sleeping since they usually posted a sign on the door. Even with BB/pellet guns we still gave people a heads up.

But today in Tulsa I would definitely think twice about taking out anything out in public. Even BB guns or EB Airsoft items. Mostly because there might be a misunderstanding with the police. All due to the amount of reactivity that has ramped up in the Tulsa Police because of the gang related problems in North and East east Tulsa. Well it's really has migrated around other parts of the city too so you have to be careful.

CCW is the way to go today in Tulsa. There are a lot of CCWs both legal and illegal running around town. People are not as freaked out in Tulsa if they happen to noticed you are carrying. At least not as freaked out as they are are hear in the metro areas of Kali.

Head outside Tulsa and it's still possible to shoot in open without problems. As long as you check in with any neighbors who are close by no one really cares.

On another note, I used to buy 1 lb cans of black powder, caps, and fuses from the store when I was 14. No one blinked. Same for things like carbide and other fun stuff. But then nobody was ever hurt either. I am not saying we were always angels. We just tried to avoid creating problems too big for ourselves to solve.

chris
08-04-2009, 8:09 PM
Lytle Creek was dangerous, but I could shoot anything ANYTHING I wanted. I miss those days so much...:(

that place was just crazy.

lowprofile
08-05-2009, 7:26 AM
Why were the mags blocked to five rounds back then?

It was to make them legal for hunting.

Steyr_223
08-05-2009, 10:24 AM
It was to make them legal for hunting.

Correct. It took me 2 minutes to unblock them once I got home, these were Colt factory mags they inserts limiting them to 5 rds were easy to remove. Those 20rd mags are still my favorites for bench shooting..

dwtt
08-05-2009, 11:37 AM
All this reminiscing made me realized the free states are like CA was in the 80's. I hope they don't let things deteriorate like it has here.

oso grande
08-05-2009, 12:00 PM
It's still the "good old days" in most parts of the country.

acolytes
08-05-2009, 12:27 PM
Back then I was making $10.00 an hour and could still afford to buy guns.....:(

Oregonish
08-05-2009, 12:51 PM
this thread just makes want to buy more guns! :43:

bodger
08-05-2009, 2:23 PM
this thread just makes want to buy more guns! :43:

...makes me want to move to a free state.

ap3572001
08-05-2009, 8:07 PM
I remember the times when You could buy HK91's , Hk94, Valmet, etc all day long. BUT! At least from what I saw, MOST people were not in hurry to buy those guns. Many wanted to have a Mini 14 and an 870 shotgun. ( some would have a 20" AR).

Blue
08-05-2009, 8:11 PM
I remember as a kid, getting my haircut at "Hogs Breath" in Dublin, and right next door was Waynes Gun Shop. That dude had EVERYTHING!!! My dad used to piss my mom off to no end cause we'd always come home from the barber with inert grenades, magazines, and old crappy military gear. Sadly after the Y2K ban, their days were numbered.

trashman
08-05-2009, 8:22 PM
...makes me want to move to a free state.

Or at least have a home in another state, too.

I'm not ready to leave California yet -- things on the RKBA front are just getting started...

--Neill

slik556
08-05-2009, 9:38 PM
aaahhh crap now I just want to be 13 year old again. In the IE, ontario area it was no big deal to take the old 10/22 and a box of ammo, get on the bike and head east. Wasn't to far to get to the orange groves or grape vineyards, they ran from ontario to the foothills. The only thing out there was chaffey college. We would hunt rabbits and squirrels, Take the shotguns and hunt dove, and quail. Now the Mills mall and Victora gardens mall, the one with Bass Pro Shops now sits where the vineyards where that I hunted. So sad, I miss the good old days!

jello2594
08-05-2009, 11:19 PM
I remember going to other stores incognito and buying guns to be banned and putting them in B&B for sale. Bob Kahn (owner of B&B) had me find guns at other stores, buy them and then jack up the prices where we were selling a standard AR15 for $2k, Mini 14's for $800, Hk91 for $3k and such. Imagine the surprise of those who spent big money for preban guns, when the identical "sporters" came out a month later.


Ah Bob Kahn... he's in this hilarious clip!
uhvKYzKwf88

bubbapug1
08-06-2009, 2:36 PM
Its still the good old days in many ways, you just need to wait ten days, pay a bit more, and not have a hi cap mag, but you can still buy most of the guns you want. I don't ever remember a $400.00 AR however, cheapest I saw was $650.00 at turners in 1984.

Guns will always go up, but not as fast as the last year...in fact, in the next ten months ammo and guns wil decrease in value, a rarity, but the market has been saturated and some, like myself, have more than we need.

Californio
08-06-2009, 3:40 PM
That's how "L.H. Oswald" got his Mannlicher Carcano too. Although I don't think it was from J.C Penney's

Talk about never fired and only dropped once.....

I thought Oswald bought his mail order, I bought mine in a Retail Store, in a Shopping Mall.

gbran
08-06-2009, 3:42 PM
Back in the 60's I bought firearms from Sears, Western Auto and many others. In the 80's I bought several handguns from Longs Drugs.

bodger
08-06-2009, 3:49 PM
I thought Oswald bought his mail order, I bought mine in a Retail Store, in a Shopping Mall.

I stand corrected, Oswald's was purchased via mail order.
Specifically, Klein's Sporting Goods in Chicago.

Steyr_223
08-06-2009, 4:36 PM
Ah Bob Kahn... he's in this hilarious clip!
uhvKYzKwf88

Love the Ali G! I have forwarded that vid to my posse..

player1
08-22-2009, 8:23 PM
Darn, those were the days, but unfortunately the date of the semi-auto handgun may be numbered with the coming law next year, AB1471, putting almost all handguns in the banned category. Maybe things will get better in the future.

Invisible_Dave
08-22-2009, 9:24 PM
I read most of these posts. Its amazing with such easy access to all these firearms that you all survived to talk about it today. I was born in 1980, I'm glad such sensible legislation has been passed to get guns off the street. They are SOOOOOO much safer now.

oron
08-23-2009, 12:21 PM
Stationed Norton AFB. 1980-83.
There was a shop close to base. Dought it's there now.
With Mil-ID only, U.K. ar-180 new. 6-mags, 200rds.
Would throw in " TAC-SAC " [soft bag]
$250.00. Ah hindsight.

player1
08-26-2009, 2:07 PM
To Invisible Dave: Those were the good old days, when saturday night specials,nightly crack wars in south central with submachineguns, and shockingly high murder rates were the norm and in plenty supply. But with this economy, California will return back to the glorious days of the 1980's. The sooner, the better..:gun_bandana:

Invisible_Dave
08-26-2009, 6:03 PM
I was hoping someone would bite on my sarcasm a little harder. :cricket cricket: