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View Full Version : CA would-be handgun owners, the Handgun Safety Certificate -


rayra
01-02-2009, 5:43 PM
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hscinfo.php
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/hscsg.pdf <-- study guide
http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/index.html

Itís a complete scam. Nothing more than yet another deliberate hurdle and tax on gun ownership.
Put into CA law ~~16yrs ago(?), itís a batch of Ďcommon senseí gun safety questions, overlain with CAís own particular brand of interpretations and safe-storage laws. Itís basically a 30 question test thatís even easier than our miserable driverís license exam.

It costs $25 to take the test and get the wallet-sized certificate / card. Without it or one of the few accepted substitutes, you cannot buy a handgun in CA. Itís good for 5 years from date of issue, costs $15 to replace if you lose it.

When it was first enacted, my DD214 signifying honorable discharge from the military was sufficient as an alternate proof of acceptable gun safety awareness. So I got to thumb my nose at it during handgun purchases. The law was amended about 5-6yrs ago and the substitutes were amended and now you must be a military retiree to fulfill that substitute standard. Along the way they also made an HSC mandatory for intrafamilial transfers of handguns (along with amending those regs to require registration of such a transfer, to remove that traceability ďloophole")

I stopped by a regional gunstore / range today to get mine, preparatory to making some last minute handgun purchases. Iíd been looking around for a couple weeks and was unsurprised to find that many / most local and regional gunstores were OUT of these controlled documents and awaiting resupply, which has reportedly been very slow in coming from the CA-DOJ. Quelle surprise. Shades of DCís willful obstructionism.

Anyway, itís a very easy exam, for a very cheesy Ďproofí / hurdle. IF you are on the cusp of a handgun purchase in CA, do yourself a favor and get this out of the way where and when you can, at a time and place of your own choosing. Donít expect to be able to walk into your local gunstore to purchase a firearm and pay your taxes and DROS / gun registration fees and start your 10-11 day waiting period and find the HSC materials waiting for you. The recent rush has hit those supplies as much as anything else.

97F1504RAD
01-02-2009, 5:55 PM
Wow!

I am glad you posted this as it seems they removed the Hunting License Exemption so know it appears as though i must go and pay and take said test.

Also it says that a person with a CCW is exempt from having to take the test so I wonder if the Utah CCw applies to this?

By the way I think it's all a load of crude

nobody_special
01-02-2009, 6:52 PM
This should be challengable post-Nordyke...

lioneaglegriffin
01-02-2009, 6:56 PM
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hscinfo.php
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/hscsg.pdf <-- study guide
http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/index.html

Itís a complete scam. Nothing more than yet another deliberate hurdle and tax on gun ownership.
Put into CA law ~~16yrs ago(?), itís a batch of Ďcommon senseí gun safety questions, overlain with CAís own particular brand of interpretations and safe-storage laws. Itís basically a 30 question test thatís even easier than our miserable driverís license exam.

It costs $25 to take the test and get the wallet-sized certificate / card. Without it or one of the few accepted substitutes, you cannot buy a handgun in CA. Itís good for 5 years from date of issue, costs $15 to replace if you lose it.

When it was first enacted, my DD214 signifying honorable discharge from the military was sufficient as an alternate proof of acceptable gun safety awareness. So I got to thumb my nose at it during handgun purchases. The law was amended about 5-6yrs ago and the substitutes were amended and now you must be a military retiree to fulfill that substitute standard. Along the way they also made an HSC mandatory for intrafamilial transfers of handguns (along with amending those regs to require registration of such a transfer, to remove that traceability ďloophole")

I stopped by a regional gunstore / range today to get mine, preparatory to making some last minute handgun purchases. Iíd been looking around for a couple weeks and was unsurprised to find that many / most local and regional gunstores were OUT of these controlled documents and awaiting resupply, which has reportedly been very slow in coming from the CA-DOJ. Quelle surprise. Shades of DCís willful obstructionism.

Anyway, itís a very easy exam, for a very cheesy Ďproofí / hurdle. IF you are on the cusp of a handgun purchase in CA, do yourself a favor and get this out of the way where and when you can, at a time and place of your own choosing. Donít expect to be able to walk into your local gunstore to purchase a firearm and pay your taxes and DROS / gun registration fees and start your 10-11 day waiting period and find the HSC materials waiting for you. The recent rush has hit those supplies as much as anything else.

thats why i got my HSC material in march. ;)

halifax
01-02-2009, 7:04 PM
Wow!

I am glad you posted this as it seems they removed the Hunting License Exemption so know it appears as though i must go and pay and take said test.

Also it says that a person with a CCW is exempt from having to take the test so I wonder if the Utah CCw applies to this?

By the way I think it's all a load of crude

Only CA CCW works.

scoutpup99
01-02-2009, 7:05 PM
My last order from the doj towards the end of December took less than 10 days to get to me after I mailed the check for the cards. I know because I had a customer come and start dros and take the test when I realized I was already out. I had the cards by the time he came to pick up his gun.

mycrstuff
01-02-2009, 7:26 PM
How about those of us that had CA BFSC, the basic firearms safety certificate that was good for your lifetime. Well they apparently didn't mean it to be for your lifetime as all CA BFSCs were canceled after the new HSC was instituted.

Mike's Custom
01-02-2009, 7:42 PM
They removed every excemption except LE or POST and active or retired Military and some that fall into those catagories. They removed hunting licenses and military service.

The BFSC was passed because we were told at the time that it would be good forever and there were other ways to qualify. well, forever came to a end Jan. 1, 2003. When the state saw how many guns were being sold and that they could make more money they did away with the BFSC for the HSC that has to be renewed every 5 years. They also added $5 that goes to the general fund. When the registration fees went up $5 that also went to the general fund instead of the firearms program. Let's face it, they are using us to fund more unneeded projects. Now they want to raise the fuel tax because what they get now isn't enough to pay for all the repairs because they have been using the road money for the general fund.

Good Ole Arny now wants to raise our DMV fees through the roof. This is one of his campaign platforms he didn't agree with and also what helped get Davis recalled. So I guess what they say is true, voters have very short memories.

I say we recall Arnold.

CSDGuy
01-02-2009, 8:02 PM
How about those of us that had CA BFSC, the basic firearms safety certificate that was good for your lifetime. Well they apparently didn't mean it to be for your lifetime as all CA BFSCs were canceled after the new HSC was instituted.
The old BFSC card is still valid... the problem is that there is nothing that it's valid for... ;)

jrsportssupply
01-02-2009, 8:13 PM
My last order from the doj towards the end of December took less than 10 days to get to me after I mailed the check for the cards. I know because I had a customer come and start dros and take the test when I realized I was already out. I had the cards by the time he came to pick up his gun.

When filling out the DROS, what number did you put down for the HSC number, since you had no HSC cards to sell?

Kid Stanislaus
01-02-2009, 8:15 PM
Welcome to the PRC.

WokMaster1
01-02-2009, 8:21 PM
When filling out the DROS, what number did you put down for the HSC number, since you had no HSC cards to sell?

007:p

reefer_bob
01-02-2009, 8:36 PM
I was up at Wild Sports in Sac... Over heard another conversation about the handgun safey thing. They said they have no more study guides, and since the state is bankrupt, they aren't printing anymore of them. Your only choice is to go online, study, and then go in for the test.

I thought that was pretty funny/sad...

wellerjohn
01-02-2009, 9:07 PM
It's just a tax, most 8 year old kids could pass the test. Wait until they raise the fee "tax" to $100.:mad:

Bad Voodoo
01-02-2009, 9:56 PM
http://www.environmentalgateway.com/notice/resetbutton.jpg

rue
01-02-2009, 10:01 PM
How about those of us that had CA BFSC, the basic firearms safety certificate that was good for your lifetime. Well they apparently didn't mean it to be for your lifetime as all CA BFSCs were canceled after the new HSC was instituted.

Yeah no ****, I had one of those "lifetime" cards as well...:mad: FU Gray Davis!

gotgunz
01-02-2009, 10:02 PM
Only CA CCW works.


Where does it say that?

Link please.


X01 = Special Weapons Permit Holder
X02 = Operation of Law Representative
X03 = Handgun being returned to the owner
X13 = FFL collector with COE (curio and relic handguns only)
X21 = Military - Active Duty
X22 = Military - Reserve
X25 = Military - Honorably Retired
X31 = Peace Officer - California - Active
X32 = Peace Officer - Federal - Active
X33 = Peace Officer - California - Honorably Retired
X34 = Peace Officer - California - Reserve
X35 = Peace Officer - Federal - Honorably Retired
X41 = Carry Concealed Weapon (CCW) Permit Holder
X81 = P.O.S.T. 832 PC (Firearms) Training
X91 = Particular and Limited Authority Peace Officers
X95 = Law Enforcement Service Gun to Family Member

Trader Jack
01-02-2009, 10:24 PM
Where does it say that?

Link please.


X01 = Special Weapons Permit Holder
X02 = Operation of Law Representative
X03 = Handgun being returned to the owner
X13 = FFL collector with COE (curio and relic handguns only)
X21 = Military - Active Duty
X22 = Military - Reserve
X25 = Military - Honorably Retired
X31 = Peace Officer - California - Active
X32 = Peace Officer - Federal - Active
X33 = Peace Officer - California - Honorably Retired
X34 = Peace Officer - California - Reserve
X35 = Peace Officer - Federal - Honorably Retired
X41 = Carry Concealed Weapon (CCW) Permit Holder
X81 = P.O.S.T. 832 PC (Firearms) Training
X91 = Particular and Limited Authority Peace Officers
X95 = Law Enforcement Service Gun to Family Member

You don't need a link it is simple ONLY CA CCW WORKS. Figure it out.

Trader Jack
01-02-2009, 10:32 PM
:chris:When filling out the DROS, what number did you put down for the HSC number, since you had no HSC cards to sell?

Good one Randy. It never ceases to amaze me that someone will post such an
open violation when the DOJ monitors this board.

ke6guj
01-02-2009, 10:37 PM
Where does it say that?

Link please.

X41 = Carry Concealed Weapon (CCW) Permit Holder


The PC lists the exemptions and the CCW exemption refers to CCWs issued under 12050?, the CA CCW regulations. Any out-of-state CCW would not have been issued under that PC section.

12807. (a) The following persons, properly identified, are exempted from the handgun safety certificate requirement in subdivision (b) of Section 12801:
(1) Any active or honorably retired peace officer, as defined in Chapter 4.5 (commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of Part 2.
(2) Any active or honorably retired federal officer or law enforcement agent.
(3) Any reserve peace officer, as defined in Section 832.6.
(4) Any person who has successfully completed the course of training specified in Section 832.
(5) A firearms dealer licensed pursuant to Section 12071, who is acting in the course and scope of his or her activities as a person licensed pursuant to Section 12071.
(6) A federally licensed collector who is acquiring or being loaned a handgun that is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations, who has a current certificate of eligibility issued to him or her by the department pursuant to Section 12071.
(7) A person to whom a handgun is being returned, where the person receiving the firearm is the owner of the firearm.
(8) A family member of a peace officer or deputy sheriff from a local agency who receives a firearm pursuant to Section 50081 of the Government Code.
(9) Any individual who has a valid concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to Section 12050.
(10) An active, or honorably retired member of the United States Armed Forces, the National Guard, the Air National Guard, the active reserve components of the United States, where individuals in those organizations are properly identified. For purposes of this section, proper identification includes the Armed Forces Identification Card, or other written documentation certifying that the individual is an active or honorably retired member.
(11) Any person who is authorized to carry loaded firearms pursuant to subdivision (c) or (d) of Section 12031.
(12) Persons who are the holders of a special weapons permit issued by the department pursuant to Section 12095, 12230, 12250, or 12305.
(b) The following persons who take title or possession of a handgun by operation of law in a representative capacity, until or unless they transfer title ownership of the handgun to themselves in a personal capacity, are exempted from the handgun safety certificate requirement in subdivision (b) of Section 12801:
(1) The executor or administrator of an estate.
(2) A secured creditor or an agent or employee thereof when the firearms are possessed as collateral for, or as a result of, or an agent or employee thereof when the firearms are possessed as collateral for, or as a result of, a default under a security agreement under the Commercial Code.
(3) A levying officer, as defined in Section 481.140, 511.060, or 680.260 of the Code of Civil Procedure.
(4) A receiver performing his or her functions as a receiver.
(5) A trustee in bankruptcy performing his or her duties.
(6) An assignee for the benefit of creditors performing his or her functions as an assignee.

gotgunz
01-02-2009, 10:43 PM
You don't need a link it is simple ONLY CA CCW WORKS. Figure it out.

I don't "need" to figure it out; I have a CCW.

heyjak
01-02-2009, 10:43 PM
[QUOTE=I say we recall Arnold.[/QUOTE]

He needs to go back to Hollywood where he belongs! This power trip is over!

:thumbsup:

heyjak
01-02-2009, 10:48 PM
I was up at Wild Sports in Sac... Over heard another conversation about the handgun safey thing. They said they have no more study guides, and since the state is bankrupt, they aren't printing anymore of them. Your only choice is to go online, study, and then go in for the test. I thought that was pretty funny/sad...

I took the test in Spanish and still got 100% !!! The only Spanish I know is "Dos Coyotes" !!! ;)

gotgunz
01-02-2009, 10:48 PM
My out of state drivers license also wasnt issued persuant to the corresponding California code; but it is valid here as well. May be a poor example but I think it is a matter of "letter of the law" vs. "spirit of the law".

I am sure that the Utah ccw (given that I have taken the course) could be viewed as following the guidelines of pc 12050 as there is training required just as there is here (I know about that part too as I teach the class locally).

Doesn't affect me but I think it should work.

Seesm
01-02-2009, 10:52 PM
So I have had a Springfield .40 for a few years and I never put in my name (it's my girlfriends ...fiance's) fathers he gave it to me...

Do I have to take some course to put it in my name? We have talked about doing a PPT sometime when he is in town...

Cuz if I have to pay something or take some course that is ghey as I have older handguns for years and know what I am doing...

Please explain a little more for me. Thanks

ke6guj
01-02-2009, 10:54 PM
yes, to do a PPT transfer, you need to have a valid HSC. Doesn't matter if you are trained or not, or have handguns or not, you need the HSC unless you fall under one of the exempt catagories.

OrovilleTim
01-02-2009, 10:56 PM
Last time I bought handguns was in Arkansas in 1998. Cash on the counter and walked out with 2 Ruger P series and some ammo.

I was buying a SP-101 for the wife for Christmas and got hit with the "you have the certificate, don't you?" Whoa! Never heard of that. Took the test, aced it, and bought the gun.

Well, a week later I'm back in the store and am thinking I'll pick up another pistol that caught my eye. Bzzt! Wrong! Seems one can only buy one new handgun every 30 days.

I must admit, I wasn't happy with the extra tax in the form of the HSC on top of the DROS fee. But, the one in 30 is what really chapped my hide!

ke6guj
01-02-2009, 10:58 PM
But, the one in 30 is what really chapped my hide!PPT transfers from other CA residents are exempt from the 1-in-30 day restriction.

And if you plan on buying a lot of handguns, you can get your C&R FFL + CA Certificate of Eligibility and be exempt from the 1-in-30 for all handguns.

scoutpup99
01-02-2009, 11:00 PM
When filling out the DROS, what number did you put down for the HSC number, since you had no HSC cards to sell?

Just entered 000000 in the box. Once I had the card I just wrote the correct number on the dros form. That is how I was told to do it by the lady that issues the cards to the dealers.

nick
01-02-2009, 11:05 PM
I guess, military service doesn't teach you how to handle a handgun... Oh well, I got mine in April. The questions were a pile of, umm, you know...

Mirage
01-02-2009, 11:08 PM
To top off the pain of having to take the test for HSC. Two gunshops that I know of in my town will not let you take the test unless you are purchasing a handgun from them? I wanted to get my daughter-in-law a HSC so when she decided what pistol she liked she would have that out of the way. Needless to say I will be making no purchases from either of those shops.

radioburning
01-02-2009, 11:12 PM
To top off the pain of having to take the test for HSC. Two gunshops that I know of in my town will not let you take the test unless you are purchasing a handgun from them? I wanted to get my daughter-in-law a HSC so when she decided what pistol she liked she would have that out of the way. Needless to say I will be making no purchases from either of those shops.

That's lame.

Quiet
01-02-2009, 11:40 PM
My out of state drivers license also wasnt issued persuant to the corresponding California code; but it is valid here as well. May be a poor example but I think it is a matter of "letter of the law" vs. "spirit of the law".

I am sure that the Utah ccw (given that I have taken the course) could be viewed as following the guidelines of pc 12050 as there is training required just as there is here (I know about that part too as I teach the class locally).

Doesn't affect me but I think it should work.

CA does not recognize out-of-state CCW permits as being valid.

I've gone down this road.
When I called them, CA DOJ says CA only reconginzes CCW permits issued by a CA LE agency.

gotgunz
01-03-2009, 12:25 AM
CA does not recognize out-of-state CCW permits as being valid.

I've gone down this road.
When I called them, CA DOJ says CA only reconginzes CCW permits issued by a CA LE agency.

True.... after I thought about it for awhile I figured that is the out they would probably use.

It's b.s regardless.

I never needed a BFSC or HSC but wondered if anybody went back to the state for a refund of the "lifetime certificate" that was no longer lifetime?

JDay
01-03-2009, 3:56 AM
To top off the pain of having to take the test for HSC. Two gunshops that I know of in my town will not let you take the test unless you are purchasing a handgun from them? I wanted to get my daughter-in-law a HSC so when she decided what pistol she liked she would have that out of the way. Needless to say I will be making no purchases from either of those shops.

AFAIK they are required to give you the test when asked, just like they are required to do a PPT for you.

halifax
01-03-2009, 5:05 AM
To top off the pain of having to take the test for HSC. Two gunshops that I know of in my town will not let you take the test unless you are purchasing a handgun from them? I wanted to get my daughter-in-law a HSC so when she decided what pistol she liked she would have that out of the way. Needless to say I will be making no purchases from either of those shops.

That, flat out, doesn't make any sense. They get their $10 profit. They might as well be saying "we can't issue you a hunting (or fishing) license unless you buy your gear from us" :mad:

reefer_bob
01-03-2009, 11:39 AM
AFAIK they are required to give you the test when asked, just like they are required to do a PPT for you.

Not really. They are still a buisness, and can refuse buisness to anyone. They are NOT required to do a PPT.

Mike's Custom
01-03-2009, 11:48 AM
Not really. They are still a buisness, and can refuse buisness to anyone. They are NOT required to do a PPT.


All CA FFLs MUST do PPTs. It is the law. The only way around not doing a PPT is if the FFL does not sell hand guns at that licensed location then they do not have to do PPTs for hand guns. But if a FFL sells longguns and handguns they MUST do PPTs for both. A FFL does not have to give HSC tests if they choose to not be licensed to do so.

No FFL can refuse to do PPTs and they can't charge more then the $25 registration and $10 PPT fee allowed by law. A FFL may charge for documentation (like car dealers do) but the fee can not be represented as part of the registration fee or PPT fee.

scoutpup99
01-03-2009, 11:58 AM
For any dealer to sell handguns they have to have some one that is a licensed instructor to administer the Safe handling demonstration.

Mirage
01-03-2009, 1:07 PM
For any dealer to sell handguns they have to have some one that is a licensed instructor to administer the Safe handling demonstration.


I don't think they are required to give the HSC test on request thought. I cannot quote what they said verbatim, but they said that they do not give the test unless you are buying a hand gun from us it cost them money to do the test. I do not buy anything from these shops anymore, but I will be sure to take all my PPT's to them as punishment for lack of service to the shooting public.
I have had these same shops try to wriggle out of doing PPT's with excuses why the safe handling demonsration cannot be done on that firearm etc., but they never came right out and said they don't do them.

Casual Observer
01-03-2009, 1:57 PM
Not really. They are still a buisness, and can refuse buisness to anyone. They are NOT required to do a PPT.


You reallly should research before giving out bad info.

An HSC (or exception) is needed just to be in possession of a handgun in CA in the strictest reading of the law.

Smokeybehr
01-03-2009, 2:04 PM
You reallly should research before giving out bad info.

An HSC (or exception) is needed just to be in possession of a handgun in CA in the strictest reading of the law.

Oy. More FUD.

reefer_bob
01-03-2009, 6:16 PM
Well, backing up my story was what I personally heard up at Wild Sports in Sac a couple days ago.

While doing a PPT transfer and chatting with the guy doing the paper work, he told me that they as a buisness still have the right to refuse service to anyone, and they have personally turned people away.

So, while it may be against the law, I refute the statement of it being FUD.

<shrug>

:)

nooner
01-03-2009, 6:58 PM
You reallly should research before giving out bad info.

An HSC (or exception) is needed just to be in possession of a handgun in CA in the strictest reading of the law.
Interesting. I purchased my three handguns 20+ years ago when there was no such requirement. Does this imply I am in violation of some law?

Trader Jack
01-03-2009, 10:46 PM
:mad::mad:You reallly should research before giving out bad info.

An HSC (or exception) is needed just to be in possession of a handgun in CA in the strictest reading of the law.


B--- S---:mad:

bwiese
01-03-2009, 10:59 PM
You reallly should research before giving out bad info.

An HSC (or exception) is needed just to be in possession of a handgun in CA in the strictest reading of the law.


Baloney. Stop spreading crap yourself, you're plain wrong.

An HSC card (and the former BFSC card from 1990s which the HSC in turn replaced) is only required for *acquisition* of handguns (due to any of purchase/PPT, inheritance/bequest/operation of law situations).

But firearms owned in CA before existence of HSC or BFSC or even mandatory DROS, or those owned by those moving into CA as 'personal handgun importers', can be retained without use of HSC/BFSC.

jacques
01-03-2009, 11:02 PM
The FFL I use was also out of cards (or whatever it was) and that was 2-mos ago. I went to another gun shop and got it there.

Possibly limiting these cards is what they are doing. Or maybe it is just the by product of another government Bureaucracy at it's finest.

Casual Observer
01-04-2009, 12:38 AM
Baloney. Stop spreading crap yourself, you're plain wrong.

An HSC card (and the former BFSC card from 1990s which the HSC in turn replaced) is only required for *acquisition* of handguns (due to any of purchase/PPT, inheritance/bequest/operation of law situations).

But firearms owned in CA before existence of HSC or BFSC or even mandatory DROS, or those owned by those moving into CA as 'personal handgun importers', can be retained without use of HSC/BFSC.

For the love of....

In some circumstances it is required just for possession. I guess it would depend on how you define "acquisition". I am well aware that you don't need to have an HSC card to possess a gun that's your personal property.

However, a HSC card is required if you're in possession of a handgun that's not your personal property (i.e.- a gun that's loaned to you).

If I loan my handgun to my brother for a week. He needs to have an HSC card- correct?

Therefore the HSC is a prerequisite for him possessing a handgun. He's not "acquiring" so much as it's being loaned to him for a short period of time (I read the DOJ use of "acquisition" in reference to purchase and registration). It's still not his property in the sense that be bought/registered it in his name.

The DOJ HSC FAQ (http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hscfaqs.php) touches on both in questions 15 and 16.

I apologize if my reply was a little short on specifics, but I was at work and trying to do three things at once. Still, no one benefits from three people pointing out that my post was "FUD" (and nothing more) when, really, all it needed was a simple clarification. Sometimes you all take this "FUD" thing a bit too far. :rolleyes:

trashman
01-04-2009, 6:22 AM
It's just a tax, most 8 year old kids could pass the test. Wait until they raise the fee "tax" to $100.:mad:

That might happen. However, dealers I've talked to on the peninsula about this say that from time to time, prospective buyers *do* fail the test....

I don't personally have an issue with people needing to pass the test, but I agree generally it doesn't lower crime or save lives.

--Neill

Mike's Custom
01-04-2009, 11:04 AM
For the love of....

In some circumstances it is required just for possession. I guess it would depend on how you define "acquisition". I am well aware that you don't need to have an HSC card to possess a gun that's your personal property.

However, a HSC card is required if you're in possession of a handgun that's not your personal property (i.e.- a gun that's loaned to you).

If I loan my handgun to my brother for a week. He needs to have an HSC card- correct?

Therefore the HSC is a prerequisite for him possessing a handgun. He's not "acquiring" so much as it's being loaned to him for a short period of time (I read the DOJ use of "acquisition" in reference to purchase and registration). It's still not his property in the sense that be bought/registered it in his name.

The DOJ HSC FAQ (http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hscfaqs.php) touches on both in questions 15 and 16.

I apologize if my reply was a little short on specifics, but I was at work and trying to do three things at once. Still, no one benefits from three people pointing out that my post was "FUD" (and nothing more) when, really, all it needed was a simple clarification. Sometimes you all take this "FUD" thing a bit too far. :rolleyes:


You only need a HSC to receive a handgun wether it is a purchase or transfer or loan. Once you have the said handgun you do NOT need a HSC just to possess it. With what your saying anyone that loses their HSC would be in violation if they had a handgun but not a HSC and that is not true. YOU only need the HSC for the DROS and the dealer but once that is doen you don't have to have the HSC just because you are carring or transporting the firearm.

DDT
01-04-2009, 11:41 AM
Had your first, incorrect, post not been so condescending the smackdown you rightfully received would not have been so curt. No need to try and spin your statement to be correct. A simple, I was wrong, is just fine and I assure you no one would hold it against you.

For the love of....

In some circumstances it is required just for possession. I guess it would depend on how you define "acquisition". I am well aware that you don't need to have an HSC card to possess a gun that's your personal property.

However, a HSC card is required if you're in possession of a handgun that's not your personal property (i.e.- a gun that's loaned to you).

If I loan my handgun to my brother for a week. He needs to have an HSC card- correct?

Therefore the HSC is a prerequisite for him possessing a handgun. He's not "acquiring" so much as it's being loaned to him for a short period of time (I read the DOJ use of "acquisition" in reference to purchase and registration). It's still not his property in the sense that be bought/registered it in his name.

The DOJ HSC FAQ (http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hscfaqs.php) touches on both in questions 15 and 16.

I apologize if my reply was a little short on specifics, but I was at work and trying to do three things at once. Still, no one benefits from three people pointing out that my post was "FUD" (and nothing more) when, really, all it needed was a simple clarification. Sometimes you all take this "FUD" thing a bit too far. :rolleyes: