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mecam
12-27-2008, 12:08 PM
http://www.bradycenter.org/xshare/pdf/reports/guns-2008election.pdf

Brady Report Says Sensible Gun Laws Won,
Gun Lobby the Biggest Loser

The Brady Campaign has issued an in-depth report called "Guns & The 2008 Elections: Common Sense Gun Laws Won, The NRA Lost, & What it Means."

The analysis highlights what happened in states with high gun ownership and states where the National Rifle Association spent millions on ads to attack the Obama-Biden ticket.

The report shows that support for gun laws can be a winning message for politicians and not a dangerous political "wedge" issue. It makes the case that voters want pragmatic solutions to protect their families and communities from gun violence and know that sensible gun laws won't hurt legitimate gun owners.

Jpach
12-27-2008, 12:19 PM
So because the NRA couldnt convince the entire united states to not vote for Obama, that means that most people want more gun laws?

Davidoff
12-27-2008, 12:21 PM
Funny how they claim victory, but I didn't hear a single Dem running on a gun ban platform. IMO, one of the reasons the Democrats won was that they did whatever they could to avoid talking about 2A issues.

tombinghamthegreat
12-27-2008, 12:28 PM
Funny how they claim victory, but I didn't hear a single Dem running on a gun ban platform. IMO, one of the reasons the Democrats won was that they did whatever they could to avoid talking about 2A issues.

IIRC a lot of the Democrats ran as pro gun canidates

bwiese
12-27-2008, 12:34 PM
We know that the Bradys have been on the run for some time now.

They're even trying to shape Heller as a positive for them!

sorensen440
12-27-2008, 12:35 PM
We know that the Bradys have been on the run for some time now.

They're even trying to shape Heller as a positive for them!

Without seeming like they are actually doing something its going to be tough for them to get donations IMO

mecam
12-27-2008, 12:45 PM
:rolleyes:

http://www.10374.com/temp/bradyfp.jpg (http://www.bradycenter.org/xshare/pdf/reports/guns-2008election.pdf)

Theseus
12-27-2008, 1:15 PM
The current gun laws should prevents most anyone from owning AK-47's!? I never did get this.

I don't consider the semi-automatic street legal version to be "AK-47", just like the AR-15 is not an M16 or M4. You may have similar parts, but they aren't the same. . . It is like calling a Ford Taurus a Jaguar because they have the same body.

If we structured more to differentiate to the public...because John Q Public doesn't know the difference, and likely wouldn't unless they were taken to a range and shown.

bulgron
12-27-2008, 1:50 PM
I had to educate my mother-in-law as to the difference between a true assault weapon and what the gun control advocates call an assault weapon. People really don't understand that you can't just go out and get an AK-47 or submachine gun or something similar without having some serious interaction with the feds.

Anyway, if Obama wants to strengthen our gun laws to stop criminals from running around with AK-47s, then by all means have at it. Yes, please, focus your attention and energy on a non-existent problem, Mr. President, and leave the rest of us the hell alone.

Arkalius
12-27-2008, 2:15 PM
Actually, there is no "true" assault weapon in the firearms lexicon. It's a political term to refer to any gun that politicians deem inappropriate for ownership by the public.

The term assault rifle is probably what you're thinking of, and usually refers to a select fire firearm that fires medium-powered rifle cartriges.

M. Sage
12-27-2008, 2:28 PM
But, but... Obama isn't anti-gun. Or was it that Obama isn't that anti-gun.

Hmm... sounds like Brady is saying that he is.

It is like calling a Ford Taurus a Jaguar because they have the same body.

Nah, the Taurus never shared that many (none I know if) parts with any Jags. Now the Ford Contour/Mercury Mystique and Jaguar X-type... same car from top to bottom. Just upgrade the interior slightly and you've gone from a low-end sedan to a luxury car somehow.

yellowfin
12-27-2008, 2:37 PM
This raises a more important question: how many politicians lost their jobs because they were anti gun this time around? It's easy to simply leave the issue out while campaigning; that nobody won deliberately running anti says nothing. The meaningful measure of win or loss is how well we identify and oust someone who is silent on the issue, votes against us a year or two later, then we remember and have them permanently unemployed for it even if they totally cover it up. In that sense the Bradys did win, in that there is some tolerance of anti 2a voting politicians by either plausible deniability, voter amnesia, or party pressure. Just how many of the so called pro gun Dems will openly stand up and tell Pelosi to go straight to hell, instead of smile and nod and play along to get along?

I don't care what they run as, I care what we get and what they really do when they think none of us are watching.

valleyrat
12-27-2008, 2:50 PM
Actually, there is no "true" assault weapon in the firearms lexicon. It's a political term to refer to any gun that politicians deem inappropriate for ownership by the public.

The term assault rifle is probably what you're thinking of, and usually refers to a select fire firearm that fires medium-powered rifle cartriges.

Actually, the term "assault rifle" was coined by Hitler in reference to the MP44 (renamed StG44), for propaganda purposes.

nicki
12-27-2008, 3:01 PM
The reality is the protection of gun rights has been carried by a few and for the last 8 years most gun owners across the country were asleep.

Truth is many didn't care what happened in places like New York or California.
Now that we have Obama in power, California, New York and Chicago style gun laws can become the national standard.

Hopefully we can get serious support from gun manufacturer's to help us in our cases, especially post Nordyke.

When we win Nordyke, I bet the story will get as much press attention as the Heller case got when it won it's first Federal Appeal.

The NRA, other gun rights groups and gun manufacturers have a choice, spend some money now and go on offense or pay alot of money later on defense with uncertain results.

Offense doesn't guarantee results, but what it does guarantee is we are picking the fights.

There is the court of law and the court of public opinion. The SCOTUS got a significant boost in the court of public opinion after they voted correctly on Heller.

Right now Obama and the Congress have alot of things that are going to take priority over gun laws, so we have a short time window.

Many of the lawsuits that we will follow up with post Nordyke probably would make a Fed AW bill a moot point.

With the 2nd being a individual right, we probably could mount challenges to so called executive orders which is probably the direction that Obama will probably go if nothing can get through Congress.

I think that we are going to see a significant increase in membership of the NRA in the next year and I think Democrats who are in swing districts would be smart to go out of their way to show they are on our side.

From a Democrat position, gun control is a loser issue.

The best game plan for them would be to talk about passing gun laws, but have them wither on the vine thanks to blue dog democrats who side with Republicans.

This is assuming they don't want to self destruct within 2 years.

Nicki

foxtrotuniformlima
12-27-2008, 3:02 PM
Lets see how many of them get re-elected if they try to pass anti-gun legislation.

"Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it”

Mikeb
12-27-2008, 4:03 PM
The Brady Bunch did win a huge victory. This country elected, for President and Vice President, two of the most rabid gun grabbers to run for public office. The democrats have huge majorities in the congress. And, some of the Supreme court justices that did give us Heller probably will retire in the next 8 years. And the Republican party is in total disarray. Short of turning over US sovereignty to the UN what else could they have hoped for.
Don't look now , but we are in trouble.
take care
Mike

Nodda Duma
12-27-2008, 8:12 PM
The Brady Bunch did win a huge victory. This country elected, for President and Vice President, two of the most rabid gun grabbers to run for public office. The democrats have huge majorities in the congress. And, some of the Supreme court justices that did give us Heller probably will retire in the next 8 years. And the Republican party is in total disarray. Short of turning over US sovereignty to the UN what else could they have hoped for.
Don't look now , but we are in trouble.
take care
Mike

Gun Control is not a Democrat / Republican issue. A Democrat from, say, Arkansas or Alaska is very different than a Democrat from California.

-Jason

Theseus
12-27-2008, 8:16 PM
I used to think or fear the issue...but I now have an OLL....so I can be elitist like the other grabbers....I have mine...don't care that you can't have yours.

_Odin_
12-27-2008, 9:17 PM
Brady Report Says Sensible Gun Laws Won,
Gun Lobby the Biggest Loser

The Brady Campaign has issued an in-depth report called "Guns & The 2008 Elections: Common Sense Gun Laws Won, The NRA Lost, & What it Means."

The analysis highlights what happened in states with high gun ownership and states where the National Rifle Association spent millions on ads to attack the Obama-Biden ticket.

The report shows that support for gun laws can be a winning message for politicians and not a dangerous political "wedge" issue. It makes the case that voters want pragmatic solutions to protect their families and communities from gun violence and know that sensible gun laws won't hurt legitimate gun owners.

Typical propaganda.

I doubt the average american voted for Obama over McCain because they favored Obama's Gun Control policies.

The report shows that support for gun laws can be a winning message for politicians and not a dangerous political "wedge" issue.

I don't recall Obama's campagin advertising their gun laws/gun control policies at all during the election - not sure how than, they can claim it's because of said policies that he won the election. Again, propaganda.

Ford8N
12-28-2008, 6:23 AM
The gun industry should be down on their knees kissing Obama's feet with all the panic sales they have had. Especially the EBR producers, not so much the FUDD gun makers. This huge surge in folks wanting to get anything with a pistol grip or black has got to be noticed by the new Obama rulers and the Brady's.

yellowfin
12-28-2008, 7:26 AM
I'm sure they see it, but the problem is the reaction from them isn't what it should be. At best their thought is "Ok, the people are preparing for a ban. " If things were the way they should be they should be thinking "Oh crap, we'd better not try anything or the people are prepared to do something about it. This gun control thing isn't worth my life. We had better not p*** them off." That is what the founders intended for precisely this scenario, that they be reminded that they are to behave, not us be scared of what they will do.

bulgron
12-28-2008, 9:04 AM
I'm sure they see it, but the problem is the reaction from them isn't what it should be. At best their thought is "Ok, the people are preparing for a ban. " If things were the way they should be they should be thinking "Oh crap, we'd better not try anything or the people are prepared to do something about it. This gun control thing isn't worth my life. We had better not p*** them off." That is what the founders intended for precisely this scenario, that they be reminded that they are to behave, not us be scared of what they will do.

When Clinton signed his AW ban, it lost him Congress.

Now "AWs" are even more popular than they were in the early Clinton years. The massive sales of these class of weapons should be enough to convince anyone of that.

If Obama and Biden push for a new AW ban, they're going to run a serious risk of losing Congress. And all for nothing, too, because an AW ban is clearly unconstitutional under Heller.

So are they stupid enough to do it?

Time will tell.

domokun
12-28-2008, 12:05 PM
When Clinton signed his AW ban, it lost him Congress.

Now "AWs" are even more popular than they were in the early Clinton years. The massive sales of these class of weapons should be enough to convince anyone of that.

If Obama and Biden push for a new AW ban, they're going to run a serious risk of losing Congress. And all for nothing, too, because an AW ban is clearly unconstitutional under Heller.

So are they stupid enough to do it?

Time will tell.

I'm sure Congress is well aware of that. I believe any restrictions to the right to bear arms will come in the form of an executive order instead since it doesn't require congressional approval to take effect.

yellowfin
12-28-2008, 12:38 PM
Lost him Congress and that's it? You call that punishment? They have no fear of that. All the really bad ones kept their jobs (Schumer, Feinslime, et al), new ones got elected thereafter, their judges stayed on the bench, Clinton was reelected, and they got control of Congress in 6 years through harassing the R party leadership with whatever they could throw at them, now have everything they had back and then some. Voting anti gun is direly short of the punitive consequences it should have.

Fear they should have is nothing they have experienced and apparently nothing the American people are sufficiently inclined to give them. They have no fear of their party being bankrupted. They have no fear of having three dozen congressmen being jailed for fraud, embezzlement, perjury, and treason. They have no fear of being forced to repay their expense accounts with interest and penalties. No fear at all of their ill gotten gains seized from their families and cronies. None fear of their tax exempt faux charity fronts getting their tax exemption yanked and owing back taxes. Fear is nothing they know anything about.

6172crew
12-28-2008, 12:55 PM
The brady's need to tell us why they voted for that one and within a day or so went out on a buying spree?

Were all the guns bought by those who didnt for for him? I dont think that is the case, alot of folks are the "I got mine", "blue falcon type" imo.

Vectrexer
12-28-2008, 1:05 PM
Funny how they claim victory, but I didn't hear a single Dem running on a gun ban platform. IMO, one of the reasons the Democrats won was that they did whatever they could to avoid talking about 2A issues.

No kidding! Even Obama was as light on the trigger as he could be. (while still carrying a big stick against firearms personally.)

yellowfin
12-28-2008, 2:07 PM
I don't recall Obama's campagin advertising their gun laws/gun control policies at all during the election - not sure how than, they can claim it's because of said policies that he won the election. Again, propaganda.controlling the issue by silence is still controlling the issue. He succeeded in them being ignored or overlooked- the effect is still the same as approval and without the cost of having to fight. We failed to force the issue. McWeasel's incompetence was a very large reason why- a good candidate wouldn't have squandered the opportunity. Sure it's not a big issue for everyone, but it could have been hugely embarrassing for Obama and hard to defend how extremely bad he is on it.

RRangel
12-28-2008, 2:39 PM
It just takes a little observation to realize that whatever the Brady Campaign says is mostly propaganda. As usual they are one big fraud, to all but the most naive, or the like minded with a deceitful agenda. Lying is their normal method of operation.

Mikeb
12-28-2008, 5:07 PM
Gun Control is not a Democrat / Republican issue. A Democrat from, say, Arkansas or Alaska is very different than a Democrat from California.

-Jason

That maybe true. Though it does seem to get a lot of support from the urban community types. They cry" ban guns guns are killing our children. Certainly a great shame,but what they leave out is it is their children that are killing their children with guns they are prohibited by law from having. It may not be a Dem/ Rep issue. But it seems to get most of its traction from the lunatic left, most of who aren't republicans.
I take some comfort from the smart people here that predict that the democrats won't waste their political capitol on this issue, though not very much...
take care
Mike