Friend needs help, NOW. (Don Anderson) - Now with official CGF Support

[50 Shooter]

This is being reposted from Biggerhammer, this is a friend of mine and some of the others on this board. This is the "flash hider" case that got the whole ball and chain rolling against my friend.

If anyone needs help it's him, if it wasn't for the dip***** that got busted for putting the flash hider on his M1A after being told not to and then lying about it, my friend wouldn't be in this position.

Here's the link.

http://www.biggerhammer.net/barrett/wwwboard/index.cgi?read=213147

When I retired in 2000, I was in a battle for my life against lymphoma cancer. I had been fighting it for three years when I met Don Anderson. He was always there for me like no other friend I had. Only God helped me more than Don. I was very sick. Many times I couldn't walk or eat, but Donnie was always there for me.
Ever since those days, Don Anderson and I have remained good friends representing EDM Arms as field reps, shooting together, working gun-shows together and organizing .50 caliber matches in Southern California. He is an upstanding person like no other perspn I know. Many of you know and love him like I do.

Donnie is now in for the fight of his life with a corrupt system in Los Angeles. I am very much aware of the facts in the LAPD's "Gun Squad" criminal investigation of Don Anderson. It began in 2006 when an incomppetent, over zealous detective of the "gun squad" embellished, stated untrue information and provided "stale" information in his affidavit for a state search warrant for Don's residence in Harbor City, an area with-in Los Angeles. This detective even used California's DOJ's .50 BMG registration information on Don Anderson to support his probable cause requirement in the affidavit.

The search warrant was executed on September 19, 2006 early in the morning by the LAPD "SWAT" team and "gun squad". They entered Don's residence with full force pointing MP-5's and shotguns at Don and his wife. The "gun squad" led by the rogue case detective seized every semi-auto firearm on the premises. These firearms included a home built semi-autto M2 .50 BMG, a home built semi-auto M3 .50 BMG and a homebuilt 1919A4 semi-auto caliber and some other items. Don had properly registered the M2 and M3 with DOJ as required by the 2004 .50 BMG ban in California.

Don was not arrested or charged with any crime at that time. Don retained NRA recommended attorney Chuck Michel of Trutanich Michel LLP law firm. Two years passed by without hearing anything from the LAPD "gun squad". Then, on the early morning of December 4, 2008 the LAPD "Fugitive Squad" arrested Anderson at his residence in front of his wife. They transported him to the 77th Division jail. His bail had been set by the case detective and DA at $125,000 which required giving the bail/bond company $9500 non-refundable dollars to get Don out of custody. This wasn't possible, so Don spent the night in jail.

On December 5, 2008 late in the afternoon, the attorneys were able to get the bail reduced to $37,000 requiring about $3000 tothe bail/bond company.

When the bail was reduced, Don was informed by the court that he was being charged with five felonies. Even though the "gun squad" case detective and DA's office had agreed with Chuck Michel back around the time after the search warrant was exeuted, that Don would be able to just turn himself in in the event he was charged with any criminal acts resulting from he warrant. This certainly didn't happen, as Don was arrested by the "Fugitive squad" on December 4th.

Regarding the five felonies that Don faces. Two or three of them relate to the registered M2 and M3, and the 1919A4 semi-auto rifles. These guns were all "home built" by Don as semi-autos in strict compliance with state and federal law. The M2 and M3 were registered with DOJ as I previously stated. They were legally built and possessed by Don, but in all their wisdom the case detective and DA are charging the guns as, get this, "ZIP GUNS" under the Californa penal code.

Don is also being charged with having large capacity feeding devices as there were several linked belts of more than ten rounds of .308 ammo in his garage. I am aware that Don had these links prior to the end of 2000 which makes it completely legal for Don to link more than ten rounds together. At this point these linked belts are being charged as a felony. Anothe felony being charged is relating to a Walther P22 .22LR semi-auto pistol that I as a FFL dealer had legally sold to Don. Some time thereafter, DOJ determined that the Walther P22 pistols were manufactured with a threaded barrel, therefore making them an "Assault Pistol", and were required to be sent back to the manufactuer for a barrel change. It looks like I'm out of room to finish this, so I'll do it with a second posting to follow.

Donnie did not receive any notification from DOJ mandating the return of the P22 pistol to the factory for a barrel change. Therefore, it never got sent back and now he is being charged with the "felony possession of an unregistered assault pistol under California penal code". Finally, he had a .50 BMG shark bang stick device that divers would use in the event of a shark attack. Don was using this thing as a paper weight. It did not have a stick so the DA is charging felony possession of an "Exotic Weapon".
My take on all this is that the case is the worst I have ever seen. It should be dismissed for a number of reasons. But, it won't be. In this state any chance they have to prosecute a gun case they go after it 100%. It is going to be very costly to defend. The attorneys have informed Don that it could cost $20,000-$50,000 to finish the case with no guarantee about the outcome. Don is in big troule here and we need to help him. John Burtt of the FCSA is going to run a nation wide raffle in the name of the "Don Aderson Defense fund". I am giving him a new .50 cal EDM Arms "Windrunner" for the raffle. The raffle won't be up and running for at least a month. And, it still needs to be approved by the FCSA Board of Directors.

In the mean time and right now, I am asking for every one's help in sending me a check made out to the attorneys Trutanich Michel LLP for whatever you can afford to help with the attorney fees for Don. Make a note on the check that it is for the Don Anderson Fund. Please do this for Don.

My address is Tom S. Miller, 3938 Stanford Drive, Oceanside, CA 92056 tel 760-757-6823. Also, please help me get this around on the appropriate boards and web-sites or whatever else the inter-net offers. Thanks so much. God Bless. Tom

[bwiese]

Hmmm....

I wonder how many of the LAPD own illegal unregistered AWs, perhaps on the Gun Squad.

LA area (incl LASO) has a very high rate of unreg'd AW ownership.

[m1match]

If he's being represented by Trutanich Michel, they can set up a legal defense fund for Calgunners and others to contribute to like they did for Blackwater OPS. I think people would be more comfortable sending contributions directly to Trutanich Michel.

[50 Shooter]

That's what we want/need for people to do, as soon as Tom get's back to me or posts here I'll know more.

[Al B.]

While not knowing Don quite as long as Tom, I consider him a friend, a gentleman and an honest person. Having worn the uniform of this nation, as well as a badge; I have gladly defended fredoms, laws and rights abroad and at home. I am sickened and saddened that some are trying to make a statistic, a career or a statement by the manner in which they have proceeded in the cases involving Don; and in so doing they not only hurt Don and all of us, but discredit the badge they carry.

I can understand to some degree, how initially, a spurious allegation can lead to a heavy handed investigation. But after the "facts" are gathered, to have continued in the manner in which it has, is disgusting, right down to having Don hauled away after all of these years.

Think it can't happen to your or I, or that it only happens to the guy next door? Think again. Don is you or I. He's not an outspoken pain in the butt, not flamboyent in pushing the limits of the multitude of gun laws....he is the "Joe the Plumber" kind of guy when it comes to shooting.

He played by the rules and registered his M-2 and M-3...yet this is used against him? Semi auto firearms that in any other state are ho-hum, but here in CA are registered and non-transferable within the state. "Zip guns"? I thought these were made from old style car antenna's and fired a .22lr as likely to blow-up as to discharge a projectile.

What is going on here? Anyone else ever complete buidling a firearm in accordance with ATF rules? Looks like California does not concur with the Federal Rules, and is trying to prove it at Don's expense.

Possession of an "Assault Pistol"...hmm, I recall reading that if one were to have "no more than 2 unregistered assault weapons" and were to run afoul of detetection by law enforcement, yet be found that they legally purchased it/possessed it save for having registered it; and were qualified to own assault weapons....it would be considered an INFRACTION. Not unlike a significant motor vehicle ticket. But in this case, they want to call it a felony. And, where is the duty to inform? How widely advertised was the Walther issue? DOJ has an automatic registration process on handguns...why couldn't the database send out a notification to all owners in CA?

Folks....this is the nightmare that anyone can wake up to. You do everything in your power to stay up with the law and comply; lead a clean life, work hard....and get your door kicked in ... twice.

A lot more than funds to the attorneys needs to be done. Legislators need to be contacted and made aware of the abuse of the laws that were enacted. Otherwise, the knock/kick on the door could happen to any of us reading these postings.

Helping Don, helps us all. I know many don't know him personally..but as I said earlier...he is just like anyone of us. Al B.

[CNIC]

Count me in! I will be forwarding my donation to the legal defense fund at the above posted address...

In the end, we all in the same boat and we all must fight together to protect our gun rights….

[nobody_special]

If the facts are really as stated here, only one thing comes to my mind:

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats."
-- H. L. Mencken

Seriously, $40k+ in order to defend against such ridiculous charges, of course with no guarantee of a good outcome? :taz:

[RRangel]

I'm glad this is posted for all to see. I'm sure Don will be getting some help here. The behavior of the "gun squad" and the DA is reprehensible. As far as I'm concerned charging him with "ZIP GUNS" under the penal code is an abuse of power. This is an outrage that should get everyone's attention.

[ke6guj]

assuming CGF can confirm that there is nothing hinky in there, I will be glad to donate some $$ to a TMLLP trust fund.

Yes, the zip gun charge is BS, expecially when CADOJ specifically allowed for homebuilt .50BMG registrations, and has allowed for homebuilt single-shot pistol voluntary registrations.

The AW charge on the P22 is what it is.

The one I'm concerned about the most is the bang stick charge. Not sure what an "exotic weapon" possession charge is. Probably a blanket 12020 charge till they determine what they want to call it. Plus there are Fed regulaitons on powerheads that don't have a shaft attached to them.

[Beelzy]

Oh crap!

The Law is going to want to get him on at least one of those bogies. They
are really good at trying to make lame charges stick. I have a son in the
middle of something with the Court. The police have nothng yet they still
want to charge him. Court time and attorney's fees just to clear your name
for something they "say" you did.

Be advised people, the Law likes to let folks think nothing much will happen
and give you a nice little bit of time to let your guard down, then they take
you away.

[HowardW56]

If your friend gives Trutanich Michel permission to post here telling us that it is all bogus and looking for help funding, I'm in...

[ptoguy2002]

Please explain the fash hider thing mentioned at the top.
How did he get "on the radar" so to speak?

[ke6guj]

IIRC, someone else got rolled for an M1A (or similar model from another manufacturer) that had a flash-hider that wasnt' registered as an AW. Apparantly the OP's friend got rolled up based on the M1A guy's statements.

[383green]

I'm hurting for money right now, but if TMLLP and/or CGF can vouch for this case here, I'll contribute what I can. I'd be most comfortable sending it to a TMLLP trust fund.

[compulsivegunbuyer]

Same here. Things are tight, but if it's legit, I'll send what I can. I guess if you got enough gun owners to send a little money to every case, you might be able to break the court system so to speak.

[Dark&Good]

Since my wife's funds were taken from her bank account 'cause a 9-year old credit card debt that, according to her, was paid already - talk about laws! - I can't afford financial help this month. If Don needs some money in January to pay the law firm, I'll be in. If I can help NOW in some other way, I'm listening.

[Dark&Good]

I don't know if this is still valid, but what a nice place this state was...

From CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, 1849:
"ARTICLE I. Sec. 19. The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers and effects, against unreasonable seizures and searches, shall not be violated; and no warrant shall issue but on probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons and things to be seized."

[Sydwaiz]

Don's a good guy. I'm sure if you've been to Costa Mesa or Del Mar, then you have seen him if you ever drooled over the Windrunners for sale. He will need all the help he can get on this as not only will this case be expensive, he has also been slow with work as the housing market is in the dump right now. Don does tile work for those that do not know. I know times may be hard right now for some of you as it is for me as well, but if we can stick together and help him out, then we can send a message to the gestapos here in L.A. that we will not go down without a fight and we are tired of their BS. Didn't they learn from BWO's case? Besides, it is the season for giving, right?!

[yellowfin]

This is yet another example of why CA needs an official oppression law, where the offending "gun squad" and DA can be fined and sent to prison for this malevolence.

[383green]

Don is also being charged with having large capacity feeding devices as there were several linked belts of more than ten rounds of .308 ammo in his garage. I am aware that Don had these links prior to the end of 2000 which makes it completely legal for Don to link more than ten rounds together.

Are they specifically charging him with having (i.e., possessing) them? There is no law against possession of large capacity feeding devices. The law restricts manufacturing, sale, importation, etc., but not possession.

Edited to add: If I'm not mistaken, even buying them isn't restricted.

[DRH]

This whole thing is just so sad :mad:. For a great guy like Don to get worked over by a system out of control is a tragedy. Folks this is the real deal and I am sure confirmation by counsel with be forthcoming. I know it is close to Christmas and times are very tough but if we do not stick together and stop this now, it will only continue to spread.

[Blackwater OPS]

That totally sucks. I'll send as much as I can, maybe donate a few things for CGF to raffle off. Keep us in the loop.

This is a perfect case for CGF IMO, if it's as advertised.

[gazzavc]

Count me in for some $$$ as soon as TMP gives us the nod.

[otalps]

This is yet another example of why CA needs an official oppression law, where the offending "gun squad" and DA can be fined and sent to prison for this malevolence.

+1 They need to be held accountable for their asinine behavior..

[ke6guj]

Ok, Tom Miller posted a little more info on biggerhammer:

Lynn, it began over a two party sale of an M1A Springfield that I transferred. The rifle came from Don and I transferred it to another individual who put a flash hider on it. When he was arrested he said the hider was on it when it was transferred to him. This was a huge lie. The "gun squad" focused on Don because the rifle came from him. Don Anderson did absolutely nothing wrong regarding the Springfield. When they were looking at him they found the M2 and M3 guns that he had legally made and registered. The problem here is that the LAPD "gun squad" knows nothing about semi-auto M2's and M3's, let alone about semi-auto 1919A4's. That's why they are now calling them "ZIP GUNS". Trust me, we plan on educating them.
In the mean time, the attorney bills will be mounting up. Don has already paid around $8,000 in attorney fees and bail. We need to send money in to the law office of Trutanich Michel LLC in Long Beach in the name of Don Anderson. Please help me get this accomplished. Tomorrow I will call the attorney and see exactly how they want to set this up. I will then post the info. Thanks, Lynn. Tom

Lets hope that Monday will bring some info from TMLLC that this a straight up legit case with no side dealings like other cases looking for monetary help, when there were drug dealing charges also involved.

[Blackwater OPS]

Ok, Tom Miller posted a little more info on biggerhammer:



Lets hope that Monday will bring some info from TMLLC that this a straight up legit case with no side dealings like other cases looking for monetary help, when there were drug dealing charges also involved.

I have have it on good authority that that charge was total BS, but yeah, I hope so too. This affects everyone with home built guns, obviously.

[jacques]

This affects everyone with home built guns, obviously.
Isn't that like 1/2 of California?

This is really bad. I feel for the guy. Can't Tom Miller just tell them there was no flash hider when it was transfered. He is a witness. The only witness maybe.

[ke6guj]

Can't Tom Miller just tell them there was no flash hider when it was transfered. He is a witness. The only witness maybe.Problem is that its past that. I didn't hear about them charging him with a AW transfer regarding that flash-hider. But the M1A guy's statements were enough to get a search warrant, where they found all the stuff that they pressed charges on.

[jacques]

Problem is that its past that. I didn't hear about them charging him with a AW transfer regarding that flash-hider. But the M1A guy's statements were enough to get a search warrant, where they found all the stuff that they pressed charges on.

That makes me even more pissed. They are making up stuff then. SOmebody must be trying to make an example out of him or something. :mad:

[truthseeker]

assuming CGF can confirm that there is nothing hinky in there, I will be glad to donate some $$ to a TMLLP trust fund.

Yes, the zip gun charge is BS, expecially when CADOJ specifically allowed for homebuilt .50BMG registrations, and has allowed for homebuilt single-shot pistol voluntary registrations.

The AW charge on the P22 is what it is.

The one I'm concerned about the most is the bang stick charge. Not sure what an "exotic weapon" possession charge is. Probably a blanket 12020 charge till they determine what they want to call it. Plus there are Fed regulaitons on powerheads that don't have a shaft attached to them.

I think the exotic weapon thing is BS!

That is like telling me that if someone had a center punch some where in their garage and a piece of pipe (that a .50bmg round can fit in) somewhere in their garage and a .50bmg round, they could also be charged with possessing parts to make an exotic weapon?

What the hell is wrong with this state?

[ke6guj]

That is like telling me that if someone had a center punch some where in their garage and a piece of pipe (that a .50bmg round can fit in) somewhere in their garage and a .50bmg round, they could also be charged with possessing parts to make an exotic weapon?
Now, that would be a ZIP gun. :D:D

[nicki]

Will a good ruling on Nordyke help?

Could this be our test case on AW's?

Nicki

[ke6guj]

It sure wouldn't hurt.

But a Nordyke ruling could be 6-12 months away.

[yellowfin]

What the hell is wrong with this state?
What's wrong is that people of the inclination of the DA and the "gun squad" haven't been thrown out of their jobs and prosecuted. They've been tolerated by the people here...for what reason I don't know.

[Vonshliken12]

It sucks because most of us here respect LEO's and much of us have family members or friends that actually are police officers. It just sucks that even though many of them know that OLL's are ok as long as properly configured they still shaft the citizens. My gf's cousin who has helped me build my AR just got hired as a sheriff. I asked him and he said he would confiscate another persons legally configured AR just to cover his butt. I don't blame him but this is why were dealing with this crap.

[CCWFacts]

I asked him and he said he would confiscate another persons legally configured AR just to cover his butt. I don't blame him but this is why were dealing with this crap.

Post-incorporation, that will be like saying,

I asked him if he would pull over and arrest black people who were driving legally on the white side of town, and he said he would just to cover his butt.

Both concepts will fly equally well post-incorporation.

[Prince50]

WOW! What a nasty Christmas present California has given Don.

I personally know Don and will contribute immediatly.

I emplore all of you to do the same. We rallied around Blackwater Ops, and need to rise up again to help one of our own.

I truly am inspired by the outpouring of positive posts in this thread. I am going to post this thread on all the boards I frequent to help our cause.

California needs change, and the kind we want will not be from Obama. The BWO case was a step in the right direction, let's use this to our advantage too.

Don, We are here for you 100% Bad economy or not, I am on your side.

Darin

[mrkubota]

Wow is right.... two years of nothing, then this.....

Funds on the way in the morning...

[nick]

Will the info for the fund TMLLP sets up be posted here?

[rue]

The AW charge on the P22 is what it is.

I'll be the first to disagree with this. As another early P22 owner I recieved a letter from the DOJ on this issue. The whole thing is pretty screwed up since DOJ originally approved the handgun for sale in CA. and somehow didn't notice that the barrel cap could be removed and a suppressor *could* be attached and now because of that oversight it's determined to be illegal and I can be charged with a crime? Screw that if they made that mistake how the hell can they turn around and come after the purchaser? :mad:

[ke6guj]

I wasn't saying that he was screwed on the P22, just trying to say that the AW charge was straight forward. Not like a zip gun charge that may not even be valid due to the definition of a zip gun and non-manufacturers being exempt from needing to pay excise taxs. Or a vague "exotic weapon" charge.

And yes, having bought the P22 in good faith as a legal firearm should account for something.

[Blackwater OPS]

I'll be the first to disagree with this. As another early P22 owner I recieved a letter from the DOJ on this issue. The whole thing is pretty screwed up since DOJ originally approved the handgun for sale in CA. and somehow didn't notice that the barrel cap could be removed and a suppressor *could* be attached and now because of that oversight it's determined to be illegal and I can be charged with a crime? Screw that if they made that mistake how the hell can they turn around and come after the purchaser? :mad:

Unless it's a real AG opinion that went through the whole vetting process the DOJ can reverse itself all day long and letters or emails to the contrary, you will not have a get out of jail free card. Which I have been trying to convince people of in another thread.

But it's still bull**** I agree. If it was legal for him to buy it they can't take it back, it's his legal property.

[CABilly]

Unless it's a real AG opinion that went through the whole vetting process the DOJ can reverse itself all day long and letters or emails to the contrary, you will not have a get out of jail free card. Which I have been trying to convince people of in another thread.

But it's still bull**** I agree. If it was legal for him to buy it they can't take it back, it's his legal property.

Isn't that how people have been allowed to keep their legally-bought AWs and full-cap mags? "No ex post facto".

[m2hbvic]

Holy s**t! I just saw this thread on Don and I can't believe that this nightmare is still ongoing. I thought that he was through with all that old BS.

I met Don a few years ago, at a party, and cooked a bunch of pork strips in my BBQ right next to him while he was deep frying a turkey. He even gave me a bunch of great cooking tips. And over the past years I've stopped and talked to Don while he was helping Tom Miller sell those BIG guns at the gunshows. Don really is a "Joe the Plumber" kinda guy, just like you and me! He's a truly down-to-earth guy who is so friendly that you'd swear you've known him for years as one of your best friends and that he's your best buddy. And when it comes to firearms, I have never heard Don talk about doing anything illegal or shady. He's a "straight arrow" kinda guy that makes sure that everything is legal.

I'll definitely send some $$$ for Don's legal defense fund, because he deserves it. Hang in there Don!!!
Vic

[psssniper]

Guys this is serious stuff, it seems nowadays that this could happen to anyone of us at any time. In times and countries past under oppressive regimes, we have read about people disappearing in the middle of the night and no one doing anything except whispering and hiding, hoping that they're not next. CalGunners are not like that. We have proven it in the past by helping and defending when and where needed and now we need to fight back and defend this brother in arms. I have never met Don but I know Prince50, Al B and 50 Shooter well enough to know that if they say Don is a good guy, then he is, and that's good enough for me.

[HowardW56]

Guys this is serious stuff, it seems nowadays that this could happen to anyone of us at any time. In times and countries past under oppressive regimes, we have read about people disappearing in the middle of the night and no one doing anything except whispering and hiding, hoping that they're not next. CalGunners are not like that. We have proven it in the past by helping and defending when and where needed and now we need to fight back and defend this brother in arms. I have never met Don but I know Prince50, Al B and 50 Shooter well enough to know that if they say Don is a good guy, then he is, and that's good enough for me.


As I stated in my earlier post...

If your friend gives Trutanich Michel permission to post here telling us that it is all bogus and looking for help funding, I'm in...

[DRH]

My check for $200.00 went out in the mail this morning directly to TMLLP with a note referencing the Don Anderson Defense Fund. I will try to provide more funds as circumstances allow.

[George W]

I happen to know Don personally.
I don't post here much but I had to post on this thread.
Like, 50 shooter, Prince 50, Sydwaze,Mrkabota, DRH said
Don is a class act that has been wrongfully charged with this ****.
My money is going out tommorrow.

George W

[tommyid1]

sooo when i get some extra coin i plan on giving a bit but should i give to calguns foundation or the tmllp and how do i do that online?

[hoffmang]

We should have an update on this in the next 24 to 48 hours.

-Gene

[Liberty Rules]

Like George W, I haven't been posting much of late, but I do know Don very well. He is a great guy and an above board individual. If they can charge Don with this BS they can do the same to every one of us. Knowing Don, he is probably feeling like the weight of the world is crushing down on him with charges being filed and the hit he is going to take financially to defend himself.

Don is a quality individual and is deserving of our support. I hope that we can all pull some things together to help him out and ease the burden somewhat.

[Sawdust]

I am seeing red of such a dark shade that I am speechless. :mad:

Set-up the fund, and I am in (again).

We must *all* pull together on this type of thing and spank *hard* all of the government agencies involved in these persecutions - or we shall surely all hang separately.

So, don't walk on by the hat without tossing anything in it - you may need the same help someday.

Finally, not only do I want Don exonerated of all charges and his property returned forthwith, I insist that the LAPD be sued punitively and all LEO individuals charged with whatever can be thrown at them.

Sawdust

[Sig226]

Finally, not only do I want Don exonerated of all charges and his property return forthwith, I insist that the LAPD be sued punitively and all LEO individuals charged with whatever can be thrown at them.

Sawdust

+1

Once the CGF gives us an update, and/or a fund is setup I will donate minimum $100. However, if the above is stated as a goal and as a matter of fact to-do, I will donate 2-3x that amount.

It would appear as though we couldn't have a more "picture perfect" candidate to support so it only makes sense to go on the offense here. Unfortunately, it makes the whole situation that much more infuriating.

[nick]

+1

Once the CGF gives us an update, and/or a fund is setup I will donate minimum $100. However, if the above is stated as a goal and as a matter of fact to-do, I will donate 2-3x that amount.

It would appear as though we couldn't have a more "picture perfect" candidate to support so it only makes sense to go on the offense here. Unfortunately, it makes the whole situation that much more infuriating.

+1.

[Biff...]

Gene,

Please keep us in the loop. I have $100 I can donate for this.

[tmuller]

I could certainly put some money together or donate a gun for auction. Keep me posted as to where to send donations and how. Thanks!!

[sorensen440]

We should have an update on this in the next 24 to 48 hours.

-Gene

I will help with what I can pending the update

[Sydwaiz]

Thanks for making this a sticky and thanks to everyone who is supporting Don. I'm not sure if he is reading this but I will convey everyones support. I know when this first started over two years ago, he felt very down about everything. Just recently, things started looking brighter and now this all of a sudden without warning. Again, I will let him know that we are behind him 100%.

[artherd]

CGF is aware of, and looking into, this. Update soon.

I asked him and he said he would confiscate another persons legally configured AR just to cover his butt. I don't blame him but this is why were dealing with this crap.

Tell him I will be here, to seek civil remedy against him personally under 42USC Section 1983.

[WokMaster1]

This is the same LA County DA's Office who went after BWO?:confused::(

[1BigPea]

I don't know Don but being a strong supporter of the 2nd Amendment and being totally disgusted with the laws and constant harrassments of law abiding citizens here in CA I will be sending a donation when the info is posted.

Reading the details of the circumstances/arrest I just can't believe that these "Gun Squads" or whatever the hell they are called don't have true criminals to go seek and arrest. They would rather go after law abiding citizens like Don and arrest HIM to what...make an example of us instead of the criminals? :(

This is just messed up...

[50 Shooter]

Cops don't like going after criminals as they are dangerous and usually put up a fight when cornered and don't want to go to jail.

The law abiding people that are just trying to get by, follow the rules, toe the line... They're easy pickin's for police as they know they don't want/need any trouble in their lives.

Again, thanks to CalGuns for making this a sticky and for all of you guys that can help out.

[sorensen440]

Cops don't like going after criminals as they are dangerous and usually put up a fight when cornered and don't want to go to jail.

The law abiding people that are just trying to get by, follow the rules, toe the line... They're easy pickin's for police as they know they don't want/need any trouble in their lives.

Again, thanks to CalGuns for making this a sticky and for all of you guys that can help out.

I would argue that most cops are not like what you are describing here

[Wolfpack331]

I am sorry to hear this is happening to him. I met him at a show a while back. Seemed like a great guy. Its kind of surreal being in Iraq and listening to everything that is happening back home with the elections and economy. Then to hear this. WTF. I can only imagine how the LA Libs are waiting to parade this around, just the visual of those weps, legal or not.

Just as I need my fire team covering my ***, He needs everyone behind him. He's on the front lines too.

[DRH]

I would argue that most cops are not like what you are describing here

I think 50Shooter meant to say "These" cops and not make a generalization but I can not speak for him. Most LEOs are noble public servants, unfortunately the few that wear jack boots seem to draw negative attention to the vast majority that just protect society and keep the peace.

[Creeping Incrementalism]

Trutanich Michel LLP for whatever you can afford to help with the attorney fees for Don. Make a note on the check that it is for the Don Anderson Fund. Please do this for Don.

My address is Tom S. Miller, 3938 Stanford Drive, Oceanside, CA 92056 tel 760-757-6823. Also, please help me get this around on the appropriate boards and web-sites or whatever else the inter-net offers. Thanks so much. God Bless. Tom

Can we mail these checks directly to TMLLP?

[Al B.]

From Tom Miller:

By:Tom S. Miller
Date: 12/9/08 13:57 In Response To: Re: Anderson Legal fund (Cisco)

Those that want to help with Don Anderson's defense fund, please send your funds to TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP law firm, 180 E. Ocean Blvd, Suite 200, Long Beach, California, 90802 in the name of Don Anderson. Please help me get this info posted on the other web-sites as well. Thank you. Tom


Thanks for supporting Don in this battle....Al B.

[Shotgun Man]

From Tom Miller:

By:Tom S. Miller
Date: 12/9/08 13:57 In Response To: Re: Anderson Legal fund (Cisco)

Those that want to help with Don Anderson's defense fund, please send your funds to TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP law firm, 180 E. Ocean Blvd, Suite 200, Long Beach, California, 90802 in the name of Don Anderson. Please help me get this info posted on the other web-sites as well. Thank you. Tom


Thanks for supporting Don in this battle....Al B.

Who do you make the check out to?

[DRH]

Who do you make the check out to?

The check should be made out to "TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP" but please write "Don Anderson Defense Fund" on the memo line or an attached note. Thanks for supporting Don!

[Riodog]

Why or What's the difference between sending funds directly to TM LLp or Calguns Foundation???

Artherd, keep us updated.
Rio

[hoffmang]

The main difference is that donations to CGF are very likely to be tax deductible while direct contributions are not tax deductible.

CGF will have an update on this shortly.

-Gene

[SteveH]

I remember reading about the "gun task force" back when that was going on. It was very difficult to find any information about them in the open.

Wasnt there some charges related to tracer ammunition in one of their cases? I seem to remember they were targeting 50BMG owners specifically.

Truely a sad story.

[50 Shooter]

Sorensen,
My comments are targeted at any LEO that would go after any person w/o knowing all the facts. Just because someone is a LEO doesn't mean that they can't question authority or at least make an attempt to check the facts.

They went after a personal friend of mine on a LIE from a guy who was trying to save his own *****. I'm disgusted that they rolled out on him TWICE like he was some kind of career criminal.

When is there going to be a change? When are the rank and file cops going to ask when enough is enough? If all cops don't want to be caught up and labled as JBT's, they need to work to make these changes. They also need to get away from the "us Vs. them" attitude that has been the standard.

[hoffmang]

All,

Just closed the loop with the Right People. This is a righteous case and we should all be confident donating to assist and oppose. I can say with 95% certainty that CGF will be supporting it directly. If you donate (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=108030) to CGF the donation is likely to be tax deductible.

Once the CGF board has completed the internal approval we'll post something formal.

-Gene

[nobody_special]

I wish I could help, but my wife is unemployed and my salary barely pays the bills (maybe). :( The best I can do is offer moral support and righteous outrage. Good luck to Mr. Anderson...

[ptoguy2002]

This is a righteous case and we should all be confident


This is what I wanted to know, donation inbound.

[nick]

Alright, that works. Will donate when I get home.

[Davidwhitewolf]

Will donate... in two weeks!

Seriously, that's when the Xmas bonus hits. The word from Gene was all I needed.

Gene, once CGF makes the announcement I'd like to publicize it on my blog. But I'd like your permission first. And of course I don't want to harm the case if TMLLP doesn't want publicity right now.

[HowardW56]

All,

Just closed the loop with the Right People. This is a righteous case and we should all be confident donating to assist and oppose. I can say with 95% certainty that CGF will be supporting it directly. If you donate (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=108030) to CGF the donation is likely to be tax deductible.

Once the CGF board has completed the internal approval we'll post something formal.

-Gene

Let us know when it is up on the CGF site and I'm in!

[hoffmang]

Gene, once CGF makes the announcement I'd like to publicize it on my blog. But I'd like your permission first. And of course I don't want to harm the case if TMLLP doesn't want publicity right now.
Permission granted. We'll have the full announcement up in the next 24 hours but you can move in front of that.
Let us know when it is up on the CGF site and I'm in!
Donations to CGF marked to support "Don Anderson" will go to the right place. Don't hesitate to donate using one of the methods on the "Donate to The Calguns Foundation (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=108030)" link at the top of every page below" CALGUNS.NET.

-Gene

[Sydwaiz]

I saw Don after work yesterday and he is in surprisingly good spirits in spite of what has happened. He is also very appreciative of everyones help and support through all this. He did not expect nor was he going to ask for any of this. I would like to thank everyone on Don's behalf for your support. It truly means a lot to him.


And for anyone wondering about his pets. His cats are just fine! ;)

[JTecalo]

Sent Paypal
Use it for Don's defense fund

[MIB916]

Hope everything gets settled quickly.

[artherd]

This case meets CGF's guidelines for support.

Anyone interested can donate directly now.

If you give us a few hours or so to make it official - you can then donate through CGF your donation will eventually become tax deductible.

[HowardW56]

This case meets CGF's guidelines for support.

Anyone interested can donate directly now.

If you give us a few hours or so to make it official - you can then donate through CGF your donation will eventually become tax deductible.

Donation made (Via PayPal)

[Davidwhitewolf]

My blog post publicizing the case is up now. (http://www.softgreenglow.com/wp/?p=6814)

[CSACANNONEER]

Well, I was asked by another FCSA member, who I owned money to, to make a contribution directly to TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP. So, I just lumped mine in with his, called them up and used a CC. For tax reasons, it would be better to go through CGF but, they will take CCs at TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP.

[hoffmang]

Well, I was asked by another FCSA member, who I owned money to, to make a contribution directly to TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP. So, I just lumped mine in with his, called them up and used a CC. For tax reasons, it would be better to go through CGF but, they will take CCs at TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP.

Note we can take Credit Cards at CGF as well - via paypal.

-Gene

[CSACANNONEER]

Note we can take Credit Cards at CGF as well - via paypal.

-Gene

I figured as much. But, the other person is from back east and he felt more comfortable going straight to the attorney. I did mention CGF to him though.

[ke6guj]

For tax reasons, it would be better to go through CGF but, they will take CCs at TRUTANICH MICHEL LLP.Too bad I don't make enough money to worry about the tax write off on charitible contributions, but money is on the way to TMLLP anyways.

[GuyW]

...these "Gun Squads" or whatever the hell they are called....

I'm pretty sure that's a typo - it's "Goon squads"...

.

[gorblimey]

Is the NRA doing anything about this, or are they going to sit on their *** like with Heller?

It's bad enough the rape of the middle class taxpayer (and our children) by the Government / Banking cabal has intensified to a breathtaking extreme, but that the "deep pockets" supposedly on the side of 2A don't fund cases such as this outright, leaving it to the little guy, is very sad indeed.

[hoffmang]

Is the NRA doing anything about this, or are they going to sit on their *** like with Heller?


NRA is not a legal defense fund. That said, NRA pays Don's counsel a monthly stipend and as such, both Don and the CGF get a lot more favorable billing than we otherwise would if this was not NRA's California counsel.

-Gene

[bwiese]

Is the NRA doing anything about this,

Echoing Gene above, the NRA and other entities like CGF are not legal defense funds, nor are personal legal insurance.

If your NRA membership were to include some 'real' legal insurance (and not "mall lawyer" wills & traffic ticket representation like the 'prepaid legal' crap your company may throw at you for a benefit), your annual membership dues would likely be several thousand dollars.

[And there'd also be 'selection pressure' that would skew rates & behaviors, because insured might well engage in borderline conduct. virtually assuring that expensive legal battles would be needed. It's much like healthcare insurance: those without insurance often take better care of themselves than with insurance.]

Bad cases/bad law can get fought, and fought vigorously, though - especially in instances like these.

[distshooter]

I donated $100 via paypal to CGF. Paypal does not provide a memo option allowing one to direct the funds specifically towards this ordeal. Please direct the funds to help Don.

distshooter

[The Calguns Foundation]

(CGNN) - CA. 9:59PM 12-15-2008.

The Cagluns Foundation will be supporting Don Anderson, and assist his defense from a wrongful arrest and persecution for doing nothing more than owning perfectly legal firearms.

Please see this thread for more information: http://calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=1762134

The Calguns Foundation is engaging Trutanich • Michel, LLP (http://trutanichmichel.com/) one of the best 2A and RKBA firms in the state. Once The Calguns Foundation's 501(c)3 application status is complete, your donation will retroactively become tax deductible, and we will (e)mail you paperwork to effect that deduction.

Please donate to The Calguns Foundation:

Donate via a Credit Card or Paypal (https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_donations&business=finance%40calgunsfoundation%2eorg&item_name=CGN%20Foundation%20%2d%20Offensive%20leg al%20activism&item_number=SeanB&no_shipping=0&no_note=1&tax=0&currency_code=USD&lc=US&bn=PP%2dDonationsBF&charset=UTF%2d8) or use the email address donate@calgunsfoundation.org for Paypal.

If you don't want to use Paypal and want to send a check or online bill payment, please send it to:

The Calguns Foundation
3200 Bridge Parkway Suite 202C
Redwood City, CA 94065

Make checks payable to "The Calguns Foundation." Please include your email address or Calguns handle so that we can send you a thank you letter for your tax deduction once our 501(c) status is complete. Also, we would like to track folks who are donating to support this case, so please write "Don Anderson's Case" on the memo line.

Two very important disclaimers

1) The Calguns Foundation is still in the process of applying for its tax exemption. Should it receive that exemption (and it expects to), your donation will be retroactively tax deductible.

2) Second, The Calguns Foundation is not your personal insurance carrier. There is no guarantee that we can or will defend any given situation, so you are thus always proceeding at your own risk.

Finally, please don't speculate on the details of this incident in this or other threads (even on other forums) as it serves no purpose, and may actually harm the case. Suffice it to say, there are some extra items about this case that make it more interesting for our side.

-Ben Cannon
Treasurer, Board Member.
The Calguns Foundation
http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/
ben.cannon@calgunsfoundation.org

[becxltoo984]

Delete

[bdsmchs]

I think the exotic weapon thing is BS!

That is like telling me that if someone had a center punch some where in their garage and a piece of pipe (that a .50bmg round can fit in) somewhere in their garage and a .50bmg round, they could also be charged with possessing parts to make an exotic weapon?


It's not BS at all, actually.

Powerheads or Bang Sticks are a very very weird firearms case. They are, technically, a firearm that uses modern ammunition. However, when they are attached to a pole then the ATF does not consider them a regulated firearm, and they may be freely bought and sold over the internet/etc without paperwork.

However, once you detach them from the stick, they become an NFA AOW and are very very illegal if you have not paid your tax and registered them.

I don't know anything about a california "exotic weapon" charge, but he could be looking at nasty federal charges for posession of an unregistered NFA weapon on that thing.

[Gryff]

Donation made tonight.

[RP1911]

I'll have an item for raffle. I did this for BSP and generated over $300.00. Just have to decide what to put up.

[nick]

Sent $100. Paypal doesn't allow to leave a memo, as previous posters indicated. I really hope it won't end without prosecuting the bastards. Of course, getting Don off the hook by itself would be great, I'm just sick and tired of government officials abusing the power given to them and getting away with it over and over again.

[dotchoy]

Just sent in my donation :D

[artherd]

I'll have an item for raffle. I did this for BSP and generated over $300.00. Just have to decide what to put up.

Awesome, let me know if you need help. I will look into wether CGF can officially participate - but it's probably best to conduct this yourself and then donate the results. Your donation would be tax deductible, but the entries would not be. If that changes, expect an update here.

[artherd]

Sent $100. Paypal doesn't allow to leave a memo, as previous posters indicated. I really hope it won't end without prosecuting the bastards. Of course, getting Don off the hook by itself would be great, I'm just sick and tired of government officials abusing the power given to them and getting away with it over and over again.

I can't comment further - but one of CGF's missions is to 'de-motivate' government entities from malicious prosecutions like this in the future.

[RP1911]

Ben:

I sent Gene a PM with the raffle info. The only item I wasn't sure of how to handle the donations.

BTW, did my Wilson ship? My DROS pick up is Thursday. :)

[CRQuarto]

Cops don't like going after criminals as they are dangerous and usually put up a fight when cornered and don't want to go to jail.

The law abiding people that are just trying to get by, follow the rules, toe the line... They're easy pickin's for police as they know they don't want/need any trouble in their lives.

Again, thanks to CalGuns for making this a sticky and for all of you guys that can help out.


LA County Sheriff's Deputy here, and I can say with 100% confidence that most of us LEO's do not fit the blatant insult you have just thrown out. I for one am utterly disgusted by this story, and will be mailing in funds to help out this case. I am all for 2nd amendment rights, and also a proud NRA member. I tell fellow LEO's at work about this site to get them informed on how utterly screwed up the gun laws in this state are when it comes to actual law abiding citizens, who are merely exercising their rights.

Best of luck to Don, and I hope everything turns out in his favor (and as matter of fact, ALL of OUR favor)

[Blackwater OPS]

LA County Sheriff's Deputy here, and I can say with 100% confidence that most of us LEO's do not fit the blatant insult you have just thrown out. I for one am utterly disgusted by this story, and will be mailing in funds to help out this case. I am all for 2nd amendment rights, and also a proud NRA member. I tell fellow LEO's at work about this site to get them informed on how utterly screwed up the gun laws in this state are when it comes to actual law abiding citizens, who are merely exercising their rights.

Best of luck to Don, and I hope everything turns out in his favor (and as matter of fact, ALL of OUR favor)

There are some good people at LASO, I've met a few of them, but "most" would be a drastic overstatement. Most of them fit this description to a tee. Those that don't quit after 5 years of mindlessly working the jails are generally... mindless. Or simply bullies.

[nick]

I can't comment further - but one of CGF's missions is to 'de-motivate' government entities from malicious prosecutions like this in the future.

Well, good. Very good :D

[CRQuarto]

There are some good people at LASO, I've met a few of them, but "most" would be a drastic overstatement. Most of them fit this description to a tee. Those that don't quit after 5 years of mindlessly working the jails are generally... mindless. Or simply bullies.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree, though I can relate to the mindless bullies part...there are bad apples in all professions :(

Still, Don has my support.

[Theseus]

Unfortunately I too am out of work and out of funds.

I hope this changes soon so that I can help.

[Sawdust]

(CGNN) - CA. 9:59PM 12-15-2008.

The Cagluns Foundation will be supporting Don Anderson, and assist his defense from a wrongful arrest and persecution for doing nothing more than owning perfectly legal firearms.

Please see this thread for more information: http://calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=1762134

The Calguns Foundation is engaging Trutanich • Michel, LLP (http://trutanichmichel.com/) one of the best 2A and RKBA firms in the state. Once The Calguns Foundation's 501(c)3 application status is complete, your donation will retroactively become tax deductible, and we will (e)mail you paperwork to effect that deduction.

Please donate to The Calguns Foundation:

Donate via a Credit Card or Paypal (https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_donations&business=finance%40calgunsfoundation%2eorg&item_name=CGN%20Foundation%20%2d%20Offensive%20leg al%20activism&item_number=SeanB&no_shipping=0&no_note=1&tax=0&currency_code=USD&lc=US&bn=PP%2dDonationsBF&charset=UTF%2d8) or use the email address donate@calgunsfoundation.org for Paypal.

If you don't want to use Paypal and want to send a check or online bill payment, please send it to:

The Calguns Foundation
3200 Bridge Parkway Suite 202C
Redwood City, CA 94065

Make checks payable to "The Calguns Foundation." Please include your email address or Calguns handle so that we can send you a thank you letter for your tax deduction once our 501(c) status is complete. Also, we would like to track folks who are donating to support this case, so please write "Don Anderson's Case" on the memo line.

<snip>



When donating via paypal, how does one denote that the donation has been specifically made for Don's defense?

Sawdust

[Hans Gruber]

I sent over some cash for Don but like others, couldn't find a spot to add a memo.

[50 Shooter]

CRQuarto,
See my post on page 8, I believe it's post number 73.

[stillnotbob]

Donated $50 via paypal. All I have right now to spare. Will donate more later if needed.

good luck

[hunter1]

With all do respect to the officer who responded on behalf of his fellow officers as to not hastily judge his bretheren in broad negative terms. While I have no doubt that you may work on behalf of the people and take great care and pride in doing so but the mere fact that those you consider "bad apples" are as "in any job" I take issue, they are a direct threat to our democracy and my freedom. If someone were to consider me a "bad apple" I do not posses a badge to wield power, authority and intimidation over the public given my inclination and propensity for unscrupulous and nefarious activites. I don't walk with the unchecked, unbridaled, unfettered, financially limitless power of the government behind me. Thank you for your honorable service but please do not patronize those of us with the boot on our necks. God bless you sir!
I am sorry if my fustration and disgust over this has caused me to come across improperly.

[Bad Voodoo]

I sent my donation to CGF today, as well.

[Lucky#13]

Guys, I am not a frequent poster at this forum, but I have long followed the legal issues here and have been very grateful for all this board has brought to our sport. Had a long personal chat, recently, with Kestryll and find him to be a first class act. I am grateful to Gene Hoffman and the others here who have put so much effort into making this state a little safer for those of us who want to enjoy our sport and stay within the law. I am overjoyed to see that the Calguns Foundation is taking this one on.

Don Anderson is a personal friend of mine as well. Many of those posting here are also. If there was ever a case where we need to fight with all we have, this is it. I will do all I can to help out. If a raffle is done, I will contribute. I am sending in funds right away and will add to that as I can.

Don, we are here for you, my friend.

[sindominator]

Well this just planes sucks, I think that if Arnold Schwasawhatever can have a tank in his backyard, why can't he keep his 50's. I am not a man of money, especially in December with X-mas and mom,sister,girlfriend,granda all with Birthdays back to back.

So I hope that $30.0 doesn't seem to cheap. Sorry I read the e-mail after buying raffle tickets for Calguns.net servers.


Best of Luck.

[goober_0]

$200 sent by PayPal.
grrrrrrrrrr.

[RP1911]

I'm ready to do the raffles. Just waiting for the blessings from the right people/person. :)

[Prince50]

Just sent $500 via PayPal to Calguns. Please everyone dig deep! Look under the sofa cushions. Under the car floormats ect.....

Give em hell Don!

Darin

[RP1911]

Anyone willing to donate a new 16" complete upper?

I am willing to put up a new unfired Stag complete lower (clears DROS Thursday) with Bullet Button already installed for raffle if someone donates an upper. With an upper, it would generate a lot more $s for Don's defense fund.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/freakshow10mm/Guns/PB270030.jpg

[ugly1]

first post on calguns,

Give em hell Don.

donation made through paypal

-sean

[Phugedaboudet]

Got Surenos and VST members here caught with drugs and stolen converted automatic rifles who get off the hook and out of jail in less than a year. SF nabs some punk with ten pounds of dope and an unregistered pistol and lets him attend voluntary drug rehab-which he skips and then kills someone.

The part about the walther has me concerned. Are threads only a problem for pistols? My Kel-tec SU-16 came with a cap on the threaded barrel, and currently has a muzzle brake, as opposed to a flash hider....I better pull that off at the range now?

It looks like this is another blatant CA attempt to attack FFL holders. But, the bright side, if there is one to be found, is that with the "victim " here being an honest-to-goodness "good guy",this could be a California equivalent of the Heller vs. DC case.

[psssniper]

Money sent via CGF,

More to follow on a regular basis until this BS is done :mad:

Don,
Hang in there man, we're behind you all the way!

[bwiese]

G
The part about the walther has me concerned. Are threads only a problem for pistols? My Kel-tec SU-16 came with a cap on the threaded barrel, and currently has a muzzle brake, as opposed to a flash hider....I better pull that off at the range now?

No, please look at the AW Flowchart: perfectly legal to have threaded bbl on rifles, perfectly legal to have muzzle brakes on rifles.


It looks like this is another blatant CA attempt to attack FFL holders. But, the bright side, if there is one to be found, is that with the "victim " here being an honest-to-goodness "good guy",this could be a California equivalent of the Heller vs. DC case.

It won't go nearly that far.

[CRQuarto]

With all do respect to the officer who responded on behalf of his fellow officers as to not hastily judge his bretheren in broad negative terms. While I have no doubt that you may work on behalf of the people and take great care and pride in doing so but the mere fact that those you consider "bad apples" are as "in any job" I take issue, they are a direct threat to our democracy and my freedom. If someone were to consider me a "bad apple" I do not posses a badge to wield power, authority and intimidation over the public given my inclination and propensity for unscrupulous and nefarious activites. I don't walk with the unchecked, unbridaled, unfettered, financially limitless power of the government behind me. Thank you for your honorable service but please do not patronize those of us with the boot on our necks. God bless you sir!
I am sorry if my fustration and disgust over this has caused me to come across improperly.

Thank you for the kind words. What I meant by "Bad apples", was that regardless of what profession you look at you will find those with less than good intentions. Granted, it is obviously more serious to find such a thing in a profession such as law enforcement or military service, than say the trash man, but evil is evil any way you slice it. Human nature is exactly that, human nature, and unfortunately we live in a state where the ones who make the laws want to make it damn hard to protect ourselves against said human nature. When I say that I am an LEO who is all for gun rights and people's rights, I mean it. I weigh my actions very carefully, as not only does it reflect on me, my department, and my profession, but it impacts the lives of those I interact with.

I can understand fully ones frustration at the law for the situation at hand, but just remember that there are a lot of us that stand beside you in the fight for freedom.

[50 Shooter]

As posted in the other forum, this Sunday is our monthly .50 shoot. If you've never shot a .50 and would like to, come on out to Angeles Range. I'm charging $10 a round and all the money is going to help out Don.

If you want to donate more that's fine also.:)

[DocSkinner]

This is yet another example of why CA needs an official oppression law, where the offending "gun squad" and DA can be fined and sent to prison for this malevolence.


I am going to try and donate -
I would also be willing to donate to a fund for a counter suite against the parties involved. Help tie up THEIR resources and time, and getthis to a high court before any new SC appointments from Obama...

[DocSkinner]

I would argue that most cops are not like what you are describing here

Most detectives/DA's bucking for political jobs would be a better insert than cops - Kinda like how the police chief's association never seems to say anything near what WORKING LE officers think/feel, but most people think they represent the working officers

[GuyW]

Kinda like how the police chief's association never seems to say anything near what WORKING LE officers think/feel, but most people think they represent the working officers

EDITED: Thank YOU for being pro-gun.

However - WHY CAN the public assume that they speak for "working officers"?

Because the majority of "working officers" and THEIR unions ALLOW that perception to stand with their silence and presumptive / tacit approval.

Even worse, these CA police unions submitted anti-2nd Amendment briefs to the Court in the Nordyke case.

These purportedly tough, brave "working officers" are all afraid to publicly (and maybe even privately) buck their unAmerican police brass and police unions on gun control (and anything other than more pay, more benefits, and more special considerations)...

...so altho I appreciate the fact that YOU are pro-gun and welcome your support, individual officer's pro-gun stance(s) are of small strategic value as long as the police unions continue their unAmerican attacks on our gun rights and traditions......

.

[daves100]

I'm tight on cash right now also. but think about looking around the house , gun room , man cave and see if you have any extra items you would be willing to part with and use that money towards the legal fund.
I'll be selling of a 50 Cal aircraft barrel once a few guys get back to me on the going rate.

i will also have a few items to put on ebay...


Remember any amount you kick in will end up being alot of money going towards the legal bill.

thanks to each and everyone of the member of calguns

[ARPirateMilitia]

http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/9439/donationws6.jpg (http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/9439/donationws6.jpg)

I'm very poor right now, I wish I had more to give. Thanks for being a awesome community that cares about our rights.

[DRH]

http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/9439/donationws6.jpg (http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/9439/donationws6.jpg)

I'm very poor right now, I wish I had more to give. Thanks for being a awesome community that cares about our rights.

Thank you! Even small donations are extremely important. We have so many members here on Calguns that if everyone even gave just two dollars it would be a large sum.


Folks, Do not be discouraged if you do not have a large amount to contribute as every little bit helps out in the long run and we are here for the long haul. I know from personal experience with my wife's credit card statements that even little amounts can add up quickly to a huge freak'n number! :eek:

[gn3hz3ku1*]

i gota get some funds together to donate.. that pistol lower can wait a few months..

the whole zip gun thing pisses me off!! grrrr In another life the gov taught me how to make a gun out of a pen for SHTF scenarios.. i didnt want to know how to do this or even care and forgot most of the steps since i didnt think that hard about it.. however it doesnt take a genuis.. so does that mean everytime i am using a pen im using a zip gun? WTH?

money to follow shortly

[MrNiceGuy]

Just got done paying all my bills.
Lucky I had some money left in my account so doing what I can.
$100 sent via paypal.

Payment Sent (Unique Transaction ID #6004062173930282R)
Dec. 20, 2008 Payment To The Calguns Foundation Completed ... -$100.00 USD

[10001110101]

Dropped another $100 to CGF. Give 'em hell!

[Gryff]

Something I would recommend...instead of all of us submitting donations on a case-by-case basis is to start donating $5-10/month to the CGF.

Like someone said, if a large number of us are donating $5/month, the legal fund would be substantial. The only caveat would be that the CGF would need to have accountability on the proportion of its funds that it spends on individual cases relative to their impact on 2A/RTKBA issues as a whole.

[Dedicated_dad]

LA County Sheriff's Deputy here, and I can say with 100% confidence that most of us LEO's do not fit the blatant insult you have just thrown out. I for one am utterly disgusted by this story, and will be mailing in funds to help out this case. I am all for 2nd amendment rights, and also a proud NRA member. I tell fellow LEO's at work about this site to get them informed on how utterly screwed up the gun laws in this state are when it comes to actual law abiding citizens, who are merely exercising their rights. ...

I joined this site specifically to be able to comment on this post.

Water-cooler conversations (notice how I refrained from going for the easy "donut shop" dig?? ;) ) do nothing to change the situation.

Are you (LEOs in general - I'm not just picking on CRQ) willing to stand up and respectfully decline to comply with what you know to be a morally improper order? If not, you're part of the problem no matter how many 2A membership-dues you may pay.

"I was just following orders" didn't work at Nuremberg, and should not be accepted here in The Land Of The Free.

I'm not anti-LEO, the fact is that a majority of my closest friends are Officers in various Fed, state, county and local agencies. Every one of them has suffered some career setback because they stood up for what they knew was right.

The only reason they were even noticed is because they're surrounded by others who put their wallets ahead of their conscience.

Yes - Legislators created stupid and immoral laws, but the reality is that they only matter so long as the Executive chooses to enforce them.

My Brothers have literally "put their money where their mouth is."

Will you join them?

Respectfully,

DD

PS: I've been disabled for ~9 months, and had no income for over 6. For me to contribute now would literally take food from my kids' mouths so I just cannot do so today. I will however promise to send what I can, when I can, and in the interim will make use of my Address Book to bring in others who CAN and WILL contribute.

Don - thanks for standing up and fighting. Prayers sent - NEVER GIVE UP!!

[50 Shooter]

Guys,
PLEASE don't start taking personal attacks at each other, it won't help out in any way and could possibly hurt Don's case.

Cal Guns is watched by more then one agency and you can bet that they pass along any info to all other agencies. I know there's alot of bitterness towards them and people want to say all kinds of things. That fact of the matter is that while these cases are happening we should only offer support to the person.

If we say things about how we feel or what we want to do, this could negatively affect the persons case that we're trying to help out. Trust me, there's alot of things I would like to say about how I feel but the last thing I want to do is have it screw up a friends chance of beating the BS charges against him.

[luv2shoot]

As posted in the other forum, this Sunday is our monthly .50 shoot. If you've never shot a .50 and would like to, come on out to Angeles Range. I'm charging $10 a round and all the money is going to help out Don.

If you want to donate more that's fine also.:)

I'd be interested in something like this if someone wants to do it again. I'm in north San Diego county if there's a place around here.


Also, to those who say "funds are tight, can't donate right now" even $5 makes a difference. No amount is too small. I just donated and while it wasn't a huge amount, it will help. I'm sure of that. I have no idea who Don is or what he's done for our community but if it were me in his shoes I'd be praying/begging for help.

As far as LEOs/etc being antigun, when the DOJ came to me fishing for anything they could use against a local shop to deny the FFL they had applied for, I told the agent the last thing she wanted to hear, that they were an upstanding business I've never had a problem with (and it was all TRUE). I told her she should issue the FFL. Now 2 years later (and only by coincidence) I bought a lower and they just happen to be the seller's preferred FFL in my area and will be doing the DROS on it.

Finally, like was said before, lets all work together. We're all pissed about these stupid abuses of power by those who took an oath to uphold the Constitution and protect us from all enemies foreign AND domestic, but lets stay united for our own sake. It would be nice if, once this is hopefully all behind Don and us, he and the attorneys would take those responsible (the agencies and each person individually) to the cleaners but that's later. Good luck Don. We're all behind you.

[artherd]

If every calguns.net user donated $5, we'd have this case licked and the resulting civil suit sewn up.

[383green]

When donating via paypal, how does one denote that the donation has been specifically made for Don's defense?

I haven't seen an answer to this yet, and I'm curious. I'm also on the cusp of making a donation, so I'd really like to see the answer before my mind wanders... :D

I note that when clicking the donate link in the CGF announcement in this thread, the reference line reads "SeanB". When clicking the donate link in artherd's signature, it instead reads "post-heller". In either case, the reference text is not editable. It looks like it may be possible to hand-edit the link in order to change the reference field, but I haven't tried this yet.

I looked for a way to "donate" (vs. sending money for goods or services) from my main PayPal account pages, but I didn't find that option, and I wasn't sure if there was anything significant about the donate-style page (hmm, I suddenly crave doughnuts).

Is there any convenient way for us donors to set the reference field to indicate our reason for donation?

Also, is there any difference between using the donate links vs. just sending money to the CGF email address the usual PayPal way?

P.S.: I loathe PayPal's anti-gun policies, and that's exactly why I prefer to use their service to make this donation! :43:

[hoffmang]

I note that when clicking the donate link in the CGF announcement in this thread, the reference line reads "SeanB". When clicking the donate link in artherd's signature, it instead reads "post-heller". In either case, the reference text is not editable. It looks like it may be possible to hand-edit the link in order to change the reference field, but I haven't tried this yet.

We can set that flag to track which link you came in from, but I haven't yet found a good way to let the donor edit it. I'm going to be looking at that in depth tomorrow.


I looked for a way to "donate" (vs. sending money for goods or services) from my main PayPal account pages, but I didn't find that option, and I wasn't sure if there was anything significant about the donate-style page.

Nothing special - just that the "Donate" click flow is per donator's expectations.

Is there any convenient way for us donors to set the reference field to indicate our reason for donation?

Doesn't look like it yet but I'm looking into it.

Also, is there any difference between using the donate links vs. just sending money to the CGF email address the usual PayPal way?

Nope. The only thing is that we just don't see which issue spurred you to donate. No big deal for us.

-Gene

[artherd]

Also, is there any difference between using the donate links vs. just sending money to the CGF email address the usual PayPal way?

Currently - No.

We're looking into ways to more accurately 'track' donations. That said, we're also looking for a good reason to do so, and I can't find any.

However, when CGF takes a case, we don't say "OK, we're going to spend $2grand then stop". That wouldn't get us very far.

Our filings will be available - and I think you will be - astounded - by the percentage that goes directly to cases & causes.

[383green]

Thanks for the answers, guys! $250 on the way...

[bringiton]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i want to send a paypal...how do i do that......under what email addie must the payment be sent out...?

let me know...thanks.....

i know how this feels..."i was charged with $2000 court settlement after shooting a bull dog that went into my fence and property line trying to attack my kids..believe me that dog looks crazy and infect with rabbies..." but thats life...

[hoffmang]

i want to send a paypal...how do i do that......under what email addie must the payment be sent out...?


finance@calgunsfoundation.org is the email address for donations.

-Gene

[383green]

i want to send a paypal...how do i do that......under what email addie must the payment be sent out...?

Here's the donation link from the Calguns Foundation announcement that's buried earlier in this really long discussion:


Please donate to The Calguns Foundation:

Donate via a Credit Card or Paypal (https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_donations&business=finance%40calgunsfoundation%2eorg&item_name=CGN%20Foundation%20%2d%20Offensive%20leg al%20activism&item_number=SeanB&no_shipping=0&no_note=1&tax=0&currency_code=USD&lc=US&bn=PP%2dDonationsBF&charset=UTF%2d8) or use the email address donate@calgunsfoundation.org for Paypal.

You should be able to click that "Donate..." link to get to the right place. To see the complete posting that I copied this from, click here:

Announcement from The Calguns Foundation (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=1789469#post1789469)

I am not a member of The Calguns Foundation; I just happen to remember where the link was in this long discussion! ;)

[bellson]

We can set that flag to track which link you came in from, but I haven't yet found a good way to let the donor edit it. I'm going to be looking at that in depth tomorrow.


Nothing special - just that the "Donate" click flow is per donator's expectations.

Doesn't look like it yet but I'm looking into it.

Nope. The only thing is that we just don't see which issue spurred you to donate. No big deal for us.

-Gene

While I DO NOT SPEAK for Calguns.net, I do run several Vbulletin sites that are industry specific(Not Firearms). I can only add that vBulletin (the software that this site is based on) is great, it is not easily pulled around to a specific need. Things tend to be generic, and making those kinds of changes are NOT done at that snap of the fingers!

We have to trust that we are doing the right thing when we make donations to any cause, and we need to trust that those who step up to take those donations are going to do the right things with those funds.

I have lurked about for several years here. My $0.02 is that the folks that run CalGuns are the real deal in terms of doing the right thing. That is only my opinion, and if you take the time to look, you will see that I have not been an "official member" for very long.

Unless CalGuns wanted to engage the services of a professional programmer, at a cost of $10,000 - $50,000 per year; they have to deal with what they have....Kinda like me.

Again, I am NOT speaking for CalGuns. I am not affiliated with CalGuns, except as a member and a voracious consumer of the info provided here. I am simply a "gun guy" like the rest of you, who happens to share in the limitations of the particular software used by this site.

Take Care

Bellson

[artherd]

Bellson - your understanding of the situation is spot on :)

Thanks
-Ben.

[Davidwhitewolf]

$500 donation sent via Paypal.

Today's the last day to donate if you want to take the tax deduction for 2008 (presuming the 501(c)(3) comes through in 2009 :thumbsup:)!

[Liberty Rules]

I also sent in a $500 donation on the 31st to help with Don's defense. I cannot stand paypal so I sent a check. Let's build a war chest to combat this obscene crap.

[hoffmang]

I cannot stand paypal so I sent a check. Let's build a war chest to combat this obscene crap.
Checks are just as easy and we save the paypal cut.

Thanks for supporting all of us.

-Gene

[Davidwhitewolf]

Yep. I had an issue with Paypal so ended up sending a check. Again thinking about taxes, the nice thing about checks is that you get to date them yourself.... ;)

[hoffmang]

Yep. I had an issue with Paypal so ended up sending a check. Again thinking about taxes, the nice thing about checks is that you get to date them yourself.... ;)

Since you're using cash accounting you can call it in 2008 pretty easily. I do warn folks that I can be slow depositing as I pull quite a few together before I run over to the bank and I don't have my CGN intern at the office these days.

-Gene

[ke6guj]

Powerheads or Bang Sticks are a very very weird firearms case. They are, technically, a firearm that uses modern ammunition. However, when they are attached to a pole then the ATF does not consider them a regulated firearm, and they may be freely bought and sold over the internet/etc without paperwork.

However, once you detach them from the stick, they become an NFA AOW and are very very illegal if you have not paid your tax and registered them.

I don't know anything about a california "exotic weapon" charge, but he could be looking at nasty federal charges for posession of an unregistered NFA weapon on that thing.

I just saw a vendor at the Ontario show this weekend selling a ".357mag Shark gun". It was not on a stick, just the bare powerhead. Listened in on his pitch and he was selling it cash-and-carry since it wasn't a firearm.

[bdsmchs]

I just saw a vendor at the Ontario show this weekend selling a ".357mag Shark gun". It was not on a stick, just the bare powerhead. Listened in on his pitch and he was selling it cash-and-carry since it wasn't a firearm.

BAD JUJU.


Revenue Ruling 55-569, C.B. 1955-2, 483.

A device ostensibly designed for submarine spear fishing, but
capable of chambering and firing .22 caliber rimfire
ammunition, is a firearm within the purview of the National
Firearms Act. However, such device, if permanently attached
to the speargun shaft by the manufacturer, would not be a
firearm.

Advice has been requested whether the following described
device, ostensibly designed for submarine spear fishing but capable
of chambering and firing .22 caliber rimfire ammunition, is a
firearm within the purview of the National Firearms Act and/or the
Federal Firearms Act.

The device, referred to as a "powerhead," is approximately 12
inches in overall length and 5/8 inch in diameter. It employs a
unique spring-actuated firing mechanism and an off-center .22
caliber chamber opening into a 3/8 inch barrel, 1 and 15/16 inches
in length. The barrel must be removed to chamber a cartridge and
the device is contact-fired by an outside trigger rod extending
beyond the muzzle.

Examination of the powerhead and consideration of the
brochures relating thereto results in the conclusion that it is a
device from which a shot can be discharged by the action of an
explosive and is capable of being concealed on the person.
Accordingly, the powerhead, by itself, is a firearm within the
purview of the National Firearms Act, specifically, sections
5848(1) and 5848(5) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954. However,
if the powerhead is permanently attached to the speargun shaft by
the manufacturer, thereby increasing the overall length of the
device to not less than four feet, the speargun with the powerhead
attached would not be a firearm within the purview of the National
Firearms Act or the Federal Firearms Act.

[ke6guj]

BAD JUJU.

Yup. I saw that and heard his pitch, and was like "I'm outta here". Then I thought about it was was gonna go back and tell the vendor that he probably had an unregistered AOW there. But I forgot about it until after I had already left :(

[Blackwater OPS]

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=145464

Check it out

[50 Shooter]

Just an update, Wed. Don was back in court and they delayed the case for another 30 days.

[Davidwhitewolf]

Thanks for the update.

[JasonDavis]

Hmmm....

I wonder how many of the LAPD own illegal unregistered AWs, perhaps on the Gun Squad.

LA area (incl LASO) has a very high rate of unreg'd AW ownership.

The better question is, I wonder how many LEOs own illegal "registered" AWs? Think about that one!

[artherd]

The better question is, I wonder how many LEOs own illegal "registered" AWs? Think about that one!

BOOOM baby!

[tahoetime]

Regarding police unions...

There was an anti-gun proposition when I was in high school in the early-1980s. Can't remember what the number was. Carm Grande, the president of the San Jose police union, came to my high school and spoke to an assembled group of history/social studies classes about it for about 45 minutes. He was strongly against the proposition and gun control in general.

I had done a paper against gun control for some assignment, somehow got the teacher to allow Mr Grande in as a guest speaker, and then that teacher told the other history teachers. Next thing you know, there were about 100-150 students getting an anti gun control speech during their history class. This was at a Catholic high school that tended to be very 'socially concerned'. Can you imagine something like happening in a public or private California school today?

As an aside, the San Jose police chief at the time was Joe McNamara, who was very pro-gun control if I remember right. Boy did the police officers hate him!

EDITED: Thank YOU for being pro-gun.

However - WHY CAN the public assume that they speak for "working officers"?

Because the majority of "working officers" and THEIR unions ALLOW that perception to stand with their silence and presumptive / tacit approval.

Even worse, these CA police unions submitted anti-2nd Amendment briefs to the Court in the Nordyke case.

These purportedly tough, brave "working officers" are all afraid to publicly (and maybe even privately) buck their unAmerican police brass and police unions on gun control (and anything other than more pay, more benefits, and more special considerations)...

...so altho I appreciate the fact that YOU are pro-gun and welcome your support, individual officer's pro-gun stance(s) are of small strategic value as long as the police unions continue their unAmerican attacks on our gun rights and traditions......

.

[50 Shooter]

Don was back in court Tues. and they did the usual delaying thing again. I had to pick my jaw up off the floor when he told me how much he had to pay the lawyers.

Holy crap! If you guys can help out any I know he really appreciates it.

[hoffmang]

I've heard a rumor that he thinks he needs to pay more. I attempted to quell that rumor as CGF has the bill from here.

Please make sure Don knows that so we can get TMLLP's accounting sending the bill to the right place.

-Gene

[glockwise2000]

Don was back in court Tues. and they did the usual delaying thing again. I had to pick my jaw up off the floor when he told me how much he had to pay the lawyers.


F*****g DAs. They are getting what they want. Keep postponing the case until funds run out and have Don plead guilty.

Hang in there Don.

[artherd]

Running up legal fees for a case a DA knows will be dismissed... how many bar cards are we going to have swinging from my freaking rear view mirror?

[KylaGWolf]

I know this is a way late post and may not do a whole lot of good, but if I remember my criminal law classes they cannot use the statement of a perpetrator but need collaborating evidence. Which means to me that the guy they popped on the M1A statement is worth garbage. They would need some evidence to back it up like someone that saw the flash hinder on the gun before it was transferred to him.

[TheBundo]

Can't they demand a speedy trial?

[zachary2287]

I just read through this whole thread for the first time. It's infuriating. I don't even have words to describe my anger. I'll be sending a check out tomorrow. Continue to keep us updated on the case.

What would the founding fathers think if they knew that law abiding citizens had to fear their doors being kicked in the middle of the night for exercising their constitutional rights? (Rhetorical)

[DocSkinner]

Can't they demand a speedy trial?

There has to be a way to force the trial to start. INAL, but there must be some way - Similar to the "produce the note" tactic used by homeowners on banks. But then all they can probably do is make a motion, and see what the judge says(?).

Is there a precedent for a standard of speedy trial? Obviously it isn't because the docket is full if it has made it before the judge already...

Any word on background of this judge?

[hoffmang]

There has to be a way to force the trial to start. INAL, but there must be some way - Similar to the "produce the note" tactic used by homeowners on banks. But then all they can probably do is make a motion, and see what the judge says(?).

Some of you may remember all the continuances and delays that the DA in the BWO case did. Those are usually a good sign.

Don is well represented here. If a DA is not moving forward with the prosecution it usually means that he's not faring well in plea negotiations and is worried he doesn't have the case he thought he had.

-Gene

[Cypren]

I know this is a way late post and may not do a whole lot of good, but if I remember my criminal law classes they cannot use the statement of a perpetrator but need collaborating evidence. Which means to me that the guy they popped on the M1A statement is worth garbage. They would need some evidence to back it up like someone that saw the flash hinder on the gun before it was transferred to him.

The legal theory you're probably thinking of is "hearsay", which would apply if the prosecution doesn't bring the perp in to testify but instead attempt to use his statement to the police as evidence. As long as they put him in on the stand, though, he's a witness, and his direct statement in court (that the flash hider was present on the gun when he bought it) is admissible testimony.

That said, Mr. Anderson will probably be put on the stand as well to testify that the flash hider wasn't on the gun when he sold it. Without some supporting evidence (such as a receipt for the flash hider, a dated photograph of the rifle, etc), it's going to fall to a jury to assess the credibility of the two witnesses and determine which one to believe. Few prosecutors would even bother to bring this case; there's far too high of a chance of losing it.

However, it sounds like in this case the charges being brought against Mr. Anderson aren't related to the flash hider, but to the search and seizure of his weapons at home, a search given "probable cause" by the allegation of the illegal sale of an assault weapon (the rifle with flash hider). From the initial post by Mr. Miller, I'm guessing the charges are two counts possession, one count manufacturing of a zip gun (violation of 12020(a)(1)), one count manufacturing of a large-capacity ammunition feeding device (12020(a)(2)), one count possession of an unregistered assault weapon (12280(b)).

The reason they're probably bringing these specific charges is because all of them seem to be something that a DA could consider winnable in court based on the letter of the law -- especially if he's getting his technical advice from the civilian disarmament crusaders at the LAPD.

I'm going to comment on my interpretation of the likely charges and rationale based on the information in Mr. Miller's post. I don't have any knowledge of the actual charges, the case specifics, or Mr. Anderson's personal life beyond what was presented.

If Mr. Anderson isn't registered as a firearm manufacturer according to 18 USC § 921, then constructing a pair of custom rifles could possibly fall under zip gun provisions. Whether or not they actually do depends on how the court chooses to construe the "manufacturing" of a weapon; is the creation of the receiver the "manufacturing", or is the assembly of the chamber, barrel and receiver together considered "manufacturing"? If it's the latter, virtually every gun owner who's ever cleaned a weapon could be charged.

The sticky problem here is that the general tenet that "the receiver is the firearm" (specified in 12001(c)) doesn't apply to section 12020(a)(1), the possession/manufacturing statute. So the LA DA may be intending to try to push this as a test case for the theory that assembling any gun parts into a functional weapon constitutes "manufacturing", and if done by an unlicensed party, the resulting weapon is a "zip gun".

Since there is no criminal violation for possession of a large-capacity ammunition feeding device, my suspicion is that the DA will charge Mr. Anderson with "manufacturing" the ammunition belt. Just because the links existed prior to the ban does not mean that they could be combined to form a large-capacity feed belt after the ban, any more than the pre-ban existence in your possession of the full set of parts to build a large-capacity pistol magazine entitles you to assemble them into a magazine post-ban.

This again raises the question of how anyone could clean their legally-possessed, large-capacity magazine post ban, since disassembling it renders it into "magazine parts" and reassembling it would constitute "manufacturing". But again, the DA may be looking for a test case here. The good news about this charge is that they have to prove he assembled the belt links after the ban. The bad news is that if he wasn't extremely careful, he or one of his friends may have given the police that evidence while insisting that the links were legally-owned prior to the ban and therefore it didn't matter when they were assembled.

All of these charges strike me as something that could only be filed by an anti-gun crusader looking to push to the very edge of the harshest possible interpretation of the law in order to effectively render civilian weapons possession null. But they do strike me as something that could be filed. Hopefully a jury would throw them out on the absurdity of the notion that the legislature intended to criminalize all modification, repair and adjustment of firearms by anyone not a federally-licensed firearms manufacturer. But you really never know what a jury will do when swayed with emotional rhetoric.

The last charge is the one that worries me the most: possession of an unregistered assault weapon. The only real defense that can be brought against this charge (since the pistol was definitely unregistered, was classified as an assault weapon due to the threaded barrel, and was in his possession) is going to be a due process violation, since he was not notified by the state that his lawfully-purchased weapon was criminalized. (The statute doesn't require them to notify firearm owners when they change the list, probably because the list was originally made for long guns, which are unregistered; they would have no way of doing so.) I'm not really sure how that argument will fare before a jury, but I do think it cuts to a general sense of unfairness that most people share and will make for a sympathetic case.

I'll be very curious to see how this one plays out in court. It could have very substantial implications if the DA is indeed trying to press such a stringent definition of "manufacturing", as I suspect.

[yellowfin]

What can be done to repeal DA's immunity from this kind of misconduct?

[GuyW]

I fail to see any so-called zipgun elements here....the gun is a type that is commercially sold with firearms taxes paid...
.
.

[Cypren]

I fail to see any so-called zipgun elements here....the gun is a type that is commercially sold with firearms taxes paid...

My interpretation of the possible charge was based on PC 12020(c)(10):

(10) As used in this section, a "zip gun" means any weapon or device which meets all of the following criteria:
(A) It was not imported as a firearm by an importer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(B) It was not originally designed to be a firearm by a manufacturer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(C) No tax was paid on the weapon or device nor was an exemption from paying tax on that weapon or device granted under Section 4181 and Subchapters F (commencing with Section 4216) and G (commencing with Section 4221) of Chapter 32 of Title 26 of the United States Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(D) It is made or altered to expel a projectile by the force of an explosion or other form of combustion.

The theory is that the home-made rifles (which is what I understood the .50 BMGs to be from the original post -- customized home-made rifles built on a commercial receiver) were different weapons than the original firearm the receiver was built for. In other words, because the entire package was not assembled together by a licensed manufacturer, and because 12001(c) doesn't apply to 12020, attaching different parts to the firearm constitutes manufacturing a "new design" of weapon -- one which is not legally approved. Despite the receiver having been taxed during its original manufacture, the "new design" of weapon would not have been taxed (again), theoretically satisfying 12020(c)(10)(C).

This is not a tested theory and there is no precedent for this that I am aware of. I'm just speculating on what the DA might be trying to push if he actually brings this to court, since few DAs take a case to court without any kind of strategy.

Hopefully the DA recognizes this is a very shaky argument to build a case on -- it might be pushable given the letter of the law, but it stretches all credulity with a jury -- and drops the charges.

[hoffmang]

What can be done to repeal DA's immunity from this kind of misconduct?

9 new Supreme Court Justices.

-Gene

[DRH]

My interpretation of the possible charge was based on PC 12020(c)(10):

(10) As used in this section, a "zip gun" means any weapon or device which meets all of the following criteria:
(A) It was not imported as a firearm by an importer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(B) It was not originally designed to be a firearm by a manufacturer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(C) No tax was paid on the weapon or device nor was an exemption from paying tax on that weapon or device granted under Section 4181 and Subchapters F (commencing with Section 4216) and G (commencing with Section 4221) of Chapter 32 of Title 26 of the United States Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(D) It is made or altered to expel a projectile by the force of an explosion or other form of combustion.

The theory is that the home-made rifles (which is what I understood the .50 BMGs to be from the original post -- customized home-made rifles built on a commercial receiver) were different weapons than the original firearm the receiver was built for. In other words, because the entire package was not assembled together by a licensed manufacturer, and because 12001(c) doesn't apply to 12020, attaching different parts to the firearm constitutes manufacturing a "new design" of weapon -- one which is not legally approved. Despite the receiver having been taxed during its original manufacture, the "new design" of weapon would not have been taxed (again), theoretically satisfying 12020(c)(10)(C).

This is not a tested theory and there is no precedent for this that I am aware of. I'm just speculating on what the DA might be trying to push if he actually brings this to court, since few DAs take a case to court without any kind of strategy.

Hopefully the DA recognizes this is a very shaky argument to build a case on -- it might be pushable given the letter of the law, but it stretches all credulity with a jury -- and drops the charges.

Actually home builders are exempt from paying taxes on weapons built for personal use, so an exemption was granted for taxes on the weapon.
It was also designed to be a firearm (1919 and M2HB), we are not dealing with a nailgun that was redesigned to shoot .22 cartridges. These weapons were as design as and are to date firearms which were made by a manufacturer. You only need to one out of the four and I think we have two out of four here. The DOJ has issued a letter stating that building a 1919 out of a kit and an 80% plate is legal, maybe they do not know the law?:confused:

[bwiese]

I fail to see any so-called zipgun elements here....the gun is a type that is commercially sold with firearms taxes paid...

Bingo!

[bdsmchs]

The one that scares me the most for Don is the AOW bang-stick/powerhead.

[Gryff]

What can be done to repeal DA's immunity from this kind of misconduct?

Follow Shakespeare's advice and kill all the lawyers. Then re-create the legal system with a primary requirement of ethical actions above all else. Then, have an oversight and disciplinary system that is not managed by lawyers.

[artherd]

Can't they demand a speedy trial?

Yes, but one must be careful in so doing. Especially when an affirmative defense is needed.

[artherd]

What can be done to repeal DA's immunity from this kind of misconduct?

CGF gets $100 million. Give me 3 years...

[DocSkinner]

Some of you may remember all the continuances and delays that the DA in the BWO case did. Those are usually a good sign.

Don is well represented here. If a DA is not moving forward with the prosecution it usually means that he's not faring well in plea negotiations and is worried he doesn't have the case he thought he had.

-Gene


So bad news is good news, sort of...

I guess that is true - If he thought it was winnable, he wouldn't be stalling...

Maybe I should take this recession and unemployment time to learn all this and get a JD! (First act would be defending myself from my wife if she found out...) PhD, Esq. - has a nice ring...

[DocSkinner]

CGF gets $100 million. Give me 3 years...

Sorry - someone in NJ won the big Lotto jackpot... Liek anyone that would live in NJ deserves that kind of money...

[GuyW]

CGF gets $100 million. Give me 3 years...


Psst - for $100 million you can buy all the Dems in the legislature and have lots left over for the post-op party...
.

[artherd]

Psst - for $100 million you can buy all the Dems in the legislature and have lots left over for the post-op party...
.

Don't think we don't know it ;)

[nick]

Follow Shakespeare's advice and kill all the lawyers. Then re-create the legal system with a primary requirement of ethical actions above all else. Then, have an oversight and disciplinary system that is not managed by lawyers.

An official oppression law could be useful here. If DA's options in case of misconduct included potential jail time and disbarrment it comes with, instead of the worst thing being the local government paying its money and the DA having virtually no personal responsibility, I dare say that they'd be much more careful in arbitrarily promoting their personal agendas, and those who do so anyway would quickly stop being a problem due to natural selection.

[rkt88edmo]

CGF gets $100 million. Give me 3 years...


Hmmmmm, need a janitor? Will sweep for stock options :)

[50 Shooter]

Don was back in court on Monday, delayed until next month. He said that next month should be the deciding point on what's going to happen.

[rkt88edmo]

This is pathetic, I wonder what kind of cause was given.

[50 Shooter]

I don't know why this got unstickied but Don was back in court yesterday, continued until next month.

This case is even bigger then most think, it will decide if you'll be able to keep those home builds. If they're found to be so-called "zip guns" then everyone with a 1919, M2, M3... kiss them good bye.:eek:

[rkt88edmo]

Do we know what the next date is yet?

[bwiese]

I don't know why this got unstickied but Don was back in court yesterday, continued until next month.

This case is even bigger then most think, it will decide if you'll be able to keep those home builds. If they're found to be so-called "zip guns" then everyone with a 1919, M2, M3... kiss them good bye.:eek:

It's indeed important - esp for Don - but it won't be 'decisive' about keeping homebuilds; this is just a county trial court and there's lotsa room for appeal.

[bdsmchs]

If they're found to be so-called "zip guns" then everyone with a 1919, M2, M3... kiss them good bye.:eek:

BS.

My 1919A4 was manufactured by a properly licensed 07 and then DROS'ed and 4473'ed to me.

Not all 1919's and M2's are homebuilds.

[50 Shooter]

I'll have to check with Don again, I think he said it was the 21st of May.

Bwiese,
Yeah but would you chance taking out your home build if this case made it through? All it would take is the "squad" to be watching this board or one of the others, when a beltfed shoot got posted... Show up with the paddy wagon and load it up with "zip gun" ciminals.:rolleyes:

[383green]

I don't live, work or shoot in the county that the "squad" is in, and Bill is even farther removed.

[laguns]

Bwiese,
Yeah but would you chance taking out your home build if this case made it through?

I also know two people that were charged with a zip gun and even though the DA's office was shown extensive proof that the guns were factory made, they refused to drop charges, stating they will gladly take it to trial and see what happens. Of course we all know what would happen. Highly decorated members of the LAPD would sit there and testify (aka "testalie") that what you have is a zip gun. Your fate will depend on weather your attorneys can convince the jury of the truth, that your guns do not meet the definition of a zip gun, cops are liars, and, and there is a conspiracy afoot to get rid of privately owned guns.

If Don settles this case without going to trial the gun unit will continue to call legal home built guns, or even ones thought to be home built a "zip gun". It is just another tool the gun unit with happily use to confiscate ALL your weapons and burden you with huge legal fees. If he has the balls and money to take it to trial, he could help put another nail in the coffin of the LAPD gun unit.


All it would take is the "squad" to be watching this board or one of the others, when a beltfed shoot got posted... Show up with the paddy wagon and load it up with "zip gun" ciminals.:rolleyes:

The gun unit IS watching and participating on Calguns.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=172349

[laguns]

I don't live, work or shoot in the county that the "squad" is in, and Bill is even farther removed.

NYPD has been running sting operation on gun stores in neighboring states for years. According to news reports one gun store was hit over thirty times before they were able to (using ATF) charge the guy with a straw purchase sale. You would think that after two dozen attempts they would figure out the guy is honest. Not so! They just kept coming till the poor slob made a mistake.

The LAPD gun unit is no different. They haven't limited their activities to LA City or even LA county in years.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=172349

[383green]

The LAPD gun unit is no different. They haven't limited their activities to LA City or even LA county in years.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=172349

What do they do when they "catch" somebody outside their jurisdiction?

[50 Shooter]

Can we get this thread stickied again?

383,
They'll turn it over to the local DA and they'll come knocking on your door.

[obeygiant]

What happened with this case?

[hoffmang]

Don's case is over with a generally positive result. I could have sworn that Chuck Michel posted something about it, but maybe not.

-Gene

[daves100]

I have not heard anything about the out come of the case. If you could please send some info. I have only met Don once what a great guy..



would also like to help to replace a few of his guns if they were taken and not returned

[obeygiant]

Don's case is over with a generally positive result. I could have sworn that Chuck Michel posted something about it, but maybe not.

-Gene

Glad to hear that it turned out well, thank you for the update.

[Linh]

Don's case is over with a generally positive result. I could have sworn that Chuck Michel posted something about it, but maybe not.

-Gene

Glad everything turned out well. Talk about a big waste of money defending something that is legal.

LA has a huge gang problems and LAPD is picking fights over things that are legal.

war on terror, war on drugs

I'm pretty sure the war on gangs is going to be lost there isn't enough prison space for all of them.

[bdsmchs]

Wow, so all is well even with the unregistered AOW?

I'm really curious what happened there.

[Seesm]

Please more info or link to said info. Thanks.

[hoffmang]

Please more info or link to said info. Thanks.

I've asked for a "The Right People" approved statement over the weekend.

-Gene

[wilit]

Tag to see the outcome. Thanks Gene.

[Seesm]

As always thanks Gene...

[ke6guj]

I've asked for a "The Right People" approved statement over the weekend.

-Geneany news on this?

[bondmid003]

Yeah I'd kind of like to hear as well

[hoffmang]

The case was favorably resolved for Don.

-Gene

[anthonyca]

Did CGF help out?

[artherd]

Oh yes.

[wash]

:clap:

[50 Shooter]

Favorably?!:confused::rolleyes:

[Theseus]

:party:

[hoffmang]

Favorably?!:confused::rolleyes:

Quite.

-Gene

[50 Shooter]

If by favorable you mean that he stopped the pain and suffering, then yes.

If losing all of your firearms and probably never getting the chance to own another, then no.

[bodger]

So is there some reason "quite" is the only description of the resolution of this?

Pending appeals and litigations?