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View Full Version : Obama/Biden 2nd admendment policys, what do we do now


HUTCH 7.62
11-04-2008, 7:53 PM
Whats gonna happen to our gun rights now that Obama is president. I can only imagine that Cal DOJ has been waiting along time for this.

F-2_Challenger
11-04-2008, 7:54 PM
Don't feed the fire and the belief that they will come kicking down your door to take them.

Just be thankful that Heller went our way.

nrakid88
11-04-2008, 7:56 PM
Pray to god they don't gain control of the Supreme Court in the next few years..., hope we can gain control of the Senate and House of Reps in a few years. Besides for that I don't know, maybe flee to another country as Political refugees if the laws get to bad, I just feel sick...

HUTCH 7.62
11-04-2008, 8:02 PM
Hell, what countries are we gonna flee too, most of the ones I can think of have tighter gun control laws.

bulgron
11-04-2008, 8:03 PM
There is no where to flee to. All other countries are worse than this one.

Assuming no one retires or dies on SCOTUS in the next couple of years, we have a chance to salvage this thing by taking back enough of the Senate that we can blunt whatever nominations The Obama makes there. We're definitely going to lose a lot of ground on federal benches, though.

As we all saw in the dissent on Heller, the sort of justices that liberals like are intellectually dishonest, and willing to make any argument in order to further their political agenda.

The best we can hope for is to hang on to SCOTUS.

This is truly a disaster.

tetris
11-04-2008, 8:03 PM
stop, drop, roll, panic. go on a buying spree!

stock up on lowers, stock up on ammo, stock up on handguns. Buy cosmoline, bury them in a hole. Obama is coming and he is going to confiscate everything!

Wheeee!!

Citizen Snips
11-04-2008, 8:04 PM
Permanent fed AWB, outright CCW ban or strict fed may-issue (only elite get one), fed ammunition serialization (including Sacramento-style registration), etc.. All probably within 2 years time.

pullnshoot25
11-04-2008, 8:05 PM
Hell, what countries are we gonna flee too, most of the ones I can think of have tighter gun control laws.

Panama and Argentina are fairly decent.

HUTCH 7.62
11-04-2008, 8:07 PM
how are the winters in Argentina?

hoffmang
11-04-2008, 8:09 PM
As long as none of our 5 SCOTUS justices don't die and we execute well, we'll be ok. I tend to think that Pelosi may lose the house in 2 years. Also know that we still have a pro gun majority even though the (R)'s do not.

-Gene

nrakid88
11-04-2008, 8:12 PM
We can only pray to take back the house.

DPC
11-04-2008, 8:14 PM
The majority has gotten what they want. Now all we have to do is sit back and watch as This CLOWN drops the ball and they reap the consiquences of thier choice. They are going to wish someone with a backbone was back in office Like W. but now they have CLOWN.


Blessed be the King of kings and Lord of lords!!!! "I will send upon them strong delusion."


DPC

mossy
11-04-2008, 8:15 PM
Don't feed the fire and the belief that they will come kicking down your door to take them.

Just be thankful that Heller went our way.

+1 we dont even know what he is going to do yet.

X-NewYawker
11-04-2008, 8:17 PM
Heller means dick!
Jesus stop being so Naive!
January: Inauguration. February: New Assault weapon ban. One gun a month.

Get used to it. A lot of stupid, scared people frightened by the Stock Market just insured the END of the America I grew up in, that my uncles died for.
Where if you worked hard, studied
You could BECOME something

The ONLY country on Earth where your future was NOt tied to your blood.
The country where the son of Arab Slave sellers could convice the sons of slaves that he was "on their side."

Stock up on Ammo -- 1000% tax coming
Stock up on guns -- 350-500% increase in the EXCISE TAX on each gun (that means a 1000 gun will cost 1600)
While we can still have them.

This was the country that my KIDS dreamed of growing up in.
Because they wanted to work hard -- MAKE something of themselves.
Now they will be considered the enemy. Oppressors of the underclass.
hey ask the question: Why were we good? Why did we pay our mortgaes on ytime, have no credit card debt, never rob and steal -- why were we so good when the poeple who lived without responsibility are going to be rewarded. I can't answer them, because there is no logical answer.
A neighbor, whooping and hollering in joy, pointed at me and said "you suck!"
When I asked how her life would be better tomorrow, she said, "It'll be better because George Bush won't be in the White house."
Idiot! He was going out anyway!


Welcome to the welfare state, where gun owners are criminals.
Where criminals can vote.

Heller was ONE opinion on ONE case. A new case and a more liberal SCOTUS can go the other way. Fact. The GUn companies and NRA know this. Only on this website do the Pollyanna's think that decision "protects their WASR"

Obama will appoint three judges in his first tern to the Supreme court. THEY will reverse Heller. The right to bear arms will become applicable only to the Army and Obama's new "civilian Army" he proposes to be as large and well armed as the US Army - -to fight "injustice" in Society.
Reps will try to stop them, but don't fantacize that this isn't bad.

Dems are looking for "payback" on the "gun toting Christians" they feel stole two Bush elections from them.

Don't be fooled.
This is going to get Bad.

HUTCH 7.62
11-04-2008, 8:19 PM
[QUOTE=mossy;1664824]+1 we dont even know what he is going to do yet.[/QUOTE
His supporters think he is going to bail them out so they don't have to pay their mortages. why can't we fuel up the gas can and get ready to dump it in the bon fire.

bwiese
11-04-2008, 8:27 PM
As long as none of our 5 SCOTUS justices don't die and we execute well, we'll be ok. I tend to think that Pelosi may lose the house in 2 years. Also know that we still have a pro gun majority even though the (R)'s do not.


I can only imagine that Cal DOJ has been waiting along time for this.


No, DOJ behavior is independent. And we have courts helping us out on that.

56Chevy
11-04-2008, 8:35 PM
[QUOTE=mossy;1664824]+1 we dont even know what he is going to do yet.[/QUOTE
His supporters think he is going to bail them out so they don't have to pay their mortages. why can't we fuel up the gas can and get ready to dump it in the bon fire.
I hope they all get foreclosed on. The stupid don't need handouts. They need education--good education. All these idiots are going to do is help me to make more money. I'd rather make less and know that my kids will have more to look forward to...oh well. I just have to work a little harder I guess.

HUTCH 7.62
11-04-2008, 8:37 PM
[QUOTE=HUTCH 7.62;1664853]
I hope they all get foreclosed on. The stupid don't need handouts. They need education--good education. All these idiots are going to do is help me to make more money. I'd rather make less and know that my kids will have more to look forward to...oh well. I just have to work a little harder I guess.

Amen brother

gunsmithcats
11-04-2008, 8:38 PM
Not too worried about the SCOTUS. The only two possible seats that can become vacant during Obama's term will be ones belonging to liberal judges, that means that even if they were filled by two gun haters, the balance would not be upset against our favor.

And yes on possibly winning the senate back. I have a feeling they won't touch firearms for a good while, at least not until the country gets back onto its feet and off its ***.

workinwifdakids
11-04-2008, 8:39 PM
When Texas secedes, we can all pull a Davy Crockett:

"You may all go to hell, and I shall go to Texas."

X-NewYawker
11-04-2008, 8:40 PM
Not too worried about the SCOTUS. The only two possible seats that can become vacant during Obama's term will be ones belonging to liberal judges, that means that even if they were filled by two gun haters, the balance would not be upset against our favor.

And yes on possibly winning the senate back. I have a feeling they won't touch firearms for a good while, at least not until the country gets back onto its feet and off its ***.

I hope you're right -- but I think you're going to be sadly disappointed...

ersatz
11-04-2008, 8:40 PM
Gun control will be the least of his concerns for at least the first year in office. All these otehr fiascos will keep him busy. Biden could try to initiate some gun control legislation though. But I think he's still trying to ban dietary supplements. Once that's accomplished he may move onto topics.

CCWFacts
11-04-2008, 8:42 PM
We're definitely going to lose a lot of ground on federal benches, though.

This is truly a disaster.

Yeah.

It's the federal benches that are going to be the worst impact for us. We'll have judges who make ruling against gun rights just because they don't like guns, never mind the law.

Paradiddle
11-04-2008, 8:42 PM
Wow - the paranoia runs deep here.

Frankly I think he and our government have much bigger issues on his mind then gun control.

Now - maybe second term....but not now. This country really does give a rats *** about guns right now - seriously.

My hope is that some stupid MF'ing cracker racist does NOT shoot him with bolt action rifle because THEN - it all ends. All guns gone....because of some short sighted racist.

nrakid88
11-04-2008, 8:44 PM
When Texas secedes, we can all pull a Davy Crockett:

"You may all go to hell, and I shall go to Texas."


Hahahaha:rofl2:
I was totally thinking Texas would be the first to secede, but I doubt they will, oh well, looks like I'm going to Argentina if the laws get to thick here

1859sharps
11-04-2008, 8:45 PM
man am I having flash backs to 92'. Savings and Loan meltdown, largest government bail out to date (then not now), recession, young political upstart calling for change etc. Clinton gets elected, predictions of gloom, doom, jack booted thugs to take our guns in the night, "panic in the streets", sky falling etc.

we got through a young socialist leaning president then, we can do it again. There is a lot more going for us from strictly gun owner perspective, let a lone many other issues, then there was in 92. (hint, internet and things like cal gun for grass roots activities)

Lets all just take a deep breath and not panic. up hill battle...yes. without hope, no.

If you haven't contributed to your favorite effective pro gun group, now would be the time. they will need the resources come next year and the mid term elections. which will actually be more important then this election, the census and redistricting is on the horizon.

smle-man
11-04-2008, 8:45 PM
I sincerely hope that the gun owners that I saw at the range the other day with Obama stickers on their truck who told me that Obama himself said that he has no interest in restricting or confiscating guns are correct. Myself, I think they are self deluding fools but you never know...

Satex
11-04-2008, 8:46 PM
Whats gonna happen to our gun rights now that Obama is president. I can only imagine that Cal DOJ has been waiting along time for this.

Obama and Pelosi have greater hot potatoes to deal with than go after 2A rights at this point. The economic situation will drive everything in the next couple of years - and hopefully they will screw it up so much that their dominance will be short lived. Towards next election, no one will touch 2A due to the consequences of the last AWB on those who supported it. So if something happens in regards to 2A, I suspect it would be 2 years down the road, which may be a sweet spot for attempting to reinstate the AWB.

All in all, the republican party deserved this. The GOP and the administration lost its core values and now the American people are punishing them. The republicans should take note, and correct the course if they plan to strengthen their position in Congress and have a shot at winning the executive branch next election.

mossy
11-04-2008, 8:49 PM
:pWow - the paranoia runs deep here.

Frankly I think he and our government have much bigger issues on his mind then gun control.

Now - maybe second term....but not now. This country really does give a rats *** about guns right now - seriously.

My hope is that some stupid MF'ing cracker racist does NOT shoot him with bolt action rifle because THEN - it all ends. All guns gone....because of some short sighted racist.

we need to teach the klan how to use knives or bombs quick :p

bwiese
11-04-2008, 8:49 PM
Because of the lay of the land and differences btwn State and Fed matters, California will continue to improve. Nordyke is coming, and coming our way.

On a Fed basis we prob won't have new bad gun laws - we still have a pro-gun majority it appears - a continuation of the 2006 election theme.

However, Obama can try go nuts on Federal judges and I think Repubs can "Reverse Bork" him and just keep things locked up. I hope Scalia, Roberts, Thomas etc are taking their vitamins and getting plenty of sleep and exercise: we need to keep 'em in place for the next 8 (well, I'd hope 4) years.

Expect continued increasing regulatory hassles of FFLs by BATF under Obama, backed by radical left AG Eric Holder. We don't have as good of a protection from out-of-scope regulation on a Federal basis as we do under California law for CA matters.

FFLs should spend time & money ensuring their books are dotted-i's/ crossed-t's. It may behoove some FFLs to close shop and come up under a new license with a new name on the FFL.

xcrunner805
11-04-2008, 8:56 PM
All I have to say is: "****TIN' FIRE AND HELL PISS" we are doomed. I'm stocking up on everything within the next year. America will wake up a different country tomorrow. Our forefathers that created the country we were would roll over and throw up in their graves if they lived to see what happend tonight.change for the worst :(

X-NewYawker
11-04-2008, 8:57 PM
Republicans in Congress get their balls from talk radio. Without it, only the Dem side of teh argument gets into the press. First on the agenda is the Fairness Doctrine, which shuts down TR and dissent.

Then guns. Believe me this bull about waiting to the second term is just that -- bull --

because the stuff they want to do to us they are not going to do while we are armed. I remember before kennedy j & B were shot, you could buy a G-3 through the American Rifleman and they would mail it to your house. Remember that?

X-NewYawker
11-04-2008, 9:02 PM
And you know -- forget our guns for a minute -- this man will stop drilling for oil in our country ("we have to break out addiction to fossil fuels") Stop coal burning powerplants ("We will bankrupt them") build no nuclear -- put all of our eggs in "alternative energy sources (none of which have panned out yet) and predicts that our bills will "skyrocket"

All his words.

And who was listening?

Bill clinton NEVER used these word s when he was running -- he ran as a centrist tax cutter (liar) but Obama SAYS he will do these things
And well, he's SO CUTE that he had to win.

Everyone I work with is a DEm -- I have had to put up with eight years of Bush hate. Now I will have to put up with Four years of Obama love.
Oh, and **** the PRess for their part in this. When they're no more Second Amendment, how long will the FIRST last?

Tactical Support
11-04-2008, 9:06 PM
God Help us if this is what we deserve!

56Chevy
11-04-2008, 9:40 PM
[QUOTE=56Chevy;1664987]

Amen brother
Another 100 million of you and then we'll be fine.:D

56Chevy
11-04-2008, 9:45 PM
And you know -- forget our guns for a minute -- this man will stop drilling for oil in our country ("we have to break out addiction to fossil fuels") Stop coal burning powerplants ("We will bankrupt them") build no nuclear -- put all of our eggs in "alternative energy sources (none of which have panned out yet) and predicts that our bills will "skyrocket"

All his words.

And who was listening?

Bill clinton NEVER used these word s when he was running -- he ran as a centrist tax cutter (liar) but Obama SAYS he will do these things
And well, he's SO CUTE that he had to win.

Everyone I work with is a DEm -- I have had to put up with eight years of Bush hate. Now I will have to put up with Four years of Obama love.
Oh, and **** the PRess for their part in this. When they're no more Second Amendment, how long will the FIRST last?
My wife kept asking me what all of the Obama voters think they're going to get. She mistook my silence for ignoring her.:p I couldn't think of anything, except that they're nuts.

AYEAREFIFTEEN
11-04-2008, 9:46 PM
Whats gonna happen to our gun rights now that Obama is president. I can only imagine that Cal DOJ has been waiting along time for this.

This is probably the least of our worries here. It looks like just about every god damn proposition in this state is going to pass. The poor, misguided voters in this state apparently don't mind paying more sales tax and allowing the state to borrow more money that they will eventually mismanage and then tax us for in the end.

Don't worry about guns, you probably won't be able to afford to buy them, let alone shoot them.

Hi speed trains!?!?!

How about pillows and blankies for pigs and chickens. Perhaps we can set chickens up in a nice REO home. Only two chickens per bedroom though.

8.75% sales tax to "improve freeways" again!?!?!

Does anyone remember last election when the misguided voters voted for a bond to "improve freeways." I don't know about anyone else, but my commute time sure as hell hasn't been reduced.

Anyone stupid enough to let this state borrow more money and tax us for more money that won't be used correctly shouldn't be allowed to own a gun.

LibertyGuy
11-04-2008, 9:52 PM
I imagine that if the Dems do try and put an insane tax on ammunition I suggest that those of us that haven't done so already learn how to reload our own. It will save us money in the long run. I know I'll be planning on signing up for the reloading class that was advertised at Angeles.

5hundo
11-04-2008, 9:53 PM
I think that gun control is going to be pretty low on the priority list for Obama...

He's got a lot of more pressing issues. However, if it concerns you that much, why not stock up now? Buy a couple receivers, or a couple extra guns for your collection. If nothing else, you'll be stimulating the economy and helping your country to recover economically.

I voted for Obama, even though he's not the best candidate for gun control. There were too many other issues at stake and I could not bring myself to vote for McCain. Since then, I've bought two receivers and an O/U shotgun. I love to shoot, but I love my country and I want to see it prosper. I want my friends from when I was in the Air Force, to come home from their deployed locations safely and as soon as possible. I want to focus on the actual war on terror and leave the distraction that is Iraq. For those reasons, I cast my vote for Obama...

deldgeetar
11-04-2008, 9:56 PM
I think that gun control is going to be pretty low on the priority list for Obama...

He's got a lot of more pressing issues. However, if it concerns you that much, why not stock up now? Buy a couple receivers, or a couple extra guns for your collection. If nothing else, you'll be stimulating the economy and helping your country to recover economically.

I voted for Obama, even though he's not the best candidate for gun control. There were too many other issues at stake and I could not bring myself to vote for McCain. Since then, I've bought two receivers and an O/U shotgun. I love to shoot, but I love my country and I want to see it prosper. I want my friends from when I was in the Air Force, to come home from their deployed locations safely and as soon as possible. I want to focus on the actual war on terror and leave the distraction that is Iraq. For those reasons, I cast my vote for Obama...

Doh! If you wanted your country to prosper, you wouldn't vote for the candidate who will raise taxes on the "rich" in bad economic times. Last president to do that.......Herbert Hoover. Sorry to piss on Obama's parade, but we will have gun restrictions AND a depression on our hands soon. Thank you America, for being so stupid.:(

56Chevy
11-04-2008, 9:58 PM
Doh! If you wanted your country to prosper, you wouldn't vote for the candidate who will raise taxes on the "rich" in bad economic times. Last president to do that.......Herbert Hoover. Sorry to piss on Obama's parade, but we will have gun restrictions AND a depression on our hands soon. Thank you America, for being so stupid.:(
A few minutes ago I just realized something: What the hell is he going to do about Iraq? Whatever it is, it can't be good.:confused:

csmintel
11-04-2008, 9:59 PM
time to stock up on cool aid you can offer them when they come for your guns. git some cyonide too..

5hundo
11-04-2008, 10:06 PM
Doh! If you wanted your country to prosper, you wouldn't vote for the candidate who will raise taxes on the "rich" in bad economic times.

We've done that for the last 8 years and it has dug us into the largest national debt in history, so how do you think the same policies were going to work under McCain? Furthermore, McCain's promise to leave us in Iraq would have drained our economy even further.

If Republicans wanted a victory, they should have nominated Ron Paul. It was that simple...

Cali80
11-04-2008, 10:10 PM
I think that gun control is going to be pretty low on the priority list for Obama...

He's got a lot of more pressing issues. However, if it concerns you that much, why not stock up now? Buy a couple receivers, or a couple extra guns for your collection. If nothing else, you'll be stimulating the economy and helping your country to recover economically.

I voted for Obama, even though he's not the best candidate for gun control. There were too many other issues at stake and I could not bring myself to vote for McCain. Since then, I've bought two receivers and an O/U shotgun. I love to shoot, but I love my country and I want to see it prosper. I want my friends from when I was in the Air Force, to come home from their deployed locations safely and as soon as possible. I want to focus on the actual war on terror and leave the distraction that is Iraq. For those reasons, I cast my vote for Obama...
Like lamb to the slaughter.
If you supported obama you should have gotten rid of your guns instead of buying 2 lowers.:eek:

csmintel
11-04-2008, 10:10 PM
we should for our own political party and push at the white house and house of reps ourselfes.

5hundo
11-04-2008, 10:12 PM
What the hell is he going to do about Iraq? Whatever it is, it can't be good.:confused:

I think the man himself said it best:

"I am absolutely convinced that strategically it is time for this [Iraq] war to end,"

I agree.

It's time to focus on the "actual" war on terror and quit wasting money on that debacle...

yellowfin
11-04-2008, 10:49 PM
The last time they were in this position they passed the NFA and GCA and not a single thing happened to them. I think they have nothing to fear at all unless we start giving them something to fear, like calling them each several hundred times a day like we do here but all year long. Even then I wonder just what will be enough. Obama and Pelosi have greater hot potatoes to deal with than go after 2A rights at this point. - Towards next election, no one will touch 2A due to the consequences of thelast AWB on those who supported it. So if something happens in regards to 2A, I suspect it would be 2 years down the road, which may be a sweet spot for attempting to reinstate the AWB.

All in all, the republican party deserved this. The GOP and the administration lost its core values and now the American people are punishing them. The republicans should take note, and correct the course if they plan to strengthen their position in Congress and have a shot at winning the executive branch next election.

marxdspot
11-04-2008, 10:54 PM
F**K!!!

deldgeetar
11-04-2008, 11:07 PM
We've done that for the last 8 years and it has dug us into the largest national debt in history, so how do you think the same policies were going to work under McCain? Furthermore, McCain's promise to leave us in Iraq would have drained our economy even further.

If Republicans wanted a victory, they should have nominated Ron Paul. It was that simple...

Well, if we are going down this road, let's do it honestly.

1. "The largest national debt in history" was caused by Democrat filibusters of ANY spending cuts after Republicans lowered tax rates. Yes, Republicans were involved in some spending as well, but let's not be ridiculous and claim Democrats, who have created these massive entitlement programs starting with the Great Society, are innocent in this matter. Rather, they have been and continue to be the cause.

2. If you think Iraq drains our economy, you don't seem to understand basic economic principles. Our economy is in a shambles because of government intervention in the mortgage industry. Government created Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac to buy out loans from banks so they could lend more money, and hence more people would own homes. In exchange, the government required that banks lend to more "high risk" individuals, AKA individuals who could not pay these loans for whatever reason. Hence, you have banks and government entities collasping under the bad debt which is insured by the US taxpayer. The watchdogs for this progam? Barnie Frank, Chris Dodd.
Who ran Fannie May? Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, etc. What's in common with these names. Democrats, all.

Furthermore, generally wars are an economic stimulus due to government purchasing goods and services from the private sector. Now, graft and corruption will damper these effects if the taxpayer is getting screwed. AKA overpriced contracts with Halliburton, Blackwater etc.

3. You argue that cutting taxes has caused this mess, and yet you do not address the example where history shows us that cutting taxes for the "rich" causes a depression. Are you suggesting that it won't happen this time? "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

I'm no GOP stooge. I voted Libertarian myself and don't like McCain in the least. However, Obama is just plain unacceptable.

mcubed4130
11-04-2008, 11:41 PM
And you know -- forget our guns for a minute -- this man will stop drilling for oil in our country ("we have to break out addiction to fossil fuels") Stop coal burning powerplants ("We will bankrupt them") build no nuclear -- put all of our eggs in "alternative energy sources (none of which have panned out yet) and predicts that our bills will "skyrocket"

All his words.

And who was listening?

Bill clinton NEVER used these word s when he was running -- he ran as a centrist tax cutter (liar) but Obama SAYS he will do these things
And well, he's SO CUTE that he had to win.

Everyone I work with is a DEm -- I have had to put up with eight years of Bush hate. Now I will have to put up with Four years of Obama love.
Oh, and **** the PRess for their part in this. When they're no more Second Amendment, how long will the FIRST last?

I've read all your posts in this thread... there's really nothing I can disagree with.

I'd suggest buying solar panels; a reloading press, and lots of supplies for reloading. We will be weathering a storm.

-M3

fusionstar
11-05-2008, 12:46 AM
I watched all McCain and Obama speeches and nothing they have said made any sense. When I listen to Ron Paul. It all clicks. Too bad no one took him seriously or even remotely understood what he was saying. These politicians are beyond ignorant and cant think of any other thing that isn't inside there bubble. What a crap pit we have dug ourselves into. If my friend names her kid Barack. I might just have to fly to Canada and club a few seals. To have a freedom of speech, the first amendment. You need the second amendment, the right to bare arms. Unconstitutional Legislation threatens Freedoms.

torsf
11-05-2008, 12:51 AM
Well, if we are going down this road, let's do it honestly.

1. "The largest national debt in history" was caused by Democrat filibusters of ANY spending cuts after Republicans lowered tax rates. Yes, Republicans were involved in some spending as well, but let's not be ridiculous and claim Democrats, who have created these massive entitlement programs starting with the Great Society, are innocent in this matter. Rather, they have been and continue to be the cause.

2. If you think Iraq drains our economy, you don't seem to understand basic economic principles. Our economy is in a shambles because of government intervention in the mortgage industry. Government created Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac to buy out loans from banks so they could lend more money, and hence more people would own homes. In exchange, the government required that banks lend to more "high risk" individuals, AKA individuals who could not pay these loans for whatever reason. Hence, you have banks and government entities collasping under the bad debt which is insured by the US taxpayer. The watchdogs for this progam? Barnie Frank, Chris Dodd.
Who ran Fannie May? Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, etc. What's in common with these names. Democrats, all.

Furthermore, generally wars are an economic stimulus due to government purchasing goods and services from the private sector. Now, graft and corruption will damper these effects if the taxpayer is getting screwed. AKA overpriced contracts with Halliburton, Blackwater etc.

3. You argue that cutting taxes has caused this mess, and yet you do not address the example where history shows us that cutting taxes for the "rich" causes a depression. Are you suggesting that it won't happen this time? "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

I'm no GOP stooge. I voted Libertarian myself and don't like McCain in the least. However, Obama is just plain unacceptable.

Well played sir!

exon111
11-05-2008, 12:55 AM
Well, if we are going down this road, let's do it honestly.

1. "The largest national debt in history" was caused by Democrat filibusters of ANY spending cuts after Republicans lowered tax rates. Yes, Republicans were involved in some spending as well, but let's not be ridiculous and claim Democrats, who have created these massive entitlement programs starting with the Great Society, are innocent in this matter. Rather, they have been and continue to be the cause.

2. If you think Iraq drains our economy, you don't seem to understand basic economic principles. Our economy is in a shambles because of government intervention in the mortgage industry. Government created Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac to buy out loans from banks so they could lend more money, and hence more people would own homes. In exchange, the government required that banks lend to more "high risk" individuals, AKA individuals who could not pay these loans for whatever reason. Hence, you have banks and government entities collasping under the bad debt which is insured by the US taxpayer. The watchdogs for this progam? Barnie Frank, Chris Dodd.
Who ran Fannie May? Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, etc. What's in common with these names. Democrats, all.

Furthermore, generally wars are an economic stimulus due to government purchasing goods and services from the private sector. Now, graft and corruption will damper these effects if the taxpayer is getting screwed. AKA overpriced contracts with Halliburton, Blackwater etc.

3. You argue that cutting taxes has caused this mess, and yet you do not address the example where history shows us that cutting taxes for the "rich" causes a depression. Are you suggesting that it won't happen this time? "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

I'm no GOP stooge. I voted Libertarian myself and don't like McCain in the least. However, Obama is just plain unacceptable.

First, it's a fact that Bush is largely (but not totally) responsible for running up the greatest national debt in history.

Second, do you seriously think wars help the economy? Throughout history wars have alway ruined countries. We are no exception. If you look at Rome and its decline, we are actually quite similar. I suggest you watch this, it condenses what normally takes years to learn into a few hours of clearly presented info: http://www.chrismartenson.com/crash-course

artherd
11-05-2008, 3:26 AM
Everyone - actually paying attention - isn't terribly worried. They don't have the votes, they don't have SCOTUS. Period.

Glock22Fan
11-05-2008, 7:37 AM
The only two possible seats that can become vacant during Obama's term

I'm sorry, have you never heard of heart attacks, strokes, car accidents and all sorts of other fatalities hitting people who are relatively young?

All nine seats are open to the risk of accidental death or disease. Some, due to the age of the holder, are more so than others.

The Director
11-05-2008, 7:50 AM
A word from the far right here...the very far right.

We've come so far from what the founding fathers originally planned for this country with Obama. We now have a documented gun grabber in office, as well as a man who is pro abortion, pro gay, and pays lip service to a God I'm sure he doesn't really believe in.

Half the country feels this way. It's absolutely sickening. All the youth jumping and chanting like they are at a rock concert just kills me. They've completely voted all of their rights away with him and potentially ushered in a police state: they have no idea what they've done.

I suspect most of the sheeple won't realize the ramifications of their actions until it is far too late.

Glock22Fan
11-05-2008, 7:57 AM
I suspect most of the sheeple won't realize the ramifications of their actions until it is far too late.

I suspect that it is already far too late.

MRboost
11-05-2008, 8:22 AM
How quickly can all of this possibly take effect? This scares the crap out of me...someone can walk into my home and I won't be able to defend myself? I can get sued for someone breaking into my home and cutting themselves on my window....this world is totally screwed.

Is this really what it has come down to?:mad:

bwiese
11-05-2008, 8:22 AM
We now have a documented gun grabber in office, as well as a man who is pro abortion, pro gay, and pays lip service to a God I'm sure he doesn't really believe in.

I could happily live with the last three if it weren't for the first.

This message brought to you by your friendly relatively-far-right atheist.

M.45
11-05-2008, 8:30 AM
Wow - the paranoia runs deep here.

Frankly I think he and our government have much bigger issues on his mind then gun control.

Now - maybe second term....but not now. This country really does give a rats *** about guns right now - seriously.

My hope is that some stupid MF'ing cracker racist does NOT shoot him with bolt action rifle because THEN - it all ends. All guns gone....because of some short sighted racist.


+1 Gun control thankfully has taken a far back seat to the real issues.

Gray Peterson
11-05-2008, 8:35 AM
"The largest national debt in history" was caused by Democrat filibusters of ANY spending cuts after Republicans lowered tax rates.

And why did the Republicans lower tax rates if they didn't have the money to pay the bills?

bg
11-05-2008, 8:40 AM
One other thing. The Dems were not able to obtain a
60 seat majority in the Senate. The GOP can still filibuster.

Fate
11-05-2008, 8:46 AM
http://photos-d.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-snc1/v368/50/59/202200553/n202200553_30500155_9838.jpg

bg
11-05-2008, 8:59 AM
Here is his possible line up. Check out who may get the
choice for Atty Gen, and Kerry is honking for Sec of State.
http://www.yahoo.com/s/982829
:party: = :puke:
National Security

Some of the same considerations are at play in picking a national security team. Massachusetts Senator John Kerry is lobbying for secretary of State, although Obama has been cautioned that would be received negatively by many Republicans.

Former Senator Sam Nunn of Georgia, who has attracted Obama's attention as a leader of anti-nuclear proliferation efforts, is another possibility.

Vice president-elect Joe Biden, currently chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, is expected to have a major voice on national security. That's why a Biden ally, former Clinton United Nations Ambassador Richard Holbrooke, is a dark- horse candidate for secretary of State. Holbrooke supported Hillary Clinton during the primaries.

Obama, associates say, will also use several prominent retired generals such as ex-NATO commander and former Marine Corps Commandant James Jones for special assignments. This could include one of the top intelligence jobs. California Congresswoman Jane Harman, former ranking Democrat of the House Intelligence Committee, would also be a candidate.

Napolitano, Sebelius

One leading candidate for a Cabinet post is Arizona Governor Janet Napolitano, an early Obama supporter. Napolitano, a former state attorney general, is being considered for U.S. attorney general.


SOS...

Liberty1
11-05-2008, 9:00 AM
One other thing. The Dems were not able to obtain a
60 seat majority in the Senate. The GOP can still filibuster.

They might still wuss out and not filibuster when they should. They need to come out strongly for limited constitutional government with lower spending, no policing of the world, and drop all their social control schemes against specific groups to gain back the independents.

bg
11-05-2008, 9:04 AM
^ I agree with ya. The soft core GOP trail that Mac took
turned off a LOT of GOP'ers. I would imagine next time
it'll be a lil different. 2010 should be interesting if we
make it that far..

5hundo
11-05-2008, 9:17 AM
Well, if we are going down this road, let's do it honestly.

1. "The largest national debt in history" was caused by Democrat filibusters of ANY spending cuts after Republicans lowered tax rates. Yes, Republicans were involved in some spending as well, but let's not be ridiculous and claim Democrats, who have created these massive entitlement programs starting with the Great Society, are innocent in this matter. Rather, they have been and continue to be the cause.

Incorrect... What you're saying here could have contributed to the current economic crisis but the national debt was a direct result of irresponsible spending on the war in Iraq. Besides, you can blame congress if you want but half of them were Republican and Bush was still President. If a Republican President can't cooperate with his congress, that's a tell-tale sign of bad leadership...

2. If you think Iraq drains our economy, you don't seem to understand basic economic principles. Our economy is in a shambles because of government intervention in the mortgage industry. Government created Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac to buy out loans from banks so they could lend more money, and hence more people would own homes. In exchange, the government required that banks lend to more "high risk" individuals, AKA individuals who could not pay these loans for whatever reason. Hence, you have banks and government entities collasping under the bad debt which is insured by the US taxpayer. The watchdogs for this progam? Barnie Frank, Chris Dodd.
Who ran Fannie May? Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, etc. What's in common with these names. Democrats, all.

The government didn't "force" the banks to design sub-prime mortgages. The banks created those types of "predatory" financing options to lure people into their grasp. The banks designed "arms" and "interest only" loans, not the governemnt. The banks did it out of greed and they're paying the price as a result of it. It's no different than what they've been doing with credit cards for years...

Furthermore, generally wars are an economic stimulus due to government purchasing goods and services from the private sector. Now, graft and corruption will damper these effects if the taxpayer is getting screwed. AKA overpriced contracts with Halliburton, Blackwater etc.

Well, we're at war with Iraq and still struggling economically... What does that tell you?

3. You argue that cutting taxes has caused this mess, and yet you do not address the example where history shows us that cutting taxes for the "rich" causes a depression. Are you suggesting that it won't happen this time? "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

Exactly! Look at the history of the last 8 years. Largest national debt in history. Apparently the philosophy of relieving the super-rich from taxes, so that they can pass the savings on to the middle class, doesn't work. Don't you think it would have by now? :confused:

I'm no GOP stooge. I voted Libertarian myself and don't like McCain in the least. However, Obama is just plain unacceptable.

He'll be fine...

It's impossible to screw this country up any more than George W. Bush already has...

bwiese
11-05-2008, 9:18 AM
And why did the Republicans lower tax rates if they didn't have the money to pay the bills?

Because that way you can kill the gov't without killing private sector ;)

bohoki
11-05-2008, 9:22 AM
Because that way you can kill the gov't without killing private sector ;)


awe don't you want you brother to grow up big and strong

well have to see how well heller stands up the next 4 years

http://i.adultswim.com/adultswim/downloads/tools/shows/frisky/wp/8_800.jpg

Grakken
11-05-2008, 9:53 AM
+1 Gun control thankfully has taken a far back seat to the real issues.

So when they 'fix' everything, you mean to tell me they will just leave us Gun owners alone? lets not forget the Bradys will be up in all their faces, 24/7 to get some stuff done. That is why they exist.

Bwahahahahahahahah

Sooner or later they will come for us (Guns). if the rest of you ostriches dont believe that, i hope they take your ***** while you sleep!

rayra
11-05-2008, 10:01 AM
stupid socialists.

Glock22Fan
11-05-2008, 11:06 AM
It's impossible to screw this country up any more than George W. Bush already has...

Gosh, have I got a bridge to sell you!

mcubed4130
11-05-2008, 11:31 AM
It's impossible to screw this country up any more than George W. Bush already has... Gosh, have I got a bridge to sell you!

+1

I have family that lived through the revolution of Iran (caused by the BBC and Carter saying the Shaw wasn't humanitarian enough - ring of chaos stuff)... We haven't seen anything yet.

-M3

Decoligny
11-05-2008, 12:04 PM
QUOTE=X-NewYawker;1664832]Heller means dick!
Jesus stop being so Naive!
January: Inauguration. February: New Assault weapon ban. One gun a month.

Get used to it. A lot of stupid, scared people frightened by the Stock Market just insured the END of the America I grew up in, that my uncles died for.
Where if you worked hard, studied
You could BECOME something

The ONLY country on Earth where your future was NOt tied to your blood.
The country where the son of Arab Slave sellers could convice the sons of slaves that he was "on their side."

Stock up on Ammo -- 1000% tax coming
Stock up on guns -- 350-500% increase in the EXCISE TAX on each gun (that means a 1000 gun will cost 1600)
While we can still have them.

This was the country that my KIDS dreamed of growing up in.
Because they wanted to work hard -- MAKE something of themselves.
Now they will be considered the enemy. Oppressors of the underclass.
hey ask the question: Why were we good? Why did we pay our mortgaes on ytime, have no credit card debt, never rob and steal -- why were we so good when the poeple who lived without responsibility are going to be rewarded. I can't answer them, because there is no logical answer.
A neighbor, whooping and hollering in joy, pointed at me and said "you suck!"
When I asked how her life would be better tomorrow, she said, "It'll be better because George Bush won't be in the White house."
Idiot! He was going out anyway!


Welcome to the welfare state, where gun owners are criminals.
Where criminals can vote.

Heller was ONE opinion on ONE case. A new case and a more liberal SCOTUS can go the other way. Fact. The GUn companies and NRA know this. Only on this website do the Pollyanna's think that decision "protects their WASR"

Obama will appoint three judges in his first tern to the Supreme court. THEY will reverse Heller. The right to bear arms will become applicable only to the Army and Obama's new "civilian Army" he proposes to be as large and well armed as the US Army - -to fight "injustice" in Society.
Reps will try to stop them, but don't fantacize that this isn't bad.

Dems are looking for "payback" on the "gun toting Christians" they feel stole two Bush elections from them.

Don't be fooled.
This is going to get Bad.[/QUOTE]

:willy_nilly: :willy_nilly: :willy_nilly: :inquis:[

Glock22Fan
11-05-2008, 12:15 PM
+1

I have family that lived through the revolution of Iran (caused by the BBC and Carter saying the Shaw wasn't humanitarian enough - ring of chaos stuff)... We haven't seen anything yet.

-M3

At the time, I thought that if the Shah was as bad as the libs kept saying, he would have had his secret police (Savak) assasinate Khomeini in his relatively unguarded exile in France (and make it look like an accident or natural causes). But no, he didn't. Big mistake.

Suvorov
11-05-2008, 12:25 PM
I'll say this much, we had all better pray to God/Allah/Science whatever or whomever we hold sacred that President Obama stays safe and unperforated for the duration of his term. Some Right Wing Zealot (or someone posing as a Right Wing Zealot) kills him and we will see civil unrest in this nation that has not been seen for over 100 years. And that will give Biden and big government the perfect opportunity to step in a do whatever they "need to do" and that would no doubt mean severely curtailing our 2nd Amendment rights as well as most other rights.

This next 4-8 years are going to be a treacherous time for America and us patriotic gun owners in particular. While I certainly did not vote for him, the deal is done and America has made its choice. President Elect Obama will be our leader and I'm hopeful that he will prove us wrong with our fears.

What else realistically can we do? At least I now have the excuse I've been waiting for to go and buy a Sig 556 ;)

dfletcher
11-05-2008, 12:31 PM
My concern is what can be done by executive order or admin law - C & R FFL cost increase from $30.00 per 3 years to $100.00 per year? New OSHA requirements on powder & primer storage? No mailing of ammo, powder or primers? In short, how can we be quietly and unilaterally screwed (as in, no legislation required) by the likes of Obama and his appointees?

bulgron
11-05-2008, 12:32 PM
What else realistically can we do? At least I now have the excuse I've been waiting for to go and buy a Sig 556 ;)

Me, I'm accelerating my build of my AR10. :D

Sutcliffe
11-05-2008, 12:41 PM
Now that we have him in office, I expect him to return the favor.
The upside is that the NRA will pick up another million or two members and it might cost Obama too much in political favors to go after evil black rifles again.

I don't expect anything the current administration has done(or expect Obama's to do) that will really prevent our economic problems from disappearing anytime soon. Come the next round of congressional elections and then the presidential race in 2012 and we might have enough backlash against our liberal utopian society that we can get a few things back in balance.

mroels
11-05-2008, 12:45 PM
anyone who thinks gun issues are going to take a backseat to other issues is being naive. We had a serious budget crisis here in California and that didn't stop all the anti-gun legislation being introduced. They don't care about prioritizing according to importance to the nation, they just wanna be able to say that they did something including introducing antigun legislation. Plus it isn't like dems are gonna have to still be written, they have all their bans/restrictive bills all prepared and ready to go. And if they don't the Brady people will write it for the dems.

However, considering that obama got a lot of support from pro-2a states makes me doubt going after state laws eg ccw.

deldgeetar
11-05-2008, 1:48 PM
[QUOTE=exon111;1666010]First, it's a fact that Bush is largely (but not totally) responsible for running up the greatest national debt in history.
[QUOTE]

Really? I wasn't aware that Bush created the Great Society, and that Bush created huge entitlement programs, and that Bush has the power to dictate that these should be appropriated for. That power is in the hands of the legislature, and these programs were created by a congress DOMINATED by the hard left for close to 50 years. If you are so short-sighted that you can't see past 8 years ago, then there is no point in me even addressing your idiotic Roman commentary. But here goes anyway. Rome's economy fell because of LAVISH GOVERNMENT SPENDING AND A WELFARE STATE combined with an influx of barbarians. Read "illegal immigrants." So yes, they are similar to us today, but not for bankrupting themselves fighting wars. Rather, for huge government entitlements that started 33 years before Bush even became president. Your ignorance is astounding, and I am not surprise you voted as a sheeple.

deldgeetar
11-05-2008, 1:50 PM
Wow and after reading some other posts from fools in this thread, apparently every Obama voter's historical perspective begins in 2000. You people really need to wake the hell up.....oh wait, too late.:mad::rolleyes:

grywlfbg
11-05-2008, 2:10 PM
Well, if we are going down this road, let's do it honestly.

1. "The largest national debt in history" was caused by Democrat filibusters of ANY spending cuts after Republicans lowered tax rates. Yes, Republicans were involved in some spending as well, but let's not be ridiculous and claim Democrats, who have created these massive entitlement programs starting with the Great Society, are innocent in this matter. Rather, they have been and continue to be the cause.

Uhhh, wrong. Medicare drug benefit was Bush's idea. Iraq war was Bush's idea. $700 Billion nationalization of the financial industry was Paulson(R), Bernanke(R), Bush's idea.


2. If you think Iraq drains our economy, you don't seem to understand basic economic principles. Our economy is in a shambles because of government intervention in the mortgage industry. Government created Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac to buy out loans from banks so they could lend more money, and hence more people would own homes. In exchange, the government required that banks lend to more "high risk" individuals, AKA individuals who could not pay these loans for whatever reason. Hence, you have banks and government entities collasping under the bad debt which is insured by the US taxpayer. The watchdogs for this progam? Barnie Frank, Chris Dodd.
Who ran Fannie May? Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, etc. What's in common with these names. Democrats, all.

Fannie and Freddie are not innocent here but Lehman, Goldman, Countrywide, IndyMac, Bear Stearns, BoA, and on and on (nearly all run by Republicans) had WAY more to do w/ the current mess than Fannie/Freddie. It was the Bush admin that forced Fannie/Freddie to buy bad mortgages made by the private banking industry that really sunk them. Also, remember Bush's "ownership society" form 2002? Bush was on board w/ expanding Fannie/Freddie.

And the government didn't REQUIRE banks to lend to high-risk people. The Community Reinvestment Act only forced banks to use the same criteria for all applicants and not discriminate based on location. Also, it only applied to FDIC banks for Countrywide et al (who wrote the largest number of subprime loans) weren't subject to the CRA.
[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=deldgeetar;1665795
3. You argue that cutting taxes has caused this mess, and yet you do not address the example where history shows us that cutting taxes for the "rich" causes a depression. Are you suggesting that it won't happen this time? "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."[/QUOTE]

One data point does not make a rule. Also, cutting taxes for the rich sure did such a great job :rolleyes: I've read several papers on the causes of the depression - taxes aren't mentioned in any of them.

Nra-Life-Member
11-05-2008, 2:26 PM
Common sense is back!

http://www.bradycampaign.org/

trinydex
11-05-2008, 3:00 PM
I'll say this much, we had all better pray to God/Allah/Science whatever or whomever we hold sacred that President Obama stays safe and unperforated for the duration of his term. Some Right Wing Zealot (or someone posing as a Right Wing Zealot) kills him and we will see civil unrest in this nation that has not been seen for over 100 years. And that will give Biden and big government the perfect opportunity to step in a do whatever they "need to do" and that would no doubt mean severely curtailing or 2nd Amendment rights as well as most other rights.

This next 4-8 years are going to be a treacherous time for America and us patriotic gun owners in particular. While I certainly did not vote for him, the deal is done and America has made its choice. President Elect Obama will be our leader and I'm hopeful that he will prove us wrong with our fears.

What else realistically can we do? At least I now have the excuse I've been waiting for to go and buy a Sig 556 ;)

surprised you're the first one to bring this up so far

EastBayRidge
11-05-2008, 3:02 PM
"but Lehman, Goldman, Countrywide, IndyMac, Bear Stearns, BoA, and on and on (nearly all run by Republicans)..."

Based on what ? You know the actual party affiliations of their boards and officers, or are just making a blanket statement ? These people are first and foremost capitalists - party affiliation is incidental to making $$.

Judging by donations, there seems to be a pretty even split - in 2008 the Dems actually had the edge. It seems generally dependent on who's in power at the time:

http://blog.sunlightfoundation.com/2008/09/25/finance-industry-giving-visualized/

trinydex
11-05-2008, 3:30 PM
First, it's a fact that Bush is largely (but not totally) responsible for running up the greatest national debt in history.

Second, do you seriously think wars help the economy? Throughout history wars have alway ruined countries. We are no exception. If you look at Rome and its decline, we are actually quite similar. I suggest you watch this, it condenses what normally takes years to learn into a few hours of clearly presented info: http://www.chrismartenson.com/crash-course

i'm watchin' this and it's terribly skewed. is this the same guy that made the 911 truth videos?

he alleges that while there was a gold standard there was no inflation? false, even by the graph that he's drawing you can SEE there is DEFINITE inflation increase and the "standard of living" did not return to the same cost.

he's suggesting that there's no residual benefits to war hardware? how about technological development?

he's also alleging or at least overlyall showing (from a biased perspective) that there's no way to check inflation and this is UNTRUE. he acts as though we MUST continue to print MORE money, that's false... we can always CHOOSE to print the same amount or print LESS. if the fed hiked up interest rates to double digits just HOW much money do you think would be "printed out of thin air." he acts and presents as if there are NO controls over this system and that's NOT TRUE. there's only POOR CONTROLLERS.

Ironchef
11-05-2008, 3:41 PM
I have a question:

Who here will actually go without guns, should they become illegal or otherwise "grabbed?"

Exactly.

And who here will sit by while any such gun grabbing will go on? You guys think you're alone in this? I recall seeing a figure that there's 40 million gun owners in this country..that's pretty much the size of CA's population. And with Heller, how many of those gun owners will just sit there with their head in their hands, turning in or registering their m1 garand's as "assault weapons?"

I think if any such things happen, that the gun owners of this country will actually make that provided for step of relinqueshing said government of it's tyrranical laws..or at least in smaller steps fight tooth and nail, as a country, and not just this liberal state or that liberal state. As someone wise said in another thread, if it comes time to bury your guns, it should be time to use them. We obviously want our guns for the reason the inalienable right was given to us, hopefully we won't be cowards when it comes time to exercise that protected right.

I saw a youtube video someone sent me in a paranoid email saying Obama was going to take our guns, and the video is about a criminal talking about gun laws and his business as he discusses how his business booms when people are disarmed, etc, etc..i'm sure you've all seen a hundred different versions of it. Point being...that's real information. If gun rights groups would hit voters where they pay attention (commercials in between american idol), it might do more than spending wasted millions on lawyers and such.

Again, gun culture restoration is the only real tool to change gun laws. We all know anti-gunners are afraid of guns mysteriously going off and slaughtering innocent school children, so is it better to force them to accept new laws, or put a gun in their hand, or show cute home movies (or reality tv shows) with people safely handling guns.

THere have always been liberals..even when gun culture thrived in the 50's. THe only difference I see is media representation, false paranoia, and political division.

Grakken
11-05-2008, 3:49 PM
The Brady report notes that Senator Barack Obama said in his convention acceptance speech that we should keep assault weapons out of the hands of criminals.

So i can read between the lines here. BHO will ban assault weapons as soon as Sarah Brady can get the doc to his desk.. because afterall since there is no ban now, outlaws have easier access to acquiring them. Interesting...Im interested in seeing what you BHO fanboi's will say when it happens. Better not complain, that's for damn sure!

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h303/usa732/its-a-trap.jpg

Grakken
11-05-2008, 3:54 PM
THere have always been liberals..even when gun culture thrived in the 50's. THe only difference I see is media representation, false paranoia, and political division.

Ive heard many times that the libs or "progressives" back than are nothing like the Mike Moore libs we have today.to me.

Sutcliffe
11-05-2008, 3:59 PM
The Brady report notes that Senator Barack Obama said in his convention acceptance speech that we should keep assault weapons out of the hands of criminals.

So i can read between the lines here. BHO will ban assault weapons as soon as Sarah Brady can get the doc to his desk.. because afterall since there is no ban now, outlaws have easier access to acquiring them. Interesting...Im interested in seeing what you BHO fanboi's will say when it happens. Better not complain, that's for damn sure!

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h303/usa732/its-a-trap.jpg

I can honestly say that is the funniest thing I have ever seen. You are my new idol!

Ironchef
11-05-2008, 4:01 PM
Yes, well done graken. lol

anthonyca
11-05-2008, 4:19 PM
There are been numerous "emergency" bills in the last few years with no time for the congress to read them, IE patriot act, housing bill, bailout bill, ect. Look at gun hating snakes like lautenberg, they put amendments in multiple hundred page bills in the last few mins before a vote. Look at the machine gun ban 1986 most congress men and even Regan said they didn't know it was hidden in there. Now they don't even have to worry about a veto for that underhanded slimy unconstitutional act of slipping gun bills in with multiple hundred page bills in the last few mins of voting. With Obama's record it will probably be encuraged. That's how I see them taking our rights in the short run. I hope I am wrong.

Rob454
11-05-2008, 4:31 PM
All this stuff has to go through senate and congress. What my suggestion woudl be is to get a BIGGER BETTER lobby than the anti gunners. Im sure most of you are in the NRA but I bet you each knkow at least 2-4 people who own guns but are not members

anthonyca
11-05-2008, 4:33 PM
All this stuff has to go through senate and congress. What my suggestion woudl be is to get a BIGGER BETTER lobby than the anti gunners. Im sure most of you are in the NRA but I bet you each knkow at least 2-4 people who own guns but are not members

I read somewhere that there are 90 million gun owners in the USA. There are around 4 million NRA members. We are doomed.

yellowfin
11-05-2008, 4:42 PM
Now that we have him in office, I expect him to return the favor.
The upside is that the NRA will pick up another million or two members and it might cost Obama too much in political favors to go after evil black rifles again.

I don't expect anything the current administration has done(or expect Obama's to do) that will really prevent our economic problems from disappearing anytime soon. Come the next round of congressional elections and then the presidential race in 2012 and we might have enough backlash against our liberal utopian society that we can get a few things back in balance.This is all based on the idea that they care what the cost is. If they feel too invincible, and this election gives them little to the contrary, they could just zap it all out in 2 years and consequences be damned. The real question is can we get anything repealed, not just sunsetted, and the answer to that is we haven't yet and I don't know what the public will would be to do so.

Lots has been accomplished in this state indirectly and quietly. Can something on a federal level be outrightly demolished once put into law?

trinydex
11-05-2008, 4:55 PM
First, it's a fact that Bush is largely (but not totally) responsible for running up the greatest national debt in history.

Second, do you seriously think wars help the economy? Throughout history wars have alway ruined countries. We are no exception. If you look at Rome and its decline, we are actually quite similar. I suggest you watch this, it condenses what normally takes years to learn into a few hours of clearly presented info: http://www.chrismartenson.com/crash-course

holy smokes it gets worse. he's actually talking about running the world on ethanol when he CLEARLY said that biofuels are only good for transportation which is the thin thin slice of the pie that he pointed out? this guy's reasoning abilities just sway and dance around to the biases of his "beliefs." which by the way he's not EVEN doing a good job of separating from his "facts."

he thinks that electricity generation isn't important? give me a flying freakin' break. electricity generation is THE key because you can turn electricity into anything else besides a hard product.

and the ONLY thing that i agree with him about is that we need to conserve petroleum for petroleum products that aren't fuel. those things are irreplaceable, well anything is replaceable but there's a significant energy cost.

F-2_Challenger
11-05-2008, 5:01 PM
Give BO a shot. He might do the country good, or he might be another Jimmy Carter. He may have single handedly inspired the uneducated African America community to get out of the getto and become a more educated and productive group to our society. He may have inspired our deprived youth whom care about nothing but the thug life and street cred. All this negativity is going to do nothing but fester. Lets see what he tries to pass then care. Just don't blanket hate him for things he might do. Hate him for the things he tries to do while POTUS.


And no I didn't vote for him.

RRangel
11-05-2008, 5:34 PM
Give BO a shot. He might do the country good, or he might be another Jimmy Carter. He may have single handedly inspired the uneducated African America community to get out of the getto and become a more educated and productive group to our society. He may have inspired our deprived youth whom care about nothing but the thug life and street cred. All this negativity is going to do nothing but fester. Lets see what he tries to pass then care. Just don't blanket hate him for things he might do. Hate him for the things he tries to do while POTUS.


And no I didn't vote for him.

I read your post and chuckled. If anyone wants to get out of the ghetto they have to be willing to work for it. Obama will not do anything for any of those people. If you don't want negativity directed toward those who would happily remove our precious rights without a second thought, then I suggest you tell those poor underhanded gun banning leftists in this country to knock it off. Good luck with that.

yellowfin
11-05-2008, 5:37 PM
Give BO a shot. He might do the country good, or he might be another Jimmy Carter. Or another Fidel Castro or Vladimir Lenin, which is a lot of people's estimation. At worst case another Mao.

CCWFacts
11-05-2008, 5:54 PM
Or another Fidel Castro or Vladimir Lenin, which is a lot of people's estimation. At worst case another Mao.

NO. The parallel is Robert Mugabe. The parallels are amazing. African socialist ideology, charismatic, "power to the people", redistribute wealth from rich whites to poor blacks, cult of personality.

jamesob
11-05-2008, 5:58 PM
Don't feed the fire and the belief that they will come kicking down your door to take them.

Just be thankful that Heller went our way. i believe when it comes down to it, heller is nothing when the whole government wants guns banned. when the house, senate and the president want them gone and nothing is going to stop them, they will ban them all.

HUTCH 7.62
11-05-2008, 6:00 PM
What the hell is the civillian Army that Obama is planning

yellowfin
11-05-2008, 6:11 PM
What the hell is the civillian Army that Obama is planningThe kind of thing that the armed citizenry is intended to protect against.

HUTCH 7.62
11-05-2008, 6:17 PM
so are we gonna become a police state. when I researched the topic it reminded me of Hitler's third reich.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 7:17 PM
The libs on scotus are going to retire wholesale. The only bright spot is that the constructonists are in good health and the ballance will probably not change in the short run.


There is no where to flee to. All other countries are worse than this one.

Assuming no one retires or dies on SCOTUS in the next couple of years, we have a chance to salvage this thing by taking back enough of the Senate that we can blunt whatever nominations The Obama makes there. We're definitely going to lose a lot of ground on federal benches, though.

As we all saw in the dissent on Heller, the sort of justices that liberals like are intellectually dishonest, and willing to make any argument in order to further their political agenda.

The best we can hope for is to hang on to SCOTUS.

This is truly a disaster.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 7:36 PM
Plenty of congressional dems have GC on their front burners and BHO will not veto their bills. Lots of luck.



Gun control will be the least of his concerns for at least the first year in office. All these otehr fiascos will keep him busy. Biden could try to initiate some gun control legislation though. But I think he's still trying to ban dietary supplements. Once that's accomplished he may move onto topics.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 8:36 PM
Texas and Califirnia are the only two states that can leagley secede.


Hahahaha:rofl2:
I was totally thinking Texas would be the first to secede, but I doubt they will, oh well, looks like I'm going to Argentina if the laws get to thick here

Meplat
11-05-2008, 8:41 PM
Sarah 2012!:D



Obama and Pelosi have greater hot potatoes to deal with than go after 2A rights at this point. The economic situation will drive everything in the next couple of years - and hopefully they will screw it up so much that their dominance will be short lived. Towards next election, no one will touch 2A due to the consequences of the last AWB on those who supported it. So if something happens in regards to 2A, I suspect it would be 2 years down the road, which may be a sweet spot for attempting to reinstate the AWB.

All in all, the republican party deserved this. The GOP and the administration lost its core values and now the American people are punishing them. The republicans should take note, and correct the course if they plan to strengthen their position in Congress and have a shot at winning the executive branch next election.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 9:04 PM
My fave gun shop is anally meticulous on their I's and T's already. I was called to "correct" small ambiguities on a 4473 before their last ATF visit.

It involved a 9 that could have been a seven! This was on a single shot .22 training rifle I bought for my granddaughter! Gawd I'm glad I dropped my FFL.

I asked the same shop to find me a TT33 to replace one that was stolen. They found one and are charging me $500 dollars for it. At first I was annoyed at them charging $500 for a $250 pistol, then I thought about how much BS they go through to provide the service and decided they deserved it.



Because of the lay of the land and differences btwn State and Fed matters, California will continue to improve. Nordyke is coming, and coming our way.

On a Fed basis we prob won't have new bad gun laws - we still have a pro-gun majority it appears - a continuation of the 2006 election theme.

However, Obama can try go nuts on Federal judges and I think Repubs can "Reverse Bork" him and just keep things locked up. I hope Scalia, Roberts, Thomas etc are taking their vitamins and getting plenty of sleep and exercise: we need to keep 'em in place for the next 8 (well, I'd hope 4) years.

Expect continued increasing regulatory hassles of FFLs by BATF under Obama, backed by radical left AG Eric Holder. We don't have as good of a protection from out-of-scope regulation on a Federal basis as we do under California law for CA matters.

FFLs should spend time & money ensuring their books are dotted-i's/ crossed-t's. It may behoove some FFLs to close shop and come up under a new license with a new name on the FFL.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 9:36 PM
The most likely to eliminate BHO before the electoral collage meets is Hillery.



+1 Gun control thankfully has taken a far back seat to the real issues.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 9:38 PM
Maybe, RINOs are a problem.

One other thing. The Dems were not able to obtain a
60 seat majority in the Senate. The GOP can still filibuster.

Meplat
11-05-2008, 9:44 PM
:TFH:Incorrect... What you're saying here could have contributed to the current economic crisis but the national debt was a direct result of irresponsible spending on the war in Iraq. Besides, you can blame congress if you want but half of them were Republican and Bush was still President. If a Republican President can't cooperate with his congress, that's a tell-tale sign of bad leadership...



The government didn't "force" the banks to design sub-prime mortgages. The banks created those types of "predatory" financing options to lure people into their grasp. The banks designed "arms" and "interest only" loans, not the governemnt. The banks did it out of greed and they're paying the price as a result of it. It's no different than what they've been doing with credit cards for yea



Well, we're at war with Iraq and still struggling economically... What does that tell you?



Exactly! Look at the history of the last 8 years. Largest national debt in history. Apparently the philosophy of relieving the super-rich from taxes, so that they can pass the savings on to the middle class, doesn't work. Don't you think it would have by now? :confused:



He'll be fine...

It's impossible to screw this country up any more than George W. Bush already has...
:TFH:

ratrick
11-05-2008, 10:43 PM
I didn't read all the posts in this thread but I didn't see any mention of the Blue Dog Coalition which is a group of approximately 50 democratic members of congress which gained three more members yesterday. Mike Thompson in Congressional District 1 is one of this group with an NRA rating of either "A" or "B+". Just about all of these democrats are strongly pro second amendment. A good group of under the radar supporters to be aware of and support.

trinydex
11-05-2008, 11:08 PM
Texas and Califirnia are the only two states that can leagley secede.

how did we work that one out?

Mulay El Raisuli
11-06-2008, 4:48 AM
man am I having flash backs to 92'. Savings and Loan meltdown, largest government bail out to date (then not now), recession, young political upstart calling for change etc. Clinton gets elected, predictions of gloom, doom, jack booted thugs to take our guns in the night, "panic in the streets", sky falling etc.

we got through a young socialist leaning president then, we can do it again. There is a lot more going for us from strictly gun owner perspective, let a lone many other issues, then there was in 92. (hint, internet and things like cal gun for grass roots activities)

Lets all just take a deep breath and not panic. up hill battle...yes. without hope, no.

If you haven't contributed to your favorite effective pro gun group, now would be the time. they will need the resources come next year and the mid term elections. which will actually be more important then this election, the census and redistricting is on the horizon.


Yes, we did survive. Not w/o pain, but survive we did. It surely ain't gonna be an easy road though.

This may even be a benefit in disguise. Once The People see the reality of what they've done, they'll learn not to do this next time. All that needs be done is educate them.

Another good thing? All those masses of people in the 'poorer parts of town' turned out to vote en mass instead of burning out the nearest Korean shopkeeper. True, they voted stupidly, but stupid is fixable. Now that they've seen that participation in the political process is good, maybe a trend will start?

The Raisuli

LibertyGuy
11-06-2008, 10:14 AM
how did we work that one out?

New Hampshire has the right to secession written into its constitution as well.

Hoop
11-06-2008, 10:35 AM
I didn't read all the posts in this thread but I didn't see any mention of the Blue Dog Coalition which is a group of approximately 50 democratic members of congress which gained three more members yesterday. Mike Thompson in Congressional District 1 is one of this group with an NRA rating of either "A" or "B+". Just about all of these democrats are strongly pro second amendment. A good group of under the radar supporters to be aware of and support.

I'm not too familiar with them, but I do know a number of the Senate races went from an (R) with an "A" rating from the NRA to a (D) with an "F" rating respectively.

Right now the focus is the Economy, but with a stacked house in _____'s favor I'm worried.

Cary Ford
11-07-2008, 7:46 AM
Those who keep throwing around the word "socialist" might want to actually look it up in the dictionary first.... Based on very recent events which saw government assume control of private financial institutions, George W. Bush more accurately fits the description of "socialist" than Barrack Obama.

I don't want anybody taking my guns away, either, but this misuse of the language to label someone with the derrogatory code word of the moment out of what seems like true emotional immaturity coupled with genuine fear of the unknown doesn't bode well for those of us (2A supporters and defenders) who need it to actually defend our Constitutional rights.

motorhead
11-07-2008, 7:52 AM
load up, circle the wagons and see what develops.
i think so. cal. should seceed from the north. with our conservative voter base here we could form a libertarian utopia.:D

Cary Ford
11-07-2008, 7:53 AM
I'll also add that those who found it so crucial to put it to a vote to open up the sacred scrolls of the state in order to exclude people from enjoying the same rights that every other legal citizen of this state enjoys (the right to marry and to have that marriage recognized as a legal union by the state) just because they happen to like someone with the same plumbing... only made it much much easier for those who want to take our guns away.

Grakken
11-07-2008, 8:54 AM
Give BO a shot. He might do the country good, or he might be another Jimmy Carter. He may have single handedly inspired the uneducated African America community to get out of the getto and become a more educated and productive group to our society. He may have inspired our deprived youth whom care about nothing but the thug life and street cred. All this negativity is going to do nothing but fester. Lets see what he tries to pass then care. Just don't blanket hate him for things he might do. Hate him for the things he tries to do while POTUS.


And no I didn't vote for him.

Wow. By than it will be too late. Yeah, being reactive is the ticket. Forget about being proactive. I dont care if he fixes the economy, i dont care about any of the other crap (Well I do care about Iraq and afgan but he wont do any better there). eventually the markets will fix themselves, but if a new AWB is passed, it will be permanent. Their infringements onto the Bill of rights will be permanent. Did i mention permanent?

Grakken
11-07-2008, 8:55 AM
Sarah 2012!:D

Sarah Palin is unelectable and was a drag for mccain rather than a boost. Not that Mccain wasnt a drag upon himself.

Grakken
11-07-2008, 8:57 AM
I didn't read all the posts in this thread but I didn't see any mention of the Blue Dog Coalition which is a group of approximately 50 democratic members of congress which gained three more members yesterday. Mike Thompson in Congressional District 1 is one of this group with an NRA rating of either "A" or "B+". Just about all of these democrats are strongly pro second amendment. A good group of under the radar supporters to be aware of and support.

Though i dont know much about them, id like too. is there a link to a "blue dog site"?

I still think that when Pelosi (damn she looks like a witch), fineswines, boxlickers reids, merthas of the world pressure them, they will fold like wet napkins. I hope i am wrong.

Grakken
11-07-2008, 9:00 AM
I'll also add that those who found it so crucial to put it to a vote to open up the sacred scrolls of the state in order to exclude people from enjoying the same rights that every other legal citizen of this state enjoys (the right to marry and to have that marriage recognized as a legal union by the state) just because they happen to like someone with the same plumbing... only made it much much easier for those who want to take our guns away.

??? WTF

Can you explain this better please?

Cary Ford
11-07-2008, 9:16 AM
??? WTF

Can you explain this better please?


Prop 8 proposed an ammendment to exclude citizens from rights guaranteed to other citizens under the Constitution.

Or, the easier you make it to ammend the law, the easier you make it to ammend the law....

X-NewYawker
11-07-2008, 10:27 AM
I'll also add that those who found it so crucial to put it to a vote to open up the sacred scrolls of the state in order to exclude people from enjoying the same rights that every other legal citizen of this state enjoys (the right to marry and to have that marriage recognized as a legal union by the state) just because they happen to like someone with the same plumbing... only made it much much easier for those who want to take our guns away.

Really? The people who voted for O (blacks and hispanics) also voted for PRop 8. The only reason it was on the ballot is that when the voters of CA approved this measure two years back, four liberal judges threw it out. I'm not going to debate gay marriage, but there is NOT a right to marry in the constitution. You can't marry your sister if you love her. Marriage is always State-approved.
Gay people in California have the right to enter Civil cotracts to guarantee inheritance, patient's family's rights, etc. most of my gay friends have gone this route
The State approves marraige because it gives you TAX benefits for it.
It's like there's no RIGHT to drive, it is a privilege controlled by the state, that's why you need a LICENSE for both.

I love when people INVENT rights that aren't in the constitution, and the say that one that IS (RKBA ) Isn't.

I know you're a young poster (plant?) So I'll explain: This prez election was about: fear about the economy, and making history.

Now we have to stop any egregious harm.

csmintel
11-07-2008, 10:44 AM
load up, circle the wagons and see what develops.
i think so. cal. should seceed from the north. with our conservative voter base here we could form a libertarian utopia.:D

hey, some of us in northern calistan want in on this with you guys!

trinydex
11-07-2008, 11:16 AM
load up, circle the wagons and see what develops.
i think so. cal. should seceed from the north. with our conservative voter base here we could form a libertarian utopia.:D

did you somehow forget about beverly hills and hollywood?

ratrick
11-07-2008, 4:00 PM
Though i dont know much about them, id like too. is there a link to a "blue dog site"?

I still think that when Pelosi (damn she looks like a witch), fineswines, boxlickers reids, merthas of the world pressure them, they will fold like wet napkins. I hope i am wrong.

Yes, just type blue dog coalition on the search line and lots of items come up including some general naratives, their website and a wikipedia description.
They don't have a pro-gun platform persay which actually is a good thing so you need to work with each individual member to express your concerns as a patriotic american concerning the second amendment. But as wikipedia stses most are strong gun rights advocates.

Cary Ford
11-07-2008, 4:42 PM
Really? The people who voted for O (blacks and hispanics) also voted for PRop 8. The only reason it was on the ballot is that when the voters of CA approved this measure two years back, four liberal judges threw it out. I'm not going to debate gay marriage, but there is NOT a right to marry in the constitution. You can't marry your sister if you love her. Marriage is always State-approved.
Gay people in California have the right to enter Civil cotracts to guarantee inheritance, patient's family's rights, etc. most of my gay friends have gone this route
The State approves marraige because it gives you TAX benefits for it.
It's like there's no RIGHT to drive, it is a privilege controlled by the state, that's why you need a LICENSE for both.

I love when people INVENT rights that aren't in the constitution, and the say that one that IS (RKBA ) Isn't.

I know you're a young poster (plant?) So I'll explain: This prez election was about: fear about the economy, and making history.

Now we have to stop any egregious harm.

"Proposition 8 is a California State ballot proposition that would amend the state Constitution to restrict the definition of marriage to a union between a man and a woman."

From Wikipedia. Emphasis mine.

Sorry, but it is about amending Constitutional (States) rights.

"Plant?" Yeah, like Obama's a "socialist."