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View Full Version : canada safe place to live?


sanddragon2004
10-29-2008, 12:09 PM
so they dont allow guns in CA.

does that make it safer?


no crime?

Booshanky
10-29-2008, 12:28 PM
Canada is relatively safe.

Comparing violent crime statistics between the US and Canada.


In 2004 there were 1,367,009 reported instances of violent crime in the US VS 300,000 in Canada. Although they also have a smaller population.

eltee
10-29-2008, 12:34 PM
They DO allow guns in Canada. I am married to a Canuk and we go there at least yearly. Everywhere I go I look in a phone book to find gunstores, and then I try to visit them. In essence, parts of Canada are less restrictive than all of California re. what you can buy. On one of my early visits to an Ontario Province gunstore, I saw Mini 14's, AR 15's, etc. They even sell a civilian version of the H&K G36, much cooler than the US SL-8, which you can't even get in Calif. w/o a mag lock of some sort.

However, there is more paperwork and local scrutiny by the police. I don't think there is even a CCW permit process on the books. I met with cops on cop business several times and we talked shop. Some of the plainclothes guys, inc. guys on the gang investigative units, don't carry guns BY CHOICE. The cops also do not pack off duty.

Mags are ALL ten rounders or less.

Canada has a long history of hunting, so traditional guns abound. Not alot of shooting ranges, but lots of open land for hunting and plinking.

Anyway, IMHO based on observation and discussions with locals and LEO's, Id say the variety of firearms available over the counter may be even better than in California, the recent bullet-button phenomenon notwithstanding. I'd also say that the red tape is longer and there is no possibility (practically speaking) for CCW. My opinions are based on my experiences with Ontario, but I doubt that the other provinces are much different.

elSquid
10-29-2008, 12:40 PM
so they dont allow guns in CA.

does that make it safer?

no crime?

You can buy guns in Canada. If you do a side-by-side comparison, in some ways the laws are better in California and in others better in Canada.

Three of my favorite pro-Canada examples:

- short barrelled pump shotguns are an over-the-counter purchase, no different than any other hunting longarm.

http://www.canadaammo.com/product.php?productid=11&cat=0&page=1

- if you have a "restricted" rifle ( same 'class' as a handgun ) like an AR clone you can slap any short barrelled upper on it and no one cares.

- you can buy guns legally by mail from anybody ( private or dealer )

In other ways Canada is worse than Cali. Most notably around issues like self defense.

-- Michael

elSquid
10-29-2008, 12:47 PM
They DO allow guns in Canada. I am married to a Canuk and we go there at least yearly. Everywhere I go I look in a phone book to find gunstores, and then I try to visit them. In essence, parts of Canada are less restrictive than all of California re. what you can buy. On one of my early visits to an Ontario Province gunstore, I saw Mini 14's, AR 15's, etc. They even sell a civilian version of the H&K G36, much cooler than the US SL-8, which you can't even get in Calif. w/o a mag lock of some sort.


True about EBRs.

However, there is more paperwork and local scrutiny by the police. I don't think there is even a CCW permit process on the books.


There is a national CCW system. For non-LEOs you have to have a cast-iron reason. Or be politically connected.

Anyway, IMHO based on observation and discussions with locals and LEO's, Id say the variety of firearms available over the counter may be even better than in California, the recent bullet-button phenomenon notwithstanding. I'd also say that the red tape is longer and there is no possibility (practically speaking) for CCW. My opinions are based on my experiences with Ontario, but I doubt that the other provinces are much different.

They aren't different - gun laws are set at the national level.

-- Michael

Alaric
10-29-2008, 12:57 PM
True, however, interpretation and enforcement of those laws vary from province to province.
http://www.panda.com/canadaguns/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Canada

elSquid
10-29-2008, 1:07 PM
True, however, interpretation and enforcement of those laws vary from province to province.
http://www.panda.com/canadaguns/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Canada

From my personal experience, the biggest difference is in things like Authorization to Transport ( ATTs ) restrictions, but I don't know if that qualifies as a big thing.

And I can't speak for Quebec. I've never lived there, so who knows what the "distinct society (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distinct_society)" does. :rolleyes:

-- Michael

nick
10-29-2008, 1:07 PM
Canada is relatively safe.

Comparing violent crime statistics between the US and Canada.


In 2004 there were 1,367,009 reported instances of violent crime in the US VS 300,000 in Canada. Although they also have a smaller population.

With the population being over 300 mln and 33 mln respectively. Doesn't sound that safe looking at these stats.

From my experience, rural Canada is safe. Big cities though... Let me put it this way. The wave of immigration from Asia, especially China, took them by surprise from which they haven't recovered yet.

sanddragon2004
10-29-2008, 1:11 PM
just got a message from my mom this morning,

my uncle was stabbed outside his apartment in leftbridge alberta. jumped by 3 guys. lost a kidney. in the hospital right now.

sanddragon2004
10-29-2008, 1:12 PM
he heard something outside went to check it out and was jumped.

nagorb
10-29-2008, 1:17 PM
you have to look at per capita, and when tougher laws are implemented does crime decrease.

nagorb
10-29-2008, 1:18 PM
hope he recovers and they catch the guys.

Alaric
10-29-2008, 1:37 PM
Bear in mind, this is a country that also requires you to carry a gun (more specifically a big game rifle) when traveling in certain areas - like polar bear country.

Who says you can never learn anything from Survivorman. :)

xrMike
10-29-2008, 1:55 PM
Canada is relatively safe.

Comparing violent crime statistics between the US and Canada.


In 2004 there were 1,367,009 reported instances of violent crime in the US VS 300,000 in Canada. Although they also have a smaller population.

Comparing the total numbers of violent crime in both countries doesn't give you the real picture though. If your numbers are correct, and given a US population of 300 million, and a Canadian population of 33 million, let's see...

That means the RATE of violent crimes in both countries is:

USA: .46%

Canada: .91%

So you're nearly TWICE as likely to experience violent crime in Canada than here. (granted, using 2004 crime numbers with 2008 population numbers is not totally accurate, but close enough probably)

That's interesting. And what's funny is, I've seen more than one Canadian say online how violent they think THIS country is...

5hundo
10-29-2008, 2:16 PM
Bear in mind, this is a country that also requires you to carry a gun (more specifically a big game rifle) when traveling in certain areas - like polar bear country.

Who says you can never learn anything from Survivorman. :)

Same with Alaska...

You ALWAYS take a rifle with you...

sanddragon2004
10-29-2008, 2:37 PM
all i can say is, if he had a shotgun, or piston in hand he might still have a kidney today. and not be in the socialist hospital right now.

a1fabweld
10-29-2008, 3:44 PM
I recently visited London, Ontario for my uncles funeral. All my dad's side of the family is there. I have never seen so many gorgeous women in one town as I did there. I know it's kind of off the subject.:) The streets are clean, people friendly, & seemed like a great place to live in general. Those are the good things I can comment about. I have never studied Canadian politics so it may be a real sh1thole from that standpoint, but I would feel comfortable living there knowing what I know. My family imigrated there 50 years ago & they all are living above average or wealthy now. If Obamination gets elected, I may head north!

lawrence29
10-29-2008, 4:12 PM
Vancover is relatively safe, last visit to North Van. had a police block on road for 3 hrs because some B. Bear and cubs were hanging around the road! i only have a 4" knife in my car!

X-NewYawker
10-29-2008, 4:21 PM
just got a message from my mom this morning,

my uncle was stabbed outside his apartment in leftbridge alberta. jumped by 3 guys. lost a kidney. in the hospital right now.

I'm sorry he's in the hospital up there! i had two friends die up there from crappy hospital care in the last three years. I personally waited -- alone -- ten hours in an emergency room with a shattered kneecap and eventually a nurse came out and told me the doctor on that shift got tired and went home. She told me I should come back the next day and hope to be seen (preview of Obamacare)

I went to a private doctor's office and with two hours had been x-rayed, read, diagnosed and put into a physical therapy group. Anyone with the money opts out of the national system, or drives down to Seattle.

On the gun scene (FYI I spent about 3 1/2 years of the last six living in Canada) I assumed it would be impossible to get a gun but three guys did a favor for me and I promised I would buy each one of them an assault rifle.

I went into the only gunstore I could find in Vancouver to discover Chinese M1-As, ARs, etc. They three guys applied for their licenses, waited the couple of months and then each one could cash in a gift certificate for a grand each towards a gun. One opted for a handgun to keep in his car (there are a LOT of drug addicts in Vancouver) one a shotgun and the other an AR.

thedrickel
10-29-2008, 4:27 PM
One thing that surprised me is the AR mags I saw were limited to 5 rounds with a little pop rivet.

sargenv
10-29-2008, 4:35 PM
I went to BC, CAN for the Canadian IPSC Nationals last year. I called up Canadian Firearms 6 months in advance and had all the permits I needed about 6 weeks later. When I crossed the border (Peace Portal, Blaine WA) I wanted to check in first with US customs to check my revolver out of the country and had more trouble leaving the US with it than I had going into Canada. US Customs wanted to see the gun, check the serial #, do all the stuff you do when leaving the country with something of value. We got to the Canadian Border, declared I had a firearm, they had us park, I went in, they didn't even want to see the gun. Handled all the paperwork, I paid my $50CAN and I was on my way.

When we returned to the US, they asked about firearms, I declared it, and they had me go inside to check in. Took about 20 mins. Lucky me it was the same guy who checked me out of the country the week before. He was happy I did well and then he sent us on our way.

I know that once you have your license that you need not go through a dealer for a ppt. You are both usully licensed and people can send firearms to each other license to license via Canadian Post. It'd be nice to be able to do that here. :D

They do have the 10 round limit for handguns.. and I believe 5 round mags for rifles, so that would suck.

elSquid
10-29-2008, 4:43 PM
I went into the only gunstore I could find in Vancouver to discover Chinese M1-As, ARs, etc.

Sounds like Lever Arms. Over the years I bought a lot of handguns and rifles from them.

http://www.leverarms.com/

One opted for a handgun to keep in his car (there are a LOT of drug addicts in Vancouver) one a shotgun and the other an AR.

The guy keeping the handgun in the car was breaking several laws.

-- Michael

lakai
10-30-2008, 12:33 AM
Vancouver is a very safe place. There are only a handful of gunstores left there. Over the years many of them have been shutdown because of illegal arms dealing. Canadian firearms laws = California Laws X 2 meaning the hassles to own a firearm are twice as annoying as they are here in california.

nick
10-30-2008, 12:36 AM
Last I heard, Vancouver had its own gang wars, Indians vs. Chinese vs. Pakistanis.

Ford8N
10-30-2008, 5:27 AM
http://www.marstar.ca/gf-SSD/SSD-BD-MP38.shtm

Lucky Canadians :43:

Max-the-Silent
10-30-2008, 6:40 AM
Canada gun laws used to be much more resonable than Fed. law way back when.

In Canada, there was none of that "Once an MG always a MG" nonsense and you could purchase semi versions of just about any MG ever made.

After they changed their law to a more Ca. - like scheme, the firearms business evolved much the same that we have in Ca. - Off list rifles with barrels (over 18") that beat the AW regs.