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View Full Version : Interesting discussion I was having with a friend...


SP1200
09-30-2008, 2:30 PM
So I'm back and forth between my home on Reno and my family in the bay area...me and my uncle were talking about how we just like the art and looks of rifles with evil features..and we were talking about building replicas, then realized most replicas are almost the real thing except with some parts missing..then came our question.

Say someone in CA wants to build a display of rifles above the fire place...Could that person simply take an Off list AK WASR clone, remove the bolt making the rifle non-operational, put the he hi cap mag in, and hang it in pride?

Of course the bolt is not at the residence or anyware near the display?

I know your thinking why not just toss on a Radd Lock and 10-30 mag and call it legal...but assume this guy has a lot of disassembled AK's and wants to semi assemble them to display them, with out having any cash at this time to buy the mags and mag locks... Then as time passes, and he has some extra cash the could assemble the replica rifle to a legal configured rifle...

MrNiceGuy
09-30-2008, 2:53 PM
I'm "guessing" you have to do more than just taking out the guts.

I think you have to weld a steel bar into the receiver to permanantely make sure no bolt nor firing mechanism can ever go into the receiver ever again.

And/Or

perm plug the barrel

At least that's what I see from Shotgun news.
You know the one, where the guy always show you how to build a non-firing display gun out of a parts kit.

SP1200
09-30-2008, 3:12 PM
Wow that's weird... I remember hearing at a gunshow that if a kit was partly assembled but not fully assembled in to an "actionable firearm" that it is simply "gun parts" and not a "firearm"
Of course this was me listening in to someone else's conversation... perhaps the assembly of the receiver parts makes it a firearm? But how can it be so if it is not "actionable?"

cntrolsguy
09-30-2008, 3:18 PM
Wow that's weird... I remember hearing at a gunshow that if a kit was partly assembled but not fully assembled in to an "actionable firearm" that it is simply "gun parts" and not a "firearm"
Of course this was me listening in to someone else's conversation... perhaps the assembly of the receiver parts makes it a firearm? But how can it be so if it is not "actionable?"


You are correct for the most part except for the registered receiver. The receiver is always considered a gun regardless of wether it is built up or not. Please anybody correct me if I am wrong.

aplinker
09-30-2008, 3:28 PM
there's a court case where a (bad criminal) guy got popped for having an AW, even though the BCG was removed.

That's the precedence we have for whether some small disassembly changes it from an AW. I think the fact he was a real criminal, with a horrible lawyer, means this wouldn't hold up.

I think making it into a bolt-action repeater (removing the piston) would be acceptable.

SP1200
09-30-2008, 3:28 PM
ahh but an 80% AK receiver (receiver with out the rails) can be ordered with out registration so I assume it is not considered a firearm..

megavolt121
09-30-2008, 3:33 PM
Say someone in CA wants to build a display of rifles above the fire place...Could that person simply take an Off list AK WASR clone, remove the bolt making the rifle non-operational, put the he hi cap mag in, and hang it in pride?


No, you cannot do this. Legally speaking, your receiver is the actual firearm itself and sticking a magazine that is 10+ rounds into it while including the evil features would constitute an AW. It doesn't matter if the bolt is gone, the barrel is plugged, etc... as long as the receiver is in one piece this is a no bueno.

You are correct for the most part except for the registered receiver. The receiver is always considered a gun regardless of wether it is built up or not. Please anybody correct me if I am wrong.

You are correct CNTROLSGUY. This is why all the AK kits you see have a receiver that is cut into multiple pieces. IIRC, the ATF considers a firearm (a receiver in this case) a demilled kit if it is drastically cut/altered so it can never become a firearm again.

Hopi
09-30-2008, 3:47 PM
I think making it into a bolt-action repeater (removing the piston) would be acceptable.

+1
Make it a manual bolt action and you're good to go with the "authentic appearance"...

M. Sage
09-30-2008, 3:49 PM
I think making it into a bolt-action repeater (removing the piston) would be acceptable.

And plug the gas tube. :D

SP1200
09-30-2008, 3:52 PM
Ok. I see.

So in case of an AK clones, any receiver with rails, should be considered 100% and that is a firearm. And with AR clones any receiver is considered a firearm.

Now what about an AK kit assembled on a bent receiver flat, with no rails, and no bolt? (I think they sportsman's guide actually sells replica receivers in this configuration)
Could someone do this that has a Krink kit, and thus because it is not a firearm be ok with the short barrel?

Or would any krink kits in CA have to remain in peaces?

SP1200
09-30-2008, 3:56 PM
And plug the gas tube. :D

wow thats an interesting idea. so you can remove the gas piston and that simply converts the AK to bolt action? Can you keep the hi cap mag with detachable ability??

aplinker
09-30-2008, 4:01 PM
No, you cannot do this. Legally speaking, your receiver is the actual firearm itself and sticking a magazine that is 10+ rounds into it while including the evil features would constitute an AW. It doesn't matter if the bolt is gone, the barrel is plugged, etc... as long as the receiver is in one piece this is a no bueno.


What does a 10rd mag have to do with making an AW?

It's about the function of the rifle (semi-automatic with detachable mags and features) that constitutes an AW.

Magazine capacity has nothing to do with it.

You could use a full kit and a demilled receiver (hacked up) fitted back together.

Hopi
09-30-2008, 4:01 PM
wow thats an interesting idea. so you can remove the gas piston and that simply converts the AK to bolt action? Can you keep the hi cap mag with detachable ability??

Yes. A bolt action AK is not controlled by AW laws.

megavolt121
09-30-2008, 6:53 PM
What does a 10rd mag have to do with making an AW?

It's about the function of the rifle (semi-automatic with detachable mags and features) that constitutes an AW.

Magazine capacity has nothing to do with it.

You could use a full kit and a demilled receiver (hacked up) fitted back together.

You can't have a rifle with features and a 10+ round magazine. As I stated in my original post, "including the evil features" as it seems like the OP would like to have a normal looking AK hanging on his wall.