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Varg Vikernes
08-09-2016, 6:11 PM
Bought one of these:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Item/574433328

Trying to source a barrel in stock.

These guys have them, but havn't been in stock in a couple of weeks.

http://www.efkfiredragon.com/sig-sauer-p225-9mm2.html

Been meaning to call the guys, but anyone know where I can get one? Been prowling Ebay and GB for 2 weeks or so.

Maybe I could buy a 228 or 226 barrel and get it machined or something?

bblr
08-09-2016, 8:31 PM
I don't know about the barrel, but I emailed Robertsons several times about buying one of those trainers and they wouldn't sell to me. How long ago did you buy? Maybe they changed their minds as it seems they are not selling very fast.

sigfan91
08-09-2016, 9:45 PM
Just out of curiosity, I put my P228 barrel in a P6 slide. It fits! I then tried to re-assemble the slide onto the frame. Something seems to be not quite right as I cannot rack the slide back. The P228 barrel is a bit snug in the P6 slide.

OP, machining is probably not necessary if you use a P228 barrel. But fitting is definitely needed. I am not a gunsmith so I take no responsibility should something goes wrong with this route :p

bblr
08-10-2016, 1:03 PM
Just out of curiosity, I put my P228 barrel in a P6 slide. It fits! I then tried to re-assemble the slide onto the frame. Something seems to be not quite right as I cannot rack the slide back. The P228 barrel is a bit snug in the P6 slide.

OP, machining is probably not necessary if you use a P228 barrel. But fitting is definitely needed. I am not a gunsmith so I take no responsibility should something goes wrong with this route :p

I tried this a while back and couldn't get it to work either. The barrels are not the same on the bottom part where it fits in the locking insert.

Here's some pics to illustrate the difference. P228 barrel in the foreground, P225 barrel in the background:

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/IMG_2658a.jpg
http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/IMG_2657a.jpg

sigfan91
08-10-2016, 3:01 PM
Is restoring a de-milled P6 worth the money? $200 for the complete frame and stripped slide; $15 to ship; $100 for transfer. One would need a barrel ($185), breech block ($100), and all the associated small parts in the breech block to make this a functioning gun.

I Swan
08-10-2016, 3:08 PM
I will periodically clear out old gun junk and stuff, sell it on eBay or Gunbroker when I have the time and patience. I truly hate dealing with eBay. Anyways with patience the barrel will probably show up there. There is people that somehow get the parts from confiscated police guns.

Some departments don't allow the entire guns to be sold but seem they let the parts minus frame be sold. I once had a lot of spare Chinese Tokarev parts. One buyer contacted me and when all is said and done he will have spent like $350-400 total building up a 9mm Norinco Tokarev from a frame he acquired somehow.

Some parts for then like certain mags and the 9mm barrel are kind of expensive. I don't understand why he wanted to do it but it was his choice and his money. I've learned to be careful doing such projects. I once had $200 total in to a Carcano after I restored it. Only reason I did so is it had some rarer than normal markings.

bblr
08-10-2016, 4:22 PM
Is restoring a de-milled P6 worth the money? $200 for the complete frame and stripped slide; $15 to ship; $100 for transfer. One would need a barrel ($185), breech block ($100), and all the associated small parts in the breech block to make this a functioning gun.

For most people, probably not. I love the P225 (I already have 2). I happen to have all the parts, minus the frame, sitting around the house.

When I saw these for sale several months ago, I figured I'd buy one and use my existing parts to make a functioning P6. I was surprised the seller on GB was unwilling to sell one to me here in CA. I think they thought these would be hot sellers, and decided not to deal with the CA laws. I followed them on GB, and they don't seem to be selling at all. I may contact them again and see if they've changed their mind.

Varg Vikernes
08-10-2016, 5:20 PM
I don't know about the barrel, but I emailed Robertsons several times about buying one of those trainers and they wouldn't sell to me. How long ago did you buy? Maybe they changed their minds as it seems they are not selling very fast.

I asked if they shipped to CA, and they did and have. They gun should be at my FFL today.

The listing even says:

We’re offering the Federal German Police P6 Trainer in the photos, or one of its virtually identical mates of equal or better grade, each for only $ 199.00. Not transferable to civilian residents of Massachusetts. CA DOJ Roster Approved Status expires 1/1/2017.

.

jrara
08-10-2016, 5:48 PM
OP,

I got spare breech blocks if you are interested.

bblr
08-10-2016, 6:55 PM
I asked if they shipped to CA, and they did and have. They gun should be at my FFL today.

The listing even says:

I saw that in the ad and asked about it as I knew the P6 was on roster. The guy still told me no. This was back in May.

mtenenhaus
08-10-2016, 7:29 PM
you might want to give Bruce Gray a call (grayguns.com). just a thought

Dimitri A.
08-10-2016, 9:34 PM
I recall reading on the sig forum that a 226 barrel will work, obviously it would need to be cut and recrowned, so maybe that's an option for you, so maybe you can look into that. Have you also looked into barrel from the new 225 A1? I know the 225 A1 isn't exactly the same (different magazines I believe), but maybe the barrels are the same. If that is the case, you can probably buy one directly from sig.

sigfan91
08-10-2016, 9:53 PM
I recall reading on the sig forum that a 226 barrel will work, obviously it would need to be cut and recrowned, so maybe that's an option for you, so maybe you can look into that. Have you also looked into barrel from the new 225 A1? I know the 225 A1 isn't exactly the same (different magazines I believe), but maybe the barrels are the same. If that is the case, you can probably buy one directly from sig.

I can say definitively that a P226 barrel will not work without machining. The locking lug is longer than P228, so it won't even fit.

bblr
08-11-2016, 2:23 AM
Have you also looked into barrel from the new 225 A1? I know the 225 A1 isn't exactly the same (different magazines I believe), but maybe the barrels are the same.

The P225-A1 uses a P239 barrel, which is 3.6" long. The P225/P6 has a 3.9" barrel.

SanDiegoMan
08-11-2016, 3:04 AM
From the listing "because we are neither competent nor gunsmiths" :p

sigfan91
08-11-2016, 11:06 AM
The P225-A1 uses a P239 barrel, which is 3.6" long. The P225/P6 has a 3.9" barrel.

Really? Does that mean the new P225-A1 is more like a reshaped P239 rather than an updated P225?

Is the frame shorter? Is the slide shorter? It'll be interesting to see them side by side.

sigfan91
08-11-2016, 11:07 AM
From the listing "because we are neither competent nor gunsmiths" :p

I saw that. I like self deprecating humor.:)

dekul34
08-11-2016, 11:44 AM
looks like they have simunition trainer versions for $140 more, considering the replacement breech block for this one is $100 alone that's not a bad deal, a functional product rather than a solid barrel and breech block you'll throw away.

sigfan91
08-12-2016, 11:17 AM
looks like they have simunition trainer versions for $140 more, considering the replacement breech block for this one is $100 alone that's not a bad deal, a functional product rather than a solid barrel and breech block you'll throw away.

Where did you see that?

dekul34
08-12-2016, 11:55 AM
Where did you see that?

Another listing from same seller on gunbroker... they have more of the simunition conversions in stock than the demilled training guns.

edit: I guess HAD may be the better word, they had over 20 in stock when i looked yesterday but now the listing is gone...

bblr
08-12-2016, 12:14 PM
Really? Does that mean the new P225-A1 is more like a reshaped P239 rather than an updated P225?

Yes, it's basically a P239. Here's the P239 parts I know of that are used in the P225-A1: barrel, trigger, hammer, decocker, slide catch, magazine (except baseplate), trigger bar. It most likely uses all the internal parts, but I can't confirm it.

dekul34
08-12-2016, 12:19 PM
Yes, it's basically a P239. Here's the P239 parts I know of that are used in the P225-A1: barrel, trigger, hammer, decocker, slide catch, magazine (except baseplate), trigger bar. It most likely uses all the internal parts, but I can't confirm it.

Ah, so it's like the M11-A1 which is built on new P229 parts instead of retooling the old P228 design...

Shrubmaster
08-12-2016, 1:49 PM
looks like they have simunition trainer versions for $140 more, considering the replacement breech block for this one is $100 alone that's not a bad deal, a functional product rather than a solid barrel and breech block you'll throw away.

Thinking you're right, the firing pin channel is filled on some of these trainers.

Varg Vikernes
08-12-2016, 2:54 PM
The P6 trainer I got was one that was the breach cut 45 degree and no firing pin or extractor. Everything else seemed right. Barrel was plugged and holes drilled in.

Shrubmaster
08-12-2016, 6:38 PM
The P6 trainer I got was one that was the breach cut 45 degree and no firing pin or extractor. Everything else seemed right. Barrel was plugged and holes drilled in.

What about the area where the hammer hits the firing pin?

Varg Vikernes
08-12-2016, 6:59 PM
What about the area where the hammer hits the firing pin?

The breach block was empty(at least didn't have a firing pin). Didn't check to see if it was brazed like another guy had though.

edit: holy crap didn't realize extractors were so hard to find too.

Shrubmaster
08-12-2016, 7:01 PM
Imo, that's still a wicked good buy. I'll be getting one. I don't care how long the parts take to source (that's half the fun!), I have other toys I can play with in the mean time.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

Varg Vikernes
08-12-2016, 7:18 PM
I thought I read wrong when I saw an extractor on Ebay for $100+

Varg Vikernes
08-12-2016, 8:47 PM
Imo, that's still a wicked good buy. I'll be getting one. I don't care how long the parts take to source (that's half the fun!), I have other toys I can play with in the mean time.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

A member tipped me off on a source on extractors:

http://totalautomation.us/sigcorner.htm

Not a bad price really. Also you can send him a P226 barrel to convert.

sigfan91
08-12-2016, 11:31 PM
Yes, it's basically a P239. Here's the P239 parts I know of that are used in the P225-A1: barrel, trigger, hammer, decocker, slide catch, magazine (except baseplate), trigger bar. It most likely uses all the internal parts, but I can't confirm it.

Wow, I went to Sig website and took a closer look at the new P225-A1. It looks like a P239 now that I know what I am looking for.

Kinda disappointing. It's a cheap knockoff of a classic Sig. And one model even dared to use the word "classic" in its name. I'll take a P225 over the new P225-A1 any day. I'll take a P6 over the P225-A1.

Varg Vikernes
08-13-2016, 6:54 PM
Anyone know what modern 226 parts will fit in a P6? Looking at the firing pin specifically.

sigfan91
08-14-2016, 12:58 AM
Another listing from same seller on gunbroker... they have more of the simunition conversions in stock than the demilled training guns.

edit: I guess HAD may be the better word, they had over 20 in stock when i looked yesterday but now the listing is gone...

I found the expired listing.

The one difficulty I see is the need for an original slide catch. I can't find it anywhere.

The simunition trainer has intact firing pin, but need slide catch. The demilled trainer has a slide catch, but no firing pin. That's just not cool...:(

sigfan91
08-15-2016, 2:50 PM
I was just looking at the $159 demilled version. This one has a cut on the right frame rail behind the trigger. I wonder how much this affects the integrity of the frame. The slide would still work. There's nothing on the slide or inside the frame that would be impeded by this cut.

We should get someone to restore one and try it. :D

bblr
08-15-2016, 5:09 PM
Anyone know what modern 226 parts will fit in a P6? Looking at the firing pin specifically.

New P226's have a stainless steel slide. P6's have a folded steel carbon slide. The firing pins for the two are different. Here's a pic that's been floating around the internet for years.

#1 is for the stainless slide on the P226, P229, and P239

#2 and #3 are both for the P228, older P226, and P225 carbon slides

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/firing%20pins.jpg

As to your first question, many of the frame parts are interchangeable among many SIG models: sear, safety lever, hammer, mainspring, mainspring seat, sear spring, decocker, decocker bearing, take-down-lever, mag catch, etc...


A member tipped me off on a source on extractors:

http://totalautomation.us/sigcorner.htm

Not a bad price really. Also you can send him a P226 barrel to convert.

I bought some of his extractors last year. They were shipped fast and functioned perfectly.

bblr
08-15-2016, 5:29 PM
I found the expired listing.

The one difficulty I see is the need for an original slide catch. I can't find it anywhere.

The simunition trainer has intact firing pin, but need slide catch. The demilled trainer has a slide catch, but no firing pin. That's just not cool...:(

I bought a slide catch at Numrich last year. It's part #18 and shows available.

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufacturers/SigSauerSigarms-33490/AutoPistols-41939/P225-35185.htm?page=2

sigfan91
08-15-2016, 5:35 PM
I bought a slide catch at Numrich last year. It's part #18 and shows available.

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufacturers/SigSauerSigarms-33490/AutoPistols-41939/P225-35185.htm?page=2

Cool thanks! I thought I checked Numerich's already.

Holy crap a locking insert sells for $180?

Varg Vikernes
08-15-2016, 5:35 PM
I was just looking at the $159 demilled version. This one has a cut on the right frame rail behind the trigger. I wonder how much this affects the integrity of the frame. The slide would still work. There's nothing on the slide or inside the frame that would be impeded by this cut.

We should get someone to restore one and try it. :D

$40 more and you don't need to take a gamble though. Kinda hard to fix an aluminum frame. If it was steel you could always weld it.

Varg Vikernes
08-16-2016, 7:18 PM
http://www.gunbroker.com/item/577954829

Those Simunition P6s area back.

Barang
08-16-2016, 8:54 PM
https://www.gunsamerica.com/904117554/Sig-Sauer-9mm-model-P6-P225-West-German-Police-Trainer-Pistol-1979-Demilled-Barrel-Beveled-Breech-Block-9-Shot-1-Magazine-2-Tone-White-Mill.htm

They are also on GunsAmerica.

sigfan91
08-17-2016, 11:02 AM
https://www.gunsamerica.com/904117554/Sig-Sauer-9mm-model-P6-P225-West-German-Police-Trainer-Pistol-1979-Demilled-Barrel-Beveled-Breech-Block-9-Shot-1-Magazine-2-Tone-White-Mill.htm

They are also on GunsAmerica.

I noticed these guys are the most intact out of the batch, but the price reflects it. Also the magazine has a different follower, made for simunition. Where as the non-firing ones have original magazines. That could also be a factor in pricing.

When it's all said and done, this project will be about $600 with a new barrel and breech block. Not the best bargain for one without spare parts lying around.

I remember when I paid $350 for a P6 a few years ago. Should have bought a few more. One guy on Sigforum reported that out of the 3 P6s he bought, 2 were unissued, unfired, totally intact, and had consecutive serials....for $250 each.

Then those Swiss P225 showed up for $400. Should have bought them all...

MadRiverArms
08-17-2016, 12:19 PM
I ordered a couple. Should be a fun project to add to my stable of Sig P6s.

Shrubmaster
08-17-2016, 12:28 PM
I noticed these guys are the most intact out of the batch, but the price reflects it. Also the magazine has a different follower, made for simunition. Where as the non-firing ones have original magazines. That could also be a factor in pricing.

When it's all said and done, this project will be about $600 with a new barrel and breech block. Not the best bargain for one without spare parts lying around.

I remember when I paid $350 for a P6 a few years ago. Should have bought a few more. One guy on Sigforum reported that out of the 3 P6s he bought, 2 were unissued, unfired, totally intact, and had consecutive serials....for $250 each.

Then those Swiss P225 showed up for $400. Should have bought them all...

Theres one for sale in the classifieds for 1200. The last time I bid on one on gb, it got up to 675 and the bidding was still climbing.

Varg Vikernes
08-22-2016, 5:20 PM
Just got my trainer out of jail. Got a cheap breach block from a member locally. Got a barrel coming in soon. Unfortunately its extended and ported. Down the line probably gonna get it cut and crowned.

Looking at the breach block it doesn't look brazed so lets hope that this is an easy conversion.

Still got the FP, FP Spring, Safety Lock, SL Spring to buy. And maybe some more mags, sights, and holsters and such.

edit: trigger is amazing too, reset is really short.

bblr
08-22-2016, 6:06 PM
Just got my trainer out of jail. Got a cheap breach block from a member locally. Got a barrel coming in soon. Unfortunately its extended and ported. Down the line probably gonna get it cut and crowned.

Looking at the breach block it doesn't look brazed so lets hope that this is an easy conversion.

Still got the FP, FP Spring, Safety Lock, SL Spring to buy. And maybe some more mags, sights, and holsters and such.

Numrich has the FP, FP spring, and roll pins: http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufacturers/SigSauerSigarms-33490/AutoPistols-41939/P225-35185.htm?page=2

Numrich also shows the safety lock and spring available for the P228: http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufacturers/SigSauerSigarms-33490/AutoPistols-41939/P228-35187.htm?page=2. I believe the P225, P226, and P228 all share the same breech block internals.


Well I guess Robertsons did change their mind and said they now would ship to me so I bought a P6 trainer the other day. I found all my spare parts so conversion should be relatively easy. I'll probably do the newer mainspring assembly and SRT as well.

Varg Vikernes
08-22-2016, 7:15 PM
Numrich has the FP, FP spring, and roll pins: http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufacturers/SigSauerSigarms-33490/AutoPistols-41939/P225-35185.htm?page=2

Numrich also shows the safety lock and spring available for the P228: http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufacturers/SigSauerSigarms-33490/AutoPistols-41939/P228-35187.htm?page=2. I believe the P225, P226, and P228 all share the same breech block internals.


Well I guess Robertsons did change their mind and said they now would ship to me so I bought a P6 trainer the other day. I found all my spare parts so conversion should be relatively easy. I'll probably do the newer mainspring assembly and SRT as well.


Yea, I'm waiting on this week's check to buy anything else.

Whats involved in new mainspring assembly?

MadRiverArms
08-22-2016, 7:25 PM
Just replacing the hammer spring for one that isn't as heavy.

https://www.gunsprings.com/SIG-SAUER%20(SIGARMS)/P-220/cID1/mID4/dID6

bblr
08-22-2016, 7:51 PM
Whats involved in new mainspring assembly?

All you need is the new style mainspring strut, seat, and mainspring. The old style assembly is a pain to get out. The new assembly is really easy to install. If you use the OEM grips you will need to remove material from the back to accommodate the assembly. If you use newer aftermarket grips like G10's, no modifications are necessary. The newer assembly will greatly reduce trigger pull--the P6 has a horrible DA pull.

Here are the different mainsprings. Your P6 will come with the bottom assembly. You want the top one:

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/sig%20hammer%20strut.jpg

See pic for grip mods:

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/IMG_6395.jpg

Varg Vikernes
08-22-2016, 8:26 PM
That thing will just drop into a p6, minus the grip mod?

Also what type of punch do i need to remove this double roll pin?

edit: also does anyone make a solid pin for the breachblock?

MadRiverArms
08-22-2016, 8:44 PM
Knock out both inner and outer pins with a 1/8" roll pin punch. The manual states these are not reusable.

This should be useful:

Sig P225 Armorers Manual (http://stevespages.com/pdf/sig_p225_combat_pistol_armorer's_manual.pdf)

sigfan91
08-22-2016, 9:09 PM
That thing will just drop into a p6, minus the grip mod?

Yes, all classic Sig P series (P220, P225, P226, P228, P229) can use any one of the 3 style main spring assemblies. The only difference is the weight of the spring. P6 comes standard with very heavy 24lb or 26lb main spring (old style). Standard P225 (old style) is 21lb (I believe). I replaced my P6 with 19lb spring and so far I have not had a single light strike. Of course I'm using commercial ammo and not military stuff which is known to have hard primers.

I actually don't like the new main spring assembly. I like either the E2 or the old style.

Knock out both inner and outer pins with a 1/8" roll pin punch. The manual states these are not reusable.

That's weird. Why not?

bblr
08-22-2016, 9:44 PM
That thing will just drop into a p6, minus the grip mod?

Also what type of punch do i need to remove this double roll pin?

edit: also does anyone make a solid pin for the breachblock?

Yes, it just drops in. Use any punch--I'm not sure which size it is (3/16" maybe?). A roll-pin punch is not needed for removal--only installation. The dual roll-pins are press fit in and thus are not reusable. Newer SIGs use a spiral roll-pin instead of the dual roll-pins or solid firing-pin-positioning-pin. These can also be used on older SIGs with separate breech-block if you like. There is a SIG armorer online (I can't remember his name), that will send you these spiral roll-pins for free. Maybe someone remembers.

http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-sauer-firing-pin-positioning-pin-current-p-series-spiral.html

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/c028015b2e62718527c7cba459417d41.jpg

Varg Vikernes
08-23-2016, 6:03 PM
Yes, it just drops in. Use any punch--I'm not sure which size it is (3/16" maybe?). A roll-pin punch is not needed for removal--only installation. The dual roll-pins are press fit in and thus are not reusable. Newer SIGs use a spiral roll-pin instead of the dual roll-pins or solid firing-pin-positioning-pin. These can also be used on older SIGs with separate breech-block if you like. There is a SIG armorer online (I can't remember his name), that will send you these spiral roll-pins for free. Maybe someone remembers.

http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-sauer-firing-pin-positioning-pin-current-p-series-spiral.html

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/Misc/c028015b2e62718527c7cba459417d41.jpg



Guy that sold the breach block to me said Total Automation will provide roll pins with the extractor:

http://totalautomation.us/sigcorner.htm

I just bought a new stainless guide rod on a whim this morning.

Varg Vikernes
09-22-2016, 8:44 PM
Sorry to ressurect this thread. But does a breach block need to be fitted to slide? Looks like my breach block may need some sanding to fit flush with the top of the slide?

http://i.imgur.com/Y5ehquwl.jpg

bblr
09-25-2016, 5:18 PM
Sorry to ressurect this thread. But does a breach block need to be fitted to slide? Looks like my breach block may need some sanding to fit flush with the top of the slide?/img]

That's not normal. I've never heard anything about fitting. I wonder if that's the wrong breech block? The P225/P6 has it's own that's different from the P226/P228.

bblr
09-25-2016, 5:27 PM
There's no fitting. The roll pins go through the slide and breach...that's it.

Here's some P225/P6 pics to show how it should look:

http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/P225_5.jpg
http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/370SigSauerP2259mmPistol12_zps4fd9139f.jpg
http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt153/biglou_71/DSCN1485.jpg

My guess is you've got the wrong breech block.

http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-sauer-breech-block-p225.html
http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-breech-block-p226-228.html