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Glock19newb
08-09-2016, 3:13 PM
I'm about to take some handgun classes in LA. The instructor lists a holster and belt as things to bring. I'd like to get a nice holster but guys are telling me good luck with getting a concealed carry out here. I live in Pasadena btw. If its near impossible to get a concealed carry permit, what good is a nice belt and holster? I'm looking at ones that go inside the pants and not out. Not sure if thats the right way to go.

Any input about this topic?

Scratch705
08-09-2016, 3:17 PM
well if you want to take a class u need to get a good belt and holster. so that is what it will be good for.

why get a IWB when you can't CCW, as I believe some classes don't allow IWB for their beginner classes.

most will require OWB holsters or at least recommend it since it will be easier to use as you will be holstering and un-holstering all day.

I bought holsters for 2 of my pistols that I would want to take classes with, not because i want to CCW them. my one actually CCW sized pistol does not have a holster since i know i can't get a CCW in LA County.

vliberatore
08-09-2016, 3:17 PM
What good is the nice belt and holster?

You'll need them for the class. Sounds good to me.

ARDude
08-09-2016, 3:18 PM
Since you live in Pasadena, check with the PD and see what it takes to get a CCW there. If you apply with LASD, forget about it.

What kind of class are you taking?

ChuckDizzle
08-09-2016, 3:20 PM
Sounds like you might need to enroll in a different class.

A good holster is handy if you plan to legally carry on your property or business. Or if out hunting where you also want a sidearm.

A cheap holster is a good thing to have, you don't need a fancy one for the limited use described above. Extra cost just increases the durability and comfort of your rig.

Glock19newb
08-09-2016, 3:20 PM
Handgun 101 and 102 with Stanton "Stan" Lee

Glock19newb
08-09-2016, 3:21 PM
Since you live in Pasadena, check with the PD and see what it takes to get a CCW there. If you apply with LASD, forget about it.

What kind of class are you taking?

Handgun 101 and 102 with Stanton "Stan" Lee

ElDub1950
08-09-2016, 3:39 PM
Just pick up an Alien Gear OWB for your classes. Good quality and very reasonably priced. A good gun belt is nice to have but for a couple of classes, a decent leather 1.75w belt from Walmart will do OK.

ARDude
08-09-2016, 3:46 PM
Handgun 101 and 102 with Stanton "Stan" Lee
I wouldn't spend a whole lot of money. I used a Uncle Mikes holster and mag pouches with a good thick leather belt for a couple classes I took years ago.

accel
08-09-2016, 4:02 PM
Holster might be needed for home defence scenario. If something suspicious going around you might want to put some belt and holster on.

FireCloud9
08-09-2016, 4:10 PM
Good belts are nice to have whether you'll be CCWing or not.

lastinline
08-09-2016, 4:14 PM
The reason for a sturdy belt and quality holster for any class is a matter of proper safety. If students are going to be taught basic mechanics of gun handling, sight-picture, trigger press, reloading, etc., it is not as easily done from a table, bench, or some other contraption. It can be done, but it is certainly better (IMO) for the instructor to be able to move safely around the student for necessary coaching/corrections. For outdoor locations that don't usually have automated target retrieval systems, the student can take steps either forward or back to adjust distances to the target. A holster when properly used can solve the problem of folks breaking the 180 rule, etc.

Brother_Hesekiel
08-09-2016, 4:22 PM
Get a "Sticky" holster for $24.99, and you'll love it to death.
No belt needed.

P5Ret
08-09-2016, 4:31 PM
The reason for a sturdy belt and quality holster for any class is a matter of proper safety. If students are going to be taught basic mechanics of gun handling, sight-picture, trigger press, reloading, etc., it is not as easily done from a table, bench, or some other contraption. It can be done, but it is certainly better (IMO) for the instructor to be able to move safely around the student for necessary coaching/corrections. For outdoor locations that don't usually have automated target retrieval systems, the student can take steps either forward or back to adjust distances to the target. A holster when properly used can solve the problem of folks breaking the 180 rule, etc.

^This for a basic classes, like it sounds like your taking.

Get a "Sticky" holster for $24.99, and you'll love it to death.
No belt needed.

^Not this.

You want to have a good sturdy belt and an OUTSIDE the waist band holster to start with. It is much easier to learn proper technique with a good holster that is easy to reholster with, than it is with a IWB holster. Having multiple holsters for guns is a right of passage for most. I'll also bet that most people have a box full of holsters somewhere.

CSACANNONEER
08-09-2016, 4:38 PM
Holsters are a very personal thing. There is no way that anyone can recommend the right holster for you. Many people like the hybred holsters or even all kydex IWB holsters. I don't care for them. My daily carry is in a Sticky holster. It is very comfortable, doesn't have clips, can be adjusted to any position regardless of where the belt loops on your pants are, can be easily adjusted for height and cant, is quick to put on and take off, etc. However, it's not ideal for a class. Every style of holster has it's drawbacks. When it comes to soft holsters like Sticky, Ramora, Ace, soft suede, etc. for safety, you should REMOVE the holster to re-holster your firearm. In fact, it's in the directions for Sticky Holsters. Also, I would NEVER carry a Sticky holster without a good quality belt. The lowest quality leather belt I recommend is a Boston Leather. You can find them for around $20-$25. Galco, Alien Gear, etc. all make +$50 CCW belts that are better but, more expensive. Also, remember that ALL holsters wear out. I'm getting about 18 months out of a Sticky Holster before I need to replace it. I get 10-15 years from an IWB suede holster with a single metal clip.

lastinline
08-09-2016, 4:43 PM
Get a "Sticky" holster for $24.99, and you'll love it to death.
No belt needed.
The only thing "sticky" will be the dried blood as it coagulates on your leg and foot after negligently discharging while attempting to re-holster into something not sturdy, and that keeps moving around.

MarikinaMan
08-09-2016, 4:52 PM
I wear a holster working around the house and yard. When shtf, are you going to walk around gun in hand?

a sturdy mens belt you may already have, a 20-30 dollar belt loop holster, and a mag holder. Ill sell you a couple of blackhawk mag holders for double stack I have for 11 bucks each shipped. If u want them. New in box.

CSACANNONEER
08-09-2016, 4:57 PM
The only thing "sticky" will be the dried blood as it coagulates on your leg and foot after negligently discharging while attempting to re-holster into something not sturdy, and that keeps moving around.

:facepalm: Read the damn directions! It clearly states NOT to do what you are suggesting. It is not designed to be used that way. BTW, mine don't move around anymore than any other IWB holster does.

fritztkatt
08-09-2016, 5:21 PM
Long guns have slings, hand guns have holsters.

For a non-specific class, I suggest you look into a safari land paddle. Since I have to use them at work, the Blackhawk serpa aren't that bad (once I paddle mounted it), passive/positive retention as well.

I used a safariland a few times and found it excellent in comfort, quality (for the price), adjustable (for cant and retention iirc).

Super easy to slip a paddle on and off, but you still need a good belt underneath it. I got a Triple K leather belt over a year ago for $35 on amazon, it's holding up well. They're made in San Diego as well.

bsg
08-09-2016, 5:43 PM
consider the Milt Sparks OWB 55BN if you are desirous of leather. this holster is a good range use/everyday carry holster and the folks at Milt Sparks Holsters, Inc. mention this in the holster's description. the holster's history and it's origins may be of interest to you and this is provided by the maker.

most of my examples of Milt Sparks holsters are early variants made during the lifetime of the late Milt Sparks (Idaho City marking) and quality is top-shelf. the company lived on after the passing of Milt Sparks and continues to produce high quality gunleather. this holster company has long enjoyed it's earned reputation for high quality and continues to be a highly respected maker in the gunleather industry.

current delivery time from maker is quoted as being 12-18 weeks. link for Milt Sparks Holsters, Inc. provided below.

www.miltsparks.com

SkyHawk
08-09-2016, 5:56 PM
I agree OWB is best for class and great around the house. IWB is a real pain in a class. You will have to holster the gun a lot in class, nothing beats OWB for holstering repeatedly.

I like the Bianchi Remedy (Model 57) a lot for class. I am a leather man though. I also carry concealed with the Remedy in the winter under a flannel shirt.

https://www.amazon.com/Bianchi-Remedy-Holster-Glock-Black/dp/B005KW3D5M/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1470794259&sr=8-1&keywords=Bianchi+remedy+glock

xxINKxx
08-09-2016, 6:01 PM
Holster might be needed for home defence scenario. If something suspicious going around you might want to put some belt and holster on.

:confused:

Seems a bit overkill. That would require you to go put pants on too, then loop the belt in and holster wasting time. If your in a situation where you need a pistol for HD, your not gunna need to holster it for whatever reason. Just carry it in your hand.

CSACANNONEER
08-09-2016, 6:58 PM
:confused:

Seems a bit overkill. That would require you to go put pants on too, then loop the belt in and holster wasting time. If your in a situation where you need a pistol for HD, your not gunna need to holster it for whatever reason. Just carry it in your hand.

You're only confused because, you're only thinking about your living situation. I, for one, have put pants, a belt and a holstered firearm on before confronting a trespasser. I guess, I would have scared any trespasser away if I hadn't put my pants on first but that's another story. I don't have a problem taking 15-30 seconds to put pants, belt and a holstered firearm on if I see a potential problem at my front gate. After all, it's almost a mile from the house and, while I might see the need to have a firearm with me, I am not going to approach every person coming in with a firearm in my hand. That's not even legal in California. So, yea, putting on a holster can be a wise choice.

plumbum
08-09-2016, 7:08 PM
Gotta have holsters (and slings for long guns), and having more than one is even better.

I have probably 15 inexpensive Uncle Mikes of various sizes - even an OWB for my Charter .38 - seems silly but I have it strapped to a fanny pack that is a sort of grab bag. Gun never stays there, but if I have both, the gun is secured and positioned correctly.

Thepug99
08-09-2016, 7:09 PM
You can always borrow someone's holster if you don't want to buy one. Ask the teacher . Oftentimes they have extras.
I have taken classes where I borrowed rifle with scope from the instructor.

CouchOperator
08-09-2016, 7:12 PM
Do not go cheap on a holster. Period. Its the one thing securing and holding that loaded handgun from hands on to hands off the pistol. Uncle mikes is not acceptable, nor is the serpa or whatever other cheap "wonderholster" people are recommending. Get a good solid OWB kydex holster from raven concealment (they have quickship options), and rock on. Not having to worry about "the ****ty gear you saved $40 on" will allow you to focus more on the class and instructor than whether your cheap uncle mikes folded in on you when reholstering. Some schools will not (and rightly so) allow students in with cheap holsters. Kydex magazine carriers are also worth the $30-40.

What gun are you running and how much did you spend on it?

edgalang
08-09-2016, 8:23 PM
I'm about to take some handgun classes in LA. The instructor lists a holster and belt as things to bring. I'd like to get a nice holster but guys are telling me good luck with getting a concealed carry out here. I live in Pasadena btw. If its near impossible to get a concealed carry permit, what good is a nice belt and holster? I'm looking at ones that go inside the pants and not out. Not sure if thats the right way to go.

Any input about this topic?

For class use, depending on the class will generally require the following...

Not cloth/leather. Usually they want plastic/kydex. Basically something that won't collapse since you'll need to be able to do 1 hand draws.

You probably also want a NON-active retention holster, since (especially on beginner class) they dont allow serpas or the like.

You'll also want 0-cant, since (again this is a beginner class) they'll tell you to do draws from the standard 3 o clock position.

You'll also want it to be OWB.


If you are able, I'd go straight to a custom kydex, OWB, 0-cant holster and pair it with a 1.75" gun belt with nylon inserts. I wish I was told this earlier in life...then I could of saved some money on holsters.


OTOH...if you REALLY are going to carry CCW, then leather is the way to go IMO (just not for class). If you also plan to carry while riding a horse, then sure Serpa is the way to go.

Sam1234
08-10-2016, 9:30 AM
How about a Blade Tech holster?

Simple, hard plastic, good retention without a strap or physical catch, good for class, good solid draw and reholster.

Sam

MarikinaMan
08-10-2016, 10:01 AM
You're only confused because, you're only thinking about your living situation. I, for one, have put pants, a belt and a holstered firearm on before confronting a trespasser. I guess, I would have scared any trespasser away if I hadn't put my pants on first but that's another story. I don't have a problem taking 15-30 seconds to put pants, belt and a holstered firearm on if I see a potential problem at my front gate. After all, it's almost a mile from the house and, while I might see the need to have a firearm with me, I am not going to approach every person coming in with a firearm in my hand. That's not even legal in California. So, yea, putting on a holster can be a wise choice.

So true. Even if you are in the right as a property owner, approaching an unknown entity with gun in hand can be seen as brandishing, which is punishable by law. I'm not saying it will stick or not, but who wants to deal with that **** anyway. Holster your firearm if the perp is less than a bump in the night. For example, somebody wanders onto your property.

L84CABO
08-10-2016, 10:03 AM
I'm about to take some handgun classes in LA. The instructor lists a holster and belt as things to bring. I'd like to get a nice holster but guys are telling me good luck with getting a concealed carry out here. I live in Pasadena btw. If its near impossible to get a concealed carry permit, what good is a nice belt and holster? I'm looking at ones that go inside the pants and not out. Not sure if thats the right way to go.

Any input about this topic?

Like others have said, you need a holster and belt for a class so you might as well get a good one.

Beyond that, learning to draw from a holster is a very basic and fundamental gun handling skill...one everyone should possess regardless of what the stupid CCW laws are. To that end, you may move to a different county one day or the world could go to crap and you might actually need it. How much you think that might actually happen is up to you. But better to have the skill and not need it than the other way around IMO.

For class, it's probably best to have an OWB holster. Tons of good ones out there in either leather or Kydex. Keep in mind that leather will take a fair amount of time to break in before it's good to go for a class. So if you don't have the time to run several hundred draws through it, go with Kydex.

Weather you want to pick up a good IWB holster too is up to you. Should you ever need to truly conceal your gun, IWB is prob the way to go...albeit usually less comfortable than OWB.

A good belt is also invaluable. And at least you can wear the belt for regular daily wear so it's worth getting a good one. Folks here can help point you in a direction for both the holster and the belt once you narrow things down a bit. Do you want a leather holster or Kydex? IWB or OWB or both? Leather belt or a web belt like the Ares Aegis, etc. Lots of threads already on belts and holsters so searching should yield lots of info. :)

Legasat
08-10-2016, 10:30 AM
DeSantis makes decent holsters for not a lot of money. IWB and OWB.

CSACANNONEER
08-10-2016, 10:35 AM
So true. Even if you are in the right as a property owner, approaching an unknown entity with gun in hand can be seen as brandishing, which is punishable by law. I'm not saying it will stick or not, but who wants to deal with that **** anyway. Holster your firearm if the perp is less than a bump in the night. For example, somebody wanders onto your property.

Worse than that. If a trespasser has a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury because you point or otherwise threaten them with a firearm, they have the right to use lethal force to defend themselves. You have no right to use lethal force to merely run off a trespasser. So, sometimes having a holstered firearm is much better than not having one at all or having one in your hand.

cockedandglocked
08-10-2016, 10:41 AM
I have a Blackhawk Serpa holster for just such a purpose. I don't really have any use for an OWB holster other than for classes, and occasionally hunting. It doesn't get much use these days since I got my CCW.

It's a good holster, just be aware of the fact that the release button puts your finger right where the trigger is as you draw the pistol. This can be a good thing for experts, but a bad thing if you're not careful. See the "I just F-ing shot myself!" video on youtube for an example of what not to do....

Scratch705
08-10-2016, 11:38 AM
I have a Blackhawk Serpa holster for just such a purpose. I don't really have any use for an OWB holster other than for classes, and occasionally hunting. It doesn't get much use these days since I got my CCW.

It's a good holster, just be aware of the fact that the release button puts your finger right where the trigger is as you draw the pistol. This can be a good thing for experts, but a bad thing if you're not careful. See the "I just F-ing shot myself!" video on youtube for an example of what not to do....

and if OP's name is also indicative of his pistol of choice for the class, an IWB is really not a good choice nor a button retention holster like serpa's for a first time user and class participant.

i wouldn't want to be next to the person who was a first time class taker and using an IWB or serpa next to me as the chances for ND goes way up especially with all the holster draws and re-holstering throughout the day.

edgalang
08-10-2016, 2:04 PM
...
i wouldn't want to be next to the person who was a first time class taker and using an IWB or serpa next to me as the chances for ND goes way up especially with all the holster draws and re-holstering throughout the day.

IWB/Serpa might be a moot point anyways, since the class most likely won't even allow him to participate if that's what he came in with. That's why neither should be an option for a 1st holster IMO.

Che762x39
08-10-2016, 2:14 PM
Handgun 101 and 102 with Stanton "Stan" Lee

I like Stan Lee but his class is Comic Book 451. I did not know he did handguns too. :oji:

Che762x39
08-10-2016, 2:18 PM
I wouldn't spend a whole lot of money. I used a Uncle Mikes holster and mag pouches with a good thick leather belt for a couple classes I took years ago.

If you have a Glock I would suggest the Glock Sport Holster at $12 :oji:

AKexpat
08-10-2016, 2:50 PM
This has nothing to do with the OP's question, which is very valid and has been addressed adequately here in this thread, IMO.

I am only going to address the quote below.

I wear a holster working around the house and yard. When shtf, are you going to walk around gun in hand?

I live in a very rural area and wear a 1911 .45 5" working around the house, the other 14 acres, and in the house. I am 64, retired, have sciatica in the right leg, small-of-the-back problems, and wear stout suspenders as I cannot wear a belt of any type as it exascerbates my problems. In short, my health has been better.

This may not work for many but it works for me. For HD, I can get my jeans on in about 30 seconds and slide this easily into the waistband at the 4 o'clock position (without worrying or thinking about a belt and holster), if I need to do so. If not, I can just carry it in hand and confront the perp(s) at the point of entry. Otherwise in the other scenarios, it is just easy to carry.

I am not advocating it for those that run, or do any strenuous things where it may become dislodged from the waistband. It is a much improved Mexican carry for old folks like me. :oji: If you are physically able to wear a good gunbelt and OWB holster, by all means do it.

It is called a Clipdraw and it works great for my situation. YMMV.


http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii274/sourdoughjim/1911%20Hardballer%20005_zpskddntkbl.jpg


Jim

CSACANNONEER
08-10-2016, 3:46 PM
The main problem with the clipdraw is that the trigger is uncovered which is not the safest way to carry a firearm.

L-2
08-10-2016, 7:34 PM
From what I gather, is the OP's class on 8/20/16? If so, time's running out.

Here are two low cost options which should work for a class:
http://www.lapolicegear.com/gam5xmapaho.html
http://www.lapolicegear.com/galco-tacslide-belt-holster.html

I don't know the stores in the Los Angeles area. Whether you prefer a belt loop or paddle holster is personal preference. The two above show in-stock at LAPolice Gear.

There's even a retail store which may also be a good idea to go in-person:
http://www.lapolicegear.com/showroom.html

You'll want some time to ensure the equipment is working well together with what clothing you plan to wear, including what belts you already own. Get off Calguns and start shopping and buying, especially if the class is in 10 days, make that 9 days as today is already gone.

Vacaville
08-10-2016, 7:41 PM
At least for me, every rifle gets a sling and every handgun gets a holster. I've got friends who don't have either for any of their guns, and I'm like "How are you gonna carry it if you need to?". "You gonna carry your little case like a laptop?" Having holsters also implies that you get a gun belt.

Lonestargrizzly
08-10-2016, 7:52 PM
Just go down to walmart and get a nylon universal holster.

Scratch705
08-10-2016, 10:43 PM
Just go down to walmart and get a nylon universal holster.

yep, at this point if your class is the aug 20th class with stan, goto a retail store that has holsters and buy a OWB there.

isn't there also a calgunner on here runs this store http://packinfurdefense.com

he probably has a few holsters in stock and i remember reading that he allows you to try them out in store.

CSACANNONEER
08-11-2016, 7:45 AM
If you haven't got one yet and really need one fast, these are not bad:

http://packinfurdefense.com/products/black-ambdextrous-slide-holster

I keep a few on hand for loaner holsters. They are far better than anything you can find at Walmart or even at many gun stores. They fit most handguns, can be worn IWB or OWB, clip or running the belt through the holster, RH or LH. Having a few of these in your stash will never be a bad thing.

AKexpat
08-11-2016, 8:47 AM
The main problem with the clipdraw is that the trigger is uncovered which is not the safest way to carry a firearm.

I know (from your sig) that you are a certified NRA Pistol instructor, so I'm willing to bet your response would always be by the book. You are graciously entitled to your opinion, sir, and I know you are coming at this scenario from a safety standpoint. Kudos.

However, even if the 1911 is carried cocked and locked, in order for a round to fire the grip safety must be depressed and the thumb safety in the "off" position, as well as the trigger being depressed.

And, what's the old expression? Keep your booger hook off of the bang switch until you acquire the target!

I have never had an AD/ND with this properly functioning pistol and I follow the 4 basic firearm safety rules implicitly.

Thanks for your input, sir.

Jim

cockedandglocked
08-11-2016, 9:16 AM
However, even if the 1911 is carried cocked and locked, in order for a round to fire the grip safety must be depressed and the thumb safety in the "off" position, as well as the trigger being depressed.

And, what's the old expression? Keep your booger hook off of the bang switch until you acquire the target!

I have never had an AD/ND with this properly functioning pistol and I follow the 4 basic firearm safety rules implicitly.

Some points I'd like to make. Regarding the first paragraph I quoted above, you're relying on a mechanical safety to keep you safe. What is the first thing everyone says about mechanical safeties? DO NOT RELY ON THEM!

Your second paragraph above, only applies while the gun is in your hands. It is irrelevant to carrying a gun IWB. Your finger isn't the only thing that can pull the trigger there. Your bunched up panties, or any number of other things, could get crammed in the trigger area and cause it to fire as you move around.

Lastly, congrats on never having an ND. Keep carrying IWB with a loaded chamber and nothing covering the trigger, and that will surely change. It's not "if", but "when". Again, you quote the "4 rules of firearm safety", which are rules intended for when you're handling a firearm, not while carrying it IWB. I assure you, your weapon is not "pointed at something you intend to destroy" while it's tucked in your pants. Or maybe it is? :shrug:

fritztkatt
08-11-2016, 10:50 AM
What are you guys doing wrong with a serpa that your finger lands on the trigger? Granted I've only live fired with one using a m9, and played with one for a 1911, both had my finger on the frame.

I really don't see the big deal here.

Clip draw, it's your ND, not mine.

Appendix, it's your femoral artery and fun bits, not mine.

SOB, it's not my spinal cord during a slip and fall.

Friction retention, not my lost or gun grab.

Positive retention, it's not my messed up draw.

ETA: leather, not my collapsed holster.

Iwb, not my shirt tail causing glock leg.

Plastic, not my scratched gun.

Use what works for you. Just be safe. Nothing wrong with a uncle Mikes or serpa off the shelf... it's just not ideal.

Lead Waster
08-11-2016, 11:38 AM
Just go down to walmart and get a nylon universal holster.

I agree with this. Uncle Mikes makes a generic nylon holster. Fits almost everything.

It's not ideal, but it does provide a way to carry (almost any) gun on a belt.

Lonestargrizzly
08-11-2016, 11:49 AM
Big 5 may also have something.

AKexpat
08-11-2016, 12:30 PM
Some points I'd like to make. Regarding the first paragraph I quoted above, you're relying on a mechanical safety to keep you safe. What is the first thing everyone says about mechanical safeties? DO NOT RELY ON THEM!

Your second paragraph above, only applies while the gun is in your hands. It is irrelevant to carrying a gun IWB. Your finger isn't the only thing that can pull the trigger there. Your bunched up panties, or any number of other things, could get crammed in the trigger area and cause it to fire as you move around.

Lastly, congrats on never having an ND. Keep carrying IWB with a loaded chamber and nothing covering the trigger, and that will surely change. It's not "if", but "when". Again, you quote the "4 rules of firearm safety", which are rules intended for when you're handling a firearm, not while carrying it IWB. I assure you, your weapon is not "pointed at something you intend to destroy" while it's tucked in your pants. Or maybe it is? :shrug:

Thank you for your comments, sir.

I see by your username that you may be a Glock fan. If so I can understand why you insist upon a covered trigger. I last shot a Glock a decade ago (my BIL's .40) and did not care for the blockiness of the pistol nor the poor trigger.

The 1911 has two mechanical safeties whereas the Glock has none. I have built one 1911 from a stripped frame and parts, and have had at least 4 others that needed work, which I did myself with 25+ years experience in this area. If you want to learn about 1911 pistols, get Jerry Kuhnhausen's books. Seriously.

[PDF]The Colt .45 Automatic - A Shop Manual Vol.1 by Kuhnhausen.pdf
www.klstottlemyer.com/.../The_Colt_.45_Automatic_-_A_Shop_Manual_Vol.1_by_Ku...
A Shop Manual. Volume 1. In the Kuhnhausen. M1911 Pistol Series. Jerry. Kuhnhausen ...

It is available online.

Thanks to all that feel I am putting myself at risk by using the Clipdraw. If so, I'll have my wife post an obit, if and when.

Jim

BJJ223
08-11-2016, 12:53 PM
You will need a holster for SHTF. Don't cheap out. Buy quality.

cockedandglocked
08-11-2016, 1:03 PM
Thanks to all that feel I am putting myself at risk by using the Clipdraw. If so, I'll have my wife post an obit, if and when.

Jim

Believe me, I hope I'm wrong, I don't want you to shoot yourself. As long as you feel safe, then go for it. I'm just not sure the clipdraw is a good recommendation to make to strangers whose level of safety and experience might not match yours, especially when they named themselves "glock19newb". My recommendation for a Serpa holster also wasn't the best, but I pointed out in my post that it might not be right, or even safe, for some people. The responsible thing for you to do would be to add a similar disclaimer to your recommendation, because it is, in fact, unsafe for most people.

AKexpat
08-11-2016, 1:28 PM
Granted I've only live fired with one using a m9, and played with one for a 1911, both had my finger on the frame.

I really don't see the big deal here.

Clip draw, it's your ND, not mine.

Wow. You state you have only fired a few rounds from a 92 and a 1911. Wow. You seem to have a lot of experience. :rolleyes: Good that you had your finger out of the TG. You may have saved a few lives.

Appendix, it's your femoral artery and fun bits, not mine.

SOB, it's not my spinal cord during a slip and fall.

LOL, so how is a IWB pistol discharge going to have an impact on my spinal cord? It's your spinal cord that is affected whether or not you are armed.

Friction retention, not my lost or gun grab.

Positive retention, it's not my messed up draw.

Do you really believe that stout holster retention will save your butt?

I think that is the biggest fallacy around insofar as pistol retention because the perp will do anything to get your gun if he knows you have one. If you carry OWB it is easily discernible to anyone looking for one.

ETA: leather, not my collapsed holster.

Iwb, not my shirt tail causing glock leg.

Plastic, not my scratched gun.

I have no idea what you are railing about. Seriously.

[/QUOTE] Use what works for you. Just be safe. Nothing wrong with a uncle Mikes or serpa off the shelf... it's just not ideal.[QUOTE]

drunktank
08-11-2016, 1:40 PM
OP, if you want to borrow a cheap basic Glock holster (for free), then private message me and I'll send it in the mail.

Just give it back when you are done please!

grantar2
08-11-2016, 2:08 PM
I'm about to take some handgun classes in LA. The instructor lists a holster and belt as things to bring. I'd like to get a nice holster but guys are telling me good luck with getting a concealed carry out here. I live in Pasadena btw. If its near impossible to get a concealed carry permit, what good is a nice belt and holster? I'm looking at ones that go inside the pants and not out. Not sure if thats the right way to go.

Any input about this topic?

Unless your instructor has told you to bring IWB, you will either be made to use a nylon one size fits all if he has any to loan, will be told your not shooting, or will be told to buy a rig at the range.

Even if concealment is a the subject most instructors for safety reasons will use IDPA style OWB rigs with a concealment vest or jacket. The risks of IWB are more than they need to deal with, plus it makes it harder for them to manage watching manipulation during the drills.

Depending on the gun and your size a entry level training rig will cost $80. That would include a belt / Holster / 2 Mag holder. Works good for training classes and early IDPA.

Feel free to call us at Packin' Fur Defense to discuss.

If your really bent on getting an IWB, make sure you ask your instructor. Also make sure it' is a rig that will work at 3 O'clock. Many instructors / Ranges will not allow appendix carry especially during drills, as they do not want you to shoot yourself, high risk of being fatal, during repeated drills, and mostly because to holster your gun is at some point likely to point sideways down the shooting line. Anything behind 3 0'clock will not be allowed as it will break 180.

AFTII
08-11-2016, 2:09 PM
Ok, here's my .02.

For my first CCW class, I used a Cross Breed IWB for my G 30S. At the end of the day, my R thumb (draw hand), was swollen to 50% again its original size. IWB is great for CCW, not so good for performing 100's of draws in a day. Go OWB.

Most instructors cringe when they see someone with a Sherpa holster. Some will not allow it for the reasons stated herein: https://www.fletc.gov/sites/default/files/imported_files/reference/public-information/freedom-of-information-act-foia/reading-room/training-information/holisterStudy.pdf I also think they are kinda slow.

As others have said, the choice then becomes somewhat personal. How much retention do you want? Do you care about noise, finish abrasion, price, etc.?

I personally like Blade Tech Eclipse / Total Eclipse holsters for OWB. Sometimes they come with the the IWB conversion. In any event, they can be converted to IWB for about $12.

In my experience, they have good retention and facilitate a smooth draw. They are also easy to re-holster and offer a positive click when re-holstering. They also hold the gun pretty high and tight for easier concealment.

Being in sunny Cal, most people who can carry concealed carry IWB, but in other parts of the country, its common for folks to carry concealed using a OWB holster and cover garment. You should check to see if your instructor requires you to bring a cover garment. Picking a proper cover garment is a whole different topic, but if you see some fat old guy walking around wearing a vest on a hot summer day without a camera or fishing pole, he's probably packing.

Good luck and have fun.

CSACANNONEER
08-11-2016, 3:21 PM
I know (from your sig) that you are a certified NRA Pistol instructor, so I'm willing to bet your response would always be by the book. You are graciously entitled to your opinion, sir, and I know you are coming at this scenario from a safety standpoint. Kudos.

However, even if the 1911 is carried cocked and locked, in order for a round to fire the grip safety must be depressed and the thumb safety in the "off" position, as well as the trigger being depressed.

And, what's the old expression? Keep your booger hook off of the bang switch until you acquire the target!

I have never had an AD/ND with this properly functioning pistol and I follow the 4 basic firearm safety rules implicitly.

Thanks for your input, sir.

Jim

I'm not saying that it is not the best option for you or your needs. Every holster design has pros and cons. I was just pointing out one of the drawbacks of the Clipdraw design. Also, the OP is obviously new to firearms and taking a class where the instructor requires a holster, not just any "method of carry". So, yea, due to those reasons as well as the "by the book" safety concerns, I don't think it's a good or even viable option for the OP's current needs.

HopetonBrown
08-11-2016, 3:36 PM
Just go down to walmart and get a nylon universal holster.

I agree with this. Uncle Mikes makes a generic nylon holster. Fits almost everything.

It's not ideal, but it does provide a way to carry (almost any) gun on a belt.

Many instructors/schools won't allow a nylon holster.

HopetonBrown
08-11-2016, 3:40 PM
What are you guys doing wrong with a serpa that your finger lands on the trigger? Granted I've only live fired with one using a m9, and played with one for a 1911, both had my finger on the frame.



What people think they're doing, and what they're actually doing, are sometimes different things. Especially when feeling pressure from a timer, or being watched by peers.

Here's a video by Guns & Ammo magazine touting the awesomeness of the Derpa holster. They're even dismissive about the claims of it being a dangerous holster.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJ2Qg4xwHgg

LJ2Qg4xwHgg

Now slow down the video of the draw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXakcPB0evk

LXakcPB0evk

Well respected firearms trainers like Travis Haley, Chris Costa, Larry Vickers, Kyle Defoor, Todd Green, Jeff Gonzales, Kyle Lamb and Paul Howe have all come out against the Serpa. In police work they'd call that a clue.

With regards to the OP, a quality holster and belt are not useless. A kayak is only used for kayaking. Golf clubs are only used for golfing. A holster and belt can easily be of benefit when taking firearms classes, and shooting competitively.

fritztkatt
08-11-2016, 4:25 PM
The almost a year where I carried a m9 for at least 80, if not 120+ hours a week (that's not a typo), the 2 expert pistol qualifications (dropped 2 shots first time, 1 shot second time), division match, and some civilian world shooting using a borrowed holster/gun, makes me know what I'm talking about when I carry/fire a m9.

It may not be much, as I'm still a young guy, but I've ran nearly 5k rounds through my two 1911s (combined). I shoot a SS idpa classifier, which is respectable.

I know a thing or two, one of which is that you're doing it wrong if your finger lands on the trigger.

Amazing that a bunch of grown men/women can't keep their finger off the trigger.

ETA: not saying I'm a fan of the serpa, just that it's not that bad. It has its advantages as a holster system. I still like hybrid IWB or plastic owb for my own use.

cockedandglocked
08-11-2016, 5:51 PM
The almost a year where I carried a m9 for at least 80, if not 120+ hours a week (that's not a typo), the 2 expert pistol qualifications (dropped 2 shots first time, 1 shot second time), division match, and some civilian world shooting using a borrowed holster/gun, makes me know what I'm talking about when I carry/fire a m9.

It may not be much, as I'm still a young guy, but I've ran nearly 5k rounds through my two 1911s (combined). I shoot a SS idpa classifier, which is respectable.

I know a thing or two, one of which is that you're doing it wrong if your finger lands on the trigger.

Amazing that a bunch of grown men/women can't keep their finger off the trigger.

ETA: not saying I'm a fan of the serpa, just that it's not that bad. It has its advantages as a holster system. I still like hybrid IWB or plastic owb for my own use.

I've never had an issue keeping my finger off the trigger while drawing it either, but it certainly happens with some people. I've found that if I cant the holster a few degrees forward, rather than being straight vertical, it's almost impossible for my finger to reach the trigger until the pistol has completely cleared the holster, since my finger doesn't really like to bend that far sideways.

jjjjeremy
08-11-2016, 7:20 PM
I love my Safariland 7ts. Positive retention like the Blackhawk Serpa suicide holsters, but thumb activated. Cheap at $36 on eBay.

fritztkatt
08-11-2016, 8:21 PM
Interesting that you don't have an issue using it canted, while vertical doesn't work for you.

I just find without the cant that it is difficult to draw, especially using the full coverage GI ones. The cut away civilian ones are nicer.

I have witnessed a serpa related ND. Genius was playing with his gun, safety off, finger on trigger, tried to reholster. Except it's not a holster problem, it's a training problem. Stupid people shouldn't have guns.

Safariland makes good stuff, thumb breaks also won't get caught on junk/brush. Not that it's a real problem to begin with. In the thought of a gun grab, it's not visible that there is positive retention, which could be advantageous.

Hopeton, nice video. That looks like a training issue to me. My best guess as to why a lot of respected trainers are against them is because it is a training issue, which makes their classes take longer for the idiots, and takes valuable training time away from people that know what the rules are. Why have to teach holster BS when they could actually get to real course material or practice?

Akexpat, not everyone feels the need to list their credentials in their sigline. A bit of anonymity is nice now and again. Use some reading comprehension, logic, do a bit of research, and fact check the real world before you question and dismiss the experience of others. You are correct that I have only fired a "few" rounds from a m92, as I only know one person that was dumb enough to buy one. I really loved the 92gsd (had some work done to it by a big name, but forget which one) my buddy let me borrow, but only a 100 or so rounds. My duty guns on the other hand, government issue m9s, I've had plenty of practice with. Both live and dry. You can go argue my pistol scores, competency, and ability to teach the m9 with HQ marine corps. The NRA feels confident in my abilities to teach basic pistol use as well.

It's a damn holster, stop over thinking it. Pretty much won't go wrong as long as it actually fits and isn't a $10 nylon piece of junk. I wouldn't go full leather IWB either.

Calguns77
08-12-2016, 10:30 AM
If you have a Glock I would suggest the Glock Sport Holster at $12 :oji:

Seriously this. They have excellent retention but cost less than a crappy universal nylon holster. And you can buy a holster and two of their magazone pouches which are also very good for around $35. Also blackhawk brand nylon duty belts are only around $25 -$35 on amazon. You can get everything you need for less than the price of 1 high end kydex holster.

deadcoyote
08-13-2016, 11:12 AM
Holsters are no different than guns. Some argue you'll never really need it so why buy it, but if you ever do need either and you don't have it you'll feel pretty stupid.

Blade tech makes really nice holsters for owb. I also like the serpa holsters but some instructors/schools don't like them. I have an alien gear owb that hides a full size pretty well by holding it snug into your body, but that attribute also makes it less useful for classes or competition.

Quiet
08-13-2016, 11:17 AM
+1 on using a Bladetech OWB holster

REDdawn6
08-14-2016, 7:36 AM
Just pick up an Alien Gear OWB for your classes. Good quality and very reasonably priced. A good gun belt is nice to have but for a couple of classes, a decent leather 1.75w belt from Walmart will do OK.

Alien Gear makes a great gun belt too.

Glock19newb
08-14-2016, 10:14 AM
A bunch of nice guys on here.

What do you think of this holster?

https://www.amazon.com/Fobus-Standard-Holster-GL2E2-Walther/dp/B001C5ZQTM/ref=pd_sim_200_1?ie=UTF8&dpID=41CRY9MJdFL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR111%2C160_&psc=1&refRID=8EHR4ZSCFW51VAQ5WEZ4

What about Hanks Gunner belt? I wear dressy pasts often so if this belt looks great and lasts a lifetime its a win win?

https://www.amazon.com/Hanks-Gunner-Concealed-Leather-Warranty/dp/B00XNRF9IA/ref=sr_1_3?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1471198194&sr=1-3&keywords=gun+belt


I also have a streamlight light/laser attached to the glock 19 so ordered this

https://www.amazon.com/Tactical-Standard-Conceal-Polymer-Holster/dp/B00I3FN3B2/ref=sr_1_sc_12?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1471198371&sr=1-12-spell&keywords=fubus+holster

Quiet
08-14-2016, 11:07 AM
A bunch of nice guys on here.

What do you think of this holster?

https://www.amazon.com/Fobus-Standard-Holster-GL2E2-Walther/dp/B001C5ZQTM/ref=pd_sim_200_1?ie=UTF8&dpID=41CRY9MJdFL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR111%2C160_&psc=1&refRID=8EHR4ZSCFW51VAQ5WEZ4

I also have a streamlight light/laser attached to the glock 19 so ordered this

https://www.amazon.com/Tactical-Standard-Conceal-Polymer-Holster/dp/B00I3FN3B2/ref=sr_1_sc_12?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1471198371&sr=1-12-spell&keywords=fubus+holster
The Fobus holsters are okay.
Not very durable and are easy to break.
Which is why they are so inexpensive.

So, if you don't mind replacing them or having a few spares on hand in case they break, then they are good for range use.

CSACANNONEER
08-14-2016, 12:33 PM
The NRA feels confident in my abilities to teach basic pistol use as well.

I wouldn't go full leather IWB either.

Forgive me but, where are holsters part of the NRA Basics of Pistol Shooting course? Also, you do realize that the NRA no longer has a "Basic Pistol" course. There is a new course now.

So, top holster makers like Desantis who have been making all leather IWB holsters for decades are doing their customers a disservice? I know plenty of LEOs and other CCW holders that have never had a problem with an all leather holster. True, it isn't a good choice for the OP's class needs but, it might be a perfect choice for other wants or needs.

BTW, if u don't like looking at sig lines, you have the option of turning them off.

trendar5
08-14-2016, 12:34 PM
Just go down to walmart and get a nylon universal holster.

For a class? No!

He needs a holster for a class. He needs a Blade-Tech OWB no-safety-lever holster, designed specifically for his exact make/model.

Wasn'tMe
08-14-2016, 12:35 PM
A bunch of nice guys on here.

What do you think of this holster?

https://www.amazon.com/Fobus-Standard-Holster-GL2E2-Walther/dp/B001C5ZQTM/ref=pd_sim_200_1?ie=UTF8&dpID=41CRY9MJdFL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR111%2C160_&psc=1&refRID=8EHR4ZSCFW51VAQ5WEZ4

What about Hanks Gunner belt? I wear dressy pasts often so if this belt looks great and lasts a lifetime its a win win?

https://www.amazon.com/Hanks-Gunner-Concealed-Leather-Warranty/dp/B00XNRF9IA/ref=sr_1_3?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1471198194&sr=1-3&keywords=gun+belt


I also have a streamlight light/laser attached to the glock 19 so ordered this

https://www.amazon.com/Tactical-Standard-Conceal-Polymer-Holster/dp/B00I3FN3B2/ref=sr_1_sc_12?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1471198371&sr=1-12-spell&keywords=fubus+holster

No direct experience with Fobus, but as Quiet said, people generally say it's not all that durable.

After using a Blade Tech OWB for several classes, I'm a big fan. Lanbo's Armory (https://lanbosarmory.com) usually has good prices on them. I would recommend this one (https://lanbosarmory.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=25676) for a Glock 19 (for range use, not CCW in S CA).

I've used leather belts from Galco and Hank's for classes. They both work well, but Galco has the edge in appearance and slimness. The Hank's belt is less expensive, but it protrudes a lot at the buckle. I'm a thin guy, so it can be noticeable. It's fine for the range, but not something I personally would want for CCW (this is purely cosmetic, btw).

floogy
08-14-2016, 12:58 PM
If basic foolproof owb holster is required then I'll add my recommendation for the Glock sport holster. Costs the same or less than a crappy holster and will do the trick. It also is close to the body and would work for ccw with jacket or large shirt.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

CSACANNONEER
08-14-2016, 1:08 PM
For a class? No!

He needs a holster for a class. He needs a Blade-Tech OWB no-safety-lever holster, designed specifically for his exact make/model.

There are quality holsters that are designed to fit many different firearms. He does not need one designed specifically for one exact make and model. Here's a good example:

http://www.safariland.com/products/holsters-and-gear/holsters/concealable-holsters/paddle/model-578-gls-pro-fit-holster-with-paddle-57800.html#start=1