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scotthmt
09-22-2008, 12:07 AM
Well i've got the hankering for a semi auto shotgun to add to my earthquake preparedness kit aka shtf set. I feel a semi shotgun will be most effective and i'd like to somewhat tactical it out, pistol grip and forward light. I would love a saiga 12 but we all know how expensive those things are. So can someone recomend me a cheaper semi auto shotgun?

Also, whats the maximum amound of rounds that a shotgun is legally able to accept? And what is the shortest legnth that it can be? Barrel and OAL?

Please forgive my noobishness, i've only shot a shotgun once but i am fairly competent with ak building and AR's aswell with pistols of the like.

mike452
09-22-2008, 8:59 AM
I think Saiga 12 is one of the cheapest tactical semi out there. I would recommend to get a used Benelli M1, but that would be 50% more than a Saiga 12.
Maybe try gunbroker.com for some less popular brands and models.

Legal requirements same as rifles.. max is 10rds, min 18" barrel, 26" total..

5150Marcelo
09-22-2008, 9:01 AM
I think Saiga 12 is one of the cheapest tactical semi out there. I would recommend to get a used Benelli M1, but that would be 50% more than a Saiga 12.
Maybe try gunbroker.com for some less popular brands and models.

Legal requirements same as rifles.. max is 10rds, min 18" barrel, 26" total..

Please show me where the Saiga 12's are 50% cheaper than the M1.
Linky?

mike452
09-22-2008, 9:23 AM
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110569004

M1s cost 50% more than Saiga 12 is not the same as Saiga 12's 50% cheaper than the M1.

SVRider
09-22-2008, 10:12 AM
I think Saiga 12 is one of the cheapest tactical semi out there. I would recommend to get a used Benelli M1, but that would be 50% more than a Saiga 12.
Maybe try gunbroker.com for some less popular brands and models.

Legal requirements same as rifles.. max is 10rds, min 18" barrel, 26" total..

I think you are failing to factor in the costs to make it Cali legal as well as the costs to bring it into the state (FFL to FFL).....

By the time you do that, you've probably exceeded the cost of a local M1 PPT, and are probably about par with one coming in from out of state...


For a relatively inexpensive semi (I am assuming you are talking short barrelled) look at an 11-87 if you can't find a reasonable M1S90. Otherwise, I recently also picked up a Mossberg 930, but haven't had a chance to shoot it yet ($425OTD PPT). All the reviews I've read so far say they are very reliable (plus it doesn't hurt as bad if it needed to be used and the police had to take it away, rather than one of my Benellis). You can find them out of state for close to that, but need to add shipping and FFL costs.

HTH!

Bongos
09-22-2008, 10:14 AM
Any Semi-shotgun even in used condition will cost over $500

I'd look at the Remington 1100, I sold my 11-87 tactical not too long ago for $700

lokmeup
09-22-2008, 10:40 AM
Saiga 12 average price $600 (yeah they can be found for a little less)

Have it shipped to Henderson Defense $20
Henderson installs bullet button $30
Ship it to your FFL $20
DROS $75
----------------
Total $745

Remember you're saving any CA taxes this way also!

SJgunguy24
09-22-2008, 11:47 AM
Why ship it to Henderson??? Ask around,you never know they might install the mag lock themselves. Depending on the vendor, of course.
That will save on shipping and FFL fees.

AJAX22
09-22-2008, 12:00 PM
Any Semi-shotgun even in used condition will cost over $500

I'd look at the Remington 1100, I sold my 11-87 tactical not too long ago for $700

Not true, I frequently purchase older semi auto shotguns for around $100-200. and I probably have at least a half dozen of them now..

My personal favorite is the Remington Model 11 (identical to the browning Auto 5) It is a JMB design and runs more reliably than most modern production firearms.

I prefer the 11 to the 1100 because I think the long recoil system is more reliable than a gas operated system.

The remmy 11 is just a champ all around.

They routinely show up on gun broker for 200 or less, in used/worn but serviceable shape.

mike452
09-22-2008, 12:44 PM
Not true, I frequently purchase older semi auto shotguns for around $100-200. and I probably have at least a half dozen of them now..



Awesome deal! The best deal I ever got was a HP laser printer from office depot that I made $50 after two rebates. Nothing on guns yet.....

AJAX22
09-22-2008, 1:06 PM
Yep, the M11 really is one of the best values that can be found in a shotgun... I really should keep my mouth shut and just buy em when they show up cheap so the prices I have to pay stay low.... but I like them so much I can't stay quiet.

Oh, just for the record, I have an S-12 saiga as well and I've played with a benelli, and they are tacticool and neat... but the Remmy 11 is more fun to shoot.

I had a locating pin fall off one time when I was adjusting the friction ring on the Remmy 11 and without me noticing it fell into the action of the gun. I put 100 or so rounds through it with the pin floating around inside the action without it missing a beat. (didn't find the pin untill I dissasembled it for cleaning when I got home)

Browning guns are designed to last foreaver if properly maintained.

scotthmt
09-22-2008, 5:26 PM
thanks guys! Now off to search!

vinny_land
09-22-2008, 10:25 PM
Mossberg 930 (SPX preferred)

5968
09-22-2008, 11:19 PM
I would look at a Reminton 11-87.

scr83jp
09-23-2008, 7:49 AM
Well i've got the hankering for a semi auto shotgun to add to my earthquake preparedness kit aka shtf set. I feel a semi shotgun will be most effective and i'd like to somewhat tactical it out, pistol grip and forward light. I would love a saiga 12 but we all know how expensive those things are. So can someone recomend me a cheaper semi auto shotgun?

Also, whats the maximum amound of rounds that a shotgun is legally able to accept? And what is the shortest legnth that it can be? Barrel and OAL?

Please forgive my noobishness, i've only shot a shotgun once but i am fairly competent with ak building and AR's aswell with pistols of the like.I have a 1950's ithaca 16g pump & a 1924 winchester model 12 12g pump that will outshoot a semiauto .Limited to 3 rounds if hunting game, 5 rounds for other purposes & there are extended mag tubes available for some brands of shotguns.

masterB
09-23-2008, 10:38 AM
I would look at a Reminton 11-87.

+1!

ar15barrels
09-23-2008, 3:14 PM
Mossberg 930 cut down and choke tubed if you want to really shoot fast, or an SPX if you just want it to look cool...

Fuzzy5
09-23-2008, 7:58 PM
+1 on the Mossy 930. I'm looking for an SPX if anyone's selling.

Another one I like, though overpriced these days, is the FN SLP. I can't believe no one's mentioned the Benellis. There seem to be a decent number of used M1s coming up now and then.

Suvorov
09-23-2008, 9:00 PM
I would look at a Reminton 11-87.


+2

I have had my 11-87P for 10 years now and it has proven to be totally reliable. I purchased rifled sights and then later installed tritium sights and a surfire forend. By swapping out the barrel and magazine tube, I can have it converted to a typical synthetic duck gun in about 5 minutes. The gas system does wonders to reduce the recoil and one can shoot target loads all day without any bruising on the shoulder.

It may not be the latest Tacticool shotgun on the market, but it certainly is Louis Awerbuck approved.

http://www.remingtonle.com/shotguns/1187.htm
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110895783

JeffM
09-23-2008, 9:13 PM
Yep, the M11 really is one of the best values that can be found in a shotgun... I really should keep my mouth shut and just buy em when they show up cheap so the prices I have to pay stay low.... but I like them so much I can't stay quiet.

Oh, just for the record, I have an S-12 saiga as well and I've played with a benelli, and they are tacticool and neat... but the Remmy 11 is more fun to shoot.

I had a locating pin fall off one time when I was adjusting the friction ring on the Remmy 11 and without me noticing it fell into the action of the gun. I put 100 or so rounds through it with the pin floating around inside the action without it missing a beat. (didn't find the pin untill I dissasembled it for cleaning when I got home)

Browning guns are designed to last foreaver if properly maintained.

+1

Recently got a good deal on a Remington 1148 - same lines as the 1100, but the same long action of a Model 11 or A5. And uses a lots of the same small parts as the 870.

It's a beautiful gun, with matching # original barrel, dated to 1955. I was going to cut the barrel to 18.25" and add a magazine extension, but it's in too good of shape for that :(

Now I'm looking for a spare barrel to cut down when I have some cash.

My inspiration: http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=135335

apbrian112
09-23-2008, 9:14 PM
i love my M1S90... it's been worked over by rob melhorn and is sweet as all get out.

JeffM
09-23-2008, 9:30 PM
Also, whats the maximum amound of rounds that a shotgun is legally able to accept? And what is the shortest legnth that it can be? Barrel and OAL?

Forgot to add some answers here:

Max rounds is 10, like any other magazine in CA (except .22 tube feds). There may be 922r issues with imports. IIRC there was someone making custom US parts for one of the Benellis (M4?) to be able to extent the mag capacity.

Minimum barrel length is 18"

Minimum OAL: I don't recall if there was a limit.

randy
09-24-2008, 1:37 AM
I don't believe his budget is there for a Benelli.

My second choice for a semi would be the Mossberg. Cheaper than a Remington, and I'll give it the nod for reliabilty. Make a few modifications to it and it could be a really good shotgun.

AJAX22
09-24-2008, 7:09 AM
minimum OAL is 26 inches (federal law)

Here are some $200 or so C&R M11's

I haven't looked at auto 5's but... you should be able to find those ;)

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110837668 (this is the one I'd buy)

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=111026713

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110795879

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=111175061 no reserve curently at $50 bucks but will go up before it ends.


If you want to build an exact replica of bonnie parkers whippet gun, here is a 20 gauge

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=111112530

AJAX22
09-24-2008, 7:16 AM
Dirt cheap browning auto 5 with one day left and no reserve ($100)

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110725358

another no reserve gun at $116 with six days left

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=111172644

Baron
09-24-2008, 8:25 AM
I'd say look for a Mossberg 930 combo.
I see them all the time on gunbroker they usually come with a 18.5" barrel and a 28" vent rib barrel....

Sounds great for SHTF to me. 18.5 for defense and 28" to get food or clays;)

I'm hoping this will be my next shotgun

ar15barrels
09-24-2008, 9:11 AM
I can't believe no one's mentioned the Benellis. There seem to be a decent number of used M1s coming up now and then.

The op basically excluded them when he said this:

So can someone recomend me a cheaper semi auto shotgun?

E. Fudd
09-24-2008, 12:50 PM
Well i've got the hankering for a semi auto shotgun to add to my earthquake preparedness kit aka shtf set. I feel a semi shotgun will be most effective and i'd like to somewhat tactical it out, pistol grip and forward light. I would love a saiga 12 but we all know how expensive those things are. So can someone recomend me a cheaper semi auto shotgun?

Also, whats the maximum amound of rounds that a shotgun is legally able to accept? And what is the shortest legnth that it can be? Barrel and OAL?

Please forgive my noobishness, i've only shot a shotgun once but i am fairly competent with ak building and AR's aswell with pistols of the like.

1. Rem. M-11: I find them slower to reload under stress than the 1100/11-87/870. As I recall, one has to press a button to release the lifter thingie to load into the mag tube. Accessories like extended mag tubes, pistol grip stocks, and white lights may be more difficult to find than for the newer models.

2. As you probably know, there are some semi auto shotguns that will cycle either heavy, full-loads or light target loads, but some have problems cycling both reliably. So keep that in mind (what ammo you plan to load primarily, what ammo would you be most likely be able to scrounge up in a worse case SHTF scenario).

3. For max capacity, 10 rd. is for detachable magazine fed semi-auto shotguns. As far as I know, there is know limit on mag tube fed shotguns, but I could be wrong...

4. For SHTF scenarios I'd prefer a rifle, higher capacity, faster reloads, even your basic 10 round mag setup. Longer range, as well.

5. Consider a pump action shotgun. Generally less expensive. You can spend the difference on accessories or ammo. Over the last 20 years shooting 3-gun, I've seen just about every make of semi's have cycling problems. Not all, but a few here and there: Benelli's, Remingtons (the dominent SA's) with major cycling issues, or problems causing DNF's.

6. If you must have a shotgun in the inventory, I'd suggest a high quality pump action like a Rem. 870P with rifle sights or ghost aperature rear sights. Plenty of accessories available. A tad better reliability. Ability to feed and shoot the heavy loads as well as the lightest target loads reliably. With rear sights, one can use it as an effective short range rifle shooting slugs.

SuperSet
09-24-2008, 3:16 PM
I'd say look for a Mossberg 930 combo.
I see them all the time on gunbroker they usually come with a 18.5" barrel and a 28" vent rib barrel....

Sounds great for SHTF to me. 18.5 for defense and 28" to get food or clays;)

I'm hoping this will be my next shotgun

I've been looking for the Mossberg 930s also but have only found the 930 Turkey (85235) model so far. It seems like it'd be a good starting shotgun.
Choate makes magazine extensions for the 930 now so getting up to 8+1 isn't a problem.

How much does it usually cost in gunsmithing fees to chop a 28" barrel down to 18.5" and subsequently, re-thread for chokes?

ar15barrels
09-24-2008, 3:25 PM
How much does it usually cost in gunsmithing fees to chop a 28" barrel down to 18.5" and subsequently, re-thread for chokes?

I would cut it to about 21" or so to match up with that 8 round magazine tube.
18" matches up with a 7 round tube.

$100ish to shorten/thread for choke tubes plus your choice of choke tube.
I am all setup for the thinwall tru-chokes. ;)

SuperSet
09-24-2008, 7:37 PM
Cool, thx ar15b. It doesn't sound too expensive for the whole dealy-o.
BTW, I spoke to a dealer today who mentioned that the 930 would not take a magazine extension so you'd stay stuck at 4+1. That sounds wrong since Choate specifically states that an extension is available for this model. Can anyone confirm?

ar15barrels
09-24-2008, 8:29 PM
Cool, thx ar15b. It doesn't sound too expensive for the whole dealy-o.
BTW, I spoke to a dealer today who mentioned that the 930 would not take a magazine extension so you'd stay stuck at 4+1. That sounds wrong since Choate specifically states that an extension is available for this model. Can anyone confirm?

I can confirm that Dave Lawver has put a magazine extension on one.
He most likely made it though.
That would be where I would get a mag extension from anyways, WAY better quality than Choate/Tacstar...

coreywhazu
09-24-2008, 10:55 PM
Someone let me know if I'm right about this...

1. It is legal to have a pump action shotgun with vertical grip, folding stock, and a pistol grip.

2. It is legal to have a mag. fed shotgun as long as it has a mag lock (bullet button).

3. I is legal to have a semiauto shotgun with a pistol grib and a vertical grip.

Sorry for the stupid noob question...

workinwifdakids
10-26-2008, 12:39 PM
1. It is legal to have a pump action shotgun with vertical grip, folding stock, and a pistol grip.
Yes. Don't forget the bayonet.

randy
10-26-2008, 4:51 PM
The Mossberg 930 is the way to go for an inexpensive semi shotgun. I would do what Randall suggests and get the field model and chop the barrel to a length that the tube would hold 8 rounds. Then if you want to shoot some shotgun matches you have a shotgun ready to go and only an inch or 2 longer than their ghetto blaster model.
I am not a fan of Mossy pumps but the reliablity of the semi made me a believer.

I would stay away from the Remy's 1100 they do have reliability problems and require maintenance and parts replacment is part of that. The 11 87 is more robust but still not on the list for me. I've owned them both and seen them in action they fail pretty regularly.

The Mossy needs some some additional work if I were going to use it in competition but not alot and I wouldn't try and make it a Benelli just make it better than stock.

AngelDecoys
10-26-2008, 5:20 PM
My personal favorite is the Remington Model 11 (identical to the browning Auto 5) It is a JMB design and runs more reliably than most modern production firearms.

Yup, great gun. I have one as well (grandfather's) made in 1906. Works like a champ and has never let me down in the field.

I have had my 11-87P for 10 years now and it has proven to be totally reliable.

I'm a big fan of my 11-87P as well. Its a righty shotgun, and I'm left handed. I actually like being able to glance into the breach to visually see the action.

Which brings up the question. scotthmt. I didn't see from your post whether you are a lefty or righty? If you go the 11-87 route (and are a lefty), the safety does not swap to the other side. I had to scrounge for an aftermarket safety.

Or have you already bought the shotgun since the thread is a month old?

supermario
11-07-2008, 7:25 PM
The Stoeger 2000 shotgun goes for around $550 and it is cool looking. It is inertia driven operatings system just like Benellis, and its owned by the same company so thats why it can use Benellis patent inertia driven system. The defense model come in all black with a pistol grip and has 4 or 5 rnds, but you can buy an extension tube and add 4 more rounds. Personally i think thats a great deal. And super reliable shotgun for half the price of others.