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View Full Version : Romanian PSL 7.62x54R can pull 1MOA? Was it just a Fluke?


Stubbie
09-15-2008, 11:32 PM
Just watched these videoes (did not make them):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qluUkOXwzfI&feature=related and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktaH0kdKV80&feature=related

From all my firearm forum lurking, I was under that impression that PSL have terrible accuracy with its grouping around 4 or 6 MOA. Recently been doing some digging, and found that there people getting great milage from their PSL.
Is it because the quality varies greatly from gun to gun in military surplus rifles where one can shoot 1 moa while the other can't hit paper? Or is the quality is fairly consistent and have I been living a lie which means I need to order a cal-legal PSL ASAP from coldwarshooters.com?
Any inputs are welcomed, thanks in advance. (Really, you guys at calguns are my saviors and the reason that I got into shooting.) :D:D:D

69Mach1
09-15-2008, 11:53 PM
Go here.
http://www.dragunov.net/

Richy
09-15-2008, 11:57 PM
Yes, PSL's DO pull off 1moa, I've done it time and time again. They are great weapons.

TurboFall
09-16-2008, 4:44 AM
I've heard they're honestly just as accurate as Dragunovs. Most people who get 4-6MOA probably feed it surplus ammo, which 99% of is delinked MG ammunition.

Supposedly Russian 7n1, Wolf, and Czech silvertips all get sub-1.5MOA.

DrunkSkunk
09-16-2008, 5:03 AM
We were shooting sellier and bellot ammo and getting 1-1.5moa out of the PSL, I was pretty ****ing impressed.

akjunkie
09-16-2008, 9:38 AM
what Vendor in southern cali (LA/Orange county) carries the PSL and how much?

ucla_jtsuei
09-16-2008, 10:56 AM
I'm done 1-1.5" groups with my PSL at hundred yards, too. I was using 7n1, and accuracy was definitely better than with Russian and Bulgarian light ball surplus.

trinydex
09-16-2008, 1:53 PM
isn't the psl only 1 moa or so?

marxdspot
09-16-2008, 3:17 PM
LOL! Try Ammo Bros. They usually have 'em. Last time I check, about a two months ago for a friend of mine, it was about $900 or so.

what Vendor in southern cali (LA/Orange county) carries the PSL and how much?

Jarhead
09-16-2008, 8:58 PM
how many rounds after ten the skinny barrel turns into spaghetti

berg
09-17-2008, 9:08 AM
Yeah it all depends on who's shooting and it and what kind of ammo they are using. The guy who mentioned surplus ammo is right on. Would you rather shoot bullets costing 25 cents or 75 cents each? Most people choose the former but still expect the performance of match ammo.

It's hard to get the PSL to perform like that out of the box though. If you swap in the US-made trigger, carefully check for wood contact on the barrel from the lower handguard, and make sure your scope is properly tightened to the scope rail, you have a chance of getting some nice accurate groups.

Hamster16
09-17-2008, 9:38 AM
wait a second the psl-54c is legal in california? i emailed jgsales.com about buying one and transferring it to a local dealer and they told me they are illegal in california because of the thumb hole stock. is this true and if not then does anyone know of any dealers in california that sell them.

EBR Works
09-17-2008, 10:04 AM
Call Chris at LanWorld.

http://lanworldinc.com/index.htm

He can order it for you, remove the stock and ship it disassembled to your FFL. When you take delivery, install an AK bullet button....

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=93866

... and reinstall the stock. Now it's Cali legal.

You just need to find a local FFL that will do the DROS. Look here:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=63050

Chris is going to order one for me from Century Arms. It is item # RI1439 at the bottom of this page:

http://www.centuryarms.biz/products.asp?cat=54&pg=2

wksun88
09-17-2008, 11:04 AM
I may be interested in purchasing one as well. Impactco, do you mind if I ask you how much it was?

EBR Works
09-17-2008, 11:20 AM
I talked to Chris' assistant Maria just 5 minutes ago and she is checking on a price for us.

I emailed the link to this thread to her so she can jump in with more info.

EBR Works
09-17-2008, 3:14 PM
From Maria at LanWorld:

Here is the breakdown of the cost of this to you:

$805.00 for the rifle.
$30.00 for the raddlock
$25.00 for shipping
$10.00 for CFLC - California only.

$870.00 total. I called Century and they do have them in stock.

Maria.

I ordered mine. Call her at 801-878-4880 if interested.

http://www.jgsales.com/images/1%20Romanian%20PSL-54C%20762X54R%20W%20scope%201501463.jpg

Toten Kopf
09-17-2008, 3:41 PM
1 MOA, at what distance. I have shot the SVD, and PSL and neither could hold 1 MOA beyond 350 - 400 yards.

Once you start shooting at longer distances they both open up like a can of worms.

And no, I won't argue about this, if they were "that' great, they would be used as "real" sniper/target rifles which they aren't. A well tuned AR15 will outshoot them all day...even at 600 yards and beyond.

Toten Kopf
09-17-2008, 8:51 PM
After reviewing the "youtube" video's, I say "BS". The PSL is incapable of shooting what they show...

600 meters has a far better group than 400 meters..."BS".

Like I said, I have shot the SVD and the PSL and they are not capable of shooting the groups shown.

Here is an example...

My Tikka .308, 10 shots at 7500 yards. Heck, it's on the internet so it must be true!

http://www.gunco.net/gallery/data/500/MVC-579F.JPG

http://www.gunco.net/gallery/data/500/target4c.jpg

EBR Works
09-18-2008, 6:07 PM
Interesting review of the Century PSL here for anyone that cares:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_/ai_n13469625

virulosity
09-18-2008, 10:20 PM
There is a difference between shooting a "dragunov" and shooting it the way it was designed to be used. The barrel is not free floating. Because of this you must use a specially designed bipod that attaches to the receiver, or support it resting on the magazine. These rifles are capable of sub MOA if you do it right, but no they will not beat a floating AR-10 with good ammo.

69Mach1
09-18-2008, 10:44 PM
According to the internet, the Dragunov is good out past 1000 yards and can take out squads of soldiers. In the right hands, it's deadly accurate. Maybe these hands. :)
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/PxXu8c-BNnE&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/PxXu8c-BNnE&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

sb_pete
09-18-2008, 11:12 PM
According to the internet, the Dragunov is good out past 1000 yards and can take out squads of soldiers. In the right hands, it's deadly accurate. Maybe these hands. :)
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/PxXu8c-BNnE&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/PxXu8c-BNnE&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

ROFLMAO! :rolleyes:

Spotter looks at soldier specks in the distance down the steep incline of mountainous terrain with variable winds, squints eyes - 1000YDS! Yep, I'm sure.

Sly kneels down and semi-hasty wraps his captured SVD, places inner third joint of trigger finger over trigger, squints into scope, mentally accounts for the wind, incline, distance, moving target, and the effect of the steep incline on the position of the man running full tilt at a diagonal to him across uneven terrain at 1000 yds. An instant later, he slaps off a shot.

Spotter squints into distance and calls shot - "spotting scope, schplotting scope I say!"

Sly adjusts and jerks off the next shot, music builds, enemy Rusky becomes good Rusky as his full tilt forward run is instantly reversed into a flying backwards sprawl. Yeah, go Rambo! :rolleyes:

... God I love Hollywood...

sb_pete
09-18-2008, 11:20 PM
After reviewing the "youtube" video's, I say "BS". The PSL is incapable of shooting what they show...
...

My Tikka .308, 10 shots at 7500 yards. Heck, it's on the internet so it must be true!
http://www.gunco.net/gallery/data/500/MVC-579F.JPG


Eh, take it for what its worth. Dragunov type rifles are meant to be DMR's. They are supposed to provide effective semi-automatic fire against man sized targets out to 600 meters. At that they excel. Are you going to be shooting clay pigeons at 1000yds with one, no. but you can use it to shoot very very VERY cheap surplus ammo at 100 or 200 yds and have fun for far less than .308, then swap out to 7n1 or the like (or handloads) and compete with similarly priced M1A's all day long (oh wait, $900 M1A...). Seriously, they are a hell of a bargain for what they are.

On a side note, semi-thread jack, what is the deal with those sling things that run across the top of the barrel on Tikkas?

elSquid
09-19-2008, 1:19 AM
On a side note, semi-thread jack, what is the deal with those sling things that run across the top of the barrel on Tikkas?

http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2008/05/31/mirage-shields-dont-leave-home-without-one/

-- Michael

Toten Kopf
09-19-2008, 7:35 AM
Eh, take it for what its worth. Dragunov type rifles are meant to be DMR's. They are supposed to provide effective semi-automatic fire against man sized targets out to 600 meters. At that they excel. Are you going to be shooting clay pigeons at 1000yds with one, no. but you can use it to shoot very very VERY cheap surplus ammo at 100 or 200 yds and have fun for far less than .308, then swap out to 7n1 or the like (or handloads) and compete with similarly priced M1A's all day long (oh wait, $900 M1A...). Seriously, they are a hell of a bargain for what they are.

On a side note, semi-thread jack, what is the deal with those sling things that run across the top of the barrel on Tikkas?


I was just having some fun, your statement is pretty much on the button. When I was shooting the SVD and PSL, the biggest problem was shot dispersion at targets beyond 450 yards.

Meaning that using man size targets, I would get one or two good hits then remaing shots would be off target (POA). Yes, a man size target can be hit with these rifles but not with any of the accuracy that I want for the cost of these rifles.

Would I own one of them, no, well, maybe. Replacement parts are the biggest problem as there are none. Also, the ammunition doesn't lend itself to "great" accuracy as say the .308.

The main thing is my objection to people showing long range groups that were shot with the PSL that would rival a high grade target rifle which of course it won't.

Jarhead
09-19-2008, 8:16 AM
or an M-14, Fal....

saki302
09-19-2008, 8:17 AM
The main thing is my objection to people showing long range groups that were shot with the PSL that would rival a high grade target rifle which of course it won't.

If they use good ammo and shoot enough- you sometimes get lucky :D

My .308 bolt gun put 3 in the same hole at 100 yards on a sandbag once (0 MOA?!?). I don't know if I will ever duplicate that one :D

-Dave

Toten Kopf
09-19-2008, 11:07 AM
Like most things, the more you practice the better you get. However, equipment can/will limit the shooter at some point.

I shot the M14 for the military and it's a fine rifle as is the FAL. I can afford the FAL but not the M1A1.

I picked up a FAL from a friend who was cleaning out his vault, it's a Century but it has never failed to fire of functioned incorrectly. In the purchase was about 300-500 rounds of surplus ammunition. The rifle shot horrible groups and at first thought that it was the rifle but after trying some handloaded ammo from another .308 that I own, the results were quite satisfactory.

http://www.gunco.net/gallery/data/500/MVC-127X2.JPG

http://www.gunco.net/gallery/data/500/MVC-126X2.JPG

I would expect the PSL to shoot as well as the FAL...

sb_pete
09-19-2008, 5:06 PM
http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2008/05/31/mirage-shields-dont-leave-home-without-one/

-- Michael

Ohhhhhhhh. That makes so much more sense now, I was thinking it was some kind of funky sling thing. I had only seen them on fully targeted out tikkas and anschutz rifles so I figured it was maybe some euro thing. Mirage shield - that makes much more sense [thumps head].
Thanks!

Toten Kopf
09-19-2008, 10:33 PM
When shooting over 600 yards at a P-Dog the heat from the barrel can/will create heat waves which will cause the image in the scope to become unclear.

It's actually a black piece of stretchable material that is hooked to the action and front sight mount (which I don't use).

The mirage band deflects the heat waves from the scopes line of sight which allows a clear image. You will have a hard time focusing on any target at any distance without one. Unless you are able to keep the barrel cool which will prevent the heat waves.