CA Dual Residency

[tetris]

I am a university student that spends time in both my home state (CA) and another state where I go to school. As such, I believe that I fit the ATF requirements for dual-state residency for handgun purchases::
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b13

The issue is that I converted my driver's license to another state. However, after reading the 2008 California Vehicle Codes:
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/vc/tocd6c1a5.htm
I think I should be able to get a CA ID card in addition to my out of state license (I could be wrong). As far as proof of residency, I also have utilities in my name at home in CA.

Does anybody know if I'm missing something here with respect to CA law and Vehicle Code regulations? In other words, should I be able to get a CA ID card and pass the DOJ check after presenting my proof of residency at the point of sale? Or is there some requirement buried in the code that I must surrender my out of state license to get as CA ID card? I don't plan on selling or transferring anything at a later date, so I am not worried about violating federal dealer requirements.

[Riodog]

What you're doing is perfectly legal. YOU are a resident of whichever state you are in at the time you are there. You may be a gun legally in that state.

The only question that has not been answered is a question of registration. If for some reason you come to the attention of a CALIF LE, will they accept the registration of your gun in AZ with going ballistic if it not being registered in Calif. I would surmize that having the proper ID from the state that your gun is registered in would suffice however as a rule CALIF is such dictatorial entity that they may be a**holes about it.

I Have weapons registered to myself in another state and usually just leave them there at the house. Very seldom do I bring anything back to Calif with me. I do make a habit of taking my Calif registered guns when I go.
Rio

[ElvenSoul]

be smart and write a letter to the CA DOJ and ask the nazi dictators I mean state officials what you should do.

[Splinter]

Just leave them in the other state, than transfer them into ca when your done. Maybe bring a few extras for us :D

[hoffmang]

You should have no issues receiving a CA ID card and what you are doing is exactly legal and expected under both Federal and State law.

-Gene

[Riodog]

You should have no issues receiving a CA ID card and what you are doing is exactly legal and expected under both Federal and State law.

-Gene

Neener, neener, neener, I've been doin it this way for years. Since 1984 to be exact and I've never had any problem, question, nor has anyone raised an eyebrow. This includes the states of Texas, Oklahoma, and Arizona.
Rio

[eltee]

Hypothetical.

I attend college away from where I was raised and where my family still lives. I attend the Univ. of Nevada in LV, my family still lives in Newport Beach, California. I am 8 months in Nev, 4 months in Calif. on an average year. I have a Nev. driver's license, a car registered in Nev., a rental (year long) apt. in Nev. and a Nev. CCW. In order to cash checks, etc. in California can I still get a California ID card?

I legally purchase a pistol as a Nevada resident from a Nevada gunshop. College ends, I return home to California to pursue fame and fortune. The pistol I bought at the Nevada gunstore is now considered used. Can I keep it? Can I sell it through a dealer and have it DROS'd as a PPT used gun even if the pistol is not on the "approved" list? (I have given up my NV DL, car reg., NV resident CCW, etc.)

I know I can't bring back any "assault" weapons I legally buy in Nevada, etc. :( if I move permanently back home, but can I bring it in (while still in college in NV) as a "visitor" to go shooting or am I breaking the law just be bringing it across the state line temporarily?

This dual (state) residency has me confused still. I can get a ticket if I have my car registered in NV but have a Calif. driver's license, my Nev. CCW is worthless in Calif., so the biggest benefit to me of having dual residency is the ability to buy guns while I live in Nevada, but if I move back there are issues. :confused:

[gunsmith]

What you're doing is perfectly legal. YOU are a resident of whichever state you are in at the time you are there. You may be a gun legally in that state.

The only question that has not been answered is a question of registration. If for some reason you come to the attention of a CALIF LE, will they accept the registration of your gun in AZ with going ballistic if it not being registered in Calif. I would surmize that having the proper ID from the state that your gun is registered in would suffice however as a rule CALIF is such dictatorial entity that they may be a**holes about it.

I Have weapons registered to myself in another state and usually just leave them there at the house. Very seldom do I bring anything back to Calif with me. I do make a habit of taking my Calif registered guns when I go.
Rio They register guns in AZ? Since when?

[hoffmang]

This dual (state) residency has me confused still. I can get a ticket if I have my car registered in NV but have a Calif. driver's license, my Nev. CCW is worthless in Calif., so the biggest benefit to me of having dual residency is the ability to buy guns while I live in Nevada, but if I move back there are issues. :confused:

When you bring a handgun back to California with intent to reside you are required to send in the personal handgun importer form (http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/ab991frm.pdf). That's all.

-Gene

[6172crew]

here's one for ya, my ffl in nv said she would sell firearms if my Cdl had my Nevada address on it..what do you think?

[tetris]

here's one for ya, my ffl in nv said she would sell firearms if my Cdl had my Nevada address on it..what do you think?

Depends what you mean by firearms. Rifles and shotguns, that's perfectly legal. Handguns? That is somewhat questionable. Driver's license isn't the definition or standard of residency, so it could be legal if you have a home in the state. But if all you do is change your address, it would be illegal to buy handguns and then transport them into CA.

[6172crew]

Depends what you mean by firearms. Rifles and shotguns, that's perfectly legal. Handguns? That is somewhat questionable. Driver's license isn't the definition or standard of residency, so it could be legal if you have a home in the state. But if all you do is change your address, it would be illegal to buy handguns and then transport them into CA.

Nobody said anything about bringing fireams into CA but I might have to get a CDL for work but I was asking my FFL how I might be able to pick up my M16 when the tax stamp clears if ATT hires me back.

I dont think I have any issues with ATT jobs, they laid of 200+ people last month.:(

[zenmastar]

I am a university student that spends time in both my home state (CA) and another state where I go to school. As such, I believe that I fit the ATF requirements for dual-state residency for handgun purchases::
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b13

The issue is that I converted my driver's license to another state. However, after reading the 2008 California Vehicle Codes:
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/vc/tocd6c1a5.htm
I think I should be able to get a CA ID card in addition to my out of state license (I could be wrong). As far as proof of residency, I also have utilities in my name at home in CA.

Does anybody know if I'm missing something here with respect to CA law and Vehicle Code regulations? In other words, should I be able to get a CA ID card and pass the DOJ check after presenting my proof of residency at the point of sale? Or is there some requirement buried in the code that I must surrender my out of state license to get as CA ID card? I don't plan on selling or transferring anything at a later date, so I am not worried about violating federal dealer requirements.

Sounds like my roommate but the reverse (student in CA from another state). He had several problems. Out of state tuition fees are high, so financially it was much better to be a resident. Also, he did not have a home, rental agreement, bills to establish his residency from his home state. In the end, he just suffers like most.

[tetris]

Sounds like my roommate but the reverse (student in CA from another state). He had several problems. Out of state tuition fees are high, so financially it was much better to be a resident. Also, he did not have a home, rental agreement, bills to establish his residency from his home state. In the end, he just suffers like most.

I imagine they are much stricter about in-state tuition for obvious reasons. Out of state tuition is basically the cash cow that keeps the University of California system afloat.

[hawk1]

They register guns in AZ? Since when?

No Texas registration either...

[Riodog]

They register guns in AZ? Since when?

Don't be one of those persons that wants to pick everything anyone says to shreds. When I fill out the paperwork they won't let me put down John Doe! Whether they do or don't isn't the issue here. When I fill out the paper work there I don't know and really don't give a damn where or to whom it goes. I just know that that particular weapon was legally purchased in that particular state at the time of purchase.

It doesn't matter what you bring into the states that I referred to however Calif is another story. What I was stating was that you can bring weapons FROM Calif to the other states BUT you had better comply with the laws of Calif when you bring them here.

It wasn't always this way in this idiotic state. I've been at this for over 30 years and before all of this government intervention I just had to have a D/L in whatever state I owned a home in. At one point it was Calif., Az., Tx., and Ok. About 89 or 90, (I don't remember) it was required that we turned in any other d/l licenses except from your home state and then they replaced them with state ID cards.
Rio

[gunsmith]

Don't be one of those persons that wants to pick everything anyone says to shreds.



not my intention to pick things apart, I thought that it was an important point.
In a debate I saw on Hannity & Colmes, Hannity let some idiot get away with saying NYC is "shall issue" because the have "premise permits" ...Even CA doesn't require permits to simply have one in your house, the guy didn't know the difference between ccw and having one in your home.

I don't reall want to pick things apart but I try to be accurate because its not only gunnies reading this forum.

[tetris]

not my intention to pick things apart, I thought that it was an important point.
In a debate I saw on Hannity & Colmes, Hannity let some idiot get away with saying NYC is "shall issue" because the have "premise permits" ...Even CA doesn't require permits to simply have one in your house, the guy didn't know the difference between ccw and having one in your home.

I don't reall want to pick things apart but I try to be accurate because its not only gunnies reading this forum.

Shall issue my arse. Even the permit to have one in your home isn't shall issue, its may issue. Same thing in MA, NY and many other north east states. Thats one thing Heller is going to change.

[Wulf]

So what's to stop a guy from Ca from registering for P.E. at a Nevada JC. Getting a NV ID, buying a bunch of guns then drop out on the first week of classes?

[tetris]

So what's to stop a guy from Ca from registering for P.E. at a Nevada JC. Getting a NV ID, buying a bunch of guns then drop out on the first week of classes?

Well, NV doesn't give state IDs unless you surrender your out of state DL. They are very strict about this. CA is not. Thats so CA can make sure all the illegals get their DL and IDs. Another thing that might stop you from that scheme would be if the ATF caught you... You have to actually have a legitimate home in both states.

[ke6guj]

Well, NV doesn't give state IDs unless you surrender your out of state DL. They are very strict about this. .

Doesn't look like this is accurate if you are a NV Seasonal Resident.

Note: The issuance of an identification card will automatically surrender your driving privileges or an identification card issued from another state whether the card is in your possession or not. This does not apply if you are a Seasonal Resident identification card applicant.
http://www.dmvnv.com/pdfforms/dlbook.pdf

[tetris]

Doesn't look like this is accurate if you are a NV Seasonal Resident.


http://www.dmvnv.com/pdfforms/dlbook.pdf

OK, good to know. I did not see that on their website. At first glance, it appears that there is no such provision.

[Riodog]

Tetris, for the most part D/L and I/D are separate issues. Actually, you can have both in Ca. You just can't have two D/Ls. This, as I suspect, was from all of the commercial drivers that had multiple D/Ls. (I was one of them although I had homes in all three states). I traded my D/L from Ok, Tx, in for I/D cards and kept my Ca D/L as my employer at the time required a Ca D/L. When I sold my homes in Ok and Tx I sent my I/D cards back. I now carry I/D from Az and D/L from Ca. I will be having a party when I call it quits in Ca and I hope every one attends. It'll be in Az.
Rio

[tetris]

Just wanted to post an update. About a year ago, I turned in my CA license for a license in another state. About two months ago, I applied for a CA ID card from the DMV and received that. In the past week, I used my newly issued CA ID card to buy a handgun in CA with a utility bill for my CA residence (same address as on the CA ID card). No problems after 10-day waiting period, I picked it up. Also important to note is that CA DMV is aware that my old license was exchanged for a license in another state (DMV canceled my CA DL) and the other state is a member of the REAL ID act which shares information with CA databases). Please note, I am an out-of-state college student, and so I fall under the ATF Rule 80-21 that is defined in the ATF 2005 guidebook.

Therefore, the conclusion is that dual residents with out-of-state DL and CA ID cards may successfully purchase guns in CA. Please note, to comply with ATF regulations for interstate transportation and acquisition of handguns for personal use (not for re-sale), you must also fall under ATF Rule 80-21--it is not enough to just receive a CA ID.

[journeyman]

Well, NV doesn't give state IDs unless you surrender your out of state DL. They are very strict about this. CA is not. Thats so CA can make sure all the illegals get their DL and IDs. Another thing that might stop you from that scheme would be if the ATF caught you... You have to actually have a legitimate home in both states.

not entirely accurate you can get a seasonal resident ID from NV without surrendering your CA DL its only when you Get a NV DL you have to surrender your CA DL and this factual because i have one

[journeyman]

already clarified I should have read further;)

[Seesm]

Weird I was gonna do a thread about something similar, so I will pop her in here to see what you all think.

This is NOT me BTW:

A Calififornia resident good friend of mine recently explained to me he had a I.D. and address from Arizona.

Anyway he cash and carried 2 ar's and 2 ak's from the parking lot of a gun show last year before even going inside. He now has them (the AR's) in California... i.e. The AK's he left in AZ he said (Hi Caps etc etc.)

I was thinking and told him... Ok it may be legal to own all that in AZ and for sure cool, but to have them here in CA seems like it would be illegal.

Am I right?

The place he has in AZ is a trailer park he drives his motorhome to and stay's in for awhile every year...

What are the cut and dry answers here, can you do this legally?


Begin again...

[NiteQwill]

Weird I was gonna do a thread about something similar, so I will pop her in here to see what you all think.

This is NOT me BTW:

A Calififornia resident good friend of mine recently explained to me he had a I.D. and address from Arizona.

Anyway he cash and carried 2 ar's and 2 ak's from the parking lot of a gun show last year before even going inside. He now has them (the AR's) in California... i.e. The AK's he left in AZ he said (Hi Caps etc etc.)

I was thinking and told him... Ok it may be legal to own all that in AZ and for sure cool, but to have them here in CA seems like it would be illegal.

Am I right?

The place he has in AZ is a trailer park he drives his motorhome to and stay's in for awhile every year...

What are the cut and dry answers here, can you do this legally?


Begin again...

California is a bit sticky. On a federal level, as long as you can legally buy a gun in one state as you can in your home state, you can bring them back and forth, legally. But California (state law) requires the resident to have ALL guns go through an FFL.

So, I have dual residency in NV and CA. I can buy all the guns I want in NV, but they must stay in NV or any other free state. I can also travel to Colorado and Utah, with my NV ID, and purchase guns there and bring them back to NV. I cannot bring any of the mentioned guns above back to California without first going through an FFL.

I have rifles and shotguns in NV that I keep at my house there. All perfectly legal.

[Seesm]

I'm moving in with NITEQWILL!! Thanks for the info good to know... I suspect the same AZ to CA for my Cali/az buddy? Him having his hi cap and non cali complient ar here is bad news yes?

[EMT007]

So, I have dual residency in NV and CA. I can buy all the guns I want in NV, but they must stay in NV or any other free state. I can also travel to Colorado and Utah, with my NV ID, and purchase guns there and bring them back to NV. I cannot bring any of the mentioned guns above back to California without first going through an FFL.

I have rifles and shotguns in NV that I keep at my house there. All perfectly legal.

Really? Any chance you could elaborate on how this? How can it be that someone that moves to CA can bring their guns with them (without any notification requirement even for long guns), but a dual resident can't move their guns about as they please?

[NiteQwill]

Really? Any chance you could elaborate on how this? How can it be that someone that moves to CA can bring their guns with them (without any notification requirement even for long guns), but a dual resident can't move their guns about as they please?

Because someone who MOVES to California is NOT a resident of California, yet. Since having dual residency applies to me, for example, I must abide by both state laws regarding firearms when living in each state.

A person may only acquire a firearm within the person’s own State, except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee's premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides. A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]

and

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs.php#9

[NiteQwill]

I'm moving in with NITEQWILL!! Thanks for the info good to know... I suspect the same AZ to CA for my Cali/az buddy? Him having his hi cap and non cali complient ar here is bad news yes?

Umm yes, having a high-cap magazine (not owned in Cali prior to 2000) and a non-compliant AR (or one on the list) is definitely a felony and jail time waiting to happen if he is caught.

[Seesm]

That is what I told him... thanks

[Sgt Raven]

here's one for ya, my ffl in nv said she would sell firearms if my Cdl had my Nevada address on it..what do you think?

Do you mean Ca DL or CDL? My Ca DL (California Drivers License) is a CDL (Commercial Drivers License). ;)

[DDT]

But California (state law) requires the resident to have ALL guns go through an FFL.

So, I have dual residency in NV and CA. I can buy all the guns I want in NV, but they must stay in NV or any other free state. I can also travel to Colorado and Utah, with my NV ID, and purchase guns there and bring them back to NV. I cannot bring any of the mentioned guns above back to California without first going through an FFL.

I have rifles and shotguns in NV that I keep at my house there. All perfectly legal.


This is completely wrong. If you have valid legal residency in NV you can bring your guns across as a visitor, if you prefer to have the guns be CA resident (here all the time) then handguns will have to be registered for $19 with DOJ. No FFL ever needed. (except the one in NV where you buy the guns.)

Guns that aren't legal in CA cannot be brought in as visitor or newly resident. S, no named AWs no "evil feature" AWs.

Here is a webpage the AG has put together to explain moving a gun into CA. http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/ab991.php

I would recommend registering any handgun you bring in because you are a resident and there's no reason to risk having to prove the gun is only visiting and isn't actually staying in the state. The $20 reg fees will be very small compared to the court costs associated with angering a DA in this case.

[Vin496]

This is completely wrong. If you have valid legal residency in NV you can bring your guns across as a visitor, if you prefer to have the guns be CA resident (here all the time) then handguns will have to be registered for $19 with DOJ. No FFL ever needed. (except the one in NV where you buy the guns.)

Guns that aren't legal in CA cannot be brought in as visitor or newly resident. S, no named AWs no "evil feature" AWs.

Here is a webpage the AG has put together to explain moving a gun into CA. http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/ab991.php

I would recommend registering any handgun you bring in because you are a resident and there's no reason to risk having to prove the gun is only visiting and isn't actually staying in the state. The $20 reg fees will be very small compared to the court costs associated with angering a DA in this case.

+1,

The laws aren't that hard to understand once you have the correct information.

[DDT]

Oh, and by the way the law requiring "personal importers" to register handguns gives 60 days from the arrival of the GUN into CA and makes no mention of the persons residency.

12072(f)(2)(A) On or after January 1, 1998, within 60 days of bringing a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person into this state, a personal handgun importer shall do one of the following:

[pfl101]

For later...

[NiteQwill]

This is completely wrong. If you have valid legal residency in NV you can bring your guns across as a visitor, if you prefer to have the guns be CA resident (here all the time) then handguns will have to be registered for $19 with DOJ. No FFL ever needed. (except the one in NV where you buy the guns.)
I appreciate the clarification, time to bring stuff back then! :thumbsup:

[d_hammy]

I posted this in another thread but thought I'd share it here as well.

As active duty military stationed here in Cali, I've purchased guns here and also off list handguns in my state of residence (Florida), while on vacation and brought them back to Cali. When I called the DOJ I was told I had a loophole being military and was advised I still use the new resident form but told to leave the 15 round clips in Florida.

[Seesm]

I appreciate the clarification, time to bring stuff back then! :thumbsup:

Bring it back to Cali or NV?