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View Full Version : Best bang for buck 308 rounds?


Mr. Magoo
09-01-2008, 6:12 PM
I am getting a rem 700 in 308 here shortly and am looking for affordable bulk rounds. I can only seem to find 7.62x39 which from what I understand is a very SIMILAR round but not EXACTLY the same. Something to do with head spacing or something rather.

Thanks.

Pugster
09-01-2008, 6:15 PM
It should be safe to use 7.62 x 51 in a 308 Winchester weapon but not always the other way around.

I usually buy my ammo from ammoman. You could also try Aimsurplus or J&G Sales.

My two cents.

5150Marcelo
09-01-2008, 6:16 PM
Just keep cruising the FS threads here. 308/7.62x51 nato ammo is ALL over this place.

UBFRAGD
09-01-2008, 6:20 PM
Stick to the cartoons..........

Tony.
09-01-2008, 6:42 PM
I am getting a rem 700 in 308 here shortly and am looking for affordable bulk rounds. I can only seem to find 7.62x39 which from what I understand is a very SIMILAR round but not EXACTLY the same. Something to do with head spacing or something rather.

Thanks.


.308 Winchester in NOT EVEN CLOSE to 7.62x39. Do not even think about shooting 7.62x39 in your .308 Winchester rifle. Bad things will happen.

7.62x51 is similar but not exactly .308 Winchester

5150Marcelo
09-01-2008, 6:43 PM
.308 Winchester in NOT EVEN CLOSE to 7.62x39. Do not even think about shooting 7.62x39 in your .308 Winchester rifle. Bad things will happen.

7.62x51 is similar but not exactly .308 Winchester

I think he meant 7.62x51 in his OP.

FMJBT
09-01-2008, 8:54 PM
For accuracy, best bang for the buck I have found is the Serbian made Prvi Partizan 168HPBT Match ammo. It normally goes for under $14.00 per box of 20, and compares favorably to much more expensive match ammo. I've had mixed results with their 175gr FMJBT rounds. Different batches will shoot differently. I think I got one batch with unbalenced bullets because they grouped all over the place. The 168's have all shot very well for me, I've heard rumors that they are loaded with Sierra 168 Match Kings.

5150Marcelo
09-01-2008, 8:58 PM
A few of us found some Federal Premium 150 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip 308's (green tipped) for .50 cents a round and came in the 500 round case! You guy missed out!

ghost
09-01-2008, 9:01 PM
military surplus,commercial made .308 is pretty expensive.

sb_pete
09-02-2008, 1:01 AM
For accuracy, best bang for the buck I have found is the Serbian made Prvi Partizan 168HPBT Match ammo. It normally goes for under $14.00 per box of 20, and compares favorably to much more expensive match ammo. I've had mixed results with their 175gr FMJBT rounds. Different batches will shoot differently. I think I got one batch with unbalenced bullets because they grouped all over the place. The 168's have all shot very well for me, I've heard rumors that they are loaded with Sierra 168 Match Kings.

I wish I could remember the thread, it may have been over on Snipershide, but it had confirmation from Sierra that Prvi was using their bullets in the 168gr Match. I think this is also the case with the 175gr loads, but the thread referred only to the 168gr stuff.

To the OP, Surplus stuff is generally the best deal. South African, Australian, and German stuff have been the best deal of late. I have had bad experiences with the Indian stuff. The German ammo attracts a magnet IIRC, so be aware of that if there are restrictions at the range you shoot at.

Here are some good sites to check for ammo prices:

AIM Surplus (http://www.aimsurplus.com/)
Ammunition To Go (http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/) (my favorite)
and Widener's Reloading (http://www.wideners.com/index.cfm)
ammoman (http://www.ammoman.com/)


As for the difference between .308 Win and 7.62x51mm NATO, read this (http://www.thegunzone.com/30cal.html). The bottom line is that if your firearm is chambered for .308, you can safely shoot 7.62NATO.

If your firearm is chambered for 7.62NATO on the other hand, then you should not shoot .308 Win unless you know what you are doing (if you are asking then you don't, so... don't). What if I do, you ask? Well grasshopper, your firearm could catastrophically explode in your face and kill you...

Hope that helps,
-Pete

aplinker
09-02-2008, 1:05 PM
Shooting cheap mil-surp out of a 700 essentially defeats the purpose.

Spend the money on the PRVI. It's the best bang for the buck as it's match quality and reasonably priced.

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 12:47 AM
Shooting cheap mil-surp out of a 700 essentially defeats the purpose.

Yep.

If you want a blasting gun to make lots of noise and use 308 ammo, just get a Socom 16.

If you want the accuracy that a bolt gun can give you, use good ammo.
Good ammo is not cheap.
Cheap ammo is rarely good.

sb_pete
09-06-2008, 1:29 AM
Shooting cheap mil-surp out of a 700 essentially defeats the purpose.

Depends on your purpose. Certainly, you don't want to shoot mil-surp exclusively. That WOULD defeat the purpose. But there's no harm in having it in addition to match ammo. It's much cheaper for a friend to fire off some rounds that way for one thing. Also, for plinking purposes within 100 or 200 yards, it won't make much difference. If you're shooting at paper for groups, then yeah, match ammo for sure. If you're out blasting some coke cans with friends, there's no harm in saving a little cash. Of course, if you get far enough out with those coke cans, you may miss often enough that the economics stop working in your favor;)

It can also be good practice ammo. One should be able to get everything in the 10 ring shooting offhand or sitting at 200 and 300 yards. You can and should work to do this with most mil-surp (maybe not that Indian crap tho).

-Pete

aplinker
09-06-2008, 3:16 AM
Barrel cost and life on a gun like a 700 isn't the same as a chrome lined battle rifle.

The accuracy expectation isn't, either.

That's all I'm referring to. I see nothing wrong with some plinking with 308, but if you're going to shoot it, it usually makes sense to match the ammo quality to the quality of the rifle.

Depends on your purpose. Certainly, you don't want to shoot mil-surp exclusively. That WOULD defeat the purpose. But there's no harm in having it in addition to match ammo. It's much cheaper for a friend to fire off some rounds that way for one thing. Also, for plinking purposes within 100 or 200 yards, it won't make much difference. If you're shooting at paper for groups, then yeah, match ammo for sure. If you're out blasting some coke cans with friends, there's no harm in saving a little cash. Of course, if you get far enough out with those coke cans, you may miss often enough that the economics stop working in your favor;)

It can also be good practice ammo. One should be able to get everything in the 10 ring shooting offhand or sitting at 200 and 300 yards. You can and should work to do this with most mil-surp (maybe not that Indian crap tho).

-Pete

Darklyte27
09-06-2008, 5:19 AM
I just got some 7.62x51 it was WWB 200 rds
http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Winchester_.308_7.62x51_147grn_FMJ.html

tommyid1
09-06-2008, 6:36 AM
handloads are your best bang for your buck.

EastBayRidge
09-06-2008, 6:46 AM
+1 tommyid1. You can get match quality ammo that's custom to your rifle for the cost of a few hours reloading and some load development. Over time, even after factoring in the reloading gear, price will be substantially less than factory ammo.

Prvi's not a bad substitute. I've shot the 308 out of my M1A to 200 yards with no problems, but I've read it quickly runs out of gas beyond 400. Brass is reloadable as well.

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 9:34 AM
It can also be good practice ammo. One should be able to get everything in the 10 ring shooting offhand or sitting at 200 and 300 yards. You can and should work to do this with most mil-surp

Good luck wit that. ;)
Most mil-surp 7.62x51 is going to be 2-3 MOA ammo.

sb_pete
09-06-2008, 10:34 AM
Good luck wit that. ;)
Most mil-surp 7.62x51 is going to be 2-3 MOA ammo.

LOL, yeah, I suppose I should qualify that. I mean an AQT 10 ring or something else with a 2 MOA X-ring and 4 MOA 10 ring. Not one o' them F-class targets. That def isn't made for blasting away wit' mil-surp.;)

-Pete

On another note, I don't see the point of the WWB in .308. $.50-$1 less per box than Prvi Match, but no where near as accurate. And then significantly more expensive than surplus? :shrug:

sandsnow
09-06-2008, 10:47 AM
If your firearm is chambered for 7.62NATO on the other hand, then you should not shoot .308 Win unless you know what you are doing (if you are asking then you don't, so... don't). What if I do, you ask? Well grasshopper, your firearm could catastrophically explode in your face and kill you...

Hope that helps,
-Pete

I don't know enough to argue this point, but I do wonder why the SAAMI site does not list this as a possible dangerous combo.

http://www.saami.org/Unsafe_Combinations.cfm

FMJBT
09-06-2008, 10:55 AM
+1 tommyid1. You can get match quality ammo that's custom to your rifle for the cost of a few hours reloading and some load development. Over time, even after factoring in the reloading gear, price will be substantially less than factory ammo.

Prvi's not a bad substitute. I've shot the 308 out of my M1A to 200 yards with no problems, but I've read it quickly runs out of gas beyond 400. Brass is reloadable as well.

I think maybe some of the earlier production runs of the Prvi may have had that problem. From my experience, the Prvi 168gr Match holds nearly the same point of impact as Federal Gold Medal Match and Lake City 7.62 Match at 1000 yards. Consistency seemed lower in the Prvi at that distance, but not by much.

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 10:57 AM
I do wonder why the SAAMI site does not list this as a possible dangerous combo.

http://www.saami.org/Unsafe_Combinations.cfm

Because in modern guns in good safe condition, it won't really matter.

sandsnow
09-06-2008, 11:02 AM
Because in modern guns in good safe condition, it won't really matter.


The article did mention something about weak actions, but wasn't clear on modern actions. I used to shoot Federal .308 match in my M1A and now I wondering if I was somehow just lucky.

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 11:08 AM
The article did mention something about weak actions, but wasn't clear on modern actions. I used to shoot Federal .308 match in my M1A and now I wondering if I was somehow just lucky.

The M1A is a modern action.
You can continue to do that without problems.

Just save all that once fired GMM brass for me. ;)

sb_pete
09-06-2008, 1:16 PM
I don't know enough to argue this point, but I do wonder why the SAAMI site does not list this as a possible dangerous combo.
http://www.saami.org/Unsafe_Combinations.cfm
Because in modern guns in good safe condition, it won't really matter.
The article did mention something about weak actions, but wasn't clear on modern actions. I used to shoot Federal .308 match in my M1A and now I wondering if I was somehow just lucky.
Yeah, there are very few guns I have ever heard or read about this being a problem in. Still, it's one of those things, the specs don't match up so you advise people to play it safe.

For what its worth, I read about problems in some of the Ishapore Enfields once though. Some other old mil-surps may have issues. Old sporting guns were likely chambered in .308 already and new guns will likely be fine. Again, the point here is that if your rifle is chambered in 7.62 NATO, ask someone knowledgeable before shooting .308 in it.

-Pete

hybridatsun350
09-06-2008, 1:45 PM
The Prvi 168gr Match is my vote as far as best bang for the buck. That stuff holds its own very well, but I was having a little bit of trouble with it once I got past about 600 yrds. It's good stuff, but it can't be compared to Federal GMM. Of course, it is less than half the price! :)

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 6:51 PM
The Prvi 168gr Match is my vote as far as best bang for the buck. That stuff holds its own very well, but I was having a little bit of trouble with it once I got past about 600 yrds. It's good stuff, but it can't be compared to Federal GMM. Of course, it is less than half the price! :)

My match loads with 155gr SMK's are costing me 37.5 cents a round.
0.00 brass
0.22 bullet
0.12 powder
0.035 primer

http://ar15barrels.com/gfx/coldbore.jpg

aplinker
09-06-2008, 8:46 PM
My match loads with 155gr SMK's are costing me 37.5 cents a round.
0.00 brass
0.22 bullet
0.12 powder
0.035 primer

http://ar15barrels.com/gfx/coldbore.jpg

Those are good prices... on top of it you put 0 as the brass cost, which isn't really a realistic comparison - unless you're lucky enough to find mountains of 308 brass.

Still, at $.45-50 you're doing well. Which I think shows how favorable the Prvi loadings are - match quality at $0.70

X-NewYawker
09-06-2008, 8:48 PM
Did anyone score any ammo deals in Ventura today?

AngelDecoys
09-06-2008, 9:10 PM
For what its worth, I read about problems in some of the Ishapore Enfields once though. Some other old mil-surps may have issues. Old sporting guns were likely chambered in .308 already and new guns will likely be fine. Again, the point here is that if your rifle is chambered in 7.62 NATO, ask someone knowledgeable before shooting .308 in it.

-Pete

You sure got this spot on. Be very careful on shooting .308 out of an old rifle chambered in 7.62. The chamber is bigger for dirt, mud, etc in those old military bolt rifles. My Ishy doesn't close on the SAMMI field guage for 7.62 NATO (the biggest), but closes on everything else. Closing on field .308 = excessive head space.

Translation. My Ishy is safe for 7.62 NATO, but has excessive headspace for .308. (Makes the cartriges bulge out near the base). I shoot soley 7.62 surplus out of that rifle.

ETA: Head space sizes
.308 GO 1.630"
.308 NO-GO 1.634"
7.62 GO 1.6355"
.308 FIELD 1.638"
7.62 NO-GO 1.6405"
7.62 FIELD 1.6455"

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 9:40 PM
Those are good prices... on top of it you put 0 as the brass cost, which isn't really a realistic comparison - unless you're lucky enough to find mountains of 308 brass.

Free brass is out there if you know where to look.
Last thursday I was at Angeles and Pasadena PD gave me 160 pieces of once fired Federal Gold Medal Match brass.
I just cleaned and sized it all today. :D

Anywhere there are LEO shooters, you should be able to score free brass if you ask the right way.

It's doubtful you would ever need more than 500 pieces of brass for any given bolt gun.
I have about 700 pieces of FC 308 now.
Some is 1x fired, but most of it is on 2 or 3 firings.
I can throw them away as I wear them out as people keep giving me more a little bit at a time.

Even if the Privi is only 70 cents a round, that does not make it a good deal if it won't shoot up to my requirements.
I need the ammo to be able to do better than MOA out to 1K to enable me to react to the wind and KNOW where my shot will fall if I do my wind work correctly.
I reload because I control the quality and not just because it's less expensive either.
I would still reload if it cost more than buying ammo if that's what it would take to meet my accuracy requirements.

532Fastback
09-06-2008, 9:49 PM
Yep.

If you want a blasting gun to make lots of noise and use 308 ammo, just get a Socom 16.

If you want the accuracy that a bolt gun can give you, use good ammo.
Good ammo is not cheap.
Cheap ammo is rarely good.

Is the Remington .308 Win considered cheap ammo or is it ok ammo/good?

ar15barrels
09-06-2008, 9:53 PM
Is the Remington .308 Win considered cheap ammo or is it ok ammo/good?

Depends on the bullet.
I had good accuracy out of Remington's premiere match 168gr SMK load.
If you are talking about the yellow box 150gr ball stuff, you might as well be using winchester white box.
It will be on-par with WWB.

532Fastback
09-06-2008, 9:55 PM
Depends on the bullet.
I had good accuracy out of Remington's premiere match 168gr SMK load.
If you are talking about the yellow box 150gr ball stuff, you might as well be using winchester white box.
It will be on-par with WWB.

damn ok, i bought two boxes today for when i get my new rifle and its 150gr its in a green and white box, not sure if its ball stuff.

vf111
09-07-2008, 12:38 AM
Stick to 308 ammo in that Remy 700. 7.62NATO ammo is not the same as 308 and if the Remy has a tight chamber the 7.62NATO rounds may not load. BTW, congrats on the new rifle and post pictures when you get 'er home!

technique
09-07-2008, 12:48 AM
For bolt guns like my R700, I like Black hills Match 168gr.

For Cheap plinkin in semi's I like South African surplus ammo.

aplinker
09-07-2008, 2:49 AM
damn ok, i bought two boxes today for when i get my new rifle and its 150gr its in a green and white box, not sure if its ball stuff.

If it doesn't say "match" it's not going to meet up to what a bolt gun can do.

Green and white probably means UMC. It's plinking ammo.

532Fastback
09-07-2008, 6:31 AM
If it doesn't say "match" it's not going to meet up to what a bolt gun can do.

Green and white probably means UMC. It's plinking ammo.

yeah i didn't think it was match ammo but i was hoping it was atleast a little better than the cheap stuff.