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View Full Version : ***Another Warning about Metroshot Firearms in San Fernando*** DO NOT SHOP THERE!!!!


radd
08-30-2008, 5:08 PM
Metroshot Firearms has been going down hill since beginning of the year. I am sure several Calguns.net members can confirm this.

I thought I was the only one that Pat, Cesar and the Metroshot Firearms gang are screwing over. It turns out they owe several other reputable vendors in thousands of dollars. Other vendors has not spoken out about them, but I think somebody needs to rat them out. They don't return calls and times you get to speak to someone they give you empty promises. Based on what I've seen this is a company that is not staying in business for long. They are funding their operation with basically "Stolen Properties"

My warning to anyone who shops at that place is DO NOT PREPAY Anything and DO NOT Leave Any Depsoit. If you have to shop there, then Cash and Carry Only. I see them going down in flames any day now. Please get the word out. If you have placed order and made payment, then get your money back ASAP.

This is also a warning to other vendors to not to deal with this dishonest and disgraceful retailer that lack a moral backbone.:mad:

Please get the word out and warn everyone not to and never shop there again!!!

I am sorry to the forum mod if you think these words are too harsh. But I speak the truth.

Radd

Matt C
08-30-2008, 5:28 PM
This is also a warning to other vendors to not to deal with this dishonest and disgraceful retailer that lack a moral backbone.:mad:


+1..

tenbrook
08-30-2008, 5:33 PM
Thats what I heard about them also. Idaho Armament told me they owe him $1,000's of dollars! They used to carry their AK's. When I called I.A. with some questions about my AK he told me I had a stolen firearm. He said I needed not to worry, it would be Metroshot who was on the hook. I would never deal with these guy's direct, way to fishy!

technique
08-30-2008, 5:45 PM
Right on radd!!!!!! Thanks for the heads up!!!!!

vega
08-30-2008, 7:52 PM
Tag.........

Sal
08-30-2008, 8:01 PM
I do happen to know that a $1000 debt is nothing compared to what they owe some people....

jacques
08-30-2008, 8:08 PM
That is unfortunate. I bought a lower from them and did not have a problem, maybe 3-mos ago. Maybe the will pop in here and try to explain things.

A heads up is always good though.

radd
08-30-2008, 8:30 PM
That is unfortunate. I bought a lower from them and did not have a problem, maybe 3-mos ago. Maybe the will pop in here and try to explain things.

A heads up is always good though.

Your lower is probably one of the many "Stolen Property" I mentioned.

As far as I know, Metroshot has NOT been paying their bills to several of their suppliers.

Please make that your last transaction with them. We need to keep this thread going until either they start paying back all their bills or until they are no longer in business. But bottomline, I rather see this dishonest dealer face justice and see to it they do not take advantage of another customer or vendor.

BTW: Good luck getting any straight answers from them.

Radd

Ford8N
08-30-2008, 8:39 PM
Wow, with it being standing room only in that closet of a shop, you would think they are making a ton of money. They seemed like nice folks to me other than being super busy handling a constant barrage of stupid questions by looky-loos.

tyrist
08-30-2008, 9:26 PM
Sounds like somebody with a gambling problem......

supersonic
08-30-2008, 10:04 PM
...............or the "other" kind of problem where you need more & more everyday ($100's-$1000's) to stay "well." Plus you pay the man before everyone else in your life ....and you even still owe HIM lotsa' deniro.;)

"You don't want none of this. It will take you places you do NOTwant to go...." .........Ray Charles

BlackReef
08-30-2008, 10:18 PM
Yea, this time last year Pat made me pay close to $100 for the transfer of a Shotgun. The week prior he assured me it would only be $50. Never went back again

dfletcher
08-30-2008, 10:21 PM
Metroshot Firearms has been going down hill since beginning of the year. I am sure several Calguns.net members can confirm this.

I thought I was the only one that Pat, Cesar and the Metroshot Firearms gang are screwing over. It turns out they owe several other reputable vendors in thousands of dollars. Other vendors has not spoken out about them, but I think somebody needs to rat them out. They don't return calls and times you get to speak to someone they give you empty promises. Based on what I've seen this is a company that is not staying in business for long. They are funding their operation with basically "Stolen Properties"

My warning to anyone who shops at that place is DO NOT PREPAY Anything and DO NOT Leave Any Depsoit. If you have to shop there, then Cash and Carry Only. I see them going down in flames any day now. Please get the word out. If you have placed order and made payment, then get your money back ASAP.

This is also a warning to other vendors to not to deal with this dishonest and disgraceful retailer that lack a moral backbone.:mad:

Please get the word out and warn everyone not to and never shop there again!!!

I am sorry to the forum mod if you think these words are too harsh. But I speak the truth.

Radd


I'm in NorCal and there's about zero chance I'll ever go there - given my general condition when visiting LA, having access to firearms can only lead to another mug shot. :cool: But I am curious, do they owe you some $$$ or you have some "close to" first hand knowledge of their dealings?

hkuspc40
08-30-2008, 10:49 PM
I once hung out at a car audio installation shop in the San Gabriel Valley....heard that the owner ran his store on credit...doesn't pay his vendors. 2-3 years in, guess what....the shop closed. I dont' think MS will screw his walk-in customers (that'll be pretty messed up)....but for the vendors, it may be a diff story.

Mississippi
08-30-2008, 11:13 PM
Then let the Vendors sue them. Should be easy to prove....right!???

I dont have a dog in this fight. Sounds like vendors are still shipping them products to sale. Strange but I dont think we know the whole story here. Maybe they will pop in on this thread.

ENTHUSIAST
08-31-2008, 3:17 PM
Here is a copy of the LAST email I sent to PAT it outlines and sums up my first "experience" with Metroshot...


"Dear Pat Kudo,

I spoke with Cesar on Saturday Feb. 23, 2008 about my xxx (Pricey Rifle #1) and he informed me that there is a shipment that is coming in about 2 weeks, but that they are ALL in GRAY and that you were gonna offer me a discount on one that is GRAY!?! (Is this ACCURATE?)

I PAID in FULL on 12/15/07 you said you were going to order the xxx (Pricey Rifle #1) from LANWORLD (as stated in the DROS Comments: LAN Transfers, UT) and it would arrive in *about* a month...

I spoke to CHRIS the owner of LANWORLD and he told me that METROSHOT has NOT had an order placed with them for ANYTHING in the last TWO MONTHS !?!

Chris @ LANWORLD also said that he could GUARANTEE delivery of the same xxx (Pricey Rifle #1) in less than TWO WEEKS...

I DO NOT want a GREY xxx (Pricey Rifle #1) price is unimportant what I want is:

1. A pick-up date for my xxx (Pricey Rifle #2) and PROOF that my xxx (Pricey Rifle #1) has been ordered ie: call CHRIS @ LANWORLD and place an order that I can VERIFY by calling LANWORLD. Chris @ LANWORLD (801) 878-4880 website: http://www.lanworldinc.com/ email: cbieling@lanworldinc.com

2. Or a pick-up date for my xxx (Pricey Rifle #2) and a REFUND on my xxx (Pricey Rifle #1)."

I paid CASH in FULL for both rifles and I was "lucky" enough to finally get the one that was already in their possession.

Pat Kudo basically NEVER returned my calls or emails and made Cesar (Nice guy who is the employee who has to apologize and mop up all of the owner Pat's Bull S**t) "deal" with me because he wasnt man enough to APOLOGIZE or take responsibility for his own incompetance/unscrupulous sales tactics.

Pat eventually wanted to pay me with a CHECK WTF?!? I paid a CASH deposit and I wasnt about to drive up to SFV from SD because at that point I would of seen and IOU on a cocktail napkin as a safer method of payment after month after month of taking Pat at his "WORD"...

Bottom line, I ended up making them give me a different rifle that has no controversy about its legality because Pat started getting all squirrely about the legality of that specific rifle type citing the BSP incident.

Had I known what I know now I would ONLY do CASH and CARRY deals with Cesar because of Pat's lack of ethics.

I did do one other transfer with a CG member there with no problems and I told Cesar what a POS I think PAT KUDO is and he said I wasnt the only guy that has been F***ED over by him...

Interesting right now Metroshot has a BMW X5 up for sale WTF?!? Need some extra $$$ to pay some bills huh Pat or do you have to change up rides because you have a few unhappy people that have been screwed by you that you are avoiding...

P.S. +1 for Cesar he has NEVER lied to me and is a stand up guy BEST of LUCK when MS closes bro you should find an employer who appreciates integrity.

BlackReef
08-31-2008, 3:20 PM
I recommend going to Bright Spot Pawn! HANDS DOWN the best FFL in Southern California. Chris is a great guy and now that I live in San Diego, I still make the drive to do my transfers. He is right off the 60 East and the 210

Electric Factory
08-31-2008, 3:57 PM
This is very disappointing news as I have a rifle in 10-day cue for pickup at this moment, an out of state transfer that is sitting at Fed Ex waiting to be picked up by Pat/ Ceasar.
I agree, the not-returning-phone-calls thing is especially galling, particularly for someone in business.
I'm going to go Metroshot on Tuesday, hopefully someone will have grabbed my rifle from Fed Ex by then .:confused:
In fairness Ceasar has always been nothing but courteous to me, I hope my transaction goes smoothly [ my pickup date is this Saturday].

apbrian112
08-31-2008, 4:07 PM
+1 for ceasar being awesome to deal with (any other FFL would benefit greatly if their employees were as knowledgeable and curteous as he is)
and
+1 for pat being a jerk sometimes...

Electric Factory
08-31-2008, 4:15 PM
Could someone please PM an email address for Ceasar ? I have a transfer coming due for pickup on Saturday, he gave me his email address and of course I lost it ! Now I really need to contact Ceasar about my pickup- can anyone help with a PM ??

natedogg1777
08-31-2008, 4:30 PM
That is unfortunate, BUT I'm sure there is more to the story. I've never been there or even heard of the place, but I do know that this has been a very tough year for businesses of all types. In that type of situation businesses typically pay the things that keep the doors open first: payroll, rent, power, etc. Certainly not an ideal situation, but such are the times. If they have any intention of staying in business they'll figure out a way to stay afloat and get ahead.

That may not be the case at all, but I just thought I'd offer up a different perspective.

-hanko
08-31-2008, 5:11 PM
That is unfortunate, BUT I'm sure there is more to the story.
There's always more to the story...usually lack of positive cash flow, or inability to balance income with expenses;)

-hanko

radd
08-31-2008, 10:22 PM
But I am curious, do they owe you some $$$ or you have some "close to" first hand knowledge of their dealings?

Both.....They owe me money and have been avoiding me and making empty promised plus I have first hand knowledge of some their dealing from the victimized vendors.

Radd

radd
08-31-2008, 10:37 PM
That is unfortunate, BUT I'm sure there is more to the story. I've never been there or even heard of the place, but I do know that this has been a very tough year for businesses of all types. In that type of situation businesses typically pay the things that keep the doors open first: payroll, rent, power, etc. Certainly not an ideal situation, but such are the times. If they have any intention of staying in business they'll figure out a way to stay afloat and get ahead.

That may not be the case at all, but I just thought I'd offer up a different perspective.

It's very easy. They are strap for cash because someone did'nt know how to manage their business. But my point is Pat and Cesar at Metroshots did not have to trick the customer and vendors this way to pay their own paychecks.

It's their lack of moral that piss me off. They could of come clean and kept a open dialog instead they choose to avoid all contact and lie their way through things.

We got rent due and employees to pay and mouths to feed just like the next hard working person. Why should this person get away with cheating and lying because he got bills to pay?!

Pat & Cesar I hope both of you are reading this. You went the wrong way in dealing with this situation. If you had not scammed so many customers and vendors out of their hard earned cash, then you will not be in this situation at all.

I hope you come clean and see this as wake up call, if you wish to stay in business.

I hope the Mods can sticky this post somewhere as warning for other calguns.net members in dealing with Metroshot until they clean up their act or out of business for good.

Radd

TRAP55
08-31-2008, 11:33 PM
If you had not scammed so many customers and vendors out of their hard earned cash, then you will not be in this situation at all.
Out of all of these people scammed, no one has filed a small claims, or a lien for real property?:confused:
I know there's two sides to every story. But if what you say is true, after I filed suit, I'd be beating on this guys door 24/7 until I got my cash back or what I paid for.

radd
08-31-2008, 11:52 PM
Ah.....very good question Danial San.

My claim is not worth the court time and money that will be spent on collecting the debt. This post is not about them owing me money. This post is about moral conduct in doing business where good faith and promise is tossed in garbage.

But I assure you, there are legal proceedings from others.

Why do you think every post from everyone, they only mentioned Cesar at Metroshot Firearms?

Pat Kudo is listed as the FFL holder and the business owner. I am sure there are many people trying to serve him court papers.

When was the last time anyone saw Pat at Metroshot in the last few weeks?

Radd

Full Clip
09-01-2008, 9:44 AM
I bought something from them off Gunbroker and then had to wait weeks for a pickup after about a dozen unreturned phone calls. If you decide to open a business, then run a business right or shut it down. Very sketchy operation. I've never gone back. Good luck Radd and others —*and do file a small claims suit. Force them to own up to their responsibilities.

lakai
09-01-2008, 9:54 AM
Things are not as simple as just suing them. Getting a judgement on business debt and collecting is not that easy although you might have a better chance if the business is a sole proprietorship.

Metroshot is LLC which is itself a separate person or entity and it looks like Pat is listed as the Agent for Service or Process but he is not personally liable for any debts that Metroshot LLC has incurred unless he has given you a personal guarantee which I doubt you have. If you decide to go to small claims and win, you still have to figure out how to collect on your judgement. There are various methods but unless he owes you a significant amount of money, its probably not worth it for you. If metroshot files for bankrupcy, (Most likely chapter 7 because chapter 11 is very costly)most likely the store will go through liquidation and your debt might be paid some of it depending on the scope of the company's financial troubles.

Radd: I totally understand and can relate to your frustrations but I hope you started this thread assuming that you will never be paid because if ever metroshot decides to pay any of its debt to vendors, you will most likely be the last vendor taken in consideration my friend. I just hope its worth it on your end.

g17owner
09-01-2008, 9:54 AM
I think informing others about the wrong doings and shady dealings of a local company that is of intrest to us here at calguns is a great service. Bashing? Perhaps, but if i do go into their shop i know what to expect. There are alot more shops in so. cal that run their business with integrity and that bring ca compliant mags to its customers. Just look around this site. I can see links to at least three on this page alone. Wake up! Metroshot is a crooked enterprise and they are destined for bankruptcy and as a customer YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT.

lakai
09-01-2008, 10:12 AM
I think informing others about the wrong doings and shady dealings of a local company that is of intrest to us here at calguns is a great service. Bashing? Perhaps, but if i do go into their shop i know what to expect. There are alot more shops in so. cal that run their business with integrity and that bring ca compliant mags to its customers. Just look around this site. I can see links to at least three on this page alone. Wake up! Metroshot is a crooked enterprise and they are destined for bankruptcy and as a customer YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT.

I agree what radd is doing is a great benefit to us as customers, but I would not want him to take a huge hit financially because of this. I'm assuming that it is not about the money for him at this point.

fmlyman
09-01-2008, 10:31 AM
O.K. I think I got it now!

Metroshot burns radd = radd "warns" calgunners not to shop there = everybody with a gripe agrees with radd (usual suspects)= all the newbies want to know why= all the armchair lawyers want action= me and my 2 cents!

I love these threads they ALWAYS! follow the same pattern

MILLITIAof1
09-01-2008, 10:47 AM
I am not a fan of metroshot.

tai
09-01-2008, 11:56 AM
I was there about two month ago, Ceasar and other worker was there, they had about two case of beer under the conter. it make me thinking, what kind of bussiness they are running.

WINGEDSWORD
09-01-2008, 1:06 PM
I have only dealt with them, once and that was for a ppt. What really angered me, about them was the fact that they would NEVER answer any telephone calls and I had to drive out there to get any response. That kind of discourtesy meant that I will never go back, after that one transaction.:(

SNEAKS
09-01-2008, 1:17 PM
I see he has a BMW on his website for sale. I think he is trying to get some quick money to pay some people back.

Addax
09-01-2008, 2:22 PM
Radd,

I am glad that you gave the Calguns.net Community the Red Flag Warning.

Metroshot used to be a very popular place for many Calgunners, including myself to frequent and shop, but then a chain of events occured between Pat and I, that pretty much showed me the true and ugly side of Pat which lead me to stop frequenting Metroshot.

I have my own stories and first hand knowledge and information from several vendors/distributors/mfg's regarding Pat and Metroshot that I do not want to publish openly, but lets just say that he is not somebody I would trust at all.

Cesar on the other hand I think (I do not know for sure) is sort of caught up in the middle and I believe he is trying to keep a sinking ship afloat by taking care of what customers he can, but it all boils down to $$$, and I do not know if or how they are going to survive for much longer...

Radd, I am sorry to see you get burned like this from Pat and Metroshot.

You are an outstanding person to deal with and your Radd Locks and parts you make for us are Excellent.

Again, thank you for the Red Flag Warning, I think you are doing the right thing in getting the Warning out there.

technique
09-01-2008, 3:24 PM
radd,

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/EuAVgWJ28Hw&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/EuAVgWJ28Hw&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>


<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/_AJ0SkbPxAk&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/_AJ0SkbPxAk&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>



:DLOL

Addax
09-01-2008, 3:40 PM
OMG... LOL!!!!!!

I can't stop laughing... That is just Evil... I love FG.

Nice one Technique!

762cavalier
09-01-2008, 5:09 PM
OMFG!!!!!!!!!

:rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2:

That was Hysterical. I think I need a new keyboard.:punk:

SJgunguy24
09-01-2008, 5:39 PM
:rofl2: GOOD STUFF, NOW THAT IS FUNNY:rofl2:

FlyingPen
09-01-2008, 6:55 PM
From the Mercenaries 2 ad:

http://www.pandemicstudios.com/mercenaries/audio/Oh_No_Full_Length.mp3

BP88
09-01-2008, 6:56 PM
Report these clowns to the BBB.

Blacktail 8541
09-01-2008, 6:57 PM
That was a great cartoon.

tankerman
09-01-2008, 7:14 PM
Report these clowns to the BBB.
BBB are the clowns, they will do nothing.

The BBB is there to support businesses not consumers, I have actually had them (BBB) assist a business (AT&T) in screwing me after reporting the business to them for ripping me off.

radd
09-01-2008, 7:41 PM
O.K. I think I got it now!

Metroshot burns radd = radd "warns" calgunners not to shop there = everybody with a gripe agrees with radd (usual suspects)= all the newbies want to know why= all the armchair lawyers want action= me and my 2 cents!

I love these threads they ALWAYS! follow the same pattern

If you think this is some sort of personal vendetta, then you have not been reading this thread. I urge you start from page one.

As I mentioned what Metroshot owe's me is not even worth the flak that I might get for making this post. What I am doing is warning to those who continue to support Metroshot, then you are also contine to support their unscrupulous business practice and may end up as victim also.

Metroshot's victims is not just limited to Californians. Metroshot's business tactic also give Califonia FFL a bad name. California friendly vendors from out of state are aslo victimized by Metroshot. Wary out of state vendors need to jump through hoops to sell to Californians already victimized by Metroshot, then they will think twice before selling to California.

Addax thank you for coming forward and confirm what I have been saying all along about Metroshot. Adxtactical is one of many reasons Caluguns.net member do not need to goto Metroshot anymore.

Radd

bigthaiboy
09-01-2008, 11:23 PM
Their PMAG"S are worth their weight in gold, no one else makes them, metroshot is one of the few companies that had the intestinal fortitude to deliver california compliant mags to it's customers.


NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING TRUE:

http://www.riflegear.com/c-30-magazines.aspx
http://www.calegalmags.com/magpul-pmags-1030.html
http://www.coldwarshooters.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=28&products_id=610&zenid=30f55a48a277a4211bb958c207c17476
http://www.cctactical.com/typesearch.php?txt_from=2&txt_searchstring=220
Plus Ammo Bros who carry the window PMAGS with real .223 brass loaded inside to fill the window.

I apologise to the other vendors here who stock 10/30 PMAGs who did not get mentioned, but I just did a quick search of PMAG 10/20 & 10/30 mags to prove a point that Metroshot aren't the only vendors with the "intestinal fortitude" to carry these CA legal magazines. I salute you all.




.

leelaw
09-02-2008, 2:55 AM
But I am curious, do they owe you some $$$ or you have some "close to" first hand knowledge of their dealings?

I thought I was the only one that Pat, Cesar and the Metroshot Firearms gang are screwing over

Translation: "Metroshot screwed me"

sonicbuff
09-02-2008, 8:38 AM
Report these clowns to the BBB.

BBB will make sure that your case is not heard. :p

tsname
09-02-2008, 9:06 AM
I didn't know there was something wrong with Metroshot until I browsed the forums. I went to Metroshot on Saturday 30 Sep with some friends but they were closed due to "Family Emergency." My cousin warned me about Pat but said Cesar was a good guy, I guess he's right since everyone else is pretty much echoing the same.

On a side note, speaking of grandpas shotguns and kiddy 22's, we went to Gun World in Burbank where I was treated like an alien and pretty much ignored the whole time. But going to Gun Gallery in Glendale was favorable, I think we were the most people the guy has seen at one time (3) but he was friendly and courteous which led to my friend being the father of a Yugo SKS.

jacques
09-02-2008, 9:38 AM
I didn't know there was something wrong with Metroshot until I browsed the forums. I went to Metroshot on Saturday 30 Sep with some friends but they were closed due to "Family Emergency." My cousin warned me about Pat but said Cesar was a good guy, I guess he's right since everyone else is pretty much echoing the same.

On a side note, speaking of grandpas shotguns and kiddy 22's, we went to Gun World in Burbank where I was treated like an alien and pretty much ignored the whole time. But going to Gun Gallery in Glendale was favorable, I think we were the most people the guy has seen at one time (3) but he was friendly and courteous which led to my friend being the father of a Yugo SKS.

That is interesting. When I drove all the way down there to pick up my Nodak Spud receiver (2hour drive) on a Saturday (several months ago), after being assured they are open on Sat. I found a note on the door saying they were closed due to family emergency. 4-hours of driving for nothing.

MILLITIAof1
09-02-2008, 11:38 AM
someone should take a picture of metroshot and post it in the fail thread.

tsname
09-02-2008, 12:34 PM
jacques sorry to hear that, I was pissed enough driving there and only being about 30 minutes away.

Militia, there really isn't much to take a picture of. The business has no sign, just a mirror-tinted door and the address above it and it's sandwiched tightly between a Mexican restaurant, and a travel agency. It's too easy to miss.

AYEAREFIFTEEN
09-02-2008, 3:58 PM
.Cesar on the other hand I think (I do not know for sure) is sort of caught up in the middle and I believe he is trying to keep a sinking ship afloat by taking care of what customers he can, but it all boils down to $$$, and I do not know if or how they are going to survive for much longer...

I agree with you on that 100%. Caesar has always taken good care of me when it comes not only to price but customer service. He's even gone out of his way to personally delivered an item to me in time for a shoot.

It deffinately seems like Caesar is stuck in the middle trying to keeping as many good relationships with customers as he can.

For the closet hole in the wall the place is, I can't imagine it costs a whole lot to run the place.

radd
09-02-2008, 8:15 PM
I agree with you on that 100%. Caesar has always taken good care of me when it comes not only to price but customer service. He's even gone out of his way to personally delivered an item to me in time for a shoot.

It deffinately seems like Caesar is stuck in the middle trying to keeping as many good relationships with customers as he can.

For the closet hole in the wall the place is, I can't imagine it costs a whole lot to run the place.

I keep reading everyone saying how Cesar has been good to them. But, that must not have been the same Cesar I have spoken to when he promised to take care the outstanding invoice for me. I have not heard a peep a since I spoke to him in beginning of August, the one time I manage to get a hold of anyone.

I hate to be the devil's advocate here, but none of us pay Cesar's salary and he does not work for any of us at the end of the day his loyalty is with Metroshot. Unless he is not just a simple employee of Metroshot he is obligated to abide by Pat's wishes.

Please keep that in mind.

Radd

PistolPete75
09-02-2008, 10:48 PM
Metroshot.

I promised not to talk bad about them no more. Simply said, let your money do the talking and shop somewhere else.

saki302
09-03-2008, 4:14 AM
On a side note, speaking of grandpas shotguns and kiddy 22's, we went to Gun World in Burbank where I was treated like an alien and pretty much ignored the whole time. But going to Gun Gallery in Glendale was favorable

I've had good experiences at Gun World, as I do a lot of PPTs there (they happen to be closest to my house). I only buy ammo and stuff occasionally, but their staff has treated me well.
I haven't gone into the Gun Gallery store yet, just seen their high gun show prices :D

-Dave

radd
09-08-2008, 10:51 AM
That is interesting. When I drove all the way down there to pick up my Nodak Spud receiver (2hour drive) on a Saturday (several months ago), after being assured they are open on Sat. I found a note on the door saying they were closed due to family emergency. 4-hours of driving for nothing.


Anyone else experienced this phenomenon this past week?

:rolleyes:

apbrian112
09-08-2008, 11:23 AM
Anyone else experienced this phenomenon this past week?

:rolleyes:

it wasn't 2 weeks ago, but i went a couple of months ago and it was the same thing.
"sorry, but we're closed due to a family emergency."

bullywagon
09-16-2008, 5:02 PM
My friend and I got some OLL from them and they were supposed to come with the bullet button... when we went to pick them up after the 10 days they didn't have the bullet buttons in stock and said they would ship it to us.... well a month later and we haven't seen anything... or been able to get a hold of anyone there via phone or email... looks like I will have to get my BB from somewhere else... last time I do business with Metroshot... they just seem way to unorganized and shady... I wouldn't be surprised if some of these missing parts are ending up in their "special builds" they sell...

grammaton76
09-16-2008, 6:22 PM
For the record, their vendor non-payment BS has been going on for a minimum of 2 years. Ever wonder why they announce new vendor relationships once in a while?

radd
09-25-2008, 3:53 PM
Bump

tenpercentfirearms
09-25-2008, 7:25 PM
A customer just left my shop that couldn't get the lowers he ordered in mid-August and started DROS on from Cesar so he eventually got his money back and drove to Taft twice. He left with his two RRA receivers I had in stock and a Noveske N6 too.

Things do not seem to be going well over there.

aplinker
09-25-2008, 8:47 PM
I think a lot is in flux at Metroshot, but they're trying to get things in order and take care of anyone.

I think Pat didn't take care of his obligations and things are coming around to bite them. I also know he was trying to sell the shop, so maybe someone will come in and put things on the right track, take care of debts and customers, etc.

It sure is a convenient location for a lot of us - would be nice if they could get it together.

Spaceghost
09-25-2008, 9:29 PM
No way someone would buy a business and honor previous debts. What did they have to do with it? If things are as bad as they seem, every potential buyer should just walk away and let the store die. Who wants to run the store that used to burn people and deal all the junk that goes along with that? Forget that, just start a new shop nearby. An honest shop close would be the last nail in the coffin for these guys.

I think a lot is in flux at Metroshot, but they're trying to get things in order and take care of anyone.

I think Pat didn't take care of his obligations and things are coming around to bite them. I also know he was trying to sell the shop, so maybe someone will come in and put things on the right track, take care of debts and customers, etc.

It sure is a convenient location for a lot of us - would be nice if they could get it together.

Electric Factory
09-25-2008, 9:43 PM
I bought an OLL from a fellow Calgunner recently, did the DROS at Metroshot because they're REALLY close to where I live, I'm supposed to pick it up on Tuesday.
All I wanna do is pick up my item and scoot.
Wish me luck.

Gunaria
09-25-2008, 9:58 PM
Report them on this website as well,

http://www.ripoffreport.com/

dfletcher
09-25-2008, 10:30 PM
No way someone would buy a business and honor previous debts. What did they have to do with it? If things are as bad as they seem, every potential buyer should just walk away and let the store die. Who wants to run the store that used to burn people and deal all the junk that goes along with that? Forget that, just start a new shop nearby. An honest shop close would be the last nail in the coffin for these guys.

Actually I think it's not at all unusual for one company to purchase another company to include outstanding debits and credits, so long as there is full disclosure and remedies in place should that disclosure be - by accident or design - less than accurate and complete.

A very simple example - customer A comes to the store in March with a gun needing repair, the store sends the gun to a gunsmith for work. Gunsmith does the work at his leisure, the store is sold in June, the gun is finished in July. Hopefully by assuming the former company's debits & credits the gunsmith gets paid, the store gets paid & the customer gets his gun.

Electric Factory
09-25-2008, 10:50 PM
Is there anyone else out there that has a pending OLL or other pending pickup at Metroshot ? Sure would be nice to know I'm not the only one....

dchang0
09-25-2008, 10:57 PM
Most businesses that are transferred include outstanding Accounts Payable as well as Accounts Receivable. Most new owners that buy failing businesses usually arrange some sort of debt repayment/reconciliation with the vendors, who are happy to accept any sort of payment, even as low as 10 cents on the dollar, from the new owner rather than get nothing from the previous owner.

The real stinker is that Metroshot has very little remaining customer "goodwill" (i.e., the brand name of "Metroshot" is not viewed favorably net in the mindshare of those who know about it).

It would be far easier to buy all of Metroshot's assets at a huge discount and then open a store nearby under a totally different name. HOWEVER, this would only be a good idea if Metroshot actually got enough business to justify opening a replacement store nearby. No point in opening a store in a location without enough customers to serve.

I'm really glad and blessed that I didn't do business with them. They were second on my list of shops that would be willing to FFL a PS90 into Calif. But, they didn't return a single call from me or the NC gunshop that was selling me the PS90, and they didn't return emails either. So, I was prevented/protected from getting scammed by them.

I know Radd personally and can vouch for him--he's an upright guy, and this isn't just some personal vendetta or private beef made public. Radd's interest is in serving the Calguns public by warning them against the imminent collapse of Metroshot. There are gonna be a lot of vendors and customers whose money has already been spent that are going to be royally screwed when Metroshot fails, and Radd's just warning people not to join in the multi-car pileup.

Addax
09-25-2008, 11:03 PM
I think a lot is in flux at Metroshot, but they're trying to get things in order and take care of anyone.

I think Pat didn't take care of his obligations and things are coming around to bite them. I also know he was trying to sell the shop, so maybe someone will come in and put things on the right track, take care of debts and customers, etc.

It sure is a convenient location for a lot of us - would be nice if they could get it together.

It is too bad that the business was really mis-managed the way it was.

House of Cards...

At one point I was very interested in purchasing Metroshot from Pat, but when I did my research, and I confirmed my findings via my sources, I decided it was a very poor business investment.

jacques
09-25-2008, 11:08 PM
Is there anyone else out there that has a pending OLL or other pending pickup at Metroshot ? Sure would be nice to know I'm not the only one....

Call before you go. They may not be there. Then again, they might. Good luck. It sounds like people are getting really frustrated and deals are being broken.

ptoguy2002
09-26-2008, 9:50 AM
Radd (and others):
Did you sell these to metroshot on credit? What were the credit terms (net30/ net60, etc)? Does a purchase order from metroshot exist? What other documentation is there? Were these on consignment?

slick_711
09-26-2008, 11:14 AM
I was there about two month ago, Ceasar and other worker was there, they had about two case of beer under the conter. it make me thinking, what kind of bussiness they are running.

What does that have to do with anything? Unless there were open containers while they were open for business what business is it of yours and where is the wrongdoing? Last I checked alcohol was a legal substance...

SlushPup
09-26-2008, 1:09 PM
Good advice. I was looking into picking this up from Metroshot:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=115010

Scroll to the bottom and read at your leisure.

Matt C
09-26-2008, 1:44 PM
Good advice. I was looking into picking this up from Metroshot:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=115010

Scroll to the bottom and read at your leisure.

LOL, I just noticed the ad for pre-paid legal on the back oh Pat's X5.


"The people peddling PPL are the same type of con artists who last month tried to get you to join their latest water filter DOWNLINE so they can exploit you. Next month it will be some new scam. People like these will rob you blind and then steal your white cane." (http://www.canlaw.com/caveat/prepaidlegal.htm)

Apparently they are also the type of people to run a crooked gun shop.

PistolPete75
09-26-2008, 2:27 PM
what happened to his $80 bullet button?

i love karma.

drifts1
09-26-2008, 6:36 PM
"No way someone would buy a business and honor previous debts."


Somebody ought to tell JP Morgan that:D

70ss
09-26-2008, 8:55 PM
i have been trying to purchase three lower recievers from metroshot (cesar) i started the paperwork on august 16th , now 5 weeks later the paperwork is no good i have called numerous times and left messages for cesar and he does not return my calls i called him 3 times on a saturday and he would not answer his phone so i drove down there and walked in the door to find cesar standing behind the counter! i do agree with one thing many have said about cesar he is a very pleasant person , but as far as bussiness goes i still have not seen my lowers! my friend called and ordered some lowers over the phone and has not even done paperwork he ordered his lowers 3weeks after i did cesar called him two days ago to tell him that he would have some lowers coming in next week i still have not gotten a call !

70ss
09-26-2008, 8:59 PM
A customer just left my shop that couldn't get the lowers he ordered in mid-August and started DROS on from Cesar so he eventually got his money back and drove to Taft twice. He left with his two RRA receivers I had in stock and a Noveske N6 too.

Things do not seem to be going well over there.

thank you very much for being up front and honest i got my lowers and ten percent is the only place to shop!great people and have the lowers and parts in stock! will do bussiness there again!even if i have to drive 2 hours ten percent is well worth the drive!!! thanks again.

xfilterx
09-27-2008, 10:34 PM
+1..

+2

I've been waiting 5 months for my 9mm UMP mags. I doubt I will ever see them. Fortunately they were only $130 for both mags so I feel fortunate it wasn't more. The downside is that no one has these mags for sale right now so my UMP conversion is just collecting dust.

HARLEY VATO
09-28-2008, 10:05 AM
ahhhh shiznit, i won't even shop there now i hope this information is accurate

Electric Factory
10-01-2008, 3:36 PM
Has anyone made contact with Ceasar within the last 24 hrs, maybe tried to go in to Metroshot on Tuesday ?
I went there to pickup a DROS-d PPT OLL lower yesterday on my pickup day, arrived a few minutes before 5:00 pm to see Ceasar and his helpers leaving the shop[?]. I told him I was there to pick up my OLL, he said they were undergoing some kind of audit [? ], could I come tomorrow [ today,Weds] ? Though at the moment I didn't understand what an audit had to do with me I said ok and asked if he'd absolutely be there today at 2:00 pm. He said he absolutely would.
Well, I just left Metroshot after waiting an hour, from 2:00pm-3:00pm- no Ceasar, nobody in the shop although the lights were on as was the TV on the wall. Presumably somebody had been there earlier ?
I really don't know what to make of this nor how to proceed. Do I just randomly continue to drive to Metroshot on the chance of running into someone ? I've called Ceasar's cell number half a dozen times, none receiving a reply. I emailed twice, no reply to those either.
This isn't a matter of an order gone sour, they have my item in their possession, or at least I presume they do. I have my DROS copy and a receipt of the transfer. The LAST thing I want to do is trash Metroshot because Ceasar has always been cordial and courteous with me. I don't wish he or Pat any ill will but I have no idea what to make of this development. I left a detailed note for Ceasar taped on the Metroshot front door begging him to call me and plan to drive down there AGAIN in a few minutes.
Any PM'd inside information would be greatly appreciated, I can't put into words how disappointed I am to be writing this.:(

idk
10-01-2008, 3:56 PM
If he and I were there on your pick up day I would of insisted it be delt with audit or not.
Roger

marxdspot
10-01-2008, 3:59 PM
I believe their normal business days are on Tuesday evenings and Saturday mornings. Customarily, if you wanted to pick something up outside those two days, you'd have to make an appointment with Cesar or Pat. Otherwise, I wouldn't waste my time gambling whether or not they're at the shop from now until Saturday morning at 9am. Good luck, bros.

Electric Factory
10-01-2008, 4:58 PM
I drove back down to Metroshot for the third time today, the note I taped to the door for Ceasar was removed, I looked through the glass door[ still no one there] and saw my note sitting on the counter !
OK, I'm saying to myself, this time I'm posting myself at the door and not leaving until someone shows up, and just a few moments after that who should walk up but... Ceasar !
We greeted and went into the shop. On top of the counter there were hundreds if not thousands of DROS forms, clearly an inspection of some kind was in fact going on and, as he explained it I can't get my OLL lower until said audit is concluded and he gets his book back [ the inspectors were out taking a break from what was a 4-hr session]. I asked him when he thought that might be, he assured me he'd call me in an hour or two to give me an update, once he had possession of his book I could then pickup my OLL.
He seemed genuinely embarrassed about the situation and I found myself feeling bad about being miffed, in any case I'll report back whether I was successful or not, more to come.
Jeez !!

tai
10-01-2008, 5:42 PM
How long can BATF audit a shop? Because it is been going on for about two weeks or more.:eek:

kmixxed213
10-01-2008, 9:37 PM
I am having a problem getting a hold of any one at Metroshot, They have my AR15 stag lefty there on consignment and I would really love to get my rifle back before they get shut down or close up shop. Has anyone been there lately?,
because pat or ceaser do not believe in answering phone calls..... and I really just want my Rifle Back.....

thanks

pottymouth310
10-02-2008, 7:07 AM
I am having a problem getting a hold of any one at Metroshot, They have my AR15 stag lefty there on consignment and I would really love to get my rifle back before they get shut down or close up shop. Has anyone been there lately?,
because pat or ceaser do not believe in answering phone calls..... and I really just want my Rifle Back.....

thanks

You are SCREWED!!!! my friend.....;)

frigginchi
10-02-2008, 7:47 AM
Hmmm they are getting an ATF inspection...


I wonder if an angry customer or vendor dimed them out.

Electric Factory
10-02-2008, 8:12 AM
I am having a problem getting a hold of any one at Metroshot, They have my AR15 stag lefty there on consignment and I would really love to get my rifle back before they get shut down or close up shop. Has anyone been there lately?,
because pat or ceaser do not believe in answering phone calls..... and I really just want my Rifle Back.....

thanks

We are in exactly the same spot, I too just want to get a hold of my own property and get out of there.
Are you planning on showing up at Metroshot this coming Saturday ? Send me a PM, maybe we can develop a mutually workable plan. As to return phone calls I haven't received a single one.:(

onikuma
10-02-2008, 9:43 AM
and it's things like this as to why i refuse to use metroshot.. even if they are 5 minutes from my work.

kmixxed213
10-02-2008, 1:09 PM
We are in exactly the same spot, I too just want to get a hold of my own property and get out of there.
Are you planning on showing up at Metroshot this coming Saturday ? Send me a PM, maybe we can develop a mutually workable plan. As to return phone calls I haven't received a single one.:(


I get off from work around 3pm I believe, we can hook up there around 4ish so we can tag team on them... but yea I gave up on calling them. Been trying to get in touch with anyone for about 6 months..

PistolPete75
10-02-2008, 1:16 PM
it's actually a quite simple solution. metroshot in due respect to their customers should give full refunds to everyone or redros on their dime. anything less than that is definitely not right.

onikuma
10-02-2008, 1:30 PM
it's actually a quite simple solution. metroshot in due respect to their customers should give full refunds to everyone or redros on their dime. anything less than that is definitely not right.

they should do that because of their irresponsibility in keeping in contact with the customer. good luck with it actually happening though.

Electric Factory
10-02-2008, 1:41 PM
I get off from work around 3pm I believe, we can hook up there around 4ish so we can tag team on them... but yea I gave up on calling them. Been trying to get in touch with anyone for about 6 months..

PM sent

grammaton76
10-02-2008, 3:41 PM
I wonder if an angry customer or vendor dimed them out.

Check earlier in the thread - some vendors have reported some rifles Metroshot wouldn't pay for (1919's, I think?) as stolen property.

ATF takes that VERY seriously, especially if there are multiple vendors doing the reporting.

PistolPete75
10-02-2008, 4:45 PM
lost firearms? wow

how can a gun dealer loose firearms like that? sound very irresponsible to me. it's a gun store for pete's sake, not a candy store. now there are more firearms out on the street and in criminals' hands. someone should take responsibility for mismanagement. this is serious stuff. a law should be passed to criminalize dealers for lost firearms which were cause by negligence.

grammaton76
10-02-2008, 6:12 PM
lost firearms? wow

how can a gun dealer loose firearms like that? sound very irresponsible to me. it's a gun store for pete's sake, not a candy store. now there are more firearms out on the street and in criminals' hands. someone should take responsibility for mismanagement. this is serious stuff. a law should be passed to criminalize dealers for lost firearms which were cause by negligence.

You'll want to re-read the earlier posts of the thread. It's not that they lost them - allegedly they bought the rifles, sold them to customers, and didn't pay the suppliers.

Riodog
10-02-2008, 6:37 PM
Has anyone thought to contact the ATF or the DOJ about this or is everyone just happy *****ing on a forum?????
Rio

radd
10-02-2008, 9:30 PM
Has anyone thought to contact the ATF or the DOJ about this or is everyone just happy *****ing on a forum?????
Rio

My original intent for this post is to inform the Calguns.net members to be careful and steer clear of Metroshot due to their repeated decaying moral conducts. There are legal action being taken by various entities.

I do encourage anyone that got burn also do take action and spread the word.

Radd

Electric Factory
10-03-2008, 3:17 PM
Radd

PM sent

Pred Thumper
10-04-2008, 10:14 AM
OK folks ... I read the posts and I decided to go to Metroshot ... and lets just say I "elected" to do business with them based on what I saw and felt at the time. I will have a complete run down once I complete the transaction... Even Radd would agree others should be able to post their opinion regarding their experience(s) with a "vendor" of any sort.

jacques
10-04-2008, 10:24 AM
OK folks ... I read the posts and I decided to go to Metroshot ... and lets just say I "elected" to do business with them based on what I saw and felt at the time. I will have a complete run down once I complete the transaction... Even Radd would agree others should be able to post their opinion regarding their experience(s) with a "vendor" of any sort.

So your are the great experiment.

Pred Thumper
10-04-2008, 11:43 AM
Hey ... dont taz me bro! Am just saying smart informed people like hearing the other side... but the jury is still out till the deal is done... call it what you will, but given the fact I did what I did based on my observations and since I am part of this community ... I will share it with you and others who care to read it. I am not taking sides.... just giving them ... you make up your own mind.

vega
10-04-2008, 7:46 PM
What kind of business you "elected" to do with them?

PistolPete75
10-05-2008, 8:37 PM
My original intent for this post is to inform the Calguns.net members to be careful and steer clear of Metroshot due to their repeated decaying moral conducts. There are legal action being taken by various entities.

I do encourage anyone that got burn also do take action and spread the word.

Radd

Is there an update on what's going on?

bigthaiboy
10-06-2008, 1:02 AM
Pred Thumper said: Hey ... dont taz me bro!

13834

pottymouth310
10-06-2008, 8:36 AM
OK folks ... I read the posts and I decided to go to Metroshot ... and lets just say I "elected" to do business with them based on what I saw and felt at the time. I will have a complete run down once I complete the transaction... Even Radd would agree others should be able to post their opinion regarding their experience(s) with a "vendor" of any sort.

Dude, you make me laugh. :rofl2:

Who elected to be the chief critic on this forum? What authority do you have to determine over 108 replies on this thread holds merit or not. Why should your “single” experience with MetroShot supersede so many other customers experience with Pat & Cesar.
Wake up! With over 10,800 views I think that pretty much said for its self anything you find out is NOT going to shock the readers of this thread. Just shut up and read don’t try to get on the ban wagon now that would be stupid. That’s like going into a minefield posted as a minefield & people are being blown up in the minefield and your saying “Ok folks…. I elected myself to check if this minefield is for real. I’ll give you me full report”.

Please….:rolleyes:

Jonathan Doe
10-06-2008, 8:40 AM
I just don't like a business that opens only a few hours a week and does not respond to messages. There is something fish about it.

Pred Thumper
10-06-2008, 10:23 AM
You know thats why I like these forums... EVERYONE is welcome to their opinion and thats is all I am doing by posting my experience... I dont expect anyone to run out and do anything based on what I say ...that means you too Pottymouth... I think we are all entitled to hear all sides good and/or bad... Gee BTW who you voting for this November Potty..... dont tell me it might change my mind ...LOL

Pred Thumper
10-06-2008, 10:34 AM
Hey topgun ... I will say this Metroshot by all appearances is nothing more than a FFL dealer. I really didnt see much in the form of displays or items for sale. I did however see a couple of computers, LOTS of paperwork and at least one huge safe all indicative of high volume transfers being conducted. Using them as the middleman purchases is most likly were the apprehension is coming from.

Pred Thumper
10-06-2008, 10:39 AM
Hey Vega ... what I did was a simple FFL transfer from a FTF transaction suggested by the seller. It was just the OLL. Nothing as serious as the issues posted by others. My point was to post my experience just didnt think it would bring out such emotions out of the wood works. I am beginnng to notice that people are becoming more sensitive these days ...must be age or something

rayra
10-06-2008, 12:53 PM
More likely outrage that someone is trying to step in at the 11th hour and paper over the problems there with a pissant PPT. 'see, look, my no-money-at-risk no-vendor-supplied-hardware logged transfer went through ok, SO NO NEED TO WORRY ABOUT FELONY LARCENY / THEFT BY CONVERSION / PROBABLE SHUTDOWN BY THE ATF.'

Get real. Either you don't realize how silly your exercise looks, or you are in collusion with Pat and running this exercise to help shore up his failing business.

radd
10-06-2008, 2:15 PM
More likely outrage that someone is trying to step in at the 11th hour and paper over the problems there with a pissant PPT. 'see, look, my no-money-at-risk no-vendor-supplied-hardware logged transfer went through ok, SO NO NEED TO WORRY ABOUT FELONY LARCENY / THEFT BY CONVERSION / PROBABLE SHUTDOWN BY THE ATF.'

Get real. Either you don't realize how silly your exercise looks, or you are in collusion with Pat and running this exercise to help shore up his failing business.

Well Said!!!

Gnzrme
10-06-2008, 6:15 PM
Wow,

I almost purchased an OLL at Metroshot...instead I ended up going with Oaktree...I know someone who purchased a complete Stagg rifle from Pat in the begining of the summer with no problems....But it honestly sounds like they are either belly up or about to go belly up...I work right around the corner from their store and see the San Fernando PD everyday in my ER, so I will ask them what they have heard about Metroshot...If they do not return the rifles that they currently have possession of, then that is theft and theft of a firearm is a felony and that would mean the SF PD and the local ATF agents would be involved. Currently on vacation until next week, so will not be able to talk to them, but will post later if I hear someting.

Air
10-06-2008, 6:56 PM
Interesting Thread.

I purchased an OLL from DD's ranch back in 2006 and the transfer was done by Pat at Metroshot. I had NO problems, but that was a couple of years ago. I was thinking about doing a transfer thru Metroshot on a rifle recently, but that's not gonna happen. Guess I'll have to find somebody new. I'm just now getting around to building my OLL, I've sat on this thing long enough!

Pred Thumper
10-06-2008, 7:07 PM
Ok I get the message... all I was trying to do was add some additional info but I see many of you are full of hate (and maybe for good reason) others undoubtly dont know what your talking about but just want to join in the frey. ... whatever

HUTCH 7.62
10-06-2008, 7:16 PM
Interesting Thread.

I purchased an OLL from DD's ranch back in 2006 and the transfer was done by Pat at Metroshot. I had NO problems, but that was a couple of years ago. I was thinking about doing a transfer thru Metroshot on a rifle recently, but that's not gonna happen. Guess I'll have to find somebody new. I'm just now getting around to building my OLL, I've sat on this thing long enough!

Yeah same here back in 2007 I cound not say anything bad about pat Gave me a great deal on a damn near new barely fired 1st gen PTR-91 with non navy lower for way less than a new rifle. It's too bad it had to come to this. But I guess all good things to good to be true must come to an end.

NiteQwill
10-06-2008, 8:07 PM
OK folks ... I read the posts and I decided to go to Metroshot ... and lets just say I "elected" to do business with them based on what I saw and felt at the time. I will have a complete run down once I complete the transaction... Even Radd would agree others should be able to post their opinion regarding their experience(s) with a "vendor" of any sort.

Either stupid or crazy or just ignorant to the fact that MS is complete garbage. It took me a total of 3 months to get my stuff from them. I hope you have your patience hat on, it will be well used.

Pred Thumper
10-06-2008, 9:11 PM
Thank you for your fine words my fellow calgunners, perhaps someday somewhere I can return the kindness

NiteQwill
10-06-2008, 10:05 PM
I don't get it. Damned if we give advice, damned if we don't.

YMMV

DedEye
10-07-2008, 12:52 AM
I don't get it. Damned if we give advice, damned if we don't.

YMMV

As Homer Simpson said (I can't find the demotivational poster though :mad:):
"Trying is the first step towards failure. The moral? Never try.

vega
10-07-2008, 7:40 AM
..... (and maybe for good reason) ......

Maybe....have you not been reading the posts?

Fjold
10-07-2008, 9:42 AM
Hey Vega ... what I did was a simple FFL transfer from a FTF transaction suggested by the seller. It was just the OLL. Nothing as serious as the issues posted by others. My point was to post my experience just didnt think it would bring out such emotions out of the wood works. I am beginnng to notice that people are becoming more sensitive these days ...must be age or something


So, in other words all your doing is waiting for the gun to show up and you will pay metroshot the transfer and the DROS fees, you are not risking anything.

What other people are warning about is to not risk their money on deposits or payments for guns that are ordered from Metroshot. Which is an entirely different matter.

It's like you go in and give them cash for a cleaning rod and then report that Metroshot is a great store. That type of report is useless.

pullnshoot25
10-07-2008, 9:48 AM
You would think that the last people one would want to screw over would be people with guns...

mike452
10-07-2008, 11:08 AM
You would think that the last people one would want to screw over would be people with guns...

people with neutered guns...

nobs11
10-07-2008, 11:40 AM
You would think that the last people one would want to screw over would be people with guns...

I don't know what you mean. Gun people are likely to be more responsible than non gun owners and unlikely to do something rash since the consequences of being foolhardy is that you will lose your guns and gun rights.

Cali80
10-10-2008, 2:25 PM
they are truant on a couple gunbroker auctions.
What is going on over there?

pullnshoot25
10-10-2008, 3:23 PM
I don't know what you mean. Gun people are likely to be more responsible than non gun owners and unlikely to do something rash since the consequences of being foolhardy is that you will lose your guns and gun rights.

Lighten up buttercup, its a joke!

pullnshoot25
10-10-2008, 3:23 PM
people with neutered guns...

I know, seriously....

Bucc
10-17-2008, 1:17 AM
OK folks ... I read the posts and I decided to go to Metroshot ... and lets just say I "elected" to do business with them based on what I saw and felt at the time.


So a dozen people saying "I got screwed" prompts you to run right out and do business with the store in question?
I can understand being somewhat contrarian but that just seems like a special kind of stupid.

dfletcher
10-17-2008, 10:20 AM
I don't get it. Damned if we give advice, damned if we don't.

YMMV

Actually giving advice is fine and I agree sometimes you do run the "damned either way" risk. But having given advice and having a fellow decide to do otherwise, only to then be told after the fact "you'll be sorry" (he very well may be) isn't exactly advice.

Personally I'm glad to get the info, if I were in the area I wouldn't patronize them. I guess others may feel differently and best luck to them.

hitman13
10-17-2008, 12:11 PM
So a dozen people saying "I got screwed" prompts you to run right out and do business with the store in question?
I can understand being somewhat contrarian but that just seems like a special kind of stupid.
yeah, its kind of like bumping a post from 6 days beforehand to state what everyone already though:rolleyes:

Bucc
10-17-2008, 2:23 PM
Yeah, sometime not living on the internet gets you behind on the internet.

Exposed
10-17-2008, 3:30 PM
hmmmm, I got a couple of 10/30 pmags for my AR15 about 5 months ago. Transaction was smooth and delivery was quick. Thats the only experience I have with them though.

g3173
10-20-2008, 7:31 PM
Well here's my experience with MS.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=124484

Didn't realize this post was up... Anyhow, i'm still trying to work things out because I really want my SPR and it's complete just sitting in a dark room collecting dust!

I actually drove all the way down from Sac this weekend to get either my SPR or $$$, but the shop was closed! I was tempted to drive my truck through the store but my wife wouldn't let me... She pretty smart! Anyhow, got an email from Cesar tonight confirming that they have my SPR and that he needed my contact info. I hear mixed stories about Cesar and I hope he does the right thing!

I know the economy sucks but to stick it to your loyal customers is really sad and at the end of the day... not worth the bad karma.

Do I smell "Class Action Lawsuit?"

tenpercentfirearms
10-21-2008, 12:32 AM
I got a phone call around 6 PM tonight at the gun shop.

"Hello, is Cesar there?"

"No, are you trying to call Metroshot?"

"Yeah."

"This is Ten Percent Firearms."

"Oh."

"I hear he is hard to get a hold of."

"Do you have a phone number for him?"

"No."

"Ok, thanks."

Riiiiiiiggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhtttttttttttttt tttttttt!

vega
10-21-2008, 7:45 AM
I will have a complete run down once I complete the transaction....

what I did was a simple FFL transfer from a FTF transaction suggested by the seller. It was just the OLL. Nothing as serious as the issues posted by others.

And the world awaits unless the transaction is not yet completed. Been more than 10 days now.

LB21
10-21-2008, 7:59 AM
So a dozen people saying "I got screwed" prompts you to run right out and do business with the store in question?
I can understand being somewhat contrarian but that just seems like a special kind of stupid.

Dude, thats f'ing hilarious! Sigline material....:biggrinjester:

hiyabrad
10-21-2008, 12:28 PM
The bottom line here is that C bought the biz from P and P had a lot of debt that he did not tell C about. C is trying to clear up the mess and not let the ship sink him. He is about 2/3's of the way thought it and trying to make it right. But he is buried now.

Not to mention that the ATF has audited him like 3 times in the last 4 months, and everything he comes out clean - a testament to C.

So all you bandwagon folks who have no idea what is really going on, or what it's like to be in his shoes at the present time, take a seat and chill.

He will come out of this on the other side and be back to regular operations.

But to tar and feather him without having first hand knowledge of what is happening is jumping on the bandwagon. So get off it. If you want to take your business elsewhere, then do so, but no need to get the mob mentality here.

As a long-time customer of P, and then C, C is stand-up and will do the right thing.

Hopi
10-21-2008, 12:29 PM
Can somebody confirm that P is no longer involved with the business?

hiyabrad
10-21-2008, 12:35 PM
From what I have been told, P is no longer involved.

Beatone
10-21-2008, 1:59 PM
Wow, no wonder P was selling a BMW suv on his former site. Hope C can make a go of it.

radd
10-21-2008, 2:04 PM
The bottom line here is that C bought the biz from P and P had a lot of debt that he did not tell C about. C is trying to clear up the mess and not let the ship sink him. He is about 2/3's of the way thought it and trying to make it right. But he is buried now.

Not to mention that the ATF has audited him like 3 times in the last 4 months, and everything he comes out clean - a testament to C.

So all you bandwagon folks who have no idea what is really going on, or what it's like to be in his shoes at the present time, take a seat and chill.

He will come out of this on the other side and be back to regular operations.

But to tar and feather him without having first hand knowledge of what is happening is jumping on the bandwagon. So get off it. If you want to take your business elsewhere, then do so, but no need to get the mob mentality here.

As a long-time customer of P, and then C, C is stand-up and will do the right thing.


Regardless who took over the business. Bottomline is Metroshot as an entity still screw over numerous vendors and customers. Even after it changed hands (if that is even true), I personally received the exact same treatment as it was ran by the former owner. Numerous customer also received the same treatment.

So, what you are saying is C is a stand-up guy but when representing Metroshot he doesn't keep his promises and don't call back his customer. Then I will agree with you.

Radd

hawk1
10-21-2008, 2:34 PM
The bottom line here is that C bought the biz from P and P had a lot of debt that he did not tell C about. C is trying to clear up the mess and not let the ship sink him. He is about 2/3's of the way thought it and trying to make it right. But he is buried now.

Not to mention that the ATF has audited him like 3 times in the last 4 months, and everything he comes out clean - a testament to C.

So all you bandwagon folks who have no idea what is really going on, or what it's like to be in his shoes at the present time, take a seat and chill.

He will come out of this on the other side and be back to regular operations.

But to tar and feather him without having first hand knowledge of what is happening is jumping on the bandwagon. So get off it. If you want to take your business elsewhere, then do so, but no need to get the mob mentality here.

As a long-time customer of P, and then C, C is stand-up and will do the right thing.

Since you have all the answers, how come "C" hasn't paid Radd the money owed to him? :confused: Sounds easy enough. I think Radd would be more than happy to get his money.
If "C" bought the business with the debt then he has no one but himself to blame for not having a full accounting done before he signed.

As for the bandwagon comments, no reason to take a seat and chill, better to keep others informed so the same stuff won't happen to them. ;)

caduckgunner
10-21-2008, 2:45 PM
How in the hell did I log onto the Sesame Street forum :confused:

sarki
10-21-2008, 4:28 PM
How in the hell did I log onto the Sesame Street forum :confused:

Wow. The only thing i can add to this thread is that my experience has been really positive so far with Metroshot and "C". The guy is real nice and from what I've been reading, and what "C" is telling me, It sounds like "P" is out and things are getting done but its taking "C" a really looooooooong time to do it. Every time i talk to the guy he sounds like a chicken with his head cut off. Im getting my OLL and and other parts from him and the prices are unbeatable. I'm going over there tonight and will post my progress with the build. OH if you havent figured it out by now......I'm a new member:D

aplinker
10-21-2008, 4:31 PM
Since you have all the answers, how come "C" hasn't paid Radd the money owed to him? :confused: Sounds easy enough. I think Radd would be more than happy to get his money.
If "C" bought the business with the debt then he has no one but himself to blame for not having a full accounting done before he signed.

As for the bandwagon comments, no reason to take a seat and chill, better to keep others informed so the same stuff won't happen to them. ;)


I've met Cesar a number of times and think he's a decent, kind and helpful guy. He's definitely someone who tries to do the right thing for everyone. I'll also say I don't feel the same about Pat. I would not be surprised to find that what he says is true of Pat.

I'll go out on a limb and guess that, if what he said is correct, then the answer to your question is obvious - there is/was no money to pay the debt.

From what he said it sounds as though Cesar is getting capital to pay off debt, make things solvent, and put the business back on track.

While I understand your position and agree with its principles, life isn't always that simple, and it seems awfully callous.

I can imagine a good number of scenarios and reasons that would cause Cesar to be in a position that the right thing might be essentially impossible. What we want to do and hope to do isn't always what happens. There are times when nice people are taken advantage of in business.

I'd like to see Metroshot come back and make a go of things.

hiyabrad
10-21-2008, 4:53 PM
I've met Cesar a number of times and think he's a decent, kind and helpful guy. He's definitely someone who tries to do the right thing for everyone. I'll also say I don't feel the same about Pat. I would not be surprised to find that what he says is true of Pat.

I'll go out on a limb and guess that, if what he said is correct, then the answer to your question is obvious - there is/was no money to pay the debt.

From what he said it sounds as though Cesar is getting capital to pay off debt, make things solvent, and put the business back on track.

While I understand your position and agree with its principles, life isn't always that simple, and it seems awfully callous.

I can imagine a good number of scenarios and reasons that would cause Cesar to be in a position that the right thing might be essentially impossible. What we want to do and hope to do isn't always what happens. There are times when nice people are taken advantage of in business.

I'd like to see Metroshot come back and make a go of things.



Times are real tough these days, and raising money for a business is also tough, frankly tougher than ever.

C is trying to make it right and at least he is trying. You know, he could just BK the company and let RADD and all the others eat it, but he's not doing that. He could tell them to just chase P, but he's not doing that either.

It's like what just happened with Bank of America and Countrywide. Countrywide went around screwing everyone and then BofA bought them and canned the CEO. Then the government comes in and sues BofA for all the ****ty things that Countrywide and their former CEO did.....and BofA paid.

So who should everyone be pissed at, Countrywide and their former CEO, or BofA?


I have to agree with UCLA, well said.

Spyduh
10-21-2008, 5:07 PM
I got a phone call around 6 PM tonight at the gun shop.

"Hello, is Cesar there?"

"No, are you trying to call Metroshot?"

"Yeah."

"This is Ten Percent Firearms."

"Oh."

"I hear he is hard to get a hold of."

"Do you have a phone number for him?"

"No."

"Ok, thanks."

Riiiiiiiggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhtttttttttttttt tttttttt!

:rofl2: :rofl2: :rofl2:

Dude that's funny.

tenpercentfirearms
10-21-2008, 7:10 PM
:rofl2: :rofl2: :rofl2:

Dude that's funny.

It gets better, he also left a message on our machine. He sounded frustrated like he can never get him to call him back.

Then again, I specifically tell people if they want to leave a message to e-mail me, so I never return phone calls either! :TFH:

The question is when did Metroshot change operations. My customer who had his buffer and spring stolen out of his M&P15 happened over the summer. I am pretty sure Cesar was in charge then.

Nate Haler
10-21-2008, 7:20 PM
[QUOTE=hiyabrad;1628231]Times are real tough these days, and raising money for a business is also tough, frankly tougher than ever. .

It's like what just happened with Bank of America and Countrywide. Countrywide went around screwing everyone and then BofA bought them and canned the CEO. Then the government comes in and sues BofA for all the ****ty things that Countrywide and their former CEO did.....and BofA paid.

So who should everyone be pissed at, Countrywide and their former CEO, or BofA?

QUOTE]

The Credit Reform Act of '95, enacted by the Clinton administration and enabled by the pathetic pandering of even a Republican majority Congress, required lending institutions to lower their standards.

So thousands of risky customers, who would NEVER have been able to qualify for a mortgage according to the old requirements, were able to get loans. And then these irresponsible BORROWERS, who shouldn't be borrowing money in the first place, started defaulting on their loans. "Gee, you mean it's not a guarantee that a house will go up in value? Pooh! Gee, you mean I have to pay property taxes? Pooh. Gee, you mean 100% financing with negative amortization is not a good idea? Pooh! Oh well, I'll just default, because those greedy banks have all the money, and I shouldn't have to honor a contract. I'm not immoral. I deserve to be happy!"

Sure, banks, Freddie Mac, and everybody got greedy. Greed is good. Irresponsiblity is not. Liberals pander to irresponsibility. Liberals excuse immoral and illegal behavior, because they don't think they (or anybody) should truly be held accountable. It's always somebody else's fault. Pathetic.

And when businesses go bad for unethical reasons, then it's wrong to cut them slack. Here's to the people who do the right thing. The silent majority.

kmixxed213
10-24-2008, 7:35 PM
Does anyone Know if Metroshot is still open for business?, I have been trying to get a hold of C. for about 6 months!!! to pull my gun off Consignment I am starting to fear the worst that he sold my gun and spent the funds..... since day one I have been given the round around from C. when I purchased the Rifle like over a year ago.... I just want my rifle back.. anyone have any recommendations what I can do to get my Rifle back form C. every time I go there. they are always closed... I am getting pretty pissed now.
thanks

BroncoBob
10-24-2008, 9:35 PM
YIKES ...................... :shock::shock::shock:

People wake up this thread has been going to months. Take these people to court for stealing and fraud.

Fantasma
10-25-2008, 12:15 PM
:beatdeadhorse5: :nopity:.......................

PistolPete75
10-25-2008, 1:32 PM
I'm just being the devil's advocate. Mayby C is just being a front man for P. I like C, but P is definitely unethical to do business with. I stopped doing business with metroshot a long time ago. If C is truely the sole owner with P having no interest, then I might go back to Metroshot.

Addax
10-25-2008, 2:19 PM
I'm just being the devil's advocate. Mayby C is just being a front man for P. I like C, but P is definitely unethical to do business with. I stopped doing business with metroshot a long time ago. If C is truely the sole owner with P having no interest, then I might go back to Metroshot.

From what I understand Cesar is the man in charge of MS now.

He should do the right thing and step up, and call everyone that is owed $$ or parts or whatever and make things right.

If he does not, through his association with Pat and Metroshot, and now his purchase of Metroshot, he will end up having a very blemished reputation and in this industry, these types of issues and reputations are not easily forgotten.

Pred Thumper
10-25-2008, 9:38 PM
Ok my fellow bashers ... I was going to let you all hang but since Vega asked... let me give you the scoop so you all can spend the next several weeks *****ing about it like girls. My transaction was completed but not without some minor issues that C has corrected 10x's over... I did return a couple of times to meet up with him to get some additional items he promised. According to "C," he is the new owner of MS has met me both those times "after hours" HINT: all you need to do is "schedule" an appointment. He still has the same cell number but HINT: I usually text him cause he cant always answer at his job. His response to my text has always been "quick". He is willing (well he did for me can't speak for the rest of you blokes) to meet any day of the week and at any time in the evening (after work I will assume). He wont talk much about the mess P left him in but I can tell he is trying his best to keep the shop going and to make things right (although am not sure exactly to what degree) Am NOT his friend just a new customer (with about a 1.5 hour drive each way) giving him the benefit of the doubt. C hopes to transition from his regular full time job to his new business and needs to pull the trigger (no pun intended) and make a go at the business full time. That may be the reason his shop hours have not been so consistent IMHO. He told me that he will be meeting with a possible "investor" this week and he is hoping it works out. I wish him the best. I feel for those who got ripped off by P I know I would feel upset too. Like I said before I dont plan on doing business with MS again only because the travel time is too burdensome and my encounter was a result of a purchase from a PP. I wish C and all of you the best. THE END

jrolfedrev
10-25-2008, 9:57 PM
I bought my lefty 6.8 Stag with LMT lower with no problem but that was last September 2007. Maybe Pat was involved with money and sex. Ouch!!! Anyway, thanks for this thread especially I have to travel 2.5 hours from Inland Empire. Question though, is Cesar reliable now he is the owner?

Hopi
10-25-2008, 10:15 PM
Their conspicuous absence in this thread, and on Calguns.net in general is telling. Busy is one thing........

MrLogan
10-25-2008, 11:56 PM
Seems like there have been numerous problems with them lately. Not to mention that they have a very low opinion of some Calguns members. :mad:

chickenfried
10-26-2008, 12:17 AM
Well that settles it. Pred thumper likes the shop and says it's good to go. I'll ignore all the other reviews, roll the dice hoping God smiles on me and give it a go:shrug:

MrLogan
10-26-2008, 3:26 AM
Well that settles it. Pred thumper likes the shop and says it's good to go. I'll ignore all the other reviews, roll the dice hoping God smiles on me and give it a go:shrug:

heheh

Amazing, some people, huh?

fmlyman
10-26-2008, 8:18 AM
Ok my fellow bashers ... I was going to let you all hang but since Vega asked... let me give you the scoop so you all can spend the next several weeks *****ing about it like girls. THE END

That says it all!

Buyer BEWARE! What more do you need to know when making any purchase.
I've bought and sold at this forum and deal with people on the premise that if I screw people I will receive the same in return. Looks to me that some people got screwed and have no other way of making it "right" so they "Warn" Calgunners not to shop there.....Boohooo!

This is all softcore porn...Let's here about someone getting some PAYBACK!

Love this thread!...Let's keep it going FOREVERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

kmixxed213
10-26-2008, 9:32 PM
I do not know How you can say C is a great guy and he is so Responsible, when I call and text him Everyday on his cell phone for 6 months. I have yet to receive a call back or a simple text explaining what the status of my rifle is. I have never dealt with Pat only C from Day one, sure He will smooth talk you, or tell you what you want to hear when you catch him at the shop. But Like I said I Have not seen or heard from C. in about 6 months. and that is unacceptable.

hawk1
10-27-2008, 8:08 AM
I bought my lefty 6.8 Stag with LMT lower with no problem but that was last September 2007. Maybe Pat was involved with money and sex. Ouch!!! Anyway, thanks for this thread especially I have to travel 2.5 hours from Inland Empire. Question though, is Cesar reliable now he is the owner?

To help save you a 2.5 hour trip you can use;

BrightSpot Pawn
9075 Mission Bl
Riverside, CA
951-360-1796

Or

ColdWar Shooters
7750 Palm Avenue **Suite G**
Highland, CA 92346
909-425-1300

Both are very oll/black rifle friendly...:)

pottymouth310
10-27-2008, 9:45 AM
I do not know How you can say C is a great guy and he is so Responsible, when I call and text him Everyday on his cell phone for 6 months. I have yet to receive a call back or a simple text explaining what the status of my rifle is. I have never dealt with Pat only C from Day one, sure He will smooth talk you, or tell you what you want to hear when you catch him at the shop. But Like I said I Have not seen or heard from C. in about 6 months. and that is unacceptable.

Simple, sounds like consumer fraud to me? call DOJ and the police file a complaint.....

jrolfedrev
11-02-2008, 12:25 AM
To help save you a 2.5 hour trip you can use;

BrightSpot Pawn
9075 Mission Bl
Riverside, CA
951-360-1796

Or

ColdWar Shooters
7750 Palm Avenue **Suite G**
Highland, CA 92346
909-425-1300

Both are very oll/black rifle friendly...:)

Thank you very much.

shooter4ever
12-16-2008, 9:57 PM
Metroshot has been closed for the past 2 weeks. Their voice mail says they're now by appointment only, but my phone calls haven't been returned.

radd
12-18-2008, 11:42 PM
Metroshot has been closed for the past 2 weeks. Their voice mail says they're now by appointment only, but my phone calls haven't been returned.

:rolleyes:

Not much suprise there......

Hope you didn't invest anything into them yet.

Seesm
12-19-2008, 12:53 AM
I read every page here... WHAT A waste of time for all of you, well heck me too.

But seriously IF you deal with this shop you are officially "special kind of stupid" as one poster said...

WTF customer service is all it is about...

And for the people who have there gun on consignment get over there. You say you do not have a way to get in touch well you should camp out (seriously) and get a "hold" of Ceasar.

Terrible to read and hear what these people are doing but sounds like just how they are...

If you deal with them you deserve what you get. I am out.

RECCE556
04-13-2009, 3:21 PM
Welcome to three months ago...

djleisure
04-13-2009, 3:34 PM
He sold prepaid legal, smokeless tobacco for the cities that have banned smoking, he tried selling me his X5 this guy was a chinese hustler but i do admit he did get some cool stuff when he got it !!. This was his hobby guess it fell through cause he has a great paying engineer job (dunno if he has it anymore) thats and according to cesar he (Pat) lives in Rowland Heights thats like over a hour away WTF??? we need a FFL here in the SGV thats AR friendly besides ammo bros and gunrunners he or someone else should open up here well not him per say with the crappy service but whatever I talked to nice dudes at Bain and Davis and they keep it old school thats another way of saying they are too scared and they straight up told me they dont want to touch AR or AK or anything exotic. Any replies PM me even if you disagree no cussing just critisism and thoughts. Just to. to clear things up his FFL is still valid but the store is closed ?? I dont think Pat or cesar are bad guys I just think they got tired have you tried standing in that place and get in line they just ran it into the ground not the best route to go but hey they burned many bridges the website is gone too! Any other stores closed due to the pulling of a FFL??www.metroshotfirearms.com

...the hell?

akjunkie
04-13-2009, 6:35 PM
He sold prepaid legal, smokeless tobacco for the cities that have banned smoking, he tried selling me his X5 this guy was a chinese hustler but i do admit he did get some cool stuff when he got it !!. This was his hobby guess it fell through cause he has a great paying engineer job (dunno if he has it anymore) thats and according to cesar he (Pat) lives in Rowland Heights thats like over a hour away WTF??? we need a FFL here in the SGV thats AR friendly besides ammo bros and gunrunners he or someone else should open up here well not him per say with the crappy service but whatever I talked to nice dudes at Bain and Davis and they keep it old school thats another way of saying they are too scared and they straight up told me they dont want to touch AR or AK or anything exotic. Any replies PM me even if you disagree no cussing just critisism and thoughts. Just to. to clear things up his FFL is still valid but the store is closed ?? I dont think Pat or cesar are bad guys I just think they got tired have you tried standing in that place and get in line they just ran it into the ground not the best route to go but hey they burned many bridges the website is gone too! Any other stores closed due to the pulling of a FFL??www.metroshotfirearms.com

Damn, where have U been?

-= Independent Armament Company =-
2053 Glenoaks Boulevard, San Fernando, California 91340
We will carry all OLL type rifle lowers, complete rifles, pistols, parts, mags, etc.


.: Hours of Operation :.
Tuesday 4pm-8pm | Wednesday thru Saturday 11am-7pm | Closed Sunday & Monday
IndependentArmament@gmail.com
818 674 6744 Dmitry cell (txt OK)
818 322 4585 main
818 479 8777 fax temp

"this guy was a chinese hustler"

actually Pat was Japanese:-)

and i believe this is their most active/recent posting.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=171000

ArkinDomino
04-13-2009, 6:42 PM
He sold prepaid legal, smokeless tobacco for the cities that have banned smoking, he tried selling me his X5 this guy was a chinese hustler but i do admit he did get some cool stuff when he got it !!. This was his hobby guess it fell through cause he has a great paying engineer job (dunno if he has it anymore) thats and according to cesar he (Pat) lives in Rowland Heights thats like over a hour away WTF??? we need a FFL here in the SGV thats AR friendly besides ammo bros and gunrunners he or someone else should open up here well not him per say with the crappy service but whatever I talked to nice dudes at Bain and Davis and they keep it old school thats another way of saying they are too scared and they straight up told me they dont want to touch AR or AK or anything exotic. Any replies PM me even if you disagree no cussing just critisism and thoughts. Just to. to clear things up his FFL is still valid but the store is closed ?? I dont think Pat or cesar are bad guys I just think they got tired have you tried standing in that place and get in line they just ran it into the ground not the best route to go but hey they burned many bridges the website is gone too! Any other stores closed due to the pulling of a FFL??www.metroshotfirearms.com

:nuts: