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View Full Version : Noveske, Colt, & other questions


sjwolf
08-29-2008, 10:32 PM
Hi. I am new to guns but have always wanted an ar-15 type rifle. I am concerned about McCains chances of winning the upcoming election especially with his VP nomination. Therefore, Im trying to get a rifle before a new ban can be passed. My decision is mainly based on reliability so Im trying to decide between Colt and Noveske.

Clearly everyone has heard of Colt with their long proven history. I would like to get a 6921 which is from what I understand a SBR and would be illegal in CA without a perm FH.

I am unfamiliar with Noveske but like what everyone has to say about them. However, I am pretty overwhelmed by all their options. (Basic, Low Profile, VIS, Recce) What does it all mean?

What is the best place to buy a Colt 6921? Some place that would weld the fh before shipping to my FFL since I have been unable to find a colt lower for sale.

Please Help. I want to get the best rifle I can especially since it may be my last. I know this is an uninformed post, However, I would rather learn about a gun after purchasing one than learn about about a gun I am no longer able to own.
Thanks

technique
08-29-2008, 11:21 PM
You can, but you may never be able to get a hold of a Off List Colt lower. There are only 2 available models.

Noveske is a good choice since a complete Colt is hard to come by.

I have a combination of the two and it is one of my favorite AR's I own.
I'm not too familiar with all of what Noveske has to offer as far as (Basic, Low Profile, VIS, Recce) but I rarely hear anything negative about them. Hopefully someone jumps in to better inform you.

Welcome to Calguns!:)

Mississippi
08-29-2008, 11:27 PM
MCains VP is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

bwiese
08-30-2008, 12:08 AM
Ummm,

(1) No Fed AW ban will be passed regardless of who's in office. Composition of House/Senate won't change that much, and on top of that everything changed after Heller. The 94 AW ban was a Democrat killer and the DLC types know that.

(2) CA can only go backwards and relax on AW stuff - otherwise they nullify AB2728, etc. They backed themselves into a corner.

(3) "Incorporation" of RKBA into CA is coming. Everything changes (favorably) after that. While the speed/degree/extent of improvement is debatable for once the sun's shining on our side in CA.

(4) McCain ain't gonna sign any AW ban even if it came up to him. He didn't sign the first one and in general has been pretty pro-gun except for some issues about gunshow sales and some campaign finance stuff that affects political speech.

(5) You can build a perfectly good AR from a mix of parts. Any lower is the about same as any other (except Vulcan/Hesse/Blackthorne). Put a good upper on it - you can find someone that will take a 6921HB upper and pin/weld a perm extension to get it to 16" min bbl length (don't acquire a 14.5" upper if you have a lower - get the muzzle device pinned/welded). There are other good brands out there too that are good enough for most folks needs - just make sure it has a chrome-lined barrel.

sjwolf
08-30-2008, 7:08 AM
I am concerned about McCains chances of winning the upcoming election especially with his VP nomination.

I hope that didn't sound like I'm for the other guy haha. I've supported McCain since the 2000 election.

MCains VP is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I spent some time researching her yesterday, and she has quite a few good views. I think she will hopefully bring in more female votes. I think most McCain supporters will continue to support him regardless. My main concern is that the people who worry about his age may not want some one with very little experience one step away from the presidency and therefore buy into the obama hype.


That aside is anyone familiar with all of Noveskes options (Basic, Low Profile, VIS, Recce) ? I like that it is quite easy to order from their site if you can stand waiting a few weeks.

If I'm set on the Colt what is the best place to get one. I do see quite a few 6921 completes for sale online but I can't have that shipped into CA without a maglock and the FH welded correct? Does some one know an online seller that would do just that?

Thanks again

trinydex
08-30-2008, 4:06 PM
Ummm,

(1) No Fed AW ban will be passed regardless of who's in office. Composition of House/Senate won't change that much, and on top of that everything changed after Heller. The 94 AW ban was a Democrat killer and the DLC types know that.

(2) CA can only go backwards and relax on AW stuff - otherwise they nullify AB2728, etc. They backed themselves into a corner.

(3) "Incorporation" of RKBA into CA is coming. Everything changes (favorably) after that. While the speed/degree/extent of improvement is debatable for once the sun's shining on our side in CA.

(4) McCain ain't gonna sign any AW ban even if it came up to him. He didn't sign the first one and in general has been pretty pro-gun except for some issues about gunshow sales and some campaign finance stuff that affects political speech.

(5) You can build a perfectly good AR from a mix of parts. Any lower is the about same as any other (except Vulcan/Hesse/Blackthorne). Put a good upper on it - you can find someone that will take a 6921HB upper and pin/weld a perm extension to get it to 16" min bbl length (don't acquire a 14.5" upper if you have a lower - get the muzzle device pinned/welded). There are other good brands out there too that are good enough for most folks needs - just make sure it has a chrome-lined barrel.
what does number 2 mean?

getafterit
08-30-2008, 4:47 PM
And number Three...RKBA?:confused:

trinydex
08-30-2008, 4:52 PM
right to keep and bare arms (2nd amendement). incorporation has to do with the 14th amendment. basically forces ca to acknowledge the 2nd amendment.

X-NewYawker
08-30-2008, 4:56 PM
Sarah Palin has more executive experience than Obama. I'd be a lot happier with her as my president with good advisors than ANY of the Democrats!

sjwolf
08-30-2008, 5:08 PM
anyone familiar with all of Noveskes options (Basic, Low Profile, VIS, Recce) ? I like that it is quite easy to order from their site if you can stand waiting a few weeks.

If I'm set on the Colt what is the best place to get one. I do see quite a few 6921 completes for sale online but I can't have that shipped into CA without a maglock and the FH welded correct? Does some one know an online seller that would do just that?


*sorry but was getting off topic*

getafterit
08-30-2008, 5:24 PM
If I were you, being worried about any future ban. Buy a stripped lower from lan world or you favorite OLL/supporter and build your own. You can do just as good a job if not better than any gun company out there.
You can find everything you need to know right here in front of you.
Again, support those that are working with Californians to support the 2nd.

sjwolf
08-30-2008, 5:27 PM
Both colt and noveske are on there but its just a different colt im looking for

ChrisXD45T
08-30-2008, 5:34 PM
The "Basic" essentially has the standard M4 handguards and front sight base.
The low-pro has Vltor railed free-float handuards and flip-up sights.
The VIS is a one piece upper/handguard by Vltor.

The railed handguard systems cost more up front, but if you have any plans on getting a railed handguard buy an upper that already has them installed, like the low-pro or VIS. It'll cost you just as much, if not more, in the end for you to have them put on latter.

sjwolf
08-30-2008, 5:41 PM
Cool thanks. Anyone know the main difference between the light and recce?

technique
08-30-2008, 5:41 PM
There are only 2 Colt models good to own here in California as I said before, So the one you are looking for is not one you can have!!!!!!!!!! You may get an upper like the Colt you want but NOT THE LOWER. So Colt parts and find a lower with an emblem you like!!!

Both colt and noveske are on there but its just a different colt im looking for

ChrisXD45T
08-30-2008, 5:42 PM
If you want a Colt it might be easier for you to build your own Off List Lower and buy a Colt upper. You don't need a FFL to get an upper and you don't have to go through the trouble of finding someone who will make a complete AR California compliant.


And most companies, like Noveske, would probably have the flash hiders pinned already to keep them from being SBRs. Less hassle.

ChrisXD45T
08-30-2008, 5:44 PM
Cool thanks. Anyone know the main difference between the light and recce?
The Recce has a mid-length gas system (better in my opinion) and the other is the standard carbine length gas system.

sjwolf
08-30-2008, 6:20 PM
There are only 2 Colt models good to own here in California as I said before, So the one you are looking for is not one you can have!!!!!!!!!! You may get an upper like the Colt you want but NOT THE LOWER. So Colt parts and find a lower with an emblem you like!!!

I am aware of the two OLL colts. Can you please explain to me why I cannot own a 6921? I was under the impression that it was just the 6920 thats on the kassler list. I thought that the only thing limiting us on the 6921 was that it has a 14.5" barrel.

technique
08-30-2008, 6:42 PM
I am aware of the two OLL colts. Can you please explain to me why I cannot own a 6921? I was under the impression that it was just the 6920 thats on the kassler list. I thought that the only thing limiting us on the 6921 was that it has a 14.5" barrel.

Because California sucks!

PIRATE14
08-30-2008, 10:01 PM
I am aware of the two OLL colts. Can you please explain to me why I cannot own a 6921? I was under the impression that it was just the 6920 thats on the kassler list. I thought that the only thing limiting us on the 6921 was that it has a 14.5" barrel.

The 6921 could be brought into CALI but if you find a lower expect to pay 1000-1400 for one........not many guys/FFLs will go through the paper work drill of making it a regular rifle..........

Might have better luck w/ a ELITE model.......

technique
08-30-2008, 10:21 PM
Its hard to even find an Elite but not impossible. Pirate14 is dead on, see what happens when you mention Colt to most dealers. Your gonna bend over backwards while jumping through hoops trying to get one. The point is, if it's worth it to you, by all means!

But from your original post, you seem to feel your running out of time. So it would be faster to go another route. A lower is only a lower.

PIRATE14
08-30-2008, 10:44 PM
Just to answer more questions....

Well the 6921 leaves the factory as a federally documented short barreled rifle, so a dealer(SOT) has to send paper work back to feds that it's not a SBR anymore.....takes several months.....and not many SOTs will do that.....

Noveske and other 14.5s are just rifles cause they are pinned to an overall 16" barrel length prior to being manufactured and the tax paid on them.....

Nothin has to make sense....that's just the way it is........gov't controlled....

Not too mention that the FEDs are terrible at keeping track of their own paperwork......first hit on the rifle from a LE entity and COLT will say it's a SBR.....so, you gotta have paper from the ATF that it isn't a SBR....

Is it worth it.....only you can decide, I would guess that there are only about 20-50 in circulation that are deregistered......I think I have about 3-5.......:chris:

sjwolf
08-31-2008, 4:26 PM
So I can own another 14.5 inch rifle such as noveske or lmt without additional hassle correct?

getafterit
08-31-2008, 4:33 PM
So I can own another 14.5 inch rifle such as noveske or lmt without additional hassle correct?

as long as it meets the 16" minimum in cali (or most other places too) via a welded or pinned FH.
As for the lowers. I think Colt was top shelf when their were only a handfull of companies making lowers. Today there are many that are machining their own. Some, even better than the Colts IMO.
If you want a nice lower check out POF's Gen II or the Tactical Inovations T15BDX. Noveski also makes a nice lower, although it looks like all the rest.
I think that some comanies are taking the lowers to the next level by offering features that could not be had before.

technique
08-31-2008, 4:37 PM
So I can own another 14.5 inch rifle such as noveske or lmt without additional hassle correct?

Yes as long as your permanent muzzle device brings it to 16in barrel length, If you want to go after the Elite series let me know, I can point you in the direction I got mine from.

sjwolf
08-31-2008, 9:54 PM
If you want to go after the Elite series let me know, I can point you in the direction I got mine from.

is that the direction you'd go? Money isn't really an issue for the rifle itself. either way i wont be getting a scope or tac light any time soon tho

technique
08-31-2008, 10:03 PM
is that the direction you'd go? Money isn't really an issue for the rifle itself. either way i wont be getting a scope or tac light any time soon tho

No. I did go that way, but just to look at it and say I have one. And I paid X2 the average amount of an AR.

I bought a Noveske lower and and Colt parts, It shoots the same and its my favorite AR, And I don't feel bad beating on it.

The choice is yours, It still took me a long time to get an Elite, I found it in NV, it went from there to FL, and then to me in CA. And I got lucky.

scfast
08-31-2008, 10:07 PM
save yourself some time and get any lower and order a 14.5 colt upper have the FH pinned and install on your lower and call it a day...The upper is where the quality is these days....for the most part a lower is a lower is a lower.

getafterit
09-01-2008, 8:10 AM
save yourself some time and get any lower and order a 14.5 colt upper have the FH pinned and install on your lower and call it a day...The upper is where the quality is these days....for the most part a lower is a lower is a lower.

+1
+1

aplinker
09-01-2008, 12:36 PM
VLTOR doesn't make rails, other than the VIS.

Noveske rails are currently SWS.

Definitely go RECCE over the N4 carbine, if you go Noveske.

If you want a carbine, buy a Colt upper.

Don't sweat the lower. Any quality lower will work well.


The "Basic" essentially has the standard M4 handguards and front sight base.
The low-pro has Vltor railed free-float handuards and flip-up sights.
The VIS is a one piece upper/handguard by Vltor.

The railed handguard systems cost more up front, but if you have any plans on getting a railed handguard buy an upper that already has them installed, like the low-pro or VIS. It'll cost you just as much, if not more, in the end for you to have them put on latter.

sjwolf
09-01-2008, 1:44 PM
Definitely go RECCE over the N4 carbine, if you go Noveske.


Thats the mid-length and comes with the 16.1" barrel correct? Will they customize it to come with the 14.5?

Is that advisable? I've seen it both ways. some say carbine for 14.5, others say middy.

technique
09-01-2008, 1:50 PM
Thats the mid-length and comes with the 16.1" barrel correct? Will they customize it to come with the 14.5? Is that advisable. I've seen it both ways. some say carbine for 14.5, others say middy.

Whats your location? You can always have the cut done later. We can recommend a place based on where you are. Also saves you some time on your order, I always order whatever is in stock. Like with my Colt upper, I ordered a 20in even though I wanted a 18in. It was in stock and shipped right away, I got it and had it cut to how I wanted.

sjwolf
09-01-2008, 2:06 PM
Whats your location? You can always have the cut done later. We can recommend a place based on where you are.

East Bay Area, Northern CA.

technique
09-01-2008, 2:12 PM
M24armorer is close to you. Whatever you decide on, he can do the cut and weld if you need it. He does a great job. He is located in Los Gatos but make frequent trips to various Bay Area shops and gun shows.

sjwolf
09-01-2008, 2:14 PM
k definitely keep that in mind. Los Gatos isn't really that far maybe an hour

aplinker
09-01-2008, 2:16 PM
Thats the mid-length and comes with the 16.1" barrel correct? Will they customize it to come with the 14.5?

Is that advisable? I've seen it both ways. some say carbine for 14.5, others say middy.

mid-length is the better choice for anything we can justifiably run (i.e., 14.5" or longer). I have a 13.8" mid-length that runs like a champ...

I'm not sure why you'd want to cut down a 16" barrel. The 1.5" adds velocity and reduces flip, flash and noise. Unless you're door kicking the extra length won't be noticed.

But yeah, you can get it reduced. It's probably not worth the effort and money. If you want a carbine, buy a colt.

sjwolf
09-01-2008, 3:25 PM
I'm not sure why you'd want to cut down a 16" barrel. The 1.5" adds velocity and reduces flip, flash and noise. Unless you're door kicking the extra length won't be noticed.

No, not kicking in doors. Always looks fun tho. Was mostly wondering for cosmetic reasons

rudedude916
09-21-2008, 7:24 PM
I have been trying to decide between a few different uppers and you guys answered all my questions in this 1 thread. You guys kick butt. I think I will go with the Noveski recce 16.1" Thanks fellas!

rudedude916
06-15-2009, 4:00 PM
I was just looking at Noveski's website and aside from the lowpro recce they also have a switchblock upper. Do you guys know what that is? Thanks.

slappomatt
06-15-2009, 4:08 PM
The switch block is their adjustable gas block designed for use with a silencer. It might be able to reduce felt recoil as well but it only has a couple of settings so its probably not great for that. It could just as easily make the gun malfunction without a silencer. (go for the recce!)

aplinker
06-15-2009, 5:16 PM
switchblock has 3 settings IIRC - suppressed, unsuppressed and off (single-shot).

Worthless, since only one of those makes sense for us.

rudedude916
06-15-2009, 8:02 PM
Worthless, since only one of those makes sense for us.

thats what I needed to hear. Thanks guys.

rudedude916
10-06-2009, 4:10 PM
Finally after about a year the have a recce in stock. Here she is. It was worth the wait.:hurray:
http://i437.photobucket.com/albums/qq97/timmoeding/shooting.jpg