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View Full Version : R1A1, My next rifle? Cost and transfer...


diddler
07-17-2008, 9:28 AM
Hey All,

A buddy of mine has an R1A1 FAL-type rifle he's thinking of selling, I've only seen it once, a few years ago. He keeps it out of state to avoid the Kaliforniastan rules.

From what I read on various forums, the R1A1 was made by CAI, who had quality control issues that were "Hit and miss". He claims that this one shoots ok but I'd want to take it the range before throwing down coin.

So first, what should I expect to pay for a used R1A1? Anything in particular I can look for while shooting it, without totally tearing the thing apart?

-EDIT- Just realized, I have no idea who made the receiver, don't have immediate access to the FAL. Might take quite a while. Its my understanding that they were built with either an Imbel, Hesse or CAI receiver. Since I can't tell which it is at this point, can I get ballpark prices on all three? Or would I just say no outright to a Hesse receiver?

And, if he brings it back into the state to take a look at it, it seems like the only thing he'd need to do before crossing state lines is pop off the pistol grip (assuming it doesn't have a flash hider or other evil feature). Sound correct? If I continue forward from there then I just need to find a local FFL to transfer via PPT. Seem to recall that the upper receiver is the "firearm" in california law, and that people usually just bring the upper to the FFL and have the lower sent directly to themselves. All correct?

Thanks!

Ryan

sb_pete
07-17-2008, 10:09 AM
Well, you should get some more posts here from others. I am not sure about FAL's but with AR's it is the LOWER that is the serialized part requiring an FFL. The uppers can freely bought and sold.

Sounds like the plan to bring it in state by popping off the pistol grip would be fine assuming it has no evil features. But:
1. Check to make sure that this particular firearm / receiver is not on the list and banned by name.
2. Make sure you don't import any hi-cap magazines. Hi-cap mag laws still apply and make sure you know them.
3. Keep asking because I am FAR from being an expert or a lawyer.

Hope that helps,
-Pete

tgriffin
07-17-2008, 10:18 AM
FAL type rifles it is the "upper" which is the serialized and hence controled component. AR it is the "lower". AK is merely the receiver itself.

Barring additional prohibited features, the removal of the pistol grip would render the rifle california legal, unless the serialized component is marked as a 'listed' AW.

I cant speak for the individual manufacturer pricing, but I would expect to pay, based on the physical condition/round count/maker/builder/exotic features anywhere in the neighbor hood of $800-$2000 (<- high end is with optics/accessories involved). Anything below $800 and he is either a REALLY good friend or something is wrong with the rifle.

-hanko
07-17-2008, 12:59 PM
From what I read on various forums, the R1A1 was made by CAI, who had quality control issues that were "Hit and miss". He claims that this one shoots ok but I'd want to take it the range before throwing down coin.

So first, what should I expect to pay for a used R1A1? Anything in particular I can look for while shooting it, without totally tearing the thing apart?

-EDIT- Just realized, I have no idea who made the receiver, don't have immediate access to the FAL. Might take quite a while. Its my understanding that they were built with either an Imbel, Hesse or CAI receiver. Since I can't tell which it is at this point, can I get ballpark prices on all three? Or would I just say no outright to a Hesse receiver?

And, if he brings it back into the state to take a look at it, it seems like the only thing he'd need to do before crossing state lines is pop off the pistol grip (assuming it doesn't have a flash hider or other evil feature). Sound correct? If I continue forward from there then I just need to find a local FFL to transfer via PPT. Seem to recall that the upper receiver is the "firearm" in california law, and that people usually just bring the upper to the FFL and have the lower sent directly to themselves. All correct?

Thanks!

Ryan
CAI guns are hit/miss, more hitters than missers and few people post about Century guns that run well. For your range test, make sure the gas regulator is adjusted for your ammo. Dump a few mags as quickly as possible. Look for feeding problems & of course reliable extraction and ejection.

I'd pay $5-700 for a RUNNING Century rifle. A couple of hundred more for an Imbel receiver. If the gun has a Hesse receiver and it runs well, it will continue to run for a long time. You should pay less for a Hesse gun because Hesse's reputation is less than stellar;).

Removing the pg will satisify CA AW concerns.

-hanko

5hundo
07-17-2008, 1:32 PM
Also, fire quite a few rounds and fire rounds made my multiple manufacturers. I've heard of people having problems with R1A1s punching off more than one round at a time.

You don't want that drama at the range... :rolleyes:

diddler
07-17-2008, 1:48 PM
Also, fire quite a few rounds and fire rounds made my multiple manufacturers. I've heard of people having problems with R1A1s punching off more than one round at a time.

You don't want that drama at the range... :rolleyes:

Yeah, I've already had that problem with an AK at the range before. Luckily there was no drama, nobody noticed over all the noise of the other shooters. That rifle got locked up and put away real quick, and now it has a new fire control group!

thedrickel
07-17-2008, 1:51 PM
If the lower is metric, removing the pistol grip will leave you with the pistol grip stud still . . . which is a pistol grip. You have to separate the whole lower, unless it's an inch model. More than likely there's no muzzle threads so muzzle device shouldn't be an issue.

diddler
07-17-2008, 2:02 PM
If the lower is metric, removing the pistol grip will leave you with the pistol grip stud still . . . which is a pistol grip. You have to separate the whole lower, unless it's an inch model.

Ahhh, hadn't anticipated that. Makes sense though. Best as I can tell the R1A1 is a Metric receiver. So for transporting into state and getting it transfered to me, I'd expect to keep the upper separated from the lower till I figure out how to legally rejoin the two (MMG, etc).

In that line, what does it take to separate the upper from the lower on an FAL? Never used one myself. In fact if anyone knows of a good how-to website on the FAL, I wouldn't mind seeing it.

Every once in a while I try to wade through the messy FALfiles website, god they don't organize their stuff very well. Tons of info, and all of it difficult to find when you need it.

Thanks!