another firearms in car question

[sb_pete]

So I got pulled over last night. No probs, need to replace a headlight bulb, cop was very nice. She did ask me if I had any of my handguns in the car though. I did not, but it got me thinking.

I have heard so many conflicting things about carrying a firearm in the car. I tried searching here and elsewhere but I really just get an overload of info and many conflicting answers.I am not asking about the ammo thing. I know that as long as the firearm is in a locked case and the ammo cannot plausibly "find it's way" into the gun, then it is properly stored.

-I have also heard that CA does not allow trunk guns though. Are there specifics on when my firearms can be in my car or just on how they have to be stored therein?
-Do I have to be on my way to or from a legal place to shoot?
-Can I pass through or stop within 1000' of a school with a properly stored firearm?
-What if I have just been too lazy to unload my guns after yesterday's range trip?
-Also what if I am not in the car? Any law specific to guns in an unattended car? (Like stopping by the grocery store on the way to the range).

Also, I have a station wagon, so there is no locking trunk and my glovebox doesn't lock and wouldn't fit anything anyway. I transport my firearms in the back of the car and visually covered over.

Thanks in advance guys.
-Pete

[Prowler]

Try the search button for "Trunk Guns". I believe there was a thread about this subject that will answer your questions.

[wceviper]

How did firearms even come up in a fix it ticket traffic stop?

[pnkssbtz]

How did firearms even come up in a fix it ticket traffic stop?

4 Words:

Pretextual Stop

Fishing Expedition

[Nose Nuggets]

How did firearms even come up in a fix it ticket traffic stop?

came here to ask this

[leelaw]

How did firearms even come up in a fix it ticket traffic stop?

Routine question to see if someone's going to admit something they shouldn't.

[boogak]

was your arms on fire?

[MudCamper]

All firearms in your car must be unloaded.

Rifles may be concealed or unconcealed.

Handguns must be either unconcealed, or in the trunk, or in a locked box other than the utility or glove box.

In a school zone all firearms must be locked up.

Some ague that you must always follow 12026.2 to transport a handgun concealed, which means that you must be "going to of from a place" which is permitted. Some (like myself) argue that you need only follow 12026.1 to trasport a handgun concealed, which means you don't need to be going anywhere in particular.

12027(g) is a special case for hunters and fisherman which allows transporting your handgun concealed.

Are you confused yet?

Read the Open Carry Flyer in my sig for clarification.

[wceviper]

4 Words:

Pretextual Stop

Fishing Expedition

I figured as much!

She did ask me if I had any of my handguns in the car though.

What puzzles me is the way it is worded. Did she ask, "Do you have any guns or weapons inside the car?" or is the vehicle plate/drivers license coming back with firearms noted, or did he bring it up himself.

[fairfaxjim]

So I got pulled over last night. No probs, need to replace a headlight bulb, cop was very nice. She did ask me if I had any of my handguns in the car though.

Whoa! Did she as it that way "Do you have any of YOUR handguns in the car"? How the hell does she know whether or not you even own any??

I did not, but it got me thinking.

I have heard so many conflicting things about carrying a firearm in the car. I tried searching here and elsewhere but I really just get an overload of info and many conflicting answers.I am not asking about the ammo thing. I know that as long as the firearm is in a locked case and the ammo cannot plausibly "find it's way" into the gun, then it is properly stored.

I have also heard that CA does not allow trunk guns though. Are there specifics on when my firearms can be in my car or just on how they have to be stored therein?

PC12025 covers concealed wepons, PC 12026.1 - 12027 give exceptions to 12025. Where in car is not an issure, only how they have to be - handguns unloaded and in a locked container, glove box does not equal locked container, trunk does, but is not the only container acceptable. Long guns do not have to be in a locked container, they are not considered concealable weapons. (see school zone exception below.)

Do I have to be on my way to or from a legal place to shoot?

PC 12026.1 Generic carrying in a vehicle - No, as long as you are a citizen over 18 and not prohibited for posession. PC12026.1 These are other exceptions that list specific places and activities that it is also acceptable, but (unlike has often been stated) are not requirements for PC12026.1, but are additional exceptions.

Can I pass through or stop within 1000' of a school with a properly stored firearm?

Yes. That is a whole different law, but CA law allows same locked container. However, federal law requires long guns to be in a locked case to.

What if I have just been too lazy to unload my guns after yesterday's range trip?

You are in violation of PC12031 - loaded gun law (different than concealed gun laws) Search this one, lots of discussion on the loaded gun issure.

Also what if I am not in the car? Any law specific to guns in an unattended car? (Like stopping by the grocery store on the way to the range).

Not if you are ok under PC12026.1. PC12026.2 does have some requirements as to route and stops if you do not fit the requirements of 12026.1. Read it, it is available here: http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/dwcl/12020.php


Also, I have a station wagon, so there is no locking trunk and my glovebox doesn't lock and wouldn't fit anything anyway. I transport my firearms in the back of the car and visually covered over.

Doesn't have to be in a "trunk", but trunk is an acceptable locked container.

Thanks in advance guys.
-Pete

You're welcome. I personally like John Machtinger's book "How to Own a Gun & Stay Out of Jail". For about $10 it really helps you navigate and understand the various areas of CA gun law.

[JPglee1]

Just be careful with trunk guns...make sure you keep them to yourself. One bogus "tip" can bring on a lot of heartache for an otherwise legal firearm

"I saw a man with a gun" call made anonymously can ruin your whole year/life....

J

[Librarian]

Quote:
What if I have just been too lazy to unload my guns after yesterday's range trip?
You are in violation of PC12031 - loaded gun law (different than concealed gun laws) Search this one, lots of discussion on the loaded gun issure.
I think he means 'didn't unload from the car', not 'didn't unload the weapons'.

[Decoligny]

Also, I have a station wagon, so there is no locking trunk and my glovebox doesn't lock and wouldn't fit anything anyway. I transport my firearms in the back of the car and visually covered over.

If you are talking about handguns, then just covering them to keep them out of sight in the back of your station wagon makes them concealed weapons. You need to get a locking secure container for them.

[leelaw]

What puzzles me is the way it is worded. Did she ask, "Do you have any guns or weapons inside the car?" or is the vehicle plate/drivers license coming back with firearms noted, or did he bring it up himself.

A license check will not come back with firearms results.

Chalk up the way the question was worded to the officer playing "I know more than you think I know" with the driver, to see if they'll admit something they shouldn't.

"So what have you been drinking tonight" vs "Have you been drinking anything?" get different answers.

[battleship]

Just wondering when purchasing ammo of any caliber do you have to have it in a locked box when its in your car, would ammo have to be in a place were a police officer can see it or can it be say in you glove compartment, or under the seat. I know you can not have it in the same container as your weapon, but what if you dont have your weaopn in the car at the same time as the ammo, is being driven around, would that change things for the law on ammo transportation when either you are transporting a weapon in a seperate container or your not.

[tyrist]

4 Words:

Pretextual Stop

Fishing Expedition

Also known as police work.

[robbor]

I recall that you allowed to carry a weapon in the car to go to the range, or actual use. So always reply, " I went to the range today" or" Im going to the range after dinner" if you admit to having a weapon in the car.

[DedEye]

Just wondering when purchasing ammo of any caliber do you have to have it in a locked box when its in your car, would ammo have to be in a place were a police officer can see it or can it be say in you glove compartment, or under the seat. I know you can not have it in the same container as your weapon, but what if you dont have your weaopn in the car at the same time as the ammo, is being driven around, would that change things for the law on ammo transportation when either you are transporting a weapon in a seperate container or your not.

You've been fed a line of FUD. There is no restriction on having ammo in the same container as your weapon, and you can place your ammo whereever the hell you want in your car, assuming it doesn't violate some vehicle code about being able to see out your windows or the like.

[rtlltj]

Routine question to see if someone's going to admit something they shouldn't.

So if I always keep my handgun in a locked container following the law, I should still say no I dont should the situation ever arise?

[DedEye]

So if I always keep my handgun in a locked container following the law, I should still say no I dont should the situation ever arise?

NO. Do not lie to a police officer. If at some point he discovers that you had a firearm and you said no, even if it were legally transported and possessed, you will have opened an unpleasant door for yourself and the line of questioning will not be fun.

If you don't want to tell an officer that you have a firearm, lest that lead to additional scrutiny, the best thing you can say is: "I have nothing illegal on me or in my vehicle officer." Most LEOs will understand what you mean by that statement and it won't give probable cause for any sort of search (as far as I'm aware), and most importantly it is not a lie.

[fairfaxjim]

I recall that you allowed to carry a weapon in the car to go to the range, or actual use. So always reply, " I went to the range today" or" Im going to the range after dinner" if you admit to having a weapon in the car.

That is true, you are allowed to carry a weapon to/from a range, but that is not the only case, and is only a necessary exception for a small number of people. Read the PC that applies to this. PC12026.1 does not contain any to/from destination type restrictions, and is NOT part of PC12026.2. These have been linked together by someone sometime in the past, and that isn't the case!

Rather than posting these open ended questions, people would be better served by asking "where can I get the ACTUAL laws on yada yada yada?"

Every one of these threads has a lot of just plain incorrect information in them. Not one of these forum answers is going to save your bacon in court. Spend some time and read the actual PC - it is on the DOJ website. Read the regs that further define the PC. Read the School zone laws (both state and fed). It is your butt that you are putting on the line out there, if you want to trust it to a bunch of us geeks that got nothing better to do that hang out here, you don't think much of it.

[WokMaster1]

How you dress plays an important part, too.

No cop in his/her right mind would ask any of these questions if you are dressed as a Hari Krishna. Especially if you pulled all your documents they requested from the crotch are of your sweaty robe.:D

[sb_pete]

Whoah! wasn't expecting so many responses! Lets see, I'll start going through them all here...

I figured as much!

She did ask me if I had any of my handguns in the car though.

What puzzles me is the way it is worded. Did she ask, "Do you have any guns or weapons inside the car?" or is the vehicle plate/drivers license coming back with firearms noted, or did he bring it up himself.

It was after I had given her my license and reg and she went back to the car to call it in and see if I had any warrants or what not. She was very friendly and the question seemed routine; it was not at all accusatory. More of a matter of fact, afterthought kind of question. The wording really threw my girlfriend who was in the car with me as well. Her words were, "Do you have any of your handguns in the car?. Note the use of (1) your, (2) handguns, and (3) PLURAL.

From what I understand and remember reading from previous threads here, Handgun ownership comes back over the radio with your DL info.So they know that when they come back to the car. I live in a college town and there were tons of cops out pulling people over that night. I was kind of expecting to be pulled over and wasn't surprised or offended although it was certainly a fishing expedition. It became very friendly almost instantly. She was in front of me and pulled to the side then pulled behind me so I knew she was going to pull me over and I just waved to her. She gave a short flash of the overhead lights. I pulled off and when she walked up, I joked with her that I knew it was my headlight bulb and that I had a spare in the back, would she like me to change it right now? (not sarcastically though) That got a laugh and after that it was just kind of going through the motions, she was asking me if I knew her old room mate who went to my high school and such.

I thought I pretty much knew the law, but it got me thinking about the trunk gun thing.

[sb_pete]

Thanks for the detailed answers FairfaxJim! that helps alot!


Quote:
What if I have just been too lazy to unload my guns after yesterday's range trip?
You are in violation of PC12031 - loaded gun law (different than concealed gun laws) Search this one, lots of discussion on the loaded gun issure.
I think he means 'didn't unload from the car', not 'didn't unload the weapons'.
Yeah, Librarian had it right. Too lazy to unload the guns themselves would be some serious laziness. Unloading all the gear I take to the range is another matter. That said, it's a good point to note either way.

If you are talking about handguns, then just covering them to keep them out of sight in the back of your station wagon makes them concealed weapons. You need to get a locking secure container for them.
Well, I was talking about all my guns and gear, but I should have been more specific. I put trigger locks on all the firearms and store them in gun cases seperate from the ammo. By visually covering them, I just meant that since it is a station wagon without tinted windows, they would otherwise be rather conspicuous so I cover them up using the sliding rear cover unless I have my .308 which is too long and necessitates putting down the back seat and covering it all with a sheet or blanket (ghetto, but it serves the purpose).

A license check will not come back with firearms results.
Chalk up the way the question was worded to the officer playing "I know more than you think I know" with the driver, to see if they'll admit something they shouldn't.
As I understand it this is not true. Longarms do not come up as they are not registered in that sense. Nor do registered AWs IIRC (although I think they can ask and have that checked, it is not read out as SOP IIRC). Handguns do come back with DL info though. In another thread a while back, one poster was describing how he overheard the dispatch reading off his list of pistols to the officer during a traffic stop.

There is no restriction on having ammo in the same container as your weapon, and you can place your ammo whereever the hell you want in your car, assuming it doesn't violate some vehicle code about being able to see out your windows or the like.
Hey Zach, what about the whole thing that the ammo can't "plausibly find its way into the chamber" or whatever that is? Is there any section of PC pertaining to proximity of ammo to gun, loaded magazines, seperate containers etc?

As I understood it, the ammo does not have to be locked but the gun does (and not in the glove box). The gun and ammo can be in the same container as long as the ammo could not somehow make its way into the gun of its own accord. Maybe I am wrong here? In any case, does anyone know the relevant PC?

How you dress plays an important part, too.

No cop in his/her right mind would ask any of these questions if you are dressed as a Hari Krishna. Especially if you pulled all your documents they requested from the crotch area of your sweaty robe.:D
LOL, nice image Wok, thanks for that:puke:

And thanks again to everyone and especially fairfaxjim! Also thanks in advance for any further answers/clarifications.

-Pete

[tombinghamthegreat]

So if I always keep my handgun in a locked container following the law, I should still say no I dont should the situation ever arise?

USE YOUR 5TH AMENDMENT RIGHTS. DO NOT INCRIMINATE YOURSELF.